Mets “Still Looking For More Players”

aldersonMets fans felt mixed views on Thursday after Sandy Alderson admitted the club are still looking for new players, despite their already-burgeoning roster.

The general manager spoke to the Daily Pennsylvanian about life at Citi Field and revealed the club is still on the hunt for more players before Spring Training.

“The offseason develops over time in segments, and right now there are still a lot of players out there,” he said.

“The question with teams is: How much money do they have left and what are their needs?”

Alderson also insisted the club have ‘turned a corner’ on talent acquisition and payroll flexibility, and so his focus now was on winning baseball games.

This is all good news for Mets fans and those betting MLB World Series; few of us turn down the chance to greet a new player to Queens. But there is a real concern this roster may become overcrowded before the season begins.

As we found when comparing our 2013 roster to projected 2014, an extra arm has been added to our starting rotation (partly down to Matt Harvey’s absence until September), The addition of Daisuke Matsuzaka to compete with John Lannan and Jenrry Mejia for our final rotation spot made sense on many levels.

This leaves the question – who, if anyone, should Alderson bring in? New players like Bartolo Colon and Matsuzaka need time to settle, to know they are wanted and to not feel threatened by further arrivals. We played well last season and should build on that, not overhaul the entire roster.

The Wilpons got a reprieve from that massive $250 million debt payment originally due in June and when you couple that with what Alderson said, the message is that money is no longer the issue it once was.

But then why was it reported from a team source that the Mets were looking for a veteran reliever on a low base salary? Would such things matter to a team whose financial worries were in the rear view mirror as they would want us to believe?

Clearly there are still some mixed messages coming from the Mets. So, look out for some new signings if they happen, but do not be too disappointed if none materialize. The good news is that 2014 already looks more promising than last year, so let’s not get carried away.

* * * * * * * *

This Fan Shot was contributed by Alex J.. Have something you want to say about the Mets? Share your opinions with over 25,000 Mets fans who read this site daily. Send your Fan Shot to GetMetsmerized@aol.com. Or ask us about becoming a regular contributor.

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  • Benny

    “Still Looking For More Players”

    Made evident by our most recent signing being yesterday.

    We are very active folks!

  • chago

    “The Wilpons got a reprieve from that massive $250 million debt payment originally due in June and when you couple that with what Alderson said, the message is that money is no longer the issue it once was.”

    They have been lying to us for over three years saying their are no financial limitations and you are going to believe them NOW . All they did was kick the can down the road and are now praying that they can start winning on a shoestring budget and get revenue up . That is the only way the payroll will ever increase . When people start spending at Citi again you MIGHT see some spending increases. Richie probably got 20 lashes from Fred for saying publicly we were done and now is out doing damage control . I am sure prospective season ticket buyers weren’t thrilled by Richie’s we are done comments.

  • Mark

    Loan not closing until February or March so no extra money this offseason thus the disconnect.

  • agetting

    and suddenly they are happy to have Tejada and Davis as front runners to begin the season as starters and think Duda can be used properly in the OF. Taking a complete 180 stance from last season and the vibe at the start of the off-season. Basically sums their off-season as a failure to get what they wanted to done. Only thing they did was sign Grandy and Colon

  • Drew

    Since we are the Mets, this is the way our season is going to transpire.
    Colon will be injured in spring training and be out for 4 months. Granderson will underachieve and only end up being a slightly better version of Jason Bay.
    Terry Collins will be fired by mid May and will not be replaced by Wally Backman.
    Is asking for a $150 million dollar payroll really asking too much for a New York franchise?

  • agetting

    sounds more believable than competing for a Wild Card. Also…we will probably win opening day

  • chago

    I just hope we get from Grandy what we got from Byrd last year . And that Colon makes it to the trade deadline without exploding and we can move his big butt for something , anything . The guy I think will be a complete waste of space is the free agent Young . I am hoping he is OK but I have serious doubts he will break the Mendoza line

  • BadBadLeroyBrown

    ”WE PLAYED WELL LAST SEASON” and should build on that, not overhaul the entire roster.

    WHAT!?! o_0

    We did………………What year is this? 1987 =|

  • chago

    That is why Richie is so popular he has many convinced that playing 500 ball for two months a year is a good year . The Yankees won 85 games last year were so pissed they went out an spent 1/2 a BILLION dollars to get back to normal . We win 74 and half our fan base will argue with you that “we played well” . Maybe Richie is magical he certainly has a lrage group of our fans BSed

  • BadBadLeroyBrown

    But then why was it reported from a team source that the Mets were looking for a veteran reliever on a low base salary? Would such things matter to a team whose financial worries were in the rear view mirror as they would want us to believe?

    I think this has less to do with the money and more to do with the remaining available options in Free agency.

    Afterall they did offer Grant Balfour 2yr/$12Million +, that he turned down so they were willing to spend but for what they view as the right player.

  • BadBadLeroyBrown

    Sandy Alderson is Jim Jones reincarnate in the baseball world.

    Both were liars and full of sh– but still managed to convince a large group of unstable people to believe in them.

    SandyTown….Dont drink the Flavor-Aid

    http://media.cnbc.com/i/CNBC/Sections/News_And_Analysis/_News/_SLIDESHOWS/DoomdayProphetsCults/SS_Doomsday_Prophets_Cults_Jim_Jones.jpg

  • Dave_in_Spain

    Jay Horwitz taking a nap in the background…

  • chago

    “Colon is the team’s #1 starter right now, and the only thing he can feel threatened by are drug tests and his refrigerator.”

    I have to disagree looks to me like refrigerators that ever threatened Colon has never been manufactured . I bet each and every one ever built has at one time or another been very good friends with Colon . Well there is the refrigerator Perry he might not like that frig that would mean competition for the eats!

  • chago

    You know how old I am ?

    I can remember when Jay Horowitz was a young man .

  • Hotstreak

    What is the plan:

    It is crap on the fans. Give them BS. String them a long.

    If you believe anything the Wilpons, SA and Selig say you need a lie detector. Five number pinocchio’s for them all.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJ3lxzuI_sc

  • Matt Mosher

    Mets: “Still looking for 80 wins”

    Get your tickets today!!!

  • Hodges14

    Very convenient.

  • Hodges14

    There are still dumpsters to dive in.

  • Metropolitan

    Of course they are,no doubt Sandy is still sifting through the dumpster

  • Hodges14

    You have to give Sandy a bit of slack. When your entire strategy is based on a web of lies and deceit it’s easy to get confused and contradict yourself.

  • Hotstreak

    I am looking for an honest FO guy in the Mets front office. This CAP PAYROLL Bank loan stuff makes losing even worse because we fans were blatantly lied too. The banks ran the show not SA whoes hands were tied and made believe they weren’t. Yes he made good trades but now I rate him even worse. A wooden puppet of the Wilpons who is programmed to lie.

  • Hotstreak

    He should have gutted the team including DW more so than ever. But Jeffery said no way Jose’.

  • Endy10

    i can’t give him any slack. i’m not sure what’s going on behind the scenes, but if sandy is seriously trying 100% to do his job well, then he has no integrity trying to cover up what the wilpons are doing. or he is a very very stupid man (personally i don’t believe that).

    if sandy seriously doesn’t have the resources to do his job, then he’s hurting the mets and he’s hurting his own career. If he does have the resources than he is a terrible gm.

    i’m not putting all the blame on him, but he has to have some control over this situation, and if he doesn’t have any, then why is he still here unless it’s the only job he can find or he’s doing someone a favor.

    something doesn’t add up, and it’s partially all of them at fault if i didn’t know better (which i don’t)

  • ColoradoMetsFan

    Regarding AlexIQ68, circumstantial yet interesting: “This Fan Shot was contributed by Alex J.”

  • Rocky Thompson

    I agree that it has more to do with remaining options and not money with regard to the bullpen. My guess it that they will try to add other Mitchell Boggs or Joel Hanrahan on a low base salary with incentives.
    IMO the Mets are not real high on Stephen Drew either. The real test of whether the Mets are will to spend money will be how hard they pursue Aledmys Diaz. He has the potential to solve both the SS position and the leadoff issue.

  • Martin

    there are no mixed mesages and nobody needs any time to settle.

  • Hotstreak

    Hey down voter(s) alot of SA lovers here, continue drinking your kool aid. You call yourself a Met fan with these guys.. These guys LIED TO US. Its one thing to lose while rebuilding. But its another to try to pull the wool over our eyes and continually lie. No loan money including DW voluntary salary reduction ever used to improve the team. Wilpons have their own money but wanted all of Citi Field, SNY, and suffered real estate bust thus over leveraged and Selig bailed them out with SA to be the Lord High Executioner of cutting costs. I think they are finally losing me. Soon my dear I won’t give damn. No hope of ownership change. LIE. LIE, LIE.

  • pastline63

    They did not proofread SA’s sentence properly “Still looking for more Cheaper Players”, is what it should have read.

  • pastline63

    Well to Reyes he definitely did say that.

  • mad met

    Maybe mo v is free thisFO loves a useless first basemen

  • Hotstreak

    Jose’ Aberu too. For 2014 would cost same 7M which CY is getting.

  • pastline63

    Interesting I wonder what the over and under will be for next season. What will be the rally point to get people excited to buy tickets?

  • pastline63

    No argument there unless your name is Jose and some money is attached to you.

  • metsman

    I’m guessing Boras’s dumpster is lined with silk though.

  • Hodges14

    Alderson’s job since he got here was to reduce payroll and lie about it to the fanbase. He’s done both extremely well. Unfortunately most of the fanbase (excepting those of course gullible enough to believe the spin from the front office) wants to root for a winning team and winning was no where in Alderson’s goals for this team.

  • Joey D.

    Hi Endy,

    I don’t give him any slack either because while Hodges is right when he says “When your entire strategy is based on a web of lies and deceit it’s easy to get confused and contradict yourself.” I believe Sandy is contradicting himself only and is not confused at all.

    He understands the contradictions of his statements and I am sure simply sees them as a pacifying tool. My own guess is that he is so analytical in his nature that is that he is alsoo indeed too out of touch with inter-personal relations and the affect his manipulative statements have on the fan base.

    Or he might not care, believing those who want to come will do so and those who don’t want to come are going to stay away no matter what.

  • Time to settle? Not sure why this would be of any concern to either of the names mentioned. I think there is a bit too much conjecture being formed from the Post article about the Mets renegotiation of their debt. 1. It’s the Post. 2. It’s a source. 3. Nothing has been finalized. 4. While the Mets may not be “bleeding cash” as much as they once reportedly did they reportedly still bled cash last year to a tune of $10M 5. Because the Wilpons do not have to make that specific loan payment does not necessarily mean they have no financial difficulties any longer.

    The Wilpons from what it seems have yet to show that they are willing or able to invest monies from their other pockets into the Mets finances/payroll at least other than when they purchased those shares of stocks. While they have invested in the team this off season that also does not mean that they are just going to throw caution to the wind and sign a player because the Post says they can.

    I think there has been more financial risk taking in an attempt to win i.e., signing Colon to a 2 yr $10M (per year) deal but it is in my opinion one as to not place the team back in the situation it found itself with Jason Bay/Johan Santana as well.

  • Hotstreak

    No way my name is Jose’ 🙂

  • Pike Miazza

    Lets get on the horn w/the other 31 GMs and tell them, “Hey we have a package of Chris Young, Ike Davis & Lucas Duda…I don’t want my players paying for sodas anymore, watta ya got?”

  • Ky

    Diaz

  • Hotstreak

    Hi Joey,

    Hodges hit it on the head “What a tangled web we weave” when we lie.

    Hodges I wish you posted that comment under my 5 star Pinocchio.

  • azulnaranja

    There are only 29 other GM’s.

  • Hotstreak

    SA is a classic Con Man. He conned GM’s to give him Wheeler, Thor, Dilly and Black except Thor all for rentals.

    But he conned the NY Met fans.

    Be careful and do not trust a con man.

    By the way SA lovers you get what you deserve. Losing. I am sick of the guy spinning it differently.

    This revelation of salary cap loan covenant in the past has made me mistrust everything about my beloved Mets.

    Its not the hard times which a true fan will tolerate. Its the blatant lies. Such as we dropped Gulf Coast team to consolidate when it was required. That is just an example.

  • Pike Miazza

    I added a team in Hawaii & Puerto Rico….lol

  • BehindTheBag

    Nah, I think it was “Still looking for more First Basemen”.

  • BCleveland3381

    We all knew we didn’t have money when our payroll plummeted, and we all knew why we didnt have money. Did you need Sandy to tell you that?

  • Anthony

    Bonafacio was just released by kc. Thoughts on him?

  • Benny

    Would be a good pick up.

  • BadBadLeroyBrown

    Sandy Lover….lol

  • Captain America

    He is Eric Young Jr 2

  • MDonaldWilpon

    This guy is dead….

    Well cross him off the list then….

  • Captain America

    Plus the $10 million signing bonus he received now AND $50 million more.

    Otherwise it was just the same $7 million like CY

  • Destry

    If he could still play SS at a repectable level, YES, we basically already have him on our team in EYJ

  • Bail4Nails

    This sounds naive, but I think we are one move away from being a good team this year. I will say it again: Sign Aledmys Diaz and/or Drew. 1)We need a Leadoff Hitter! EY will be great as a fill-in, bottom of the lineup, speed spark for this team. I don’t dislike EY, I just think this his roll on the team, an important one too.
    2) One of our many, many First Baseman must step up and produce runs. I am rooting for Flores to earn it, as I think he will give you 80 RBIs a season, no matter how few HRs he hits. We need him in the lineup. However, I will not pout if any other 1B does it. Plain and simple, we need production from First Base- somebody step up!
    3) I don’t care what your personal taste is for TDA and Lagares. They will both prove them self this season. We will be lucky to have them.
    4) At the risk of sounding redundant, GET US A SS/LEADOFF HITTER!

  • Destry

    This is actually a huge deal. The cash flow will increase significantly, and should increase revenue if it frees up enough for a SS.

  • Bail4Nails

    Absolutely! The Mets signing Diaz would be a real shot in the arm for the team, and the fan base. Beating out the Yankees, Dogers, Cardinals, and Braves for this kid, should be enough headlines to finally sell some tickets. 2/19 can’t get here soon enough.

  • “if he doesn’t have any, then why is he still here unless it’s the only job he can find or he’s doing someone a favor.”
    How does $4-5 million sound for a reason? That’s pretty good money for an aging veteran who can’t produce any results. I’d keep shilling for my boss too.

  • mad met

    One move right ike davis for mike trout..one move dude we got 1300 hundred stikeouts in this line up …

  • mad met

    Or just one good one

  • mad met

    Not a chance

  • Matt Mosher

    I’d set it at 78.5 and take the under.

  • Matt Mosher

    The key takeaway is what LIARS the ownership is. Remember when they said “Madoff situation has no impact on the Mets”? Well, since the creditors were CLEARLY dictating what the team could spend, the Wilpons were full of crap.

    As I have said, it’s not about winning – they DON’T CARE about winning. Just maintaining ownership.

  • Matt Mosher

    It’s that time of year where people are optimistic. I have a buddy who’s the same way. He actually thinks this team is something other than hot garbage. A lot of folks need to wake up.

  • mad met

    No man we got flores for ss and duda for left field we are good. The pitchers are gonna love it. especially after waching our batters strike out 10-14 times per game

  • Matt Mosher

    LOL….if Collins gets canned (he won’t) it will be another career loser – Bob Geren – replacing him.

  • Bail4Nails

    Like I said, I’m “naive”. Maybe EY outplays CY and solves that mistake. Maybe Flores picks up 1B real quick. And maybe Sandy gets that SS. Way too many maybes. But, we can do something about one of those maybes this month. Ya Gotta Believe….or, I’ll just find something else to do this summer. LGM

  • mad met

    I plan on playing alot of beach vball this year my friend …i dont know if i can watch this crap again .. my free time is important and i dont know if i want to spend it pissed off all summer ..i dedicate way to much time to this team . And they are unworthy of all our time and money .i dont know about you but i dont like going to bed pissed off all dam summer … i was really hopeing for a good team to be proud of . Not gonna happen this year .. duda left field. flores ss. trade murphy. sit juan …bad enouph reyes is not here but this crap. Man just kill me

  • Super T

    We need a SS, and a leadoff hitter, and “allegedly” have $ to spend, and the 2nd best SS from FA (Stephen Drew) is still available and could be a leadoff hitter, but for some mysterious reason he’s not getting signed.

  • Captain America

    It wasn’t madoff it was the albatross legacy contracts. See the show in the big tent. Funhouse mirrors in the bathrooms. Circus in the parking lot.

  • BarnRat

    They’re secretly planning to start Colon at SS and have him lead-off. Already signed. Crafty. TC likes the veteran presence.

  • Matt Mosher

    Agreed. I’ll be fishing. I’m not watching this garbage again. Enjoy declining ratings and attendance again this year.

  • Hotstreak

    I sincerely respect your point of view. LGM

  • Hotstreak

    Yes , honesty and trust goes a long way toward support of a plan. What plan?

  • Hotstreak

    Borus and Drew who turned down a 14.5 M Qualifying Offer was asking 45 M for 3 years. For Bosox one year was rumored.

    Correction: I believe the Chisox deal for Jose’ Abreu (building on youth althouh 26) was 68 M in TOTAL including the signing bonus. Less than 12 M per year. Some said Drew was also 7M and respectively they were wrong.

  • Captain America

    You are correct, Abreu was even more expensive than I stated. $17 million this year ($7 + $10 mill bonus) and $51 million the remaining years of the deal.

    Chris Young was $7 million total.

  • Ron

    KENDRYS MORALES!!!

  • Joey D.

    Hi Hotstreak,

    You’re both right.

    And I’ve come to the conclusion that one should not feel sympathy for Sandy since he is so good at his deceptive double talk that no doubt that when it at least comes to business he is indeed a very manipulative individual who is able to deflect criticism as good as anyone can.

  • Hotstreak

    I hate to bring politics in it but maybe SA should be in politics. He can’t be any worse than we got in Washington. But all I ask is an honest answer to a question. You see SA fantastic trades are: Well let me put it this way one ah sh*t wipes out a thousand that a boys.

    NY Yankees Deck is stacked in their favor.

    NY Mets fans: Deck is stacked against them.

    Except for the 1980’s Yankee fans are sadist and NY Met fans are masochists.

    Wilpons strength was based on financial steriods as MADoff money propped it up.

    Then they went into REHAB.

    SA as usual LIED and denied it.

    Now they are out of REHAB and all credibility gone still with a debt. But the value of the team over a billion dollars let them REFI.

    No one commented on my Break even post. The Mets will have to average close to 80 percent capacity or their equity after debt will shrink to the point all loans called in .

  • Joey D.

    Hi chago,

    From what I gather, $250 million was the figure that was due this coming June and that Sterling Mets did not have the $250 million to pay it. If that is essentially correct, than this is no different than the $160 loan last season, the $240 million in minority shares sold in 2012 or the more than $100 million needed from multiple sources in 2011 – money that is needed to keep the organization from defaulting on it’s obligations.

    I know it’s been written up but I will have to research once again how much principle the Mets will owe in 2015 for I wonder if the figure would be lower than the $250 million owed this time around. What we also have to remember is that the $162 million owed in the civil suit settlement has to begin being paid off next year as well, which also adds to the debt schedule.

    If the Mets break even this year, and the debt payment is lower next season, then perhaps they can afford to spend more on the payroll. But again, we have to take into account that except for CY’s $7.25 million, no big salary is coming off the books next season. So how much more, we don’t know. We’ve been lied to so often that when there could be a semblance of truth, we don’t believe them due to their loss of credibility.

  • DrDooby

    If you want to look at it in a different way, you don´t call it “questions” but “options”.
    Last year, the options to Collin Cowgill in CF were Jordany Valdespin, Kirk Nieuwenhuis and Rick Ankiel.
    This year, the options to Juan Lagares in CF are Chris Young, Eric Young jr, Matt Den Dekker and Kirk Nieuwenhuis. The first 3 options of 2014 are easily more proven and are better defensively than the first 3 options of 2013.
    This year, the option to Ike Davis at 1b was Justin Turner, moving Daniel Murphy from 2b or moving Lucas Duda back for good from LF.
    This year, the options to Ike Davis are Lucas Duda, Josh Satin and Wilmer Flores. Plus, Murphy from 2b if needed, of course.
    Again, with Duda being penciled in to start in LF in 2013, the 2014 options are more and better.
    With Johan Santana missing the year, the # 5 spot in the rotation automatically went to Jeremy Hefner. And Aaron Laffey was his sole backup option to open the season with Collin McHugh as another marginal option at AAA and all fingers being crossed that Dillon Gee would be okay in his return from shoulder surgery and Shawn Marcum would be ready after his injury marred 2012 season. The only “hope” with upside was Zack Wheeler by June. This year, Jennry Mejia, John Lannan and Daisuke Matsuzaka will compete for the # 5 spot behind four regular SP who are penciled in with confidence and causing debates of who to start on opening day while promising Rafael Montero and Jacob DeGrom are waiting in the wings at AAA if injuries strike multiple times. Not to forget Noah Syndergaard as another “hope” for a mid-season call-up if ready & needed.
    All in all, these are just 3 significant examples of spots where the Mets are looking at question marks entering 2014 – but also have several potential in-house answers in place. A lot would have to go wrong for all of these answers not being right.
    The only spot where there´s a big question mark and not many valid answers is the SS position. It´s the one and only spot where the FO has failed so far this winter, as big as the hope for a rebound by the marginal Ruben Tejada may be. Omar Quintanilla is a Quadruple A placeholder and certainly not a starting SS option. And Wilmer Flores as anything more than a fill-in for a few innings or a start here or there once every two weeks like Justin Turner last year would cause nightmares for the pitching staff.

  • DrDooby

    Yup, already have the same type of player. A real SS is needed who can at least challenge Tejada (it´s not Quintanilla and Tovar not yet).

  • DrDooby

    And if CY flops, he ´s gone after 2014. If Abreu merely turns into a RHH version of Lucas Duda, you´re stuck with him at 10 million $ per year for the next 5 years…

  • DrDooby

    Let me start that I´m quite unhappy with the current ownership group and also that Alderson has never been willing to state the “obvious”, i.e. “we´re rebuilding”. Which we certainly have been over the past 3+ years, only now slowly changing directions again towards being more competitive.
    However, it´s absolutely understandable that there was never any sort of admission of the severe financial restrictions from the mouth of ownership or the FO. You just cannot do that in public. Regardless of the business you´re in. In fact, mentioning you´re struggling to meet payments or have severe financial problems generally allows creditors to terminate contracts prematurely and thus may trigger collecting collataral on their part. Any GM openly stating this (well, Alderson joked about it – but never in a way that this would be a firm enough statement to risk any of these consequences) would have been fired right on the spot – rightfully so.
    If you´re working for a company, you can´t publically state it´s insolvent or very close to it as it´s not really good for the business.
    Now, one can argue (like Joey D. and I have for a while) whether this rebuilding was strictly financially motivated or not. It certainly was inevitable from a financial sort of view – but imho – was long overdue in terms of rebuilding the organization from ground up again, something that hadn´t happened in decades and led to a very disfunctional organization. So, it was the right call – even if it happened to be the only call for financial reasons…

  • DrDooby

    Develop the pitching and “buy” the bats ? Have a strong farm system that can gradually feed the major league roster and acquire the missing pieces via free agency and trade when the time has come ?
    The Mets right now have one of the deepest farm systems in Baseball (Keith Law believes the 2nd deepest farm system in all of Baseball right now behind the Houston Astros with potential backend SP / frontline RP or starting position players into the # 20 range of their Top prospect list). Now comes step 2 of gradually getting that talent to the majors and adding the missing pieces along the way.
    Add 7 wins each year in 2014 (81-81), in 2015 (88-74) and in 2016 (95-67) and then keep it up.

  • Hotstreak

    DrDooby: What if the Mets declared Bankruptcy. Chapter 11 of the U.S. Bankruptcy Code permits a business, to restructure and repay debt under a plan of reorganization. Control of regular business operations remains with the filer, but is now under the jurisdiction of the Bankruptcy Court. I believe all debts are frozen and cannot be called in.

    Yes the Mets had to stop ther nonsense from the Steve Phillips era because no more MADoff Money to fund FA. However with DW and Reyes in their early prime and Beltran in late prime the Mets had about two more years of contention before naturally falling out of contention. Minaya’s last draft picks are finally making an impact.

    The correct move was to supplement the team to remain in contention at 140 M payroll which was now ordered to be slashed or gut the team including DW and rebuild like the Cubs.

  • BCleveland3381

    Im just a realist. Im confident nobody else could have done better, especially knowing now we had bank imposed payroll limitations. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, judging Sandy based solely on wins and losses on the major league level is stupid. You’ve said multiple times that’s the ONLY thing that matters. You can figure out based on that what I think about your opinion on Sandy.

    I’ve asked before who would have done better or what else could Sandy have done to get more wins(and be more successful based on your ONE criteria) and you’ve never been able to answer. All you do is call me a Sandy lover. When you want to step out from your ignorance and name calling, please do.

  • DrDooby

    Hi Hotstreak, Chapter 11 probably was the fallback option. But I believe it causes ownership to lose the franchise under MLB rules. Pretty much what happened to Tom Hicks in Texas a few years ago. And it certainly wouldn’t have allowed for massive payroll space either – even if it helps you keep your creditors from teasing you for a while.

    And with Madoff gone and the real estate building economy not being at its best for several years now, owning an MLB franchise probably is the easiest path for the Wilpon / Katz family towards big fortune. Regardless of the remaining debt. That’s easy to live with knowing you own entities that will easily generate over a billion $ if you sell it and thus be able to pay back every cent you owe others. But it also creates cash flow and – if managed well – major profits. Not only via the TV network but also via a winning Mets team in this market. If the Mets turn into a Red Sox / Cardinals caliber team between 2015 and 2025, this will be a money printing machine. Whether the payroll is 120 million or 180 million. This team easily has the potential to draw 3 million fams again, create massive revenue elsewhere both for itself and the majority owned TV network too. It’s why rebuiling the farm system and basically resetting the payroll clock as well has made a ton of sense financially – regardless of the immense pressure that forced it. It’s a lengthy process and the risk certainly is that the young talent fails and the funding to instead try to “buy success” eventually isn’t big enough. But if it works, it has the upside to be the best & most extended run in franchise history the way it’s structured right now.

  • Hotstreak

    Good point the the Wilpons would lose ownership under formal bankruptcy. I am glad you mentioned Tom Hicks as I was prior to you now was the only one who bought him up. Everyone mentions the McCourts. But they stole money from the team that is the Dodgers. At least they commingled funds.

    Tom Hick on the otherhand was overleveraged
    with the Texas Rangers and Dallas Stars. I think he also had a soccer team in England. Tom Hicks defaulted on interest payments to the banks and Selig did not bail him out.

    If SA plan was first to rebuild the farm (most of us agree that is the way to rebuild) Then he should have gutted the team. But that is not my main point.

    I listened very carefully and intently to SA’s introductory press conference. You know the one where I think he said the Padres instead of Mets. I do not fault him at least there he showed he was human. Anyway SA said a GM’s job is two fold to simultaneously put a competitive team on the field at the major league level and to stock the farm and develop the players. .

    The reason he could NOT put a competitive team on the field was the CAPPED payroll. He had to hunt for Rule V and rejects by other teams. He was not honest. He lied.

    If he did what he has done so far and was truthful about it then that is a different story.. Frank Cashen did the same thing after Donald Grant destroyed the team. SA has a little of both in him. I gave him a C grade.

  • DrDooby

    It’s basically what I suggested in what I called an “open letter to Sandy Alderson” in late May 2013.
    I still believe that most of it remains true, 8 months later.

    http://metsmerizedonline.com/2013/05/an-open-letter-to-sandy-alderson.html/

    We have finally seen some spending. The payroll will remain in the 90 millionish range as it has been over the past couple of years. Of course, it appears the extra TV money will be pocketed, though instead of almost having 50 % of the payroll allocated to Johan Santana & Jason Bay, finally it’s been spent on players who are likely to contribute some.

    In any case, while I generally approve what Alderson has done here in terms of process & most of the (long term) results (except for not retaining or getting more for Jose Reyes), my main point of criticism has been his lack of truthfulness about the obvious rebuilding that has been going on ever since he took over.

    Ultimately, results will have to start being there. And this will be Alderson’s team – with no more payroll obligations from past years limiting him but only a – granted small – budget set by ownership.

  • Joey D.

    Hi Hotstreak,

    And notice how the majority of congressmen are lawyers….

  • Hotstreak

    Dr.Dooby: ” I missed your Open Letter to Sandy” posted article here at MMO and it is absolutely one of the best I have seen at MMO or for that matter in the media.

    The way I operate I go to the internet to support my case thinkingTheo Epstein in Chicago uses the word “Rebuilding”. He did NOT: This is what he said in the last paragraph to my link.

    “I didn’t use the word rebuilding, and I won’t,” he said. “Scouting and player development is the key to year-in and year-out success, not the occasional lucky hit. There are no definitive answers in this game, no shortcuts. When you think you’ve got it all figured out, you can get humbled very quickly.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/26/sports/baseball/theo-epstein-welcomes-new-challenge-as-cubs-executive.html?_r=0

    As to Astros:
    Sep 24, 2013 – The word “rebuild” was never in owner Drayton McLane’s vocabulary …For the majority of the season, many Astro fans had begun to wonder ……”

    So yes I stand corrected. But there is a But:

    However Sandy at his introductory press conference did say his job was to put a competitive team on the field. He did not have to say that. When asked about the immediate future of the parent club he should have just said “There are no short cuts” and refuse to expand on that if the press asked is that rebuilding.

  • Joey D.

    Hi Hotstreak,

    “No one commented on my Break even post. The Mets will have to average close to 80 percent capacity or their equity after debt will shrink to the point all loans called in .”

    Actually, I had been commenting on that in the past but sorry I did not pick up on your recent point as well. The attached indicates how the Mets counted on the selling of premium seating and an approximate drop to only 35,000 per game through 2013 in order to break even.
    http://www.newsday.com/sports/baseball/mets/mets-income-from-citi-field-dips-1.5682633
    But I think there is one major flaw in the author’s conclusion that it was the non-performance of the team that caused the big drop in attendance and that people weren’t going to spend that much money to see a bad team. I think the problem was that people were not going to spend that much money to see even a good team because the cost of going to a game was just becoming way too un-affordable due to rising costs and a bad economy – for even the Yankees experienced drops in attendance. The Mets started off the 2010 season well and were in the division race by the all-star break. So the team was winning again – yet attendance was dropping. Same with 2011 and 2012 – the team started off each season well and yet attendance kept on sagging.

    2010 could be attributed simply to the cost being too much but then IMHO the real damage did come in 2011 when we began to see the further signings of inexpensive players under Sandy Alderson.

    Unlike 2010 when the media pounded the signing of so many inexpensive players on their way down as they did with Omar, Sandy in turn was given a pass as far as judgement upon his actual moves itself, with the press instead willing to wait to see how the players panned out while instead focusing on the Mets ushering in a new era of fiscal prudence led by Sandy heading them into a new direction and better vision of how not to waste money and obtain under valued players like “he” did in Oakland. I personally did not see that happening and looked for bad times ahead.

    So did others as the chants of “sell the team” rocked outside Citi Field after the opening day loss to Washington and the team got off to that miserable start. Then the team began to jell and they were exciting to watch once again. But it wasn’t due to any of the players Sandy obtained. It was due to the hold overs from the prior year. Literally, we were playing at that .565 clip without Davis and Wright and DESPITE OF the garbage that Sandy had obtained that winter.

    Then he threw the team under the bus and it was obvious this was an organization focused on something very different than baseball. The continued actions past 2011 through now only proved it.

    That is why the fans stay away. If the effort was to improve the team and those efforts failed, there would be no question of ulterior motives and crossed purposes more would come – for the cost of tickets on the secondary market are begging to be bought.

    As for your point regarding today and the future, one has to take into account that the 80 percent capacity you mention only means the ability to keep costs at the level it is now – maintaining the now established shoestring budget throughout the entire operating budget, not just the payroll. So the Mets will have to draw an average 32,400 per game just to break even based on the current level of expenditures – and revenue sources. It does not allow for expansion unless the cost of tickets and concessions goes up for as Sandy has said, the other sources of “net” revenue has already been accounted for and I doubt that is going to change because loans still have to be repaid.

  • pastline63

    It’s a kick in the gut but I feel the same way.