4
2011
Mets Contact K-Rod
An article by 
This from the Hey Man…
Now that’s interesting…
Original Post 12/2
Before the Mets traded Frankie Rodriguez to the Brewers for two PTBNL’s they had the fourth best bullpen in the National League. K-rod was the closer of course, with Jason Isringhausen performing admirably as the setup man, and Bobby Parnell and Pedro Beato were thriving in lower pressure seventh inning duties.
Then, as I wrote on August 19, 2011, this happened:
So how is everyone enjoying the K-Rod-less bullpen so far? I mean of course you all must have expected some sort of a downgrade in performance after swapping out Rodriguez for Igarashi, but I don’t think anybody could have predicted these dreadful results. The bullpen as a whole has been a virtual catastrophe except for Izzy who may not even be back next season. The Mets went from having one of the better bullpens in the majors, to what is now officially the worst bullpen in the game in August.
As I’ve written previously, I never thought Bobby Parnell or Pedro Beato had the stomach to pitch with the game on the line. It takes more than just stuff to close out games and protect one-run leads in the 8th or 9th innings – you gotta have that killer instinct – that hard edge – that intimidation factor. All the great closers have it, and it’s not something you teach or grow into either.
Just reading some of the comments that were left in that post was kind of fun. Anyway, what’s done is done and now it seems we’re on the hunt again for not only a closer but a setup man as well. That’s life.
The reason I bring this up is because oddly enough, K-Rod’s name came up in yesterday’s conference call. Here is what Sandy Alderson had to say about that trade six months later.
My biggest disappointment going back to last year was just the way we finished the season. We finished poorly, we started poorly. Part of that was attributable to injury, but some of it was a result of weakening the team later for long-term benefit. I think for example, if we’d kept Frankie Rodriguez, we would have finished well over .500. I think that the lack of a closer cost us a number of games.
In the context of how hotly this subject was debated on MMO, with regards to the bullpen imploding soon after the trade and those who called it a coincidence or just a case of younger relievers experiencing dead arms, this at least validates what my own stance was all along, and that is that the trade absolutely destroyed the bullpen and wiped out the rest of the Mets season.
I was against the trade all along, but I did learn one thing since then and that is I don’t hold Sandy Alderson accountable for having to do what he was forced to do by the Wilpons.
About the Author: Joe DeCaro
I'm a lifelong Mets fan who loves writing and talking about the Amazins' 24/7. From the Miracle in 1969 to the magic of 1986, and even the near misses in '73 and '00, I've experienced it all - the highs and the lows. I started Mets Merized Online in 2005 to feed my addiction. Follow me on Twitter @metsmerized.
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I still don’t mind the trade. I think at the time they felt Izzy could handle it and they had more hope for Parnell and Beato. The problem wasn’t so much the lack of KRod it was the lack of guys who stepped up when they thought they could.
I don’t deny the fact a closer is valuable but KRod wasn’t worth $17.5 mil and if the Wilpon’s felt they couldn’t pay that and had any hint they would get stuck with that deal, then they had to move him.
I’d also argue that the fact they only got 2 PTBNL is a sign of what his trade value was. It was no secret the Mets wanted to trade him, everybody knew it. So why was this all they could get?
And I still think the whole locker room situation rubbed Fred the wrong way and from that day on they wanted KRod gone. Heck, they even tried to be able to cut him without owing him the $
Agreed. The two guys who got under Freddie’s skin were K-Rod and Paul Lo Duca. He tried to and succeeded getting rid of both. Their departure was also helped by their declining performance at on the field. It was a couple of perfect storms.
Too bad that Fred’s behavior doesn’t rub Fred the wrong way, and then he might get rid of himself!
Anyway, the Mets were not going to make the playoffs with K-Rod closing, and at least they found out that Parnell was not the answer to the closing problem in 2012.
Are you recommending a Jack Kevorkian solution for Freddie? Then we’d be dealing with Jeff. It’s sort of like cutting off your nose to spite your face. Anyway, the whole Dr. Death thing hurts.
Nothing that drastic, but can’t Fred, Jeff, and Saul be sent to Milwaukee (Bud Selig’s town!)?
Even with K-Rod who was shaky but still converted 23 outt 27 save opportunities the pen still blew 17 games leading after 6 innings.The bottom line is if Collins didn’t use K-Rod in one sided games like that Thursday afternoon blowout loss to the Cubs when he brought in K-Rod to get the final 2 outs in the bottom of the 8th down 5 runs and got credit for a game finished in a blowout loss.He did that at least 3 times on the road in the 8th trailing,plus using him in non save situations 4-5 run leads in the 9th inning.When you have a closer with a crazy option hanging over his head you don’t use him in situations like that.You use him when the game is on the line.If Collins managed K-Rod a little better then they wouldn’t have had to worry about trading hm to get out from under that ridiculous option.We could’ve kept him all year and then declined his 2012 option.
For those who were celebrating saving those $17.5 for this season, well, where is that money being put into as most of you had said?? also, those who were saying that parnell was ready, well, what happened to that as well??? from one of the best to arguably the worst bullpen in the league, thanks sandy, and joe D, he was forced to?? so, can we then finally say the man is not here for baseball reason but financial reasons????
baseball reasons aren’t looked at 1 year at a time by a GM. He has to balance the current season along with the future.
KRod was a good closer as a Met. The trade was about as obvious a salary dump as you can get. Don’t know how much better the team would of been had he never been traded but clearly KRod was performing his job well up to the time he was traded.
You certainly cannot knock Krod’s ability. He was a good closer for the Mets. That said, it was the right move in trading him. Knowing that practiaclly the entire budget for the offseason seems to be around 17 mil or so, it becomes quite obvious that 1 Krod vs. a catcher + a couple pitchers + a bench guy or two is certainly an easy choice.
Or KRod vs. reyes.
True true.
well, in this context “well over” could easily mean 84 wins.
Did they finsih with fewer wins than they could have? Reasonable to assume. Did it make the difference between nowheresville and the playoffs? highly unlikely.
so, they made the decision that they did not have the horses to make the playoffs, so they did a move to benefit 2012.
As to where the money is going, none of us really know. But, if Frankie was getting 17.5 this year, most likely the shot at Reyes would be gone. And at minimum.
until we see who gets brought in, we really won’t know the opportunity cost.
also, you really can’t assume that the guys that died down the stretch would have been wonderful instead if Frankie just happened to be kicking around for the 9th.
They made the decision they didn’t have the horses, so instead of doing their job, like good GMS do and bring in the horses to contend they quit. ALDERSON and his side kicks QUIT. And with the fold-, job the Braves did they could have contended with a good GM. And while you say the 17.5ip group. mil is going to Reyes, which can’t happen since Sandy the snob won’t even talk to Reyes’ folks, where is the money going… and what about the 16 mil or so that Beltran made. Where is that going? Its all going to the crooked ownership group and the over paid fired GMs Alderson hires to pal around with. Meanwhile the fans get the finger and the apologists smile and say we don’t care because all of Omar the terrible’s draft picks will be stars. Someday…. Rgiht…Maybe with the next GM and a new ownersh
So you’d prefer that the Mets GM plan his entire future based on an assumption that a team that made the playoffs the year prior and had the 4th highest win % in the sport on July 30th would eventually collapse?
The Mets were constantly teetering on the .500 mark, the best they were was 3 games over at the end of July right? They never got over the hump. The Braves showed NO signs of being in trouble until early September in Philly.
When you have Ace 7 in your hand you don’t go all in hoping that the guy with 2 Kings will forget how to play poker
Well, actually, I wasn’t surprised that the Braves fell apart – I thought there was just NO WAY the bullpen was going to keep that up the whole year(and I remember telling you that)….And guys like Jurrjens were just playing way of their heads, I knew he wasn’t going to pitch like THAT the whole year.
I knew once their pitching came back to earth, they would fall apart because their offense wasn’t really good at all.
So then why didn’t they fall apart last year? From 2010 through Sept 3, 2011 they were the 2nd best team in the NL behind the Phillies…
And I’m sorry Vinny you can use hindsight all you want but on August 30th the braves were on pace to win 95 games.
I refuse to believe you would have bet your job on the fact they’d collapse enough for a team on pace for 85 wins in September to beat them for a playoff spot.
You don’t build a team’s future on hope. If you’re the Mets you don’t go all in because “hey maybe we’ll get lucky in September.”
People act like because the Braves fell apart that suddenly the Mets were also better than STL, ARI, SF as well. The Mets would have needed FOUR TEAMS to suffer significant collapses to have a chance.
I’m not using hindsight. I said at that time that their pitching wouldn’t have kept it up a full season.
How am I using hindsight if I said that before they fell apart?
Part of the reason for both the Beltran and K-Rod trades was that the Wilpons needed cash money for signing bonuses for the both the Rule 4 draft and IFA last season and the Wilpons saved app. 5MM last season on both Beltran and K-Rod salaries which they applied to the draft. I don’t think that most of you realize that NOW the Wilpons are absolutely, positively convinced that you get the most bang for your buck from a homegrown 0 to 5 year player and not FA after getting burned badly in FA with Pedro, Blowweis, Alou,Ollie,Castillo& Bay and really not getting their money’s worth in a expensive trade for Santana. And the really current draft and development theme and edict ( You did notice the additional scouts that Sandy just brought in and that were announced yesterday) is coming down from the Wilpons. The Wilpons now rather spend 14MM in the 1st year player draft and IFA than on any 1 ML player. But now the new CBA.
one way to look at it.
another way is they realized the team is flat broke, so they had to do something to stay afloat, and you still need players.
Anybody that believes the Wilpons know anything about the business of baseball must be a Wilpon or a Katz. Scouts are a dime a dozen and the Wilpon’s didn’t break any records with their draft signings. or their IFA singings.
Losing K-Rod last year had the same affect that Losing Wags in 07 did. Unfortunately, the bullpen stacked up like a game of Jenga…You lose that one important piece and the whole thing toppled.
One problem I have is, K-Rod (at least said) he was willing to rework his contract so they could dump the option and keep him for a few more years are a reasonable price. I don’t know what K-Rods perception and the Mets perception of reasonable is, but you’d think they’d talk first. Though I have to think that when K-Rods agent dropped the ball and never submitted his list of “no-trade” Teams Sandy jumped at the deal as quickly as he could.
I know I’ll get hammered for this, but I really think at while the 17mil option was really expensive, if you look at the deal as a hole, it wasn’t that bad of a contract. It was really a 4 year deal worth about 13-14mil per year….for a top tier closer in him prime, that’s not a bad deal, especially seeing that the option was built to protect the Mets if K-Rod turned into a huge bust. Who knew that the Mets would plan have to dump 40mil in payroll this year when the deal was originally made?
Sadly, Sandy punted last year…the season tanked, fans are discouraged and we have no closer and even us most optimistic have no reason to believe that next year will be better. If we only finished even a few games over .500 and resigned Reyes and maybe a solid starter, then we’d have a much better outlook in Metsville…maybe at least, they’d be able to sell some season tickets.
Rodriguez wasn’t rally a top tier closer while on the Mets. And, of course, is a 3 inning a week pitcher worth more than a #1/2 pitcher?
No K-Rod wasn’t a “top tier” Closer on the Mets…but he was still a pretty good closer. He was considered a top tier guy when he was signed. Like I said, looking at the contract as a whole, it wasn’t that bad of a deal….it only sucked for the Mets because of the “need” cut slash payroll. The sad fact is, you’re always paying Free Agents for what they’ve done, not for what they will do.
I’d never consider a closer to be worth more than a top 1 or 2 Starter…but one lesson my Dad taught us…something only has worth if someone is willing to pay the price. Sadly, looking at what closers are getting, a four year deal worth +$10mil is what the market is set at.
Is Papelbon worth 4 years $50mil? I don’t consider him any better than K-Rod but the contracts are very similar expect Papelbon gets more money guaranteed with an easy vesting option on games pitched for his option year.
Is Bell worth (especially at his age worth 3 years at 27mil? Joe Nathan coming of surgery worth two years $14.5mil? The market is just nuts.
As strange as it seems, closers are harder to come by then we’d like to think and get burned out much faster starters, but you almost need a good closer(s) to make the post season.
Closers are hard to find because they aren’t properly evaluated. Think about it, how can you possibly get a good feel for a pitcher when he gets maybe 70 innings a year? What about the fact that closers are starting off in a situation heavily sacked in their favor.
Look at the list of the best closers in the league year to year. Notice the turnover in the leaders in SV%, WHIP, K/9 etc etc. The top 10 each year is noticeably different.
” but you almost need a good closer(s) to make the post season.”
See, that is a chicken or egg question to me. Are these teams going to the playoffs because they have a good closer, or do closers look good because they are on playoff teams?
And that is only half of the problem I have with the idea of closers.
payng a close 17.5 mil when you have no money and little talent would be about as stupid a baseball move as you could make. Mariano does not make 17.5—-nor does he deserve to.
K-Rod has little talent? Come on. He’s still a good pitcher – Maybe he was paid too much, but saying he has little talent is just not true.
He’s meaning, the team has little talent. No sense in having a very expensive closer when you won’t be utilizing him as a closer all that often.
thank you
I will try to be more specific
‘…..I don’t hold Sandy Alderson accountable for having to do what he was forced to do by the Wilpons.’
Once again, you hit the nail on the head.
Thanks Fred & Jeff.
Sigh……
geniusalderson is collecting a paycheck to be the cone headed leader of the wilponzie dump salary movement. k rod is one of many that are on their way out the door.if geniusalderson does not follow the wilponzie instructions(and dump costly players) he will be transferred to sny as host of ferddye’s hit show beer money.on this show a contestant can win 130 dollars if he is prepared to give up his first born and describe the therory of relativity while half drunk in some crummy gin mill.
oops – wrong post before
No time for personal feelings or what happened in the past – it’s about one thing – WINNING….and If K-Rod is the best option out there and the Mets can afford him than sign me up. Do it.