All The Leaves Are Brown…

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• BadBadLeroyBrown December 13, 2012 at 5:34 pm

  Ive been told by Alderson supporters to WAIT and WAIT and WAIT and WAIT and WAIT and also it is too EARLY…WAIT!!!!

  Ever since Alderson took over thats all Ive heard from them they go crazy when he makes minimal moves that turn out to be nothing later on….but I and others get killed when we mention his inactivity or lack of creativity to improve the team….

  TWO years/seasons later going on THREE….Im still being told its TOO EARLY…WAIT some more…..

  NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!! I wasnt told to wait when Omar,Phillips or any other GM we’ve had for 2 to 3 freaking years before we see improvement. But for this Bozo I have to wait while all he does is cut payroll…He has money to spend now so you dont here that excuse anymore from his followers Sandy lovers….They just tell us to WAIT its TOO EARLY…..

  FYI ………….ITS NEVER TOO EARLY TO IMPROVE!!!
  • taskmaster4450 December 13, 2012 at 7:13 pm

    And what did you get with Phillips and Omar.

    Phillips…1999 and 2000 and a crash by 2002.

    Omar….1996,7,8 and then crash that has led to 4 4th place finishes.

    But then again, the main problem is that Wilpon always listens to the fans and just spends to appease them. Remember when Wilpon made Phillips spend more money so he went and go Appier which led to Mo Vaughn. Wonderful philosophy that was.
    • Metsie December 13, 2012 at 7:43 pm

      A world series appearance, another Playoff appearances and two more competitive chances at them in September…

      What has Sandy got us so far? Wheeler?

      Any idiot can trade an annual ALl Star a possible HOFer for a kid like that it doesn’t take brains or effort!
• TruthsaboutMurphy December 13, 2012 at 5:37 pm

  Angels tv deal = 150 a year

  Dodgers tv deal = 240 million a year

  Paid to the teams by a television company. Those teams do not own the network.

  Mets tv deal = 65-70 million a year(and they own the friggin’ network!

  Mets play in a bigger market for a bigger city. Something’s wrong here and it ain’t Alderson that’s at the root…the mets should be rolling in so much tv money that the Wilpon’s financial troubles shouldn’t even enter into the equation.

  Joe, you can post all the pics of Sterling’s building around the world and list all the ways the Wilpons are getting out of financial trouble. The reality is that baseball’s economics in big markets have completely skyrocketed while the Mets are still stuck at a payroll that might sit at 85 million.

  In big market terms, that’s like what the marlins are spending.

  230 million dodgers
  200+ million Yabkees
  150+ million angels
  170+ million phillies
  140+ million Red Sox

  You can’t blame Alderson for what is obviously a ownership that’s incapable to put forth a fair payroll that perhaps falls into the middle of the pack in terms of these big market teams.

  Maybe you could argue back 3 months ago…now? This should be painfully obvious that the franchise has been hijacked and run into the ground.
  • srt December 13, 2012 at 5:40 pm

    This.
  • Dick Young Lives December 13, 2012 at 5:43 pm

    You give a bad name to those of us from the Emerald Isle. Alderson has $20MM+ to spend. He simply doesn’t want to spend it. What good is all your research when it brings you no profit. Pay attention to the news.
  • ray sadecki December 13, 2012 at 6:36 pm

    and how many of those 5 teams were in the world series last year?
    • 51s December 13, 2012 at 6:39 pm

      What a pathetic comment. Maybe these teams weren’t in playoffs but at least they tried. I guess you love losing. You jessup donal and Alderson. The four loserlovers.
      • taskmaster4450 December 13, 2012 at 7:19 pm

        Tried? That is a laugh. The Yankees and Phillies are just hanging on for their last hurrah since their cores are older than dirt and breaking down and their farm systems are bare. The Red Sox were completely dismantled by August. There is a difference between seeking improvement and desperation.

        But look at the money the Yankees are throwing around for guys 38, 40, 43, and 40. Keep spending because it is NY.
      • ray sadecki December 13, 2012 at 7:25 pm

        you know you have won the argument when you opponent resorts to namecalling.
  • taskmaster4450 December 13, 2012 at 7:14 pm

    Yankees $80 M

    Red Sox $70M-$80M

    And both those owners have substantial holding in the networks.
• MDonaldWilpon December 13, 2012 at 5:38 pm

  There was Madoff Money when Phillips and Omar were around.
• srt December 13, 2012 at 5:39 pm

  ‘There has been a seismic shift in the baseball landscape…’

  Must be nice to have ownership who put together deals resulting in money that can actually be spent on the club they own.

  Thanks, Selig.
• Dick Young Lives December 13, 2012 at 5:39 pm

  FYI ………….ITS NEVER TOO EARLY TO IMPROVE!!!

  Apparently it is always too early for a front office full of bungling fools who are overpaid and underwhelming.
• MetsHype December 13, 2012 at 5:57 pm

  Cubs sign Anibal Sanchez 5yrs 75M
• MetsHype December 13, 2012 at 6:17 pm

  Anibal Sanchez not done yet, Tigers making a late push according to Heyman
• TruthsaboutMurphy December 13, 2012 at 7:29 pm

  How many have gone to the World Series over the last five years Ray? Are you actually saying that it is okay to have a payroll under 125 million when you play in NY?

  I’m not saying money equals throphies, but not spending money when you don’t have a productive farm system is suicide.

  Wow Ray, your comment was really stupid. Almost as if you think the Mets situation is okay. Look at the free agent market. It’s gone up considerably due to rising revenues. The revenues are rising primarily due to new television deals. The agents know it and have armed themselves with this information.

  So, that’s how a Shane Victorino coming off a bad year gets 39 million. How Angel Pagan gets 40 million.

  If these players; these not elite players, receive this amount of cash on the open market, then teams must all be ready to open their wallets if they don’t have a feeder fund to draw players from in the minors. The Mets, offensively speaking, don’t have the ability to man an outfield with good major leaguers. They’re going into battle with muskets, while other big market teams have drones.

  85 million dollar payroll folks… In today’s climate a 125-140 million dollar payroll isn’t that big anymore. By 2014, half of baseball will be around those numbers due to the upcoming 50 million dollar increase in the MLB negotiated TV contract. I’m just asking for a chance here. I’m just asking for this big market team to spend accordingly in today’s shifting baseball economy; just so they have a chance.

  Come on Ray, use your noggin. This is New York…it’s not Miami. The biggest market in the league and a team in the second biggest market is outspending the mets by 150%. If they just bridge that gap by a little, it’s not a lot to ask for. How many seasons of mediocrity must we be witness to.

  I know, I know… We got Anthony Recker. We’ll be fine.
• TruthsaboutMurphy December 13, 2012 at 7:35 pm

  Notice I didn’t name call…

  That’s cause I won and you are just grasping.

  Notice I’m not yelling out names of players they need to sign…

  That’s cause they do need to spend cautiously, not just free wielding their wallets and signing aging players.

  I just want what fair to us and to the owners…a chance.
• This is stupid December 13, 2012 at 8:01 pm

  You said so dream on my friends… You should’ve used dream on by aerosmith, much better song anyway
• Joey D. December 13, 2012 at 9:20 pm

  Hi Joe,

  Very appropriate using “California Dreaming” as a metaphor describing the different directions made by clubs in sunny southern California compared to us suffering through another winter of our discontent. I have my reservations about these big signings working out for either team because trying to buy a championship usually doesn’t work – but at least they are trying. They are not standing still or worse, going backwards.

  Is it just a co-incidence that Sandy made so many promises about this coming winter and that “California Dreaming” is a cut from the Mamas and the Papas first album titled “If You Can Believe Your Eyes And Ears”? LOL

  I’m looking at my original Dunhill album with a picture of the four of them in the bathtub and the precious vinyl recording inside in all it’s glorious monophonic sound! Going to now put it on the turntable to flashback to wonderful memories from 47 years ago when not only was the song released but the Mets had just pulled off the biggest deal of their short four year history – getting Ken Boyer from the Cardinals for Al Jackson and Charlie Smith. I was a kid then so the trade had me all excited, but today I would look at it as the Mets again only acquiring another over the hill all-star on his way down. But back then, while we were not California Dreaming, we were dreaming about reaching heights above the cellar for the first time.
• Lareplus December 14, 2012 at 12:08 am

  Not only that, it is one of the worst jobs of lip synching I have ever seen. .
  • Joey D. December 14, 2012 at 12:36 am

    Hi Lare,

    You know, I always wondered why they lip synced so often when appearing on really big shoes (err, shows) like Ed Sullivan. That was usually restricted to lower budgeted shows oriented toward teenagers like Bandstand, Where The Action Is, syndicated ones like Lloyd Thaxton, Hollywood a Go-Go and occasional acts on prime time shows ones like Hullabaloo or Shindig.

    Funny story about lip syncing in his book “Rock, Roll and Remember”. Dick Clark wrote about a group appearing on his Saturday night ABC program. They did not realize the afternoon performance which was also in front of an audience was only a dress rehearsal and thus when the broadcast began, Dick introduced them, the curtain went up, the vocals would be heard and there was an empty stage. Of course, I do not know how true that story is because I cannot imagine the host not being informed by the time the curtain rises of one of the acts not being there and all the stage hands going on with their duties without noticing it as well.

    But does sound like something this particular Met organization would be capable of doing …. LOL
• DrDooby December 14, 2012 at 5:24 am

  I´ve brought this up before – but patience also resulted in the Mets only ever dynasty of the mid to late 1980s.
  When Frank Cashen & Co. took over in 1980, they inherited a shallow MLB roster, a mediocre farm system and the # 1 pick in the 1980 draft which was an easy call for Darryl Strawberry. He had no real financial restraints.
  While he made a half-hearted effort to keep the major league team competitive with a few “smear lipstick on a pig” shortterm moves like signing LH Randy Jones or trading for Dave Kingman and George Forster. Of course, those moves utterly failed as the Mets kept losing in the first four years of the Cashen tenure. Of course, trading away fan favorite Lee Mazzili for two non elite prospects (Darling & Terrell) and later Terrell for Howard Johnson actually hurt shortterm on both occasions. Also, giving away future stars Jeff Reardon & Mike Scott for fringe major leaguers in the early 80s looked bad in retrospect.
  However, he stayed PATIENT, let his team build up the talent base of the farm system gradually while making bold & big moves when the time was right, i.e. mid 1983 (in his 4th season on the job) getting Keith Hernandez and after 1984 getting Gary Carter and after 1985 getting Bob Ojeda and Ray Knight, trading away a bunch of homegrown young players or prospects like Neil Allen, Hubie Brooks, Floyd Youmans, Calvin Schiraldi & others.

  So, you can blame Alderson for not smearing enough shorttem lipstick on the pig that is and has been the Mets major league roster. Last winter´s small scale moves like adding Francisco, trading for Torres & Ramirez mostly failed. The moves in the previous winter like signing Hairston, Capuano or Isringhausen mostly worked.
  They all had in common that they – purposely – had no longterm impact. And this winter anything beyond possibly trading Dickey for longterm pieces and otherwise signing leftovers to shorttem deals to fill out the roster also makes little sense in the big picture.

  Or would you rather have this alternate universe scenario:
  1. Wilpons suddenly find money and push the 2013 budget up to 125 million (i.e. 45 million to spend)
  2. Sign Michael Bourn (let´s say, 5-years, 75 million $) & Raffael Soriano (4-years, 40 million $) to risky longterm contracts. But to have more available to spend in 2013, let´s backload the Bourn & Soriano deals a bit, so they only cost a combined 15 instead of 25 million this year
  3. Trade Jon Niese, Zach Wheeler (he must be a hack anyway if Alderson & Co. got him – after all, any idiot would have been able to get him for two months of compensation free Carlos Beltran) & Wilmer Flores for Justin Upton ?
  4. Sign RHP Shaun Marcum as a rotation replacement for Niese to a 3-year, 39 million $ contract
  5. To improve the bullpen, trade Michael Fulmer & Rafael Montero (two more hack Alderson signings) to CLE for RHP Chris Perez
  6. Also re-sign Kelly Shoppach (2-years, 5 million $)
  7. Also re-sign Scott Hairston (2-years, 10 million $)
  8. Last but not least, sign a LOOGY, say LH Tom Gorzelanny to a 1-year deal at 1.5 million.

  Your 2013 Mets:
  SP: Dickey – Santana – Marcum – Harvey – Gee
  RP: Soriano – Perez – F.Francisco – Parnell – Edgin – Gorzelanny – Hefner
  Lineup:
  1) Bourn, cf
  2) Murphy, 2b
  3) Wright, 3b
  4) Davis, 1b
  5) Upton, rf
  6) Duda, lf
  7) Tejada, ss
  8) Thole, c
  Bench:
  Shoppach, c
  Hairston, of
  Baker, of
  Turner, if
  Valdespin, if

  Payroll in 2013: 125 million
  Is that a playoff team ?
  In 2013 ?
  In 2015 ?
  In 2017 ?
  Projected payroll going into 2014 (assuming Dickey gets extended at 12 million per year) with salary spikes for Wright, Bourn, Upton, Soriano and arb raises for Davis, Tejada, Gee, Parnell : roughly 120 million (including money deferred to Bay).
  So, if your budget stays at 125 million, you have 5 million left to spend to replace Santana, Francisco, Perez and Gorzelanny who are all free agents. Or hope that your budget gets bumped up to 140 million for 2014, so you can sign, say Tim Lincecum as a free agent next winter.

  See where the problem is ?
  If you spike up the payroll before you´re ready to win and have an affordable young core in place, you have to be able & willing to add to it every year to keep things going while ending up with a roster that gets older & older & more expensive every day.
  Also, all these signings mean the Mets lose their regular 1st & 2nd round picks in the 2013 draft besides trading 4 of their current top 8 prospects.
  Of course, this would be a perfect Steve Phillips plan. Have fun & go out with the babes and don´t think about any impact it´ll have tomorrow…
  • Joey D. December 14, 2012 at 9:48 am

    Hi DrDooby,

    You are right to bring it up again that patience is a virtue which did indeed lead to our longest era of being a top competitor. We can also add that at the beginning stage of that process the fans’ impatience can be brutal while cooler heads prevail.

    But I have been bringing up a point as well – one can only be judged on his own merits, not those of others.
  • Metsie December 14, 2012 at 2:04 pm

    Since when on Gods green earth has ONE WORLD SERIES become defined as a DYNASTY?

    I guess anyone who thinks Sandy has a good record due to his one WS in 89 needs to define it that way, but the rest of the world calls you a one and done….
  • Metsie December 14, 2012 at 2:05 pm

    And Patience had very little to do with it….
    What did is having 5 top 10 first rounders to work with which in the end resulted in only TWO players Gooden and Strawberry!
    • Joey D. December 14, 2012 at 2:40 pm

      Hi Metsie,

      Knew you were going to pick up on “dynasty” so that is why my answer referred to those years as our “longest era of being a top competitor.”

      I understand using past examples to back up one’s point – we all do that, however, in order to make a proper comparison – if there is indeed a pararall – one has to do his or her research to identify not just the similiarities but also the differences in regards to circumstances, approaches, individuals, outside factors, etc. before making a blanket statement.

      To dismiss that paints a false picture of history.
      • Metsie December 14, 2012 at 3:30 pm

        Well Joey if your going to do tha then your also saying we were one hit curveball away from Dynasty in 2006-2008 too….

        Perspective….

        I have no problems with how someone defines standards provided those standards apply to ALL assesment…

        I know lots of folks look to Cashen as a hero….
        I never did. He did what he did due to a decade of bad team losing and getting the best picks every year and he didn’t even make the right choice 50% of the time but it was enough to win!

        What did it in the end?

        Trading Kids for GOOD not GOOD for KIDS!

        Something these guys don’t want to acknowlege and just keep talking about Mazzilli as if it was the only trade that made it happen.
        • Joey D. December 14, 2012 at 3:40 pm

          Hi Metsie,

          When one thinks about it, if in addition to that hit curveball, had George Foster been able to just lift even a fly ball instead of a bases loaded grounder to third with one out forcing Mex at home in the first inning of that final game against St. Louis in 1985, it could have been a four year dynasty. When Foster all but killed that rally and we wound up scoring just one run that inning, I already felt the game was lost. It was a momentum breaker.
          • Metsie December 14, 2012 at 4:05 pm

            LOL Foster = the most expensive GDP in baseball! LOL
            Games turn on one play thats for sure…
            If foster drives in a run he becomes Ventura not goat….
            And then the acquisition of Foster becomes a very important one doesn’t it and what does that say bout the situation now?

            New GM coming in and by year three goes after players to help those kids he got the previous three to get to the championship….

            Bottomline he didn’t do it….
            And I have no problem with standards provided those standards are applied accross the board.

            Unfortunatly on these blogs people set two standards for pass and fail and tailor them to their agenda because if one was applied either both would pass or both would failand thats not in thier posting interests….

            Cashen was competent but he is not the GM god people make him out to be.
            He brought in McIlvane and Harazin who did the REAL long term damage to this team just as I suspect once Sandy gets fired DePo and the other two heads of our three headed monster will when they take over….

            Maybe we win another WS in 2019 just in time for Wright to retire on top.