Harvey Wants To Remain With Team During Rehab

MattHarvey1

February 7th, 7:13 PM

Matt Harvey was a guest of Mike Francesa on WFAN today and said things are going really smooth as he continues his rehab from Tommy John surgery.

He basically repeated much of what he told the Post yesterday, but there was one thing that stood out to me.

Harvey told Francesa that he expects to spend all of spring training with Mets and ALSO intends to spend the regular season with the team. He looks at is as a way of staying connected to his team and teammates which I found to be very profound and admirable.

The Mets former first rounder wants to stay close to the action, chart the games, and study the hitters all in an effort to comeback better prepared and with a good working knowledge of opposing hitters.

Harvey could have opted to stay home like most every player does when they are out for the year, but not this kid. This one is cut from a different cloth. This kid is old school. I wish we had a dozen more like this one…

Get back soon, dude…

February 7th, 9:00 AM

Matt Harvey says he is set to begin a throwing program in as soon two weeks he told Dan Martin of the NY Post on Thursday.

“They said I should be able to start throwing four months after the surgery and that’s Feb. 22, and I haven’t had any setbacks,” Harvey, who had elbow surgery in October. “I can’t wait. Even if it’s 10 feet, I just want to pick up a ball. As if right now, I don’t see why I wouldn’t be able to do that.”

Harvey, who will be at Port St. Lucie when the other Mets pitchers report on Feb. 15, hasn’t been shy about his desire to pitch before the end of the season, but said he’s aware teammates and others in the organization are concerned he may try to rush back.

“I completely agree that I shouldn’t come back too soon. I haven’t touched a baseball yet so I don’t know how things are going to go once that happens. But if things are still progressing and it shows I’m ready to go and I get cleared, I want to be able to play.”

Harvey still has it in his mind that he wants to pitch in 2014.

“If I get to throw a couple of innings in August or September and then have a normal offseason without having to go into next year with all those questions still out there, that would help me significantly,” Harvey said.

“I’d love to face hitters to build my confidence up back up and not just jump into a new season having not seen anyone.”

Like most players, Harvey hates not being on the field with his teammates. He’s a baseball player and his only desire is to get out there and play as soon as he can. It’s up to the Mets to make sure they keep a safe and deliberate pace as to his return and to protect Harvey from himself.

To that end, Sandy Alderson said yesterday evening that it’s unlikely Harvey will pitch for the Mets this season. Even if the Mets find themselves in a pennant race.

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About Joe D 7835 Articles
I'm a lifelong Mets fan who loves writing and talking about the Amazins' 24/7. From the Miracle in 1969 to the magic of 1986, and even the near misses in '73, '00 and '15, I've experienced it all - the highs and the lows. I started Mets Merized Online in 2005 to feed my addiction and interact with other passionate Met fans like you. Follow me on Twitter @metsmerized.
  • SRT

    Recovery from TJ used to be an average of 18 months. Now some are coming back in less than that – some even in 12 months. And even though it’s a ‘routine’ type surgery for many pitchers, the rehab is grueling and some re-injure themselves – meaning it’s not a 100% guarantee.

    Gotta love Harvey’s optimism and determination – but I’d just assume he take his time and wait for the start of the 2015 season.

  • Metjorge

    Love the passion in Harvey, but what is the point of throwing a couple of innings in August or September? Too big of a risk for this guy to rush it. The whole franchise depends on him being healthy for 2015, so they must do everything in their power to make sure he sticks to the plan to be the opening day starter in 2015 at the earliest.

  • SpinalRemains

    Its 100% foolish to even consider anything other than an April 2015 return for this kid.

    Why would anyone support a return for this Sept? Ticket sales? Come on. Not even The Mets are that stupid…….right?

  • dealingwithidiots

    Did you read the last few lines? “To that end, Sandy Alderson said yesterday evening that it’s unlikely Harvey will pitch for the Mets this season. Even if the Mets find themselves in a pennant race.”

  • RyanF55

    No need to rush back and jeopardize the arm on a team destined hopefully for around a .500 finish. Wait the extra year unless he is truly and absolutely ready to go. We all know 2015 is the actual year we have a shot of contending…if we can play for a wildcard and host meaningful games in September this season, I will take that. This year’s success for me is growth of the young players, Syndergaard and Montero getting MLB experience, and momentum into a big 2015.

  • BehindTheBag

    Just having him at camp is a good thing.

  • SpinalRemains

    Of course I read it. Sandy has also said numerous other things which are at best considered …….well, lies.

    I don’t believe anything the front office says. Why does anyone believe them is a more likely question

  • vigouge

    So Alderson is asked a question, he gives the correct answer and yet you still complain?

  • CJM

    Think about it. He’s a young guy who gets paid well. His team plays in NYC and he lives there. No reason not to go to the games. You get to watch the best sport from a great seat all while living in NYC and getting paid well. Then you get to travel to these other awesome cities for free with the team, get a nice hotel room free, and go out on the town without worrying about pitching. It’s awesome that he wants to stay with the team, chart games, etc. But why the hell wouldn’t he want to, considering all the perks?

  • CJM

    Some pitchers are coming back in less than 12 months. I want to say Wagner came back in 9-10 months but I’m not positive. I know at least one pitcher has come back in 9 months.

  • oleosmirf

    Question:

    Why did Ralph Kiner have such trouble getting in the HOF. Retired in 55, but didn’t get in until 75 and just barely got in too with only 75.4% of the vote

  • SpinalRemains

    Actually I’m neither complaining nor disagreeing with anyone. I initially commented on Matt Harvey’s progress. That’s what the article is about. Seeing as the discussion always touches on a Sept. return, I commented that I think it’s a bad idea. I really do not know why you’re confused, but it’s simple.

    Matt Harvey tore his UCL. Matt Harvey got UCL surgery. Matt Harvey can pick up a ball in ten days. Matt Harvey will want to pitch ASAP. Now here’s the tricky part. I do not think it is a good idea for him to do so. My comment never mentioned anyone specifically wanting him to return. That’s just the general topic of discussion. The fellow below me took that as me not reading, and you took it as me complaining.

  • I am not too bothered if everything goes perfect and continues to go perfect that Harvey comes back and gets a few innings in September. But…the best idea he’s had is staying with the team for the 2014 season. There’s no better way to grow as team than by spending time together as a team. I also appreciate his willingness to study and chart hitters, that helps him in the future and helps the teams’ othe pitchers in the present as well.

  • I noticed that too yesterday especially. And it makes no sense at all. He arguably was THE bat for an era, and yet people kept not voting him in. Crazy.

  • oleosmirf

    I understand the standards were tougher and he had a short career between the War and his back, but still shouldnt have taken .4% in his last year on the ballot.

  • Benny

    The point is there are a bunch of players who don’t do this and seeing that he wants and will do this is quite admirable.

  • Benny

    Dude is a warrior!

  • BCleveland3381

    The Mets aren’t rushing Harvey back. No way they want him getting hurt. Harvey will be the only one wanting to pitch. The Mets will even have Boras on their side making sure he’s 100% healthy.

  • Wow, I didn’t know that. I assumed he got in within 5-7 years. I have to look into that.

  • BadBadLeroyBrown

    Like Mejia, he(Harvey) obviously doesnt value Frank Franks guidance.

    http://metsmerizedonline.com/2013/07/francisco-told-mejia-he-should-milk-it-and-just-collect-his-paycheck.html/

    Which is a plus

  • He lives in CT though, not far but still far enough. And he said he’d travel with the team too. But like Benny said, and what my poiint was, most players don’t do this.

  • CJM

    Yeah I understand that. I’m saying it’s a win/win for him. Baseball’s enjoyable. I’m sure being around the team is enjoyable for him. And going out, as we all know, is also enjoyable for him. He gets to bond with his mates, study other hitters, and have fun.

  • CJM

    Are you sure he lives in CT? I know he is from CT and it seems like he’s there a lot according to his Twitter, but does he not own a NYC apartment?

  • Joey D.

    Hi Joe D.,

    “Old school” indeed. Great to know how dedicated to his craft he is and more important, how much he understands how he has to not only keep connected to the team but to keep on top of the hitters so to be prepared to face them when coming back in 2015 (though one would think saber charts and data would be sufficient enough).

  • Taskmaster4450

    As I was reading the article, that is the first player who popped into my mind.

    +1 Leroy.

  • Taskmaster4450

    Very true. They will hold him back looking for the next few years he is under control and Boras is looking for that 9 figure contract for him.

  • Taskmaster4450

    Not got in on the 15th an final try.

  • Taskmaster4450

    How can you not love this kid’s attitude and approach?

    This is often all that separates the very good from the great: mindset.

  • Joey D.

    Hi Oleosmirf,

    At first I thought it might have been playing with a losing franchise and being buried in Pittsburgh rather than New York, Brooklyn or St. Louis had some influence with the sports writers of the time for there was not the media exposure and when television first exploded in the fifties Ralph was past his prime.

    But I do think it was that Ralph only had a ten year career (the minimum requirement) and even though eight of those years were by far Hall of Fame caliber, the sportswriters at that time had a mindset regarding longevity until Sandy Koufax forced them to reconsider that position. Sandy only pitched 12 seasons and the first six were in relative obscurity until he finally became a pitcher (but not hall of fame quality) in 1961. It was only the last five years of his career that he became the dominant pitcher of his time and Hall of Fame pitcher (and two of those also cut short by injury) and had his career cut short by an arthritic elbow by the age of 30.

    So it is my hunch that because of Koufax the sportswriters finally had to look at Ralph for what he did in that short period of time instead of basing his eligibility on the length of his career instead.

    Jackie Robinson and Roy Campenella were robbed of years due to racial prejudice so distinctions were made in their cases (which was the right thing to do). But I don’t believe many with just ten or eleven years in the majors were elected to the Hall before that time no matter what they did. Will have to look that up myself.

  • MyasDaddy

    You are nails Harv. I have to give it to you. I’d go to war with you any day.

  • Julian

    I just wouldn’t trust him throwing grenades right now….

  • MyasDaddy

    I am not worried at all. He will be fine. I hope he makes it back by September.

  • NewYorkMammoths

    I wonder who’s happier today: Mets fans because Harvey is going to spring training, or Yankees fans because A-Rod isn’t?

  • MyasDaddy

    Can I tell you my honest opinion about the whole thing? AROD was bamboozled. You think the Yanks and MLB weren’t in on this together?

  • BCleveland3381

    I think they both had a common interest in Arod not playing, but that doesn’t mean they were conspiring together to make it happen. Fact is, they didn’t have to. The MLB knew the Yankees didn’t want Arod around. The MLB doesn’t want him around either. Selig went after Arod and decided to make him an example. The Yankees were very happy with that. I don’t think there was anything more to it than that.

  • I think those writers would gladly take a mulligan for all those years they hosed Ralph.

  • MyasDaddy

    You don’t think it had something to do relieving themselves $140 million?

  • Nolrog

    Neither will play this year, so they have that in common.

  • calamityfrancis

    This is why Johan Santana was a loser and why Harvey is such a beast. He effing cares and actually wants to be with his team. He wants to earn his paychecks even if he can’t play.

  • Nolrog

    Ah, conspiracy theory at it’s finest. The Yankees did nothing but sit back and watch. They benefitted, sure, but they weren’t in on it any more than the players association was.

  • BarnRat

    He accomplishes more for the team with this message of support/study/be ready than with any innings he might or might not throw in Sept. Bravo.

  • MyasDaddy

    No doubt. They held their poker faces really well. But, they had nothing to lose and all to gain.

  • vigouge

    His short career was a big factor.

  • Bail4Nails

    I will feel pretty bad for Harvey, having to watch a couple stud pitchers come up and steal his spotlight this season. They’ll need security to keep that monster off the field.

  • Hotstreak

    I totally disagree: Santana was criticized for professional suicide by throwing too soon.

    The down vote was not me.

  • 3doza33

    Love it! The thing that pissed me off about Santana was that he was never there to help our young pitchers while he was hurt. He collected his $20 mill and didn’t contribute one bit! Imagine how much Niese could have learned from Santana if he was actually around!! That always pissed me off! So anyway…. It’s great to see Harvey will be with his teammates this year. I think it will help him and his teammates!

  • BCleveland3381

    What are you saying? Of course the Yanks would love to get out of that deal and are more than happy to not pay that money this season. But you make it sound like the Yanks and MLB were conspiring to get Arod. The fact is the MLB wouldn’t conspire with the Yankees because the Yanks have nothing to add. They have no power when it comes to punishing Arod. They were happy to see him suspended, but that’s where it ends.

  • BronxMets

    smoke another doobee

  • BronxMets

    yeh it was mlb and the Yankees that just magically created all the evidence out of thin air………..wow…this country is in trouble.

  • BronxMets

    what did? the evidence?

  • BronxMets

    I guess myasdaddy thinks they created all they evidence.

  • BronxMets

    the famous “he’ll be fine” as if you know.

  • BarnRat

    Do you travel much?

  • BronxMets

    he only played 10 years. 375 HRs or so.

  • BronxMets

    the other thing is you have to look at who got in during that time. You can only vote so many guys in

  • MyasDaddy

    I just think they tried to really hammer this guy. I am not saying he didn’t do it. But, they want to rid this guy. Both sides!

  • Taskmaster4450

    The Yankees still had to pay ARod more money this season than the Mets have to pay Harvey.

  • BronxMets

    how did they hammer him? neither enitity was allowed to comment during the process?

  • Taskmaster4450

    $140M?

    The Yankees saved $22M that is all. The rest of the contract is guaranteed.

  • Taskmaster4450

    ARod could have taken the deal with Braun and the others…..he didnt.

  • MyasDaddy

    AROD’s original suspension was for 211 games.

  • Taskmaster4450

    Fine, so that is a season and a half….so it would amount to $33M….that is a far cry from $140M.

  • Pike Miazza

    Harveys a pitbull and I guarantee he will convince the uppers at some point in late July to let him pitch games.

  • Alex68 (Ch)

    Ha!! Go ahead and tell that to those who believe in computer side of baseball

  • Alex68 (Ch)

    Lmao, youll get down votes for agreeing with any of us #CORE members

  • Alex68 (Ch)

    Once the mets are out of it by july, we won’t hear anymore talk about him coming back. I think this kid wants to win so bad he’ll rush to get healthy, but the team being out 23 games by then will shut that notion. Good to see his mindset though, we got an ACE for years to come

  • Don’t freak out Alex. I had to give you a down vote for no other reason than to bust your chops. LOL

  • Alex68 (Ch)

    And since when that has bother me? You might wanna go check to see if any of them new bloggers is crying wolf about vote downs, I could care less, as I said before in a comment that was deleted, down votes mean I am infuriating SANDY LOVERS..

  • SRT

    Not sure I get those additional statements by Harvey.
    If I understand it correctly, rehab from TJ is tedious and often grueling. Doesn’t that need to be accomplished by specific trainers that deal with this for the team – and monitored very carefully?
    How is he going to do that in Flushing and especially on the road?

  • Martin

    He has to stay in New York that is where the Russian models are

  • Martin

    Why would these things not be available in flushing or on the road?

  • Michael Armato

    Love this Kid

  • Derpy

    All the experts are in New York. Either he gets to fly to New York left and right from wherever else he could rehab (Florida?), or he can just chill in NY, rehab in the morning/afternoons (which is when he would rehab either way), then spend the nights with the team, aka his friends and coworkers. Sure beats watching netflix by yourself.

  • Andrew Herbst

    I love Harvey’s attitude. I just don’t want him to rush his rehab and come back in September. I’d rather have him be fully healthy next April.

  • Alberto Salebe

    I gave him a down because he is an idiot always with negative comments

  • diehardmets

    No, he won’t. I’ll happily upvote anyone who makes a good comment. Unfortunately, non of your comments are anything even resembling good.

  • BCleveland3381

    In 2015 we are adding a Cy Young candidate to our team, that’s the way I look at Harvey’s injury. 2014 isn’t a lost cause though. I think we can be a .500 team, which I think considering the Harvey injury, is a solid step in the right direction.

  • Hotstreak

    I thought you did NOT give down votes but you at least admitted it.

  • CJM

    Harvey is not in control of how long his rehab will take. It’s impossible for him to personally rush it. Remember that. If he comes back in ’14, it will be because people who know a lot more than you and me and every other fan feel he is ready.

  • Hotstreak

    I got you, thanks for wake up call.

  • calamityfrancis

    Russian models can probably be found in Russia too.

  • Hotstreak

    I was just thinking now that DW is married and Mat Harvey is again available maybe Harvey gets royalties in his jersey sales. See there must be a ulterior motive, money. More down votes coming 🙂

  • calamityfrancis

    mbah?

  • BCleveland3381

    I think you need to adjust your tin foil hat.

  • lareplus

    we will have a dozen more like him because this guy is infectious and the other guys on the team are going to catch it from him. .

  • john q

    Kiner is/was a questionable induction into the HOF. He just barely made the 10 Year eligibly requirement. His career is extremely short by HOF standards. His career numbers are well below HOF standards.

    He was a great player though dominating baseball from 1947-1952. From 1946-1953 he was probably one of the top 5 players in MLB. But his peak lasted about 6-7 seasons and he was basically shot as a player by age 30.

    His career slash stats are extremely impressive: .279/.398/.548 but his career numbers are well below HOF standards for a below average defensive left fielder: 369 HR, 1015 rbi, 971 runs, 1451 hits, 1011 walks, 6200 plate appearances.

    His Peak numbers more than qualify him for the HOF but his career numbers fall well below.

    Kiner’s career WAR is 49.4 but he accumulated 43.2 in a 7 season peak. That’s about 87% of his WAR value in only seven seasons. That’s remarkable and extremely unusual for a player with over 40 War who played less than 15 seasons. Kiner just had a very odd and unique career.

    The closest modern player to Kiner that I can think of is Nomar Garciaparra. Nomar was great for 6 seasons and then he was shot. He lingered for 4 more years but he was done.

    Dale Murphy, Cesar Cedeno, and Vada Pinson had somewhat similar careers in that they were great players for 6-7 years and then they were shot. But they lingered around for 6-7 more years. Murphy was very odd in that he sucked for 4-5 years, was very good-great for 6-7 years and then sucked for another 4-5 years.

    Bobby Bonds was another player with a similar arc. He actually had more career value than Ralph and had a 6-7 year time span when he was a great player.

  • Hotstreak

    Thanks for the comment. I welcome all comments.

  • CJM

    No and I understand that traveling can really suck. But when the Mets travel they use private charters and their business is not quite the same as regular business travel. Tell me you wouldn’t love to get paid upper 6 figures to hang out with a pro baseball team all summer, even with the inconvenience of flying some red eyes every now and again.

  • sperry

    You do realize him staying in to finish that no hitter basically cost him the rest of his career, yes?

    You do remember the game in 2008 where he pitched a shutout on a knee that he shouldn’t even have been walking on, yes?

  • Hotstreak

    First the “Uppers” sort of convinced him to have the surgery.
    Second: No way he convinces them to risk their investment in him.
    Third: After saying Santana was not in pitching shape last ST they were infuriated when he tossed without them knowing about. Harvey said he would only toss with managements approval.

  • Hotstreak
  • BarnRat

    Yeah, if someone had offered this deal at 24 I would have been on-board. I’d have regretted it, but I would have been on-board.

  • TexasGusCC

    Just ONE dozen Joe?

    He’s a BEAST!

  • KennyandtheMets

    I am excited about the prospective rotation in 2015, but I can’t buy in to this year’s team being 500. Just too many holes in the line up.

  • Hotstreak

    Since my comment is now an orphan the post said no need to say “the down vote was not me”, and had expletive words for the one I was responding to. For the record look at all the down votes the guy got without my down vote.

  • TexasGusCC

    This is the first time I have heard anyone knock Santana’s demeanor or character. You hadn’t seen how he carried himself previous years?

  • Hotstreak

    Kenny, it is possible due to depth this time on the roster which is overlooked. Competition for a change except SS which is not that critical as Tejeda most likely will be serviceable. Yeah no Harvey but we are a better team than last year.

  • KennyandtheMets

    I love the Granderson pick up and I like the Colon pick up. Still, I’m not sure we are better than last year. I don’t believed in either Young to give us enough offense. Same with Tejsda and all the possible 1B residents. To be a 500 teams there are a lot of things that have to break right. d’Arnaud needs to hit. Lagares needs to improve his offense. Wright, Granderson, and most of the pitching staff needs to stay healthy. Too many question marks.

  • john q

    The standards were “easier” back then. It’s much harder to get into the HOF since the mid 1990’s.

  • Hotstreak

    If Grandy and Colon are busts then I agree. However I like both pickups but like you do not understand why CY who I am not counting on. I agree TdA is the key guy who has to be a factor both offensively and defensively. Wheeler and the BP are also key. When I say key I mean fair to good years and not compete busts. M urphy and DW have to be well Murphy and DW. Gee and Niese have to well Gee and Niese. 🙂

  • john q

    They started voting for short careers way before Koufax. Dizzy Dean undeservedly was voted during the 1950’s. There were a few other players with short careers elected before Koufax as well.

  • mets4lyfe

    I’m not entirely sure why certain people are using this story as a reason to go on a diatribe about Johan Santana. There are plenty of reasons why Johan wasn’t in the clubhouse or traveling with the team while recovering from his shoulder injury.

  • KennyandtheMets

    My other concern is Collins. I think he will play EY2 over Lagares. I also don’t like how he has anointed Niese the ace of the rotation. If I were the coach, it would be Colon. I think his ERA from last season (and his career, for that matter) warrants the #1 spot. I don’t trust Collins to get the most out of the team.

  • mr mojo risin

    Dude, I want to see you back on the mound too … but for real, just take a chill pill, ‘date’ a different supermodel for a few months and see you in 2015

  • calamityfrancis

    And where was he last year? For 30 million dollars, he could have, I don’t know, helped mentor our young pitchers instead of doing absolutely nothing?

  • Joey D.

    Hi John Q.,

    Thanks for reminding me about Daffy’s older brother. Yes, if it wasn’t for those many seasons in which he pitched a handful of games he wouldn’t have even made the ten required for eligibility. It was, of course, the line drive that smashed off his toe that came off the bat of Earl Avril in the 1937 All-Star game that that ruined him.
    Like Koufax, fans only caught a glimpse of a truly great pitcher.

    But that still doesn’t excuse Ralph Kiner from being shunned so long and then making it by the thinnest of margins. Instead, it only further confuses all of us by either showing my theory was wrong unless it was the next generation of baseball writers that looked at longevity differently

    But for those five and a half seasons, just like Sandy, he deserved to be in the Hall. One has to take into account the era he was pitching in. When pitchers were giving up an average 4.5 runs a game, Dean was holding them down to three or less which was quite an achievement. That was when there were only eight teams and with so many players
    and very few openings, the caliber of play was quite high and intense with many a good player spending an entire career in the minors not because he wasn’t good enough for the majors but simply because there were just not enough spots.

  • DrDooby

    Pretty much this. Tommy John surgery takes a minimum rehab phase of a full 9 months but may take up to 15 months even without any setbacks. Every person heals differently and it doesn´t make sense to give predictions.
    That said, for example Mike Pelfrey underwent Tommy John surgery in early May 2012 and started his first spring trainig game for the Twins in late February 2013, less than 10 full months after the surgery and opened the season on the Twins roster less than 11 months post surgery.
    If Matt Harvey (surgery Oct. 22nd 2013) recovers at a similarly fast pace, he´d be in line for closely monitored GCL rehab games by mid August 2014 and could conceivably return to the Mets at some point in September, maybe in a relief role as he wouldn´t be fully stretched out yet. Of course. only if he´s a quick healer & doctors give a fully green light.
    The Mets & Harvey will surely play things safe, of course. So the green light will only come if Mets doctors feel he´s 100 % ready to go. And the more likely scenario has Harvey´s rehab taking the average of 11+ months and him getting back into games during Instructional League in late September 2014 and eventually starting his regular winter program to be fully ready for spring training 2015 where he´ll probably arrive in late January…

  • DrDooby

    Santana´s first shoulder capsule surgery already pretty much ruined his career. The track record for pitchers to return from this procedure is very poor as this sort of surgery still remains in its exploratory phase. Bret Saberhagen was the first pitcher to get it back in 1996 and did last just over 300 innings afterwards. The track record for others such as Rich Harden, Dallas Braden, Mark Prior or Chien Ming Wang is much worse. Soft tossing RH Chris Young has made it back – but also with diminished velocity and less success.
    So, odds are Santana´s career was put onto the finish line by the initial surgery and it´s great for him to have had two good months & the no-hitter left in his arm after the surgery. Odds are, it wouldn´t have gone much beyond it anyway…

  • Ed Renner

    I am definitely an older Met Fan, having been around since the first season. I do understand that this is a different world now. But Mr. Mojo Risin, try to show a little bit of class. Comments like yours aren’t cool, they are classless and immature. How about some substantive Mets talk.

  • Dave_in_Spain

    I´ve often wondered why rehabbing pitchers don´t stay with the team more often. It´s a great opportunity to learn pitch sequencing, talk with coaches, work with veteran pitchers, talk with hitters about their approach… Good on Harvey!

  • Dave_in_Spain

    Something about his eyes in this photo remind me of Nicholas Cage.

  • Hotstreak

    Kenny we agree on everything except Drew who you want and I don’t. Sure SS is weak but we can do better job with a young cheap SS not named Mr. Q. Do you want Backman. I do.

  • BCleveland3381

    We were .500 once we took Duda out of the OF last year. Sure, we don’t have Harvey, but we have a full year of Wheeler, hopefully Colon is close to what he was last year, and our ugly combo of Aaron Laffey, Shawn Marcum, Caros Torres are out of our rotation.

    d’Arnaud just has to hit a little and he’s an upgrade over Buck. Granderson and Chris Young along with Lagares makes our OF defense really good. Offensively, I think its an upgrade, even if only a slight one. Ike and Duda can’t really be worse than they were last year. Drew is the missing piece. With him, I think .500 is not only the goal, it would be expected.

  • BCleveland3381

    Why are you so concerned with down votes? Every one of your posts mentions them? Who cares?

  • KennyandtheMets

    I think you have more faith in Tejada than me. I hope you are right about him doing the job. Signing Drew is not my first choice. If I were running the team, I would trade for a young SS.

  • Dark HelMet

    Regretted it, eh? If you say so.

  • Dark HelMet

    The no hitter was unrelated to his struggles, most likely. Johan was a VERY GOOD pitcher for a MONTH or so after that game. Why do people forget that?

  • Dark HelMet

    Your comment was pretty silly, dude.

  • KennyandtheMets

    I thought you didn’t want Drew. I like the OF of Granderson, Lagares, and CY a lot defensively. Offensively though, aside from Granderson, they are a question mark. CY needs to have a bounce back year. I hope he will, but who knows. I think Lagares could improve his offense, but I fear that he might not get the chance. Collins seems to really believe that EY2 is his lead off hitter. You know that CY will be given every chance to earn the 7.25 mil he signed for. I’m afraid that Lagares might end up in Vegas, or even worse, riding the pine for the big club.

  • Metro12

    You just know this kid is chomping at the bit to get back very soon. Not next year, but this year. One part of me wants to see him attempt this, just to see how far he can go. But another part wants him to be ultra conservative and protect that talented arm from coming back too soon.

    Harvey is the total opposite of Mr. American Idle.

  • Andrew Herbst

    That’s true. The doctors and medical staff are in charge of that. We have to trust their opinions.

  • MLBGM Fire TC

    IF and only IF hes ok to get a few startsmaybe 4-5 starts (5 innings each) in September when it dosnt really matter, just to get him a little work and confidence for next ST, I would have no issue. BUT its got to be 110% that hes ready. No need to speed him up to pitch a few starts and risk loosing him in 2015.

  • MLBGM Fire TC

    yea your right about that

  • MLBGM Fire TC

    yep! this season will be fun to watch and see WHO will be here in 2015. With one nice trade we could be ready to finally compete in 2015!

  • MLBGM Fire TC

    I think 500 could be attainable

  • MLBGM Fire TC

    I think d’Arnaud will be ok this season, and will be much better next season given that he will not only be 1 year older but have 1 season under his belt. The kid can hit, id expect this season, 260-270 with 8-12 HR, with a more improved line in 2015

  • Hotstreak

    Brad Miller I want. I would come a SA lover if he obtained him for anyone not named Harvey, Noah or Wheeler. Although as I read more about Brad Miller he could be another Wilmer Flores who will be moved to 2B.

  • alan friedman

    There is one major flaw in your theory CJM and based upon the things Matt has said it is what we should be worried about. While the doctors and coaches have a schedule for his rehab, Matt Harvey’s desire to excel and to be the best could prove to be a problem. Will he go out and try to rush things by overthrowing from the get- go? Will his desire to come back sooner than the year that it takes most to recover be a roadblock to his recovery?
    We have already heard his initial comments about trying to rehab without the surgery which the team finally able to convince him could be a lot more dangerous to his career. Thank God he decided to go ahead and have the surgery. No one can question his work ethic or his determination to be a great pitcher but until proven otherwise, I am questioning his “smarts”.

    “Youth is sometimes wasted on the young”

  • BCleveland3381

    Ive been 100% in support of getting Drew. Always have been. Im against giving him an opt out clause if we have to give him a 3 year deal, but I’ve always wanted Sandy to sign him.

  • skyhappysal

    I don’t think considence will be a problem for this guy. I wish we had even ONE mroe like this guy. Maybe we got lucky with Harvey but he is the type of guy to completely turn around a team – with his perfomance, confidence, and leadership.
    Call me silly but there isn’t a pitcher I would rather have (discounting the injury and risk involved) to build my team around- not Verlander, or Strassberg, or Felix, or even Koufax, I mean Kershaw.
    The money situation helps but the leadership and work ethic but him over the top for me.

  • Eyeball

    I’d love to see him on the mound in October.

  • SRT

    “Youth is sometimes wasted on the young”

    Truer words have never been spoken.
    I often think, if only I knew then what I know now…..

  • Gland1

    What do you mean by “annointed Niese the ace of the rotation”? The ace is the guy who pitches the best. That is most likely going to br Colon. Niese just might be the guy who pitches the first day.

  • Fast Eddie

    One of the side benefits of dating supermodels during rehab is that it doesn’t put too much of a strain on the pitching arm. If you do it right, that is.

  • KennyandtheMets

    With Tejada as the starting SS and Davis or Duda as the primary 1B? Sorry, I can’t see it.

  • alan friedman

    I sure hope that you are right Dr. The team will be playing it safe with Matt Harvey but Matt’s desire to excel and become the best is what concerns me. I sure hope that the team’s doctors and coaching staff put him on a “short leash”.

  • KennyandtheMets

    Got it.

  • alan friedman

    I certainly agree “33” but there was so much bad blood between the front office and Johann that him being there would have been a constant problem fueled by the media!

  • KennyandtheMets

    I read something a few days ago that said Collins called Niese his ace. Maybe it was a misquote.

  • alan friedman

    100 % correct on all points Dr.

  • Gland1

    He can call him whatever he wants. Its just a word and he’s trying to pump him up. But it doesn’t matter. If Colon pitches well he will end up as the Ace. Didn’t Niese start opening day last year? And who ended up being the Ace?

    Of all of the reasons to be concerned about Collins this is literally at the bottom of the list.

  • ColoradoMetsFan

    Was it Yogi who said, “You can observe a lot by watching,” or words to that effect? As MH’s level of development, staying with the team should be a good thing…

  • john q

    Joe D.

    My point basically was that they were voting/selecting players with relatively short careers way before Koufax was elected in 1972. They started selecting players with short careers during the 1940’s so Koufax’s election had nothing to do with Kiner’s selection.

    Kiner’s career is extremely short: (6200) plate appearances. It’s one of the lowest amount of plate appearances in the HOF for a 20th century player non catcher, non negro league player.

    Kiner is by no means a no-doubt HOF, He’s a borderline HOF, so he wasn’t shunned or slighted because he wasn’t elected immediately. Like I said previously, he just barely made the eligibility by 1 season.

    One thing that hurt Kiner was that they didn’t pay any attention to On Base% back then and On Base% was one of Kiner’s great skills.

    There’s probably two things that helped Ralph Kiner get elected in the end.

    1-He was an announcer so he was visible and in peoples’ minds. This is basically what got Phil Rizzuto elected. It doesn’t help your HOF chance when you fall away from public view.

    2-The veterans’ committee made about 12-15 horrible selections during the early 1970’s, electing players who had no business in the HOF. This was based mostly on cronyism as old Giant and Cardinal players from the 1920’s started electing their friends in droves.

    Two of the players they selected: Ross Youngs and Chick Hafey had extremely short careers and were nowhere near the player Kiner was. I would imagine that some of those players selections helped Kiner get elected.

    The voting now has changed dramatically in the past 30 years and it’s extremely hard to get into the HOF now. It was just much easier to get into the HOF if you played before 1962. The writers haven’t made the mental adjustment that expansion basically doubled the league yet they percentage wise they never expanded their voting behavior.

  • KennyandtheMets

    It’s at the bottom of your list. That’s fine. I believe in pitchers earning their spot in a rotation. To place Niese ahead of Colon doesn’t take into account which one is the best pitcher right now.

  • Joey D.

    Hi John,

    I actually think Ralph was a shoo-in for the hall. He was not border line player by no means. Look at what he did in Pittsburgh playing in spacious Forbes Field and on a team in which he was pitched around – hence, the reason for the high OBP Everyone recognized he was being pitched around because he was such a feared hitter with a great batting eye, just like Ted Williams who lost out on a few batting titles because qualification was based on at bats and not plate appearances.

    Don’t know about Ralph being a broadcaster had anything to do with the push for outside of New York his broadcasting career was irrelevant. Just like with Rizzutto. Between you and me, I don’t recall Ralph ever self-promoting himself for hall of fame recognition even when asked while with Phil he would not stop talking about wanting it badly.

  • mr mojo risin

    kinda creepy heh heh… but true

  • john q

    Joey D,

    How was he a “shoo-in” for the HOF? Based on what exactly? He little no to no support on his first few attempts and he just barely made the eligibility requirement. He only had 6200 plate appearances which is one of the lowest totals in HOF history. His career numbers were: .279, 369HR, 1015rbi, 971runs scored, 1011walks, and 1451 hits.

    Jose Vizcaino had more hits in the major leagues than Ralph Kiner. Eric Karros has more career RBI than Kiner.

    Forbes Field wasn’t spacious when Ralph Kiner played there? They moved the left field fences & left field power alleys in 30 feet when they acquired Hank Greenberg in 1947. Lf went from 365 to 325 and Left center went from 406 to 376. They called that area “Greenberg Gardens.” Greenberg retired after 1947 and Kiner became a star and they renamed it “Kiner’s Korner.” That was a great park for right handed hitters from 1947-1953. They moved the fences back in 1954 “after” Kiner left the Pirates.

    Ted Williams only lost one batting title (1954) because of at bat restrictions which was the rule at the time and then later switched to 502 plate appearances in 1962. T. Williams wasn’t always “pitched around” he had an amazing batting eye and wouldn’t swing at bad pitches on principle.

    Kiner also had a great batting eye it wasn’t just that they pitched around him all the time.

    Well Ralph was a broadcaster in NYC the media capital of the U.S. back in the 1960’s not Pittsburgh. It did help him stay in the public eye.

    You’re right in that Rizzutto shamelessly plugged himself for HOF recognition well into the 1990’s.

    I can’t remember if Ralph ever did something like that because I was too young. I doubt he did. I remember when he went into the HOF in 1975 because they spoke about it on the air quite often that year.

    I’m not saying Ralph “self promoted” I’m saying that he was consistently in the public eye so he wasn’t forgotten. It didn’t hurt that he was in a major media market telling old stories day after day and then having people look back on his career form time to time. Back in the pre ESPN/cable/internet days it was very easy for player to forgotten once he retired and went back home and got some regular job.

  • Joey D.

    Hi John Q,

    Knew they moved some of the fences in but did not remember it was to that extreme and that far reaching – thanks for setting me straight on that. But even without referring to the numbers, I have to go by my memory – not of the local media from the sixties and seventies but rather from what I read in older magazines from the fifties for when I was young I was a big collector of those things (when I was 14 or 15 it was the equivalent of today having magazines from around 2000 but much less expensive). What was written about Ralph Kiner really stuck out in my mind because he was then broadcasting for the Mets and I was only beginning to learn about baseball’s great historic past.

    I remember Yankee fans and the organization along with Rizzutto not hiding the fact that Phil very much wanted to be elected to the Hall but my recollection was that of Ralph staying out of the discussion. Maybe it was just a matter of Rizzuto being more open with his feelings saying how he was waiting by the phone and depressed not getting a call where it wasn’t as much a case of modesty with Ralph as it was keeping his own disappointments private.

    I did word it wrong – meant to say the great batting eye with Williams. Though it was also true with Ralph, intentional walks were less prone with the Red Sox for they were not like the Pirates obviously.

    In one of those magazines I collected from 1955 there was an article titled “Is the rule on walks unfair?” and it obviously focused specifically on the skinny splinter because he did lose out to Avila in 1954. Eventually the rule was changed to 3.1 plate appearances but exactly when I do not know. It was before 1961 – that was when expansion in the AL upped the figure to 502 plate appearances from what I guess was 477 beforehand.

    From what I recall,Ty Cobb won a title in a season when he fell short of the minimum standard at-bats because adding outs to meet that total he would have still been leading the junior circuit.

    Hey, this has been fun. You really know your old time baseball and thanks again for reminding me that Ralph did not have to contend with Forbes’ left field which did not seem to be a problem for Bill Mazeroski when facing Ralph Terry over 53 years ago.

  • john q

    Joe D,

    Yeah, the Dryfuss family sold the Pirates in 1946 and a group headed by Frank McKinney bought the team. That’s when Bing Crosby became a minority partner in the team.

    Detroit was having contract squabbles with Hank Greenberg so he decided to retire rather than play for less. Detroit sold his contract to The Pirates and they made a deal with Greenberg and paid him $80,000 which was a crazy & astronomical sum for a baseball player back then.

    To accommodate Greenberg’s pull hitting style, they moved the fences in left and left center quite drastically and renamed it “Greenberg Gardens.” The team also changed their uniform for one year to a black script P on the cap and a script Pittsburgh on the jersey. You can see this in the film “42.” They would eventually go to their classic black & yellow look in 1948. It’s hard to realize now but the Pirates wore a dark red & blue color for the longest time.

    Greenberg mentored Kiner in ’47 and Kiner had his first big season. I think Greenberg left at the end of the season to take a front office position in Cleveland. I would imagine he had money squabbles with the Pirates for 1948 because he was only 36 and he could still hit. I think Greenberg held the record for the most HR hit (25) in a player’s final year for the longest time. I think Dave Kingman broke the mark. He might still hold that dubious honor.

    Yeah, Kiner had a great batting eye but they didn’t really even look at things like On Base% or walks back then. Heck they only started to look at that stuff in the early 2000’s.

    Yeah, Rizzutto got kind of shameless during the 80’s and early 90’s about his HOF case. I think in the end a deal was made among the veteran’s committee where Ted Williams voted for him as long as Yogi Berra voted for Ted’s buddy Bobby Doerr. The veteran’s committee has been pretty awful since the 1940’s trading votes, cronyism , lazy research. The worst instance was during the early 70’s when you had a bunch of of ex Cardinals and Giants from the 1920’s and they basically voted in all their ex teammates. There’s about 12 terrible selections from that time period. There was also a lousy veteran’s committee in the early 60’s and the late 40’s that did somewhat the same thing.

    If your interesting in the HOF and all the dirty stuff that goes on behind the scenes read “The Politics of Glory” by Bill James. I think it’s still in print. It came out in 1994 around the time of the Phil Rizzutto controversy. It’s a bit dated in parts but overall it’s very illuminated how the HOF evolved and worked until 1994.

    I think the at bats rule was lowered for the batting title around 1957? I think partly because of that Ted Williams incident in 1954. They finally went to plate appearances when they went to the 162 game schedule in 1962.

    That Ty Cobb story is highly possible. There was also a lot of shenanigans going on with batting titles back then because there was often contract bonuses attached. I guess the famous one was the old Chalmers trophy by the Chalmers automotive company. The batting champ would get a free car & a trophy if he won. Everybody hated Cobb so I think they let Napoleon Lajoie win be letting fly balls drop and not going after easy ground balls. That’s essentially how you got the first MVP awards instead of a batting title to determine the best player. An MVP award would voted on by the writers so teams couldn’t cheat like they did in the Cobb/Lajoie story.

    I actually didn’t realize that they moved the fences “back” after Kiner left the team in ’54, I had to look that one up. I really don’t know the reason for that.

    The Galbreth family bought the team in 1950 and they hired Branch Rickey to run the team and he basically gutted everything and was a major tightwad and treated Kiner like crap because he was the only star and the only player making any money. Rickey badmouthed him and traded him for nothing when Kiner was basically shot in ’53. In hindsight is was pretty dumb for Rickey to badmouth Kiner because he brought his value way down. Anyway Rickey basically stole Clemente in the rule 5 draft from Brooklyn. He brought in Mazeroski and Groat and Vern Law and most of those key guys that would win the 1960 WS. I think Rickey had to retire sometime in the late 50’s because of his health so he wasn’t there when they won.

  • Joey D.

    Hi John Q.,

    WOW and I do mean WOW! That is quite a family experience you have and a lot of great inside information. Will try and get that book from James but it brings out the problems once discussed in MMO about whom gets to vote for the hall of fame due to the sports writers being a part of the steroid era cover up and not exactly being the ones to make judgments upon others.

    But beyond that, I don’t know if there is a solution because as you have brought to my attention (and thanks for doing so!) the old timers committee has becomes a club.

    With Rizzuto it was shameless – but you know what the ultimate shame of that might be? Phil might have actually deserved to be in the hall but his no holds barred campaign to get in could have ruffled the feathers of one too many a member on that committee and thus he held himself back. And in addition, it is the perception of Phil’s HOF qualifications as a fan. For myself, I won’t deny the built up resentment I still hold to this day regarding he and his cronies publicly campaigning for his enshrinement that I cannot look at his career objectively. When Phil was making his acceptance speech I remember feeling he got in more from the pressure exerted upon the Hall (even privately) than anything more. Something just did not seem right. Though not aware of the politics behind it, it seemed as if he did not get in out of merit. Again, it is possible that Rizzuto was his own worst enemy and the public posturing he created could have caused resentment among those on the committee and thus held him back. Who knows, it’s only a guess.

    I recall reading something about Cobb and the batting title staring with Cleveland’s LaJoie when they were each awarded the car in 1910 in Cobb’s autobiography “My Life In Baseball – The True Story” when I was younger as well, but as we get on in years, the exact details fade from memory.

    Too bad the Pirates never faced Cleveland in a world series – would have loved to have seen Hope and Crosby get after each other with that one.

  • john q

    Joe D,

    Frank McKinney was a big time politician from Indiana who led a group that bought the Pirates. To the best of my knowledge, the Greenberg signing was really unusual for the time period. In some ways it was like a free agent signing.

    I think McKinney and his group were upset that they spent all this money on Greenberg and the team only won 62 games. I think that’s why they didn’t offer him another contract of 1948. Clearly Greenberg could still play.

    It’s odd how McKinney sold the team in ’50 after buying it in 1947. I don’t know the details. McKinney later went on to be the head of the DNC in the 1950’s.

    Yeah, the James book really gave me a much clearer picture as to how the HOF worked/works.

    Rizzuto is very tricky because he lost 3 years from WW2 and then he suffered from the effects of malaria in 1946. Then he retired kind of quickly around ’55 or ’56. I think even with 3 years of WW2 credit, he’s a borderline case. They used to compare him to Pee Wee Reese which was ridiculous because Reese was a much better player.

    Yeah, I agree with you that the stuff with Rizzutto was shameless by the late 1980’s. I think Steinbrenner deserves some of the blame as well as he was always trying to get as many Yankees in the HOF as possible. Tony Lazzerri was another poor veteran’s committee selection in the early 1990’s. Then Steinbrenner paid off Reggie Jackson to wear a Yankee cap on his plaque. That’s when they changed the rule about players choosing the cap of their choice.

    There was a lot of vote trading among the veteran’s committee back then, you vote for my teammate I’ll vote for your teammate kind of stuff. That’s how Bobby Doerr got in, he was T. Williams good buddy. So Yogi Berra votes for Doerr, T. Williams votes for Berra’s buddy, Phil Rizzutto.

    The worst according to Bill James was the early 1970s’ group. That’s how Chick Hafey and Ross Youngs got in the HOF which is a joke. It would be like Carl Crawford and Jason Werth ending their careers in 2013 and getting elected to the HOF.

    I think some of the writers saw that and said, wait a second KIner was a much, much better player than those two guys and that might have helped his case.

    I think that Chalmers trophy dispute is explained really well in the Ken Burns Baseball documentary.