27
2012
Phillies Sign Pierre, Mets Looking For LH Outfielder, Bay 2014 Option Is In Play
An article by Hojo's Mojo
The Phillies have announced that they have signed free agent outfielder Juan Pierre to a minor league contract and it includes an invitation to Spring Training. Pierre, 34, spent the 2011 season with the White Sox and batted .279 with 27 stolen bases while playing everyday in left field.
Yesterday, Jerry Crasnick of ESPN reported that the New York Mets are keeping a close eye on the available left handed hitting free agent outfielders which had included Juan Pierre as well as Raul Ibanez, Rick Ankiel, Kosuke Fukudome and Johnny Damon. Crasnick also added that the surplus of free agent outfielders who fit the Mets criteria will give the cash-strapped Mets some negotiating leverage.
With Jason Bay entrenched in left field and Lucas Duda projected to start everyday in right field, this may signal that Andres Torres could be sharing centerfield with a platoon mate. The Mets already had adequate backups in Scott Hairston and Mike Baxter, so thye may be looking for something more if Ankiel, Damon and Ibanez are on their radar.
Thoughts From Joe D.
Obviously the left handed hitting Duda will not be effected by such an acquisition, so this could also signal that Bay could lose some playing time against right-handed pitching in an attempt to keep him from reaching the 500 plate appearances that will help trigger his 2014 vesting option for $17 million. That option becomes guaranteed with 500 PA in 2012 and 2013. It’s interesting to note that while Pierre, Damon and Ankiel have each played centerfield in the past, neither of them did in 2011 and all of them have lost lots of range over the years. I’m thinking the Mets are looking ahead and making sure that Bay’s contract is definitely off the books in 2014.
About the Author: Rob Johnson
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I still think Bay has to play everyday, at least for the first eight weeks. The Mets have to be able to get something out of him to even dump him, let alone get something back of any value. It would be for the best to platoon him immediately, but then they’re stuck with him. I think the Mets need to do everything they can to try and get him off the team by July 31, and if that menas dealing with him killing the Mets for two months, it’s a risk they have to take.
I did not know that Jason Bay had a vesting option based on 500 plate appearances otherwise i would never have claimed that no way would he be platooning. Now that I know this NOW i can see the Mets making a move like this to prevent that from happening.
But if there is any semblance of a platoon it would be based on that vesting option and not for the reasons we argued about – which was an outright platoon.
That’s what happens when you don’t listen to the accountants…
Luckily, his splits are far apart enough to not have any issues in platooning him. If all of a sudden he’s put into a platoon situation and there is no justification (IE, he’s playing worse than someone else or he just can’t hit righties or lefties), that’s a lawsuit waiting to happen.
Obviously, if he’s ripping it up against both lefties/righties, well, then you are stuck with him, but at least he’d be getting paid to do the job they thought he was supposed to be doing.
You really had no idea about the vesting option? You need to pay closer attention.
“But if there is any semblance of a platoon it would be based on that vesting option and not for the reasons we argued about – which was an outright platoon.”
Do you think if Bay was performing at an adequate level, we’d be having this discussion? Bay hits well against lefties, but crap against righties. That is pretty much a platoon player.
Vesting Option 600 plate appearances in 2013 or 500 plate appearances in both 2012 and 2013.
Let the countdown begin just like the one for KROD last year.
Ok,what most of you fail to realize is that even with that vesting option there’s a thing called MLB union, if bay is healthy and producing to OF par and the mets start reducing his At bats just to avoid the option, the union could step in and FORCE THE METS to play him because the player is not hurt.. so pray for him to suck even more than he did or get hurt so he doesn’t reach those 500 at bats…
“if bay is healthy and producing to OF par” then there’s be no reason to sit/platoon him. But he’s not performing up to par, now is he?
He’s not but they have to show that there is a legitimate upgrade to keep the heat off. Hairston or Baxter won’t cut it.
Just have him start training now with the Mets trainers. That’s good for a pulled hammy or a torn something, thus insuring that this whole thing is moot.
Absolutely. Last year in 123 games he still managed over 500 plate appearances, so barring any injury, they would have to sit him a lot to avoid the contract. The one thing the MLBPA will not tolerate is trying to circumvent the contract.
Now no, but if in 2014 he starts producing what do you think will happen???? i know you’re slow, but come on, for once use your head… he can suck 3 years straight but if he produces for the first 300 at bats of the season and the mets star cutting his at bats for the option not to kick in the union steps in.. forcing the mets hand to play him… a 280 15 50 is a good season for the union.. hell, a great season…
If he produces in 2014, the point would be moot because the option would have already vested. You’re talking yourself into circles. You’re confusing yourself. Do try to keep up.
Also, if he sucks for three straight years, the union has no leg to stand on when into the fourth year, he sees less time. .280, 15, 50 is a good season for the union? What about .279, 50 RBI and 27 steals from a leadoff guy? That a good season for the union? Because I’m still waiting to hear the collusion rumors on why Pierre only got a minor league contract.
Uhh, because he’s a free agent, we’re talking vesting option.. you’re really that stUP**!!!!!!!!!!!!
LoL, that’s the best you got? I’m stupid because you can’t talk enough baseball to win a debate?
ok, answer yourself this question, why would the union step in for pierre when he’s a free agent? as a player is your choice to sign with the team you want at the $ you want. unless it exceeds the salary by a huge margin, case in point, CC sabathia, who got an offer from the brewers of $100 million but the yankees offer was $160 million, he wanted to stay in milwaukee but the union was not gonna allowed that to happen.. get it?
Dump Jason BUM asap!!!!! I’ll take a bucket of baseballs for him
Hmm….When you say dump Jason Bay are you thinking that he should be released? You still have to pay him and right now you have no one better, do you? It is obvious that no other team wants to trade for him right now with his contract so I am guessing that the right thing to do is to see if the new dimensions of the ballpark work out for both he and David. The guy hustles, plays good defense and is an excellent base runner.
Tell you what I’ll take the bucket of baseballs and sell you the Brooklyn Bridge!
Snap out of it, man or is it just that you like bashing?
It really needs to be for Bay. Unless he has some kind of immediate and impressive resurgance vs. RHP, he will not be the everyday left fielder for long.
And it has nothing to do with contracts or $. Purely based on baseball reasons (as in, he has been terrible vs. RHP since he joined the Mets).
if that trend continues, he will be platooned at some point. Not having to worry about his option vesting will just be a side benefit.
I did not know about the 500 PAs. There is no way that Bay should be allowed to cross that threshold. Plus given his slumps atplate, players union cant argue if Mets cut his PT. Nice catch Joe D.
Good point Joe. First, Ibanez plays LF NOT CF. And if Ankiel has lost range, then it seems likely that a move like this would be to primarily ensure that Bay’s 2014 contract clause doesn’t kick in. i luv Johnny Damon, but i’ve head there are questions whether he can play any OF position for very long at this point. He’s now an AL-type player. A clutch, gritty player, but a DH currently.
Ankiel sounds like the best ‘fit’ of the 3 guys mentioned.
Plus he can pitch!!! kidding…
All Pierre got was a minor league deal? If that is all he got the Mets should have stepped in. He could have brought some speed to this club who is now lacking it without Beltran, Reyes and Pagan.
That’s right,
The guy hits .279 with speed and gets signed to a minor league contract. The lowest he ever hit was .275, Mets need a leadoff hitter but Sandy likes to sign guys who hit .213 and pitchers with ERAs around 6.00 for cheap. He doesn’t get good ballplayers for cheap. But he uses sabermetrics/advanced statistical analysis while all the other GMs get the players the Mets should be getting at the prices that would be just right for the Mets
What a genius, what a progressive thinker Sandy is.
He’s got speed but no power and plays lousy defense. and, he’s 34, so that speed is going to be an issue. Aren’t you one of the ones who goes on about “driving in runs” and losing games on bad defense?
Perhaps there is a very good reason he couldn’t sign a big league deal.
the Mets need someone with some pop in their bat and Pierre does not fit that bill.
well when you have no money then signing a Juan Pierre who is 34, stole almost 30 bases last year and NEVER hit below .275 in his career who is not the best defensive CF – to minor league contracts – becomes a good move. It’s better than signing 28 year old journeymen who hit .213
oh, forgot to add one thing – especially when it could be a fit for your team and their specific needs
What need? Dropped balls in the outfield?
Would he have been a interesting signing to stash in Buffalo? Sure.
But, I really am not clamoring for him. 28 other teams wouldn’t even give him a minor elague deal.
28 teams passed over him? That’s your beef? What the hell kind of players have been almost 98 percent of Sandy’s signing? All other teams passing over them.
smh.
Pierre is just one guy that was passed over by 28 teams that is better than MOST of the other guys that Sandy signed that have been passed over by 28 teams
Except for Capunao who just signed 2 year $10 million deal.
and andres torres does?? ruben tejada and josh thole do??? please … stop it… don’t try to come here and defend him, he’s the worst GM in the history of the mets..
Torres plays defense. We need that in CF with Duda playing RF.
I have no idea what Thole or tejada have to do with Juan Pierre.
We didn’t have much speed in the second half (and it is not like Beltran was a base stealing amchine anyway), yet we scored more runs than we did in the first. That is with no Beltran and Reyes either injurred or not unning.
Defense was one of the big concerns last year and Juan Pierre does not resolve that. At all.
The problem with that Clayton, and others, is that you’re assuming Pierre WANTED to play for the Mets because of course he would over the Phillies. The whole point of free agency is to give the player the right to choose where they want to play. A minor league deal with an invite isn’t as appealing when you’re looking at a possible last place team or close to it.
You can say that about any player you wanted that signed somewhere else. We all don’t know where these guys want to play. You can speculate but you don’t know. Just sounds like another person taking a bullet for their beloved Sandy.
So how do YOU know if he was or wasn’t offered the very same deal then? What would be some of the reasons to join the Phillies over the Mets for an exact deal. I can’t believe you cannot see the obvious reasons. Instead you resort to as usual calling names. What are you a child? If there’s no money in the till and all you have to offer is a minor league deal for a player, what do you expect any GM to do? Maybe if they printed out cards titled Major League Baseball Player with Pierre’s name on it. Yeah that would seal the deal.
Spector: Both the Tigers & Mets had spoken to Pierre’s agent. So since he only signed a minor league contract… that’s enough evidence for any logical person to understand that he saw a better opportunity even with a minor league deal with Philly.
The Mets showed interest, Pierre made his choice.
Perhaps Sandy should have taken him out to dinner though
A steak dinner, business cards and a seat on the plane next to the bathroom and Pierre would have been ours! THE HUMANITY!!!!! WHYYYYYYYY?!?!?
Oh, the Mets SPOKE to his agent? Is this another jesslt LIE, another jesshlt spin job, another jesslt talking out of both sides of his mouth?
Everyone on this site by now knows to take this bum for his word, right?
Or were the Mets and Tigers LINKED to Pierre?
I guess for Sandy Lovers that’s all the evidence you need that Pierre would not have come here.
“The Mets and Tigers have also been linked to the SFX client in recent weeks, though the Tigers’ interest in adding position players has diminished now that they’ve added Prince Fielder.”
What do you think that means? Do you think that means Sandy Alderson sent Pierre’s agent an e-card paired with a “poke” on Facebook and a LinkedIn Request?
Jerry Crasnick: “The #Mets are diligently monitoring the LH-hitting OF market: Damon, Fukudome, Ankiel, Ibanez and Pierre.”
How exactly are you thinking they monitor a market without talking to an agent who sets the market?
The force. Get with the program dude.
The Mets spoke to Pierre’s agent? Care to back that up???
Well first of all we BOTH don’t know what was in Pierre’s head. There ARE players who would take the lesser team because it increases their chances to play. If Pierre wins the backup job to Victorino than good for him. He had a better chance of winning the starting job with the Mets. And don’t give me the “no money in the till” line – I’ve addressed that about 892 times today alone and probably 2,356 times on this site.
What part of “spending better with the same amount of money” do you NOT understand. I think you refuse to. Oh and I called you names? Where?
And how many more filler signings of guys that hit .214 and pitchers with ERAs of 6 do you have to see, while other teams are signing players that can help them win, at the same price as Mets can afford, before you start rubbing your eyes?
The guy doesn’t play center anymore so there is no room for him on the roster to try and “comeback”.
Ohhhhhhhhh,
Never mind the thought that “hey, we’re broke, this guy is a lifetime .296 hitter we can get for a minor league deal and we need help in CF and he’s played it before so it’s worth a shot”
Your mind is already made up that just because he hasn’t played it recently, and depending on a team’s specific needs, that he can never play it again. Sure.
Oh never ever think that thought process could be a possibility. But you love your Sandy and have to defend him, i know.
See again you make many assumptions about how I think but you are always far from the truth. Just in your “Sandy Saves” world.
The team absolutely needs a CF, no doubt. Pierre hasn’t been that guy for a very long time. As for the almighty lord Sandy and trading Pagan, that trade only works if the team got another CF, not Torres in there full time. Have said it other places and maybe even said it to you but you don’t read what people say you only assume what they say.
I hate Pagan and wanted him gone, but Torres is a downgrade. Which makes sense because the improvement came in the bullpen. BUT you don’t make that trade and leave Torres in CF full time. They would of been better served dropping pagan and signing a 2m CF and another 1m BP arm.
How many more times do I have to type something against what Sandy did for you to believe I don’t suck him off and I am more objective like many others over here. You just don’t give anyone a chance to have a say.
I get your point that taking less to get more playing time can be attractive but how do you see Pierre getting 350+ at bats with Bay, Torres, Duda and even Hairston? How would THAT be an incentive to come to a team that is so much of a paraiah ESPN won’t show them at all on a Sunday this coming season? Yet you believe Pierre would choose the Mets over the Phillies. I literally don’t know what to say to you man. You win.
easy, easy, easy, easy now
You already have Pierre’s season playing out. But you have to defend your Sandy to the death, I understand.
Who the hell is Torres that he suddenly rates a guaranteed major league gig???? The guy’s a career journeyman and part time player on his 4th MLB team. He’s 34 and lifetime .244 hitter and a .318 obp Sandy traded for him so he must be a stud. I get it.
Well MM he’s basically a slightly older version of Pagan with more power, less of a slap hitter, but a much better defensive player with better baseball instincts. So in comparison to who’s he’s replacing, yes he’s a stud by default. I don’t expect him to do anything overly spectacular, just hold his own and not make so many foolish mental mistakes Pagan was known for,
For the record, I never said he would chose the Mets over the Phillies, just stated that if the guy is accepting a minor league deal, and chances are he could have gotten something much better, the Mets should have tried to have made a run at him.
Whether they did or not is unknown, but obviously they did not make him a significant offer large enough to want to go to Flushing on an assumed MLB contract.
I would think in general a free agent would take a guaranteed MLB deal over a minor league contract with an invite to ST. But who knows, maybe the minor league deal was a formality so that they can keep their 40 players on the roster without the risk of losing any until the regular season. Could be a lot of things.
Good job Clayton,
We just don’t know.
And yet you have a strong opinion that you share frequently and loudly.
Then why do you make all these assertions like you do know what happened?
sigh………….the stupidity continues to lag around here
I give OPINIONS on what I think should happen and has happened. Since we DON’T KNOW what transpired with Pierre..for all we know maybe they said they’ll come here for a couple bucks more and Sandy gave back a sarcastic response…..IF…IF Sandy himself spoke and IF Sandy spoke to the agent cuz we don’t know that either and since WE DON’T KNOW I will form an opinion.
Now we’re getting into other areas outside of baseball. This happens all the time on this site in with these saber geeks and it winds up going on forever.
To the intelligent baseball people here – you know what i’m talking about.
All of your frustration would go away if you just didn’t….give your opinion.
clayton, did you select a school yet? you will be such an asset wherever you go…
even if Bay were to have a decent year, he would still be overpaid in 2013. I am for shorting him on the ABs. A contract is a contract. They tried to leverage the mets. the mets are perfectly within their rights to work the contract the way they want. Anyway, he might just get hurt and take care of everything.
If Sandy Alderson was able to sign all the good, cheap ballplayers that OTHER teams have been signing then maybe the Mets would start looking a little competitive for the Wild Card again and instead of the geeknoids and stat head hoping guys like Bay, Santana, & Wright produce for the sake of moving them for “prospects” or “dumping salaries”..the rest of us would be hoping for them to have good seasons for the…….gasp…sake of WINNING.
Not anymore. Sandy is doing a TERRIBLE job again and his legions of androids all march in unison like the North Korean army all supporting the TERRIBLE job he’s doing because …..I don’t know why they support it – i guess because they all like sabermetrics and moneyball before baseball.
That must be it. You’re right again.
all the ballplayers that are so good they can only get a MiL deal?
Everything. He hit it right on the nose.
that’s right, he falls right into the mold of the type of players Sandy has been signing since arriving – players that every other team doesn’t want..except Pierre is better than most of those.
Which is why he waited until January 27th to sign a minor league deal for barely above league minimum.
yep, only a few days after Prince Fielder signed. Heck Rick Ankiel and Edwin Nunez are still out there. Oh but that’s different since they are FAs and not minor league signings. All signings must follow an order of relevance.
Let’s see:
- Juan Pierre
- Brad Lidge
- Blanco for 1.25 million or heck..if you’re gonna sign Rob Johnson who’s career high AVG is .213 you may as well go after Pudge Rodriguez and pair any of them with Thole
- Keep the Ramirez for Pagan trade, and substitute another ballplayer/minor leaguer for Torres
- That 12 million for Francisco? Use that for a starter
- Maybe another trade or 2?
IF Alderson was able to have the type of offseason like that – THEN maybe I’d say hey this guy is starting to do a good job and show that he wants to win no matter what. But naturally that’s not the case since the Mets now do things like the Oakland A’s
I do enjoy how you keep preaching that you want the Mets to focus on trying to win now but are mad they gave Francisco a contract instead of signing Brad Lidge.
You prefer old and unhealthy to younger and healthy. But then use injuries as an excuse for why the Mets failed in years past.
Very interesting.
I wonder at what point do you put your personal hatred for a man you don’t know aside and actually just root for the Mets?
I wonder at what point do you put your personal hatred for a man you don’t know aside and actually just root for the Mets?”
the same day you stop rooting for the atlanta braves, the mets biggest rivals…
i don’t root for stupidity. The guy is doing a TERRIBLE JOB and EVERYBODY should be angry at the awful job this clown is doing, not to mention the terrible PR with his disposition and TERRIBLE job at enthusing a fan base.
Sorry but that’s just your opinion, which is the reason that everyone is not angry with this current FO right now.
Big picture…..
I am looking at the big picture – again, you of all people should stay out of it – you don’t belong.
Why?
If we took a poll right now, I’d bet the ranch on which poster would be voted off the island….
Oh, and the big picture hasn’t changed. I’m talking about smarter use of the money the Mets have to compete. Doesn’t effect big picture at all and as a matter of fact if there were smarter decisions made with the money the Mets have it would be BETTER for the big picture!!
Again, stay out of it, you don’t belong.
Sorry pal, but you’ve got no say on who posts here and who does not.
Just pass over my comments if you can’t handle them. No need to respond.
They complain and complain about the reclaimation projects the Mets sign, and then get their panties in a bunch when Brad Lidge goes elsewhere. It’s not about baseball with them, that’s been clear for hte better part of a year now.
You know Jessup I try to avoid commenting on what the usual suspects have to say because it’s so unoriginal it’s a joke. But every now and again I like dip my toe in the kiddie pool and see what those in the “core” are complaining about which is usually what money Alderson hasn’t spent from his Monopoly set today.
Bayonne, sandy alderson had a good day when he overpai…errr, acquire francisco and rauch… and traded pagan for ramirez and gave CF to andres torrez…
I think it’s quite clear that so far the guy is a flat out TERRIBLE GM and doing an awful job. If this happened 20 years ago the guy would be RIPPED apart in the papers and on his way out for such a HORRENDOUS job he’s doing
Don’t know what happened to him between now and 1989 but the guy is simply a BAD general manager.
bayonne,i’ve said it from the get go, he’s been the worst GM in the history of the new york mets… the worst..
While I agree I would have liked to have seen a couple more trades, the other one’s I’m not against.
- Francisco only counts for 6 this year.
- Blanco, no thanks. I don’t think he’s got 70 games in them knees. I would assume much less than that as well. Pudge does intrigue me, I will say.
- Lidge really doesn’t do much for me. The Phils offered even less than a million for him, so that should say something. Usually the team an FA is coming from that is offering little to no money should be a red flag, knowing what they know medically.
- Pierre would have been a nice signing. Now, if you are Pierre, would you want to sign with the Mets or the Phils at this point. We don’t know if Sandy was sniffing around on that one or not, so can’t say much. I’d say it was a nice signing had the Mets signed him.
And I would like to have seen something better in the starting rotation/6th starter. Wouldn’t mind seeing Zack Duke of all the dregs that are left, but the remaining options are pretty crappy to say the least.
um…I KNOW that 6 million is only for this year. It’s still 12 million spent. I guess now I have to break things down into even more detail.
- I disagree on Blanco plus he would be a boost to this pitching staff and mentoring Thole
- Lidge is the type of move you make when you’re broke, not Francisco. Plus Lidge has been through the wars and can help Parnell and others.
How many more mentors before people realize Thole just sucks.
Blanco is hanging out in Arizona enjoying the weather on a first place team and I think he is digging that. Lots of assumptions that the Mets have the ability to sign anyone if they would just spend.
Everyone wants to play for the Mets. Didn’t you know that? Who wouldn’t want to play on a broke team two years away minimum whose owners are being sued? Picking playoff teams like Philly and Arizona is just stupid.
Obviously that statement by XtremeBS has NOTHING to do with what we are discussing and that is Pierre would have been a nice minor league signing for the Mets. Nowhere in this blog post has anybody alluded that ballplayers want to play for the Mets and since we do not know that Lidge, Pierre, and anybody else that Sandy has MISSED OUT on – since we do know know what they are thinking..than XtremeBS can post these response like he usually does when he runs out of ideas – off topic short retorts.
well, missed out on certainly implies that he had the option to get them, so they would have wanted to sign here.
and none of us know which of these guys the FO reached out to about exploring a deal.
You’re the one that brought up Blanco sweet teets.
As for Pierre, isn’t that the equivalent of what Torres is, but Torres can play center at this point? This is really not the type of player you want when Bay and Duda are in the corners and will see most of the time. This team needs more power not more week hitting 4th outfielders.
What is Lidge going to teach Parnell how to choke even more? Lidge is the guy where you got pieces in place and are throwing money to take a chance. The last thing the Mets bullpen needs are reclamation projects. They need arms to absorb all those games where they come into the fifth.
I’m with you on what’s left for pitching. But there’s no denying we really need some SP depth.
Pierre plays awful defense. you want him next to Duda? That is why Torres was in the Pagan deal.
You’re upset over Brad Lidge? why? He’s old and broken.
Again, Henry Blanco? Hes 40 and not very good. He can’t handle a platoon with Thole.
it’s your opinion that he’s not very good and can’t handle a platoon – Thole would be getting most of the playing time anyway
For my response to Lidge see my response to NJSTUCKTEX. I’m of the opinon he can help and we don’t know what he’s gonna do but Brad Lidge types are the type you sign when you’re broke.
Pierre would have been a good signing for a broke team.
“it’s your opinion that he’s not very good and can’t handle a platoon ”
No, it’s a documented fact.
” I’m of the opinon he can help and we don’t know what he’s gonna do but Brad Lidge types are the type you sign when you’re broke.”
Yes, but you can’t sign them all. I have no idea why you think succss hangs on Brad Lidge.
It is one thing to say “I’d take a flier on Lidge”. It is another to piss and moan because soemone else signed him to a minor league deal
Donal — Henry Blanco would do a great job with guys like Mike Pelfrey. He can help Mike by calling pitches, framing them, blocking low balls, and most importantly throwing out guys trying to steal. Used properly, Henry would have been a good choice. Though I think Sandy is doing the job asked of him by the Wilpon’s, he missed a good one in Henry Blanco.
Unless Pierre is coming to platoon everyday with Bay he is not doing much for the Mets. Like Joe said he didn’t play CF last year and in fact according to B.R. he has played all of 29 games in CF the last 3 years combined.
I am more concerned about the depth at CF then a platoon person for Bay myself so I would prob lean more toward Ankiel who according to B.R. has at least played CF last year. 105 games worth.
I was wondering the same thing about Pierre, since I was pretty sure he had been relagated to LF at this point.
There is usually a reason a guy has to accept a MiL invite deal, and it usually is not because he is really good.
But of course any minor league invite that Sandy procures makes sense, right?
Another HYPOCRITE defending their GOD ahead of just wanting to win in baseball.
LET THE BLIND DEFENSE OF SANDY COMMENCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If the Mets discussed a minor league offer to Pierre, then what would you say?
If the Mets and the Phillies offered you a minor league deal and you felt you could contribute on a big league level, which offer would you take?
You’re acting like they didn’t even look into Pierre when reports indicate you are (wait for it) wrong. Since reports indicate the Mets and Tigers were talking with Pierre.
I actually enjoy your posts at this point. Everyone is just more foolish than the last.
But no, he is not my God. And normally all MiL invites, including the ones the Mets get, are long shots to do anything and basically either suck or have serious injury concerns.
and some of the ones I like, some I don’t, but none of them are that big of a deal.
And you miss that point that you can be indifferent to a signing, meaning you are fine if they do or fine if they don’t. Lidge would be in that category. If they had signed him, I would have been fine with it and interested to see if he could offer anything. But, I don’t care in the least that he went elsewhere.
no big deal huh? We’re not going anywhere so no big deal right? Why even bother to try and get the best players u can with the money you have since it’s no big deal
If my posts are nonsense to you, and I don’t know who the hell you are or if you ever even experienced baseball outside of sitting in a seat then i just take your stupid mind set from where it comes
the MiL signings are by and large not a big deal. Same for any team. Mostly guys you don’t expect to need or just want for AAA filler and emergency depth.
sometimes one hits but that is not all that common.
but of course, they should try to get the best possible talent on these deals too. And it is far from clear that Lidge (or Pierre) even qualify as that.
…in your opinion – you forgot to finish off with that. There are those of us who, for a broke team, feel they would be better off giving Lidge 1 million or couple bucks more than spending 12 million on Francisco for 2 years – especially if you’re not planning on competing. At least Lidge is one year – in my opinion
But to you and other Sandy apologists – no. That is not an option.
It’s not en vogue here anymore to exchange ideas on what you think is best for the Mets because if it clashes with what Sandy Alderson thinks is best for the Mets you get scoffed at.
Sad state of affairs.
No people are more than free to exchange different ideas.
The problem is, you aren’t capable of doing that. You just go off on wild rants with insults and accusations and threats.
Seriously. you are losing your mind over Juan Pierre.
Wondering if has some nagging injury. Because he did start 152 games last year, all in LF.
As to the bay discussion vis a vis the Union, his #s for the last 2 years scream platoon player. If he gets a month of every day duty to start the season, and the results are consistent, then the mets will have perfect justification for platooning him.
If it works out that a young guy (IOW, part of the future) like Kirk is raking and making a case to get called up, even easier. And if the team is not looking competitive, then it becomes a no brainer.
The Mets publicly that I know have not even hinted at Bay platooning which is not to say they are not thinking it but I would think they will bend backwards to give Bay all the chances to establish himself as an everyday left fielder.
You have 3 outfielders Bay, Torres and Duda most likely making the team barring anything unforeseen. You have Hairston as a 4th OF off the bench. You will most likely only carry 1 more outfielder. Wouldn’t it make baseball sense to have it be a player that can play CF? Pierre in my opinion doesn’t fit that need.
Oh, I agree that they need someone else they can actually play CF, as opposed to give it the old college try like Bay or Hairston.
And Pierre does not fit that bill.
But, nothing to say it can’t be someone that also plays LF too vs. tougher RHP.
Agreed that indeed would be the best case scenario.
BMF: Can I ask a question without a fight erupting…. if you found out the Mets offered Pierre a minor league deal just as the Phillies did, then what?
OMG, HOW can you TRDMB people debate this Bayonne guy?
He must be 60+, and have an IQ of about 60-.
He doesn’t understand that people stopped evaluating players largely on BA about 30+ years ago.
He doesn’t understand that Alderson is totally hamstrung by Wilpon spending restrictions, and that what Alderson and his team are doing has NOTHING to do with Moneyball, and EVERYTHING to do with LACK of money ball.
Seriously, Bayonne is a loser numbskull of the first degree—why give him any credit? How can MF4D and Gary lower themselves to debate this fool?
Wow.
Sounds like you’re another unintelligent saber, sandy booster.
How dare we poke holes in the awful job Sandy is doing. Boy it’s so easy to just sit back and say “he has no money to work with” easy right?
Meanwhile almost on a daily basis good players are being signed at about the same prices that Sandy is using to get the Mets filler and complete JUNK.
You go to hell.
Whoever taught you how to discuss differing views must have been a mute.
You call people uneducated because they believe that what some of the best GMs in the sport practice is a valid baseline for talent evaluation.
So you call people uneducated because people from the Ivy Leagues are doing things you don’t agree with. Figure that one out.
What college did you go to?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHA you just got so reeled into that you fool.
If you think you are among those who know baseball well, then you are far more delusional than you even appear to be.
You worship BA but don’t seem to understand that OPS tells you everything that BA does AND A LOT MORE.
Getting a lot of singles–which is all Juan Pierre does with some SB thrown in–IS NOT more valuable than getting a lot less singles with lots of BB, 2B, and HR thrown in. Or being a really good fielder.
There’s not one scout on the planet who would take your inane and idiotic side in any of these debates.
Sure there are Saber-geeks who overstate things like UZR and BABIP—and you are every bit as ridiculous as they are.
But “go to hell” is indeed a bulletproof argument.
And saying Sandy has no money to work with is actual reality.
There are folks saying that the Mets are about to have one of the–if not THE–highest 1-year payroll decline ever.
But hey, Sandy is the worst GM ever ever ever ever ever.
No, YOU are the worst commenter ever.
Oh, and hi Alex!
Now they’re whining about Juan Pierre but if we had signed him we would be hearing how we got another cheap roster filler.He’d be the equivalent of putting Louie Castillo in CF. Not to mention he can’t play CF anymore.Yeah he stole 27 bases but he got caught 17 times and has led the league in CS 7-8 times.Just what we need,another baserunner giving up outs on the basepaths.He would however work well in softball where you can have 4 outfielders.
Juan Pierre has lost a step and is at the point in his career where he’ll be losing another. Father Time is unforgiving. Juan is a pretty good bunter though.
Very true Des.He can lay them down with the best of them/
HAHA Yes! Dude it’s so quite over there because people get there really isn’t anything of value to debate. So RDM people keep coming over here including TRS and now I am somehow trapped in this Maury Povich bizarro world. It’s a friggen train wreck and even my wife is starting to lose respect for me the past couple days that I’ve been here.
And your right we are arguing with a brick wall, there is no point. The worst is he runs away when he doesn’t bully someone and just spits at the next person.
HELP ME.
LOL.
We need a 12 step program to back away….
Oh and what the hell is Real Dirty Mets Blog, some privately started web site or blog created in a living room.. where the average or less than average fan fan who sits in the upperdeck – if they can afford to go – and drinks the beer they snuck in, can get involved and live their dream of writing about their favorite team?
I’m supposed to be impressed? Sorry no.
Are you high right now? Or drunk off busch light? Where is your head right now?
Now you’re knocking how other blogs are started? Forgive me Joe D if I am wrong but wasn’t MMO started on… myspace? You’re knocking a blog because it was started in a … living room?
Where was MMO started? In a high rise executive suite in Manhattan?
I love how you knock the fact that the blog in question is viewed by folks who can only sit in the upper deck. Most people today call those people the real fans, not the ones who can afford to sit on field level.
I believe you are right. I connected to this site back on the My Space days to get graphics to spruce up my wall. LOL MMO Also had the best Mets avatar on My Space and I wanted to make sure MR. Met was in my friends list.
You should stop by, you wouldn’t last 2 minutes.
HAHAHA!
I commented on Metsblog a little a while back, and Bayonne came there one day and was relentlessly mocked.
It was sad and funny at the same time.
I just had to stop by to have a bit of fun; I am out for the night soon, but Gary, I promise the site will be VERY happening soon, one spring training gets going and we can focus on the future.
Bayonne is a serious sadsack.
Cheers my friend!
Cheers right back at ya my friend!
You WILL be seeing me a lot more very soon at the cool kids’ Met site.
Life has been INSANE forever, but I WILL make time to be there often once ST gets underway.
Best to you and Mrs. Salty!
Its funny I never go to other blogs until BMF reacts negatively to them. So I just checked out RDMB, nice job
I am of course biased, as one of the original writers and founding members, but I modestly say that it really does present a lot of fine content, an AMAZING commenting community, and it will be much more lively once games start.
Other than me, the community there really is VERY wise and mature!
You should check it out once the season gets going. It’s amazing, you can have a difference of opinion with people and its respected and debated. Awesome place compiled from a bunch of us that got booted by Cerrone when he turned the comments off 3 years ago because he felt he was losing control. Cerrone even did a chat session at the blog in it’s first week to explain his position. Pretty funny how the place got created.
Oh, and as for dealing with Bayonne, remember what the wise sage TRS once so hilariously said back in the Metsblog days:
“….sometimes it’s fun to toy with idiots.”
Thank you, goodnight, and God bless.
TRS is a wise sage and I’m the dumb one?
The world turned upside down. But i am not affected by such unintelligence and blind ignorance because I take it from where it comes. A whole army of clowns that mean nothing to me.
mocked?
Because the very idea of this GM doing a lousy job has so infuriated a fanbase of home-made bloggers, morning newspaper experts, & fantasy baseball fans who confuse it with real baseball that they have nothing better to do than come after me. That’s fine I can handle it because they all mean NOTHING to me.
FYI, i can’t see it now but I had much more likes than dislikes, almost 2 to 1 so this clown can spin it anyway he wants. And I am not lying I do not do that.
Imagine, pointing out a GM’s mistakes and saying he is doing a terrible job and being outdone by other GMs. Who know that would garner so much frustration? That’s the way things are these days with saber and moneyball now in the equation. It’s less about clear baseball evaluation and more about philosophy and if you try to dispell that philisiophy you are mocked and scorn.
But that’s okay. I am not offended one bit. I will continue to ATTACK this front office, everyday if I have to, until I see better results. And I have a feeling there will be no better results. So get ready to mock me everyday saber goons because I am not going anywhere
No, it has nothing to do with your opinions. It is how you express them. How you present yourself and how you interact with others.
“So get ready to mock me everyday saber goons because I am not going anywhere”
Statements like that, and the fact that you mean it without any irony what so ever are why you get mocked.
I doubt the front office is concerned with you raging against the machine.
Looking forward to those posts,
Kingman.
“Oh and what the hell is Real Dirty Mets Blog, some privately started web site or blog created in a living room..”
What do you think MMO is?
“where the average or less than average fan fan who sits in the upperdeck – if they can afford to go – and drinks the beer they snuck in, can get involved and live their dream of writing about their favorite team?”
Wow, what a teewat .
Its better to be some loser in his living room commenting on those sites, stalking people and making comments about their family.
I knew you were an ignorant, insecure, loud mouthed, spineless, reactionary, self involved tool, I had no idea you were a snob on top of it.
TRS is the guy that runs real dirty blog? I had no idea or do i even care. I just thought he was just another avg joe who commented here. Oh wait, he is.
That’s supposed to impress me? Give me a break. Okay i think that’s the first and last time that I will ever mention that little bloggy thingy. Just another dope big on ambition and good for him for providing a little place for the average fan to live out their dreams. But when it comes to actual baseball knowledge him and his like are no different than most. Little numbers loving people who like to think they understand the game.
“That’s supposed to impress me? Give me a break. Okay i think that’s the first and last time that I will ever mention that little bloggy thingy. Just another dope big on ambition and good for him for providing a little place for the average fan to live out their dreams”
This says everything anybody needs to know about you.
You realize MMO is a bloggy thingy right? You realize YOU are an average fan right?
When you look in the mirror, do you see Jack Nicholson?
He eats breakfast 300 yards from 4000 Sabermetricians who are trained to annoy him. So don’t think you can come in here, flash an IP address and some fancy facts and make him nervous.
It’s amazing to me how few people connect Nathan R. Jessup to my handle of Jessep.
He sees himself as a superior human being who would make a better GM than Sandy. After all, he coached some young sandlot teenagers. LOL.
He’s an XBox,Playstation GM.He puts his MLB 2K team together by trading for the guys with the most RBI’s. No baseball IQ at all.
105 comments and counting on a post about a player that signed a minor league contract with another team. Joe D is it safe to say this post has had the highest hits today?
LOL, these comments are too funny.
A few days ago, I did a giveaway on MMO for a rare hat that was given as a gift to anyone who attended the BAT Dinner in 2010. I had been saving it as part of my Mets collection but decided to give it away to a lucky reader in a 1962 Mets trivia question contest.
After randomly choosing a winner the next day, I emailed the person to congratulate them and send me their mailing address. I also asked them to include their Facebook url so I can mention them on my wall.
Finally, about an hour ago I got a reply. She tells me how excited she is, how much she loves the site and included her mailing address. She also wrote something that struck me as odd, she said her mother won’t let her have a Facebook account, but she included her twitter instead.
Out of curiosity I went to her twitter page and discovered a sweet girl who loves the Mets and couldn’t be more than 14 or 15 years old. She reminded me of my nieces and god daughter.
Her profile pic was that of a wide-eyed teen in awe because she was taking a photo with R.A. Dickey in front of Citi Field.
The first thing that popped into my mind was how happy I was that she won. The second thing was the horrifying thought of how many times she must have come across comment threads like this one.
I really wish everyone would remember that your daughter, your niece, or even your little sister could be reading what you write here. Mets fans come in all ages. I hope this gives you pause the next time you hit the post comment button.
ya cut me deep joe, ya cut me deep
Agree 100%.
But I’m thinking this plea falls on deaf ears.
You sound like a very decent person. I wish I could say the same for some of the regular posters here. It’s sad really because you’ve built this site up so much over the years.
Yeah there’s a few,especially one who spew nothing but venom. I haven’t been commenting in months but it looks like I missed nothing.The same rants 2 months ago are still ongoing. Sad
Maria, I agree with you. there are guys here always ready to fight. just keep the faith as a fan, this summer all us real fans will have something to talk about!
Jaun Pierre is OK…..He certainly would be a better minor league signing than Tuiasosopo, Baxter, ect who have almost no chance of making any impact at the major league level. Pierre also would have brought some speed to this team because now without Reyes and Pagan we don’t have much team speed at all.
It would have been a nice signing.
Cardinals are close to signing Oswalt:
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2012/01/cardinals-close-to-agreement-with-roy-oswalt.html
If Oswalt’s healthy, that’s going to be a great move for them.
Pierre has horrid arm which makes him CF liability in what still is a big ballpark. In that regard he made no sense for the Mets.
And for Joe D. to claim Ankiel didn’t play center in 2011 is simply not true, indicates zero research or faulty effort at that. Ankiel played105 games worth including game-ending diving catch that robbed Reyes with game on the line.
Plus to say he’s lost range over the years when he’s barely played years as position player in the majors – 5 – and missed almost all of 2010 – implies he’s had far more time in the majors as outfielder than he has. I haven’t observed a notable difference in range from 2007-2011 when I’ve seen him, admittingly not a lot, but he’s looked solid to me. In fact, I’d take his D in a heartbeat. His problem are high K’s, low OBP and BA which presumably factors into his current unemployment.