7
2011
Alderson Had a Good Day
An article by 
Last night I couldn’t go to bed after a long day because for the first time since Alderson became GM it seemed as though a plan of sorts was being unveiled.
Before anybody assumes anything, I don’t think anything that happened last night was phenomenal, I just think it was a sign of moving on, and an actual plan for 2012.
The biggest move was the trade of Angel Pagan for Andres Torres and Ramon Ramirez.
I like the trade for a few reasons. Mainly, Pagan and Torres were likely to be non-tendered. Torres+Ramirez likely equal what Pagan would have made so right there you have a smart financial move with baseball reasons behind it.
Second, I don’t expect Torres to be some magical hitter, or even better with the stick than Pagan. What I do expect is that he will be a much better fielder. I’ve been saying that for the Mets, and mostly any NL team I’d prefer the roster be built with strong bats at the corners, and defensive minded at 2B/SS/CF and somewhere in the middle behind the dish.
Don’t think the moving of the fences is a mistake with Beltran and Reyes gone. Citi Field still will be a pitchers park, but players like Wright/Davis/Bay are “expected” to perform at an even higher level than they have, when you add Duda to the mix you have 4 players who could have been negatively affected by the fences, who with that small move are now considered an upgrade.
If you get more production out of 3B, LF alone, you’ve made up significant ground on the loss of a full year Beltran and Reyes. The worst word when building a team is “if”, but right now that is all you can hope for with the Mets corner stars. If Duda can play 140+, If Davis is really healthy, if Wright and Bay can get their head on straight.
Torres in CF should make Bay and Duda better in the OF, assuming Duda is the starting RF. The other thing I like about Torres is that Giants fans liked him. When a player of his offensive caliber is “liked” by the team’s fans that tells you something. Here’s a quote from a friend of mine,
“I like Torres a lot. Great guy, great glove, lots of speed, a little pop, and draws walks. Strikes out a lot and probably won’t hit for average. Split the difference between his career year in 2010 and his disaster last year and you still have a pretty valuable player given his gold glove D and the walks. He has struggled with ADHD his whole life and it sounded like the Giants were worried about that and lost faith in him last year.”
The ADHD thing is interesting. Something I haven’t heard reported regarding this trade. His words as a fan like you or I speak to me because he clearly has an appreciation for the way Torres plays the outfield.
Then from McCovey Chronicles
“The love letter to Andres Torres will come. He is, and always will be, one of my favorite Giants of all-time. I’ll miss him, even as I appreciate that Angel Pagan is a pretty good player.” Grant Brisbee
You don’t love a player like Torres unless he plays hard right?
In 2010, Andres Torres was awarded the Willie Mac award by the San Francisco Giants, which is given to the player who best exemplifies the spirit and leadership consistently shown by McCovey throughout his long career, voted upon by the players and coaching staff.
If you don’t love the sound of that, considering the Giants won the World Series in 2010 then I can’t convince you to appreciate Torres.
I’m not saying I love Torres but when you pair him with a very capable middle reliever, how can you not be pleased with the trade?
I think there is still a divide between the fan base, and that divide is going to linger until one half of us gets over the fact that Jose Reyes is not a NY Met. Every move made from Reyes signing to the end of Alderson’s reign can’t be paired with “if they had signed Reyes.”
It’s time to move on, I’m not saying you shouldn’t be disappointed that Reyes is gone, I’m saying no amount of bickering or complaining is bringing him to Citi Field except as a Miami Marlin.
Alderson can’t replace Jose Reyes right now, it’s not realistic. So the best thing he can do is move on, and find ways to improve the team in other weaknesses. In 2011, the bullpen racked up 27 losses for the Mets. Rauch/Ramirez/Francisco should “on paper” decrease that total.
As fans we have a choice to make, either move on, or become Randy Quaid in Major League 2.
Alderson proved with his actions last night a few things:
#1 He is capable of making an impact trade that isn’t superstar or big time prospect driven. The Pagan for Torres/Ramirez deal was a creative one. The easiest deals to make are X Superstar for X Prospects, and have a nice day.
#2 He is concerned with 2012, if he wasn’t there would be no reason to bring in 3 veteran relievers in 1 day. Nobody can come here and say as of this morning Alderson doesn’t care how many games the Mets win in 2012.
#3 Information on exactly what they are trying to do with player movement is not going to be leaked, they are holding their cards close to the vest and I like it.
I like the moves because they aren’t flashy, but they are significant. It showed me that Alderson isn’t here to just trade everybody or let every player walk.
It also showed me he recognized what I’d say was their biggest weakness and he did his best to fix that problem while not exhausting his budget.
As a Met fan it’s time to get behind that concept.
About the Author: Michael J. Branda
My time with MMO began in July of 2009 when I wrote a Fan Post defending Omar Minaya (before it was cool to do that.) I grew up a Mets fan with the mid 1980's teams. My favorite Met of all-time is (and was) Wally Backman. When it comes to sabermetrics versus old school thinking, I like to think I meet in the middle. I believe thinking of new ways to get answers is helpful, especially when the same way has not produced results. However, I think over-thinking certain situations can get you into trouble. I'm excited for the new regime, because I believe they have pieces in place to focus on several aspects of the Mets organization. I've waited this long for a World Series, waiting a few more years for another chance isn't going to kill me.
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Of Course alderson had a nice day, now cover your eyes… SMH, another terrible article by a guy who about 3 weeks ago demanded answers, now is praising torres for being a nice guy.. for a guy who loves numbers as much as you do i am surprised you didn’t post his numbers at how much he sucks!!! memo to mets fans and baseball fans, when a guy hits 220 and is a major leaguer, reason is the guy plays hard!!! this is no secret, alex cora is a career 244 hitter but guess what, he plays hard and plays the game the right way, stop sucking alderson’s **** with garbage articles like this.. he had a good day because he paid $9.5 million combined to acquire 2 guys with ERA over 3.50, that for reliever that is an atrocious number, but hey, he’s sandy alderson, in your eyes all his moves make sense.. just like brad eamus last year right?? you’re the worst of the worst in this blog..
you praised the man for “fixing the bullpen in 2012″ yes, but how about weaken the offense BIG TIME??? no, that goes unnotice by you because you don’t wanna criticize the man.. he’s not here to let any player walk?? he let capuano and reyes walk? trade pagan for somebody who is pure garbage, btw, you realize endy chavez is 4x a better defender than torrez right? we could’ve gotten him for way cheaper if you’re concern is money, but of course. you won’t point that out when is alderson right?? pathetic article..
68: if the article is crappy then what is your comment?
“another terrible article by a guy who about 3 weeks ago demanded answers” — Alex68
Again EXACTLY what I said on November 18th was
“After this season, I’d like for Sandy Alderson along with the Wilpon’s to stand at a podium and tell us all what the plan is” “after two years go by, I believe we all deserve some answers on the future of this organization.”
So your attempts are failed once again. You bring nothing to this blog but negativity and you drive readers away. Your entire comment is so bias it’s ridiculous.
The Mets could have gotten Endy Chavez for cheaper? Then how would they get Ramon Ramirez Alex? How does signing Endy Chavez improve your bullpen?
Your comments are getting more and more pathetic
Alex68,
Are you having a difficult day? If not…
How OLD are you? If you’re a sensible, mature adult, these comments are inappropriate in so many angles. And if you’re not over 21, then I understand.
C’mon Alex68. It is a good article. Maybe you have some bile spilling over from an earlier day. It’s time to turn the corner and live in the present moment. All of us, especially Jessep, deserve it. Thanks for listening to my view.
Des
Like all the moves. Alderson did a very good job fixing the crappy bullpen. If he deals Pelfrey, too, and improves the starting rotation, I’ll give him a gold star.
Absolutely agree.Nice upgrades all around.Pagan and Torres probably both needed a change of scenery and perhaps they both have bounce back seasons.Ramirez is very good,Francisco is solid and although I wasn’t crazy about the Rauch deal because I think 3.5 is a lot for a set up guy coming off a career worst season.Rauch has dominated NL East teams in his career so that might be the thought process behind that move,plus going back to the NL in general is usually a plus for a pitcher.
I think a lot of it was they looked at his HR/9 and HR/FB%. Those numbers were way above his career norms. Of course playing in the AL East in homer friendly parks had to inflate that to an extent.
Right trs: the large majority of his HRs were given in Toronto, NY, Texas, Baltimore which are all top HR stadiums in the sport. You have to consider that.
Again not totally sure but fairly certain a minor league injury can not be a 60 day DL which means they don’t free up a 40 man spot.
There’s a major league and a minor league DL
Minor league DL is technically a “7 day DL”
Ah you are right. I am surprised that a minor league player on the 40 man roster can tie up a 40 man spot even when he is out for a year.
yeah, I guess it’s so that teams don’t just put any minor leaguer on the 60 day DL and stockpile players claimed through waivers etc.
Yeah I guess, but you would not think many teams would want to rob a young player of 60 days unless it was actually warranted.
That being said, it may be moot. Seems like I read last year that right now there is no DL during the off-season? That all players count because of situations like the Rule 5 draft?
Right but trs remember not every minor leaguers on 40 man is a young minor leaguer. A guy like say Nickeas or Chris Carter from a few years ago gets hurt for say 3 weeks in AAA, if another team waives a guy you wanna give a shot to, its a no brainer to do that
Yes I’m pretty certain there is no DL until after Rule 5.
So I would expect if Mets are at 41, that they will DFA at least 2 guys. Baxter and Stinson to me seem most logical. I know Carrasco was terrible but you’re paying him anyway, you can cut him if its that bad after Spring T
Some Met fans just don’t get that you’re not getting a championship caliber team on a beer pocketbook. All the complaining and whining in the world isn’t changing that. Don’t shoot the messenger – it’s not SAs fault this team is broke.
Revenues are likely to be worse in 2012 then they were in ’11. Maybe then the Wilpons will be forced to sell. Either that or they’re going to have to spend some money to get increased revenue.
Even with the projected last place finish next year, SA is trying to improve the BP, which was the worst liability we had last year. I don’t believe for one second we aren’t ‘punting’ for the 2012 season but at least there’s a shred of hope now we won’t relinquish any lead we have in the late innings at the clip we did last year.
Thing is even if they were expecting to compete next year I think paying a guy like Pap 16M instead of spreading that around on multiple relievers is a poor strategy.
Changing subjects, anyone know how much room we have on the 40 man? With the rule 5 draft coming up I would expect them to be looking for a backup catcher, CF, and maybe a long man.
Think I read last night we’re now at 41. Which means guys will be cut.
I’m thinking the first to go is DJ Carasco, right?
And depending on how many – if any – SA picks up in the Rule V draft tomorrow some more may have to be cut. Not exactly sure how that works but can you just remove them from the 40 man? Or do you really have to ‘cut’ them (talking about minors) and then resign them but not to the 40 man?
To remove a player from the 40 man the MEts would have to designate them for assignment which gives them 10 days to release, trade or send them to the minors. I think they have to clear waivers before you can send them to your own minors which is why most would just be released.
I’m not positive but I believe they were at 38 before yesterday, so the 3 relievers would put them at 41 as srt suggests
So you’re likely looking at guys like: Baxter, Satin offensively then maybe Carrasco/Stinson?
But also you have thoughts on non-tendering Paulino he’s still on the 40 man roster. I’m not sure on that deadline though
Couldn’t they DL at least one of those guys?
I don’t think so n. Considering they had to reinstate Murph, Buchholz, Ike and Johan from the 60 day DL I’m not too sure they can just throw somebody on… plus it’d have to be the 60 Day DL not just the 15 day.
What about Mejia?
wow surprise another asskissing alderson article by jessup, shocker.
thanks for your continued support addict77.
I forgot about Buchholz. Don’t know where he’s out, health wise. Maybe they’ll remove him from the roster.
I don’t see him on the roster. Not sure if the Mets ever offered him arbitration.
I think they have to have room on the 40 man before they can even draft them. Thus I would expect actually 3-4 players to get the axe today.
Looking at the roster, there will have to be some tough decisions to make more room but Sandy has got to have some flexibility for the Rule 5 draft.
I could see them non-tendering Paulino and releasing Carrasco. That would give them a little room. I thought I just counted the roster to be a 40 right now after the trade and signing. Maybe they can move Mejia to the long-term DL.
O.K.. I’m thinking 2 cut will be Carrasco and Paulino.
Don’t really remember what the 40 man looks like – who from the minors is on there – so not sure who is likely to be removed. I guess it all depends on how many guys SA is targeting in tomorrow’s draft.
a good day for who? a team that hopes to finish around .500. The goal of a baseball team is to win the WS, not sure how your hero got us any closer to that goal with these moves, maybe if you stopped kissing butt for one second you would realize the mets suck and we have sandy to thank for tearing the team apart and restacking it with recycled trash. O i forget the WS does not matter to you. you feel the same way your hero does, anti winning, anti ws.
will, your comments always make me doubt when people like Alderson or Tie Dyed say “New York sports fans are the most knowledgeable in the country”
Thank you for your consistency and continued support
you cannot handle facts? you have said that you don’t care who wins the WS, only meaningful games in September matter to you, and your hero has had 7 straight losing seasons as GM, with 8 on the horizon. My comment looks about right.
will: If the Cubs turn it around does theo Epstein get credit from you at all?
I never said I don’t care about the WS.
I said if you as a fan get to experience a team that over the course of 8 consecutive years wins an average of 93 games then you are a very, very lucky fan and should embrace that.
The playoffs are a crapshoot, the St. Louis Cards in 2006 played 162 games and finished 1 game over .500. Were they a better team than the Mets? No. They beat them in a best of 7 series.
Their WS is still impressive and is the ultimate goal, but you can’t ignore regular season success either.
Here we go again. Strike up the band for mediocrity. The names are changed but the song remains the same. Last year our great bullpen upgrade was a two year deal to Carrasco, plus Buchholz, Boyer, Tankersley, Byrdak and Bonser. Wow, what an upgrade. Alderson had a great day – two years in a row!
KMaxx: The mere fact you’re comparing “Carrasco, plus Buchholz, Boyer, Tankersley, Byrdak and Bonser” to Rauch-Ramirez-Francisco either proves your bias or uneducated on these players
You never answered a question I asked you a few days ago (at least I don’t think you did)
If the Cubs turn it around, will you give credit to Theo Epstein?
Well certainly these names on paper are much better than the ones you listed.
I see releasing both Carrasco and Paulino and outrighting Satin or Lutz to create room for the Mets recent additions plus most likely 3 more additions.
Off topic- acc. to Rubin, the Marlins have scheduled an announcement for 12:15 PM EST. I never thought Albert would leave St Louis.
My bad- Marlins Reyes announcement at 12:15.
Very nice write-up. I also think it’s encouraging that Gaint fans held Torres in such a positive way. Sandy did have a good night. Bullpen in place w strong competiton for couple of spots. Nice job getting rid of Pagan i think we’ve seen the best of his game coupled w his injury history. But our lineup has taken a hit over the past 2 days losing production ss,cf and announcing 2nd cather from within so we’ll need to stay healthy and maybe have a productuin surprise..
With Rule 5 tmorrow i wonder if Sandy has an OF that he’s eyeing. We def could use another cf/rf probably righthanded hitter..
I didn’t realize that Jon Rauch was a Type B FA and the Jays did offer him arbitration meaning they will gain a sandwich round draft pick for losing him and Francisco. Regarding Pagan and Torres, don’t forget that Pagan is a FA after next season while Torres has 2 more yrs. of arbitration eligibility.
IMO, Sandy did have a good night even though he probably overpaid for Francisco by at least 1MM per and reached a bit for Rauch. There was competition out there for Francisco’s services. And beggars can’t be too choosy- obviously the Mets right now aren’t exactly a hot landing spot for any FA with them being a team in transition.
You hit the nail on the head Sach. The Mets are back where they were before they signed Pedro Martinez. Not too many F.A.’s want to come to a team that has no shot at the playoffs for at least 2 years. In acquiring a guy sometimes you have to overpay when you are not in the driver’s seat. Unfortunately, Sandy inherited a mess both financially and player wise and it will take time to fix it…..
In the meantime, it looks like the Marlins are the big buyers this off season and the biggest prizes being Pujols and Fielder are still out there.
Acc. to Sherman, the Red Sox are also interested in trading for Jon Niese.
Only if we get Elsbury
The Nats were interested in trading for the Angels Peter Bourjos as well as Angel Pagan to a lesser extent but now are serious about moving Werth to CF and giving Bryce Harper a shot at RF in ST.
Acc. to Rosenthal, Mark Buehrle has signed with the Msarlins- 4yrs. 58MM.
Sandy said tonight he sees Capt. Kirk as being a half season away from the bigs.
if he hadn’t had to miss the 2nd half last year, he could reasonably be competing for a job in ST.
I like that they are concentrating on the bullpen. Pagan was always a bit of an enigma. I liked him but he is not someone to build a team around.
Now let them concentrate on getting starting pitching, a starting catcher, a starting shortstop, a centerfielder, a lead off hitter – and then we can talk about having a possible .500 team.
We need new ownership.
Yup, we have lots of holes to fill. But by 2015 we’ll either be there or having another rebuilding plan.
“Alderson had a good day” Yeah, he finally got out of bed and went to work for a change. Up until now all he’s been doing is “exploring”. Has he finally discovered The Brave New World?
Sandy could replace the entire roster with peanut vendors and Jessup would STILL have an article ready to go about how great a GM he is and how smart the moves were, what a great day it is to be a Met Fan….
Uhhhh Yeah….Right!
Yep that’s my hope. I love peanut vendors.
jessep is jessep. Cherish him. Sure beats the handwringers and whiners.