Jason Bay Likely To Retire

jason bay

Former Mets outfielder Jason Bay tells Shi Davidi of SportsNet.ca that he does not foresee a situation where he would continue his playing career and so he is “essentially retiring”.

Bay had contemplated an offer to play in Japan, however the 35-year old believes it is time to focus on family.

Bay finishes his career with a .266/.360/.481 slash, 222 career home runs and 754 RBIs in 1278 games over 11 years.

Prior to the 2010 season, Bay signed a 4-year, $66 million deal with the Mets, ending in disaster. The two parties agreed to part ways in November of 2012.

About Clayton Collier 388 Articles
Clayton Collier, a senior editor for MMO, is a Journalism major with a minor in Broadcasting at Seton Hall University. He is also a staff member at 89.5 WSOU, Seton Hall's modern active rock radio station. Following him on Twitter: @Clayton_Collier or E-maili him at MaybeNextYearMets@yahoo.com
  • Phoenix Met

    By all accounts seemed like a good dude. Sorry his career ended the way it did, and even more sorry that it didn’t work out while he was a Met.

  • Benny

    Straight up robbed us.

    Honestly I wouldn’t be surprised if he comes up as a player who used PEDs.

  • Big Mets Fan

    Not a bad guy. Not a good Met.

  • XtreemIcon

    He retired in 2009.

  • sperry

    Nor would I. Has there ever been a player with such a ridiculous drop off in production?

  • SpinalRemains

    Agreed. He may have the deepest splits in the baseball multiverse. From All Star to ahhhhh hell no, in one offseason. From knocking baseballs off the left field wall to knocking his head the left field wall.

    PEDs

  • metFAN660

    Sad story. The guy hustled his ass off. I think his problems were more related to running into too many walls, as opposed to PEDs.

  • Didn’t he “focus on family” when he came off the million day disabled list and flew straight up to Canada to watch the birth of his 18th kid?

  • Macacawitz

    Here’s an unambiguous example of the quickness with which an elite level player can completely lose it. When he lost it, he LOST it. He was Ike Davis before Ike Davis.

  • It’s hard not to be bitter as a Met fan after his tenure here, but good for him. Happy retirement even if you cost us lots of collective frustration, depression, higher blood pressure.

  • LongTimeFan1

    Class act. Those concussions really ruined what had been a very fine career. Still is but those last few years is what stands out to those apt to focus on the negative as embittered Mets fans often do.

  • Big Mets Fan

    Can’t argue that he didn’t play hard. He certainly did.

  • vigouge

    PED’s? There has never been any hint of a rumor that Jason Bay ever took performance enhancing drugs, none. Why invent a reason when the most likely culprit are the multiple concussions and other injuries?

    BTW, he robbed no one. No player ever robs a team unless that player fails to give 100%.

  • goorru

    LMAO, As Met fans what should we focus on his years as a Pirate?

  • Waz0787

    Eff you bay.

  • Erin_II

    I`m just glad that I never have to look at his stupid, hardworking, good clubhouse face ever again.

  • Erin_II

    HA!

  • Hitmanᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ ✔

    Funny how he waited for the Mets to stop paying him to start “focusing on family”.

  • Justin Anthony

    Congrats on a great career Jason. You’ll be missed

  • metFAN660

    Benny is addicted to negativity.

  • Well we know one thing for sure – he definitely did not take PEDs when he was on the Mets.

  • KennyandtheMets

    Well said.

  • Benny

    “There has never been any hint of a rumor that Jason Bay ever took performance enhancing drugs…”

    Did I say there was? I just simply shared my thought of not being surprised if he was on them. Do you know how to read?

    “Why invent a reason when the most likely culprit are the multiple concussions and other injuries?”

    I must’ve missed where I “invented” something. Again do you know how to read?

    “BTW, he robbed no one. No player ever robs a team unless that player fails to give 100%.”

    Man, you are on a roll today! Calm down sherlock! Considering he gave us nil in the performance department, and he got paid a considerable amount, that would put this transaction at negative value. Was this literally a robbery, well no, but did he get overpaid for the services he provided us? Definitely, which is my point!

  • Waz0787

    Would you pass on the millions from wilpons? I hope he runs into more walls post retirement.

  • Benny

    Considering I am a Mets fan, yes I guess I am addicted to negativity…

  • Benny

    HA!

  • Tacohow

    Bay isn’t the first guy to not live up to a contract. But he was a victim of the cheap and broke Wilpons who used his contract as an excuse to never sign anyone ever again (along with Castillo and Perez). As the last big free agent signing in years (till Granderson) his name became synonmous with the Mets recent demise, while it had much more to do with the Wilpons inability to field a good team than anything Bay did.

  • coyote521

    yeah, hate on Jason Bay, because he was THE ONLY star player to come to the Mets and turn into a total dud,

    except of course for George Foster, Jim Fregosi, Kenny Boyer, Mo Vaughn, Ellis Valentine, Carlos Baerga, Bobby Bonilla, and many more

    Who took a wrong turn down Alomar Avenue the minute they put on a Mets uniform,

    and most of whom cost the Mets a lot more in either bread or talent than Poor Jason Bay did.

    And besides, Bay bumped his head. Twice.
    What’s Alomar’s excuse?

  • Hitmanᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ ✔

    Damn, that’s harsh.

  • Benny

    “What’s Alomar’s excuse?”

    Age? Plus he didn’t perform as bad as Bay did here. He actually hovered around a .700 ops (bad, but not horrible like Bay).

  • Connor O’Brien

    LOL this is great

  • Pike Miazza

    …”all the way to the bank bitch…”

  • Waz0787

    He was horrible to watch. An epic bust

  • Waz0787

    What the all down vote?

  • Pike Miazza

    Everybody seems to be forgetting that he was awful from day 1 in a Mets uniform way before the concussion. He didn’t live up to any of that contract

  • sperry

    Are you all forgetting how painful his at bats were to watch?

    Talk about absence making the heart grow fonder. Jesus.

  • sperry

    Why would Mets fans care about what he did for other teams

  • Benny

    Thank you!

    His production was awful from the getgo. People on here stating his concussions are what caused his decline are just comical. I mean I literally remember fans hoping that the concussions actually wake him up and let him find his offensive production from his Boston days. How soon some people forget, huh…

  • BronxMets

    your point?

  • BehindTheBag

    And that would be a great advertisement against PED’s.

    “Listen up kids. If you take steroids, you could end up growing up to be Jason Bay.”
    “NOOOOO!!!!!”

  • Tired_OF_FakeRumors

    Can we play the race card? This guy literally did NOTHING for the Mets and people still support him because he hustle. BUT Carlos Beltran gets thrown under the bus by ownership and a lot of dumb fans despite being one of the best center fielders of his era and in franchise history.
    Anyways that’s not Bay’s fault so I wish him a happy and peaceful retirement.

  • R04

    Once again with the Rican drivel. Please stop posting. Nobody cares.

  • Corporal Hicks

    I know people like to throw out PEDs or the after-effects of a concussion, but I still think there has to be some issue with his eyesight. I saw him in Seattle, years after his concussions, and he still looked like he literally could not see the ball.

    As a side note, Seattle’s habit of signing terrible former Mets has given me the opportunity to vent years of frustration by booing the likes of Bay, Oliver Perez, and Kelly Shoppach…

  • jason bay

    Bay had previously done most of his damage on FB’s up. He stopped getting as many FB’s up and started getting more down and started looking down and couldn’t react when the 4 seem came. The pitch he used to square became the pitch he swung through or fouled back..

    He also swung at a lot more pitches off the plate and made weak contact with them.

    Pre concussion his SLG was .424 at Citi and .231 on the road through 2/3rds of the season.

    It was some combination of:

    Being pitched to differently.

    Trying to do too much.

    Loss of bat speed.

    Not having the surgery on his shoulder Boston wanted.

    The Fenway effect.

    Not wanting to come here in the first place.

    Being the Man in a bad lineup.

    The concussion (and being put on a plane as Church was) probably took away any chance for him to right himself but what was going on (pre concussion) was some combination of the above.

  • Tired_OF_FakeRumors

    WTF! is the first time I post this.

  • Gland1

    Bay isn’t a victim. He was awful as a Met and people didn’t like him for it. End of story. He’s not a scapegoat for the Wilpon’s being broke; he was just a terrible player. If anything he got cut tons of slack because he is supposedly a “good guy” and he “tried”.

  • jason bay

    Most fans love Beltran but a better example of what your saying is Castillo. He played hard and he played hurt when he could but got the full wrath of Met Fans basically because he was a bad signing.

    Second basemen don’t normally last beyond 32 or so unless your talking about the HOF types.

    Part of the reason could be apathy and disgust after yet another FA bust and many less fans in the stands but that might not be the whole deal.

  • Tacohow

    Okay no one ever said bay was a victim. He was used as an excuse to not bring in free agents, to not spend money. “see, we tried it with Bay, clearly that way doesn’t work”. The Giants signed Barry Zito to one of the worst contracts in history. He is not hated by the fans as they still attempted to win after that mistake.
    Soriano, Mauer, John lackey. All terrible contracts. Are they so hated by their fan base?
    Bay was hurt and terrible with the Mets. But that did not stop them from not bringing in a decent player for the next five years. That was the Wilpons.

  • Gland1

    You specifically said he was a victim. Your sentence said ” But he was a victim of the cheap and broke Wilpons….”

    I’m not sure what the Wilpons have to do with this situation. I don’t like Bay because he sucked. I don’t like the Wilpons because they can’t afford to keep this team and as they try to cling to it it the team suffers. Those are two separate issues.

    You’re acting like fans are scapegoating a good player. He flat out sucked.

  • goorru

    They say time heals all wounds except maybe concussions.

  • goorru

    I think his point was that Bay and also Santana’s contracts became even more of a burden when the Wilpon’s decided that they had to cut payroll by historical numbers.

  • Gland1

    If that’s what he means, that’s true. But by saying he’s a victim of the Wilpons (which is what he said) and talking about other guys who haven’t performed after they were given big contracts, he seems to be implying that he isn’t being hated for fair reasons. I think for the most part the people who hate Jason Bay do so not because of the Wilpons, but because Jason Bay was awful.

  • Tacohow

    You misunderstood
    I meant the past five years have been blamed on Bay
    That any time we talked about bringing in a big free-agent his name was thrown around as the reason free agent deals always failed
    Bay was hurt and terrible with the Mets.
    But the reason the Mets have been terrible is the Wilpon’s. Not Bays.

  • Taskmaster4450

    Bay was nothing with the Mets. He was terrible from Day 1 and that cannot be disputed. Many seem to hate these players for the money they make but that is unfair. There is not a single person on here who wouldnt sign the contract put in front of Bay, Castillo, or Francisco. If a team is going to offer it, a player will take it.

    As for Bay ending the Met signing FA, that isnt the case. The simple fact is the Met have been bleeding money since 2009. Alderson was brought in with Job #1: save the franchise for the Wilpons. When a team is losing between $70M-$90M a year as reported happened in 2009 and 2010, expenses were going to be cut. Bay and his $16M a year (or whatever it was) did not cause the Wilpons financial difficulties nor did he prevent them signing other players. The Wilpons decisions to finance a new stadium coupled with the Madoff scandal was all it took. Without Uncle Bernie’s fact returns (read cashflow), the Mets were operating in the red.

  • jason bay

    Bay is a perfect example of the Wilpon Method in action.

    Even a full year after the Madoff scam was revealed..the Wilpon’s were still utilizing their Plan in order to goose the turnstiles instead of looking out for the long term heath and viability of the Franchise by getting Reyes’ signature on an extension.

    Then they played weasel while hiding behind Alderson when Reyes was bumrushed by Loria in what turned out to be a scam deal itself.

  • Gland1

    I think the past five years have been pretty well blamed on the Wilpons. The Wilpons may have been afraid to bring in free agents because of Bay, but people don’t see that at as a valid excuse. We know they are broke, they can try and use whatever excuse they want.

    So Bay is a victim of nothing. He’s just bad. And it may seem that the Wilpons were afraid of signing FAs after Bay, but the reality is that they are just broke/

  • Kubo, Asian Dynamite

    NOT ONLY WAS MISTER BAY ONE OF THE GREATEST MET OUTFIELDERS OF ALL TIME, HE WAS ALSO A TRUE CLASS ACT. UNFORTUNATELY AT SOME POINT, A WALL RAN INTO HIM, CAUSING HIS EPIC PRODUCTION TO BE SLIGHTLY WORSENED.

    YOU WILL BE MISSED, MISTER BAY.

  • Waz0787

    Troll on a metsblog? Eff u bay. I hope you hit more walls during your post retirement career. Greatest mets my a$$. He was a failure from day one.

  • Pedro’s Rooster

    Great to see you here, my friend!

  • Kabeetz

    Castillo was the weak link on an otherwise loaded team with WS potential. Bay didn’t play on teams with that same level of expectation (though an all star in his place would’ve been a huge difference maker).

    To the OP I think few Mets fans would take more issue with Castillo or Beltran over Bay. I don’t think there is even a comparison there. Bay is much more reminiscent of say a Mo Vaughn signing.

  • Des

    Jason Bay always gave everything he had. He never stopped hustling.

    Thanks Jason.

  • Des

    I liked and support both Beltran and Bay. Somehow I don’t think I fit your view of them or me. Let’s recognize their efforts and not what they do for our ego needs.

  • Cervant

    Good luck.

  • Des

    Pete Reiser suffered from running into balls too. Leo Durocher,
    who was Reiser’s first major league manager, reflected many years later
    that in terms of talent, skill, and potential, there was only one other
    player comparable to Reiser – Willie Mays. Durocher also said that “Pete had more power than Willie — left-handed and right-handed both. He had everything but luck. Pete is now gone but he was special.

  • Joey D.

    Hi Task,

    Will not deny Bay did not do the job we expected of him (and that I felt he and Citi Field would not be a good match to begin with which is a different story anyway) but he did hustle and suffered that concussion which could have led to a more serious head injury.

    But Bay indeed has become the poster boy for being reflective of the Mets fiscal problems which is unfair. The financial problems the Mets have never were an outgrowth of any of the erroneous spending on players they did.

    Going into the 2013 with the Mets payroll being as low as it was, they went into the season with a $2.4 operating income deficit. In turn, with the Yankee payroll being so tremendously higher, the Yanks only went into 2013 with an operating income surplus of just $1.4 million. In total, that is only a variation of $3.8 million. Yet, the Yankees face no fiscal calamity whereas if the Wilpons don’t get that re-financing this coming June, Sterling Mets might be forced to sell.

    Why? The answer is in the net revenue. Now, both teams play in the biggest baseball market in the country so there is enough money to be made, even if one captures the bigger market share of the two. The Yankees make so much profit from their net revenue whereas the Mets need to use that net revenue to pay off their debt because of the tremendous losses suffered by the parent company at the hands of Madoff.

    Other teams with high payrolls like the Angels, Rangers and Tigers have operating budget that are actually in the red and yet do not find themselves in any economic trouble. The difference is that these teams did not have the dependency on what turned out to be a ponzie scheme combined with a debt payment that they did not have the resources and the financial credit to pay back.

    This is why the Mets high roster payroll of a few years back cannot be blamed for the problems facing Sterling Mets today. Even if one wants to assert less fans came to see a team with a losing record and that in turn meant less operating income, as pointed out, other teams with high payrolls operate with a negative operating balance quite handedly regardless of their won-loss record or attendance.

    So Jason Bay has become the unfair symbol of what has led to the Mets problems of today. All he is responsible for is for not performing as expected when he was not injured and nothing more.

  • Hotstreak

    On eyesight I agree. Josh Hamilton also blue eyes and big splits day and night games. Bay I think he was a mistake to sign and I had that opinion after 3-4 games, yes I did. I never liked horrendous with two strikes and never clutch against the Mets. I never feared him as a pirate. I admit I did not watch him in AL with Boston. But he was still horrendous with two strikes based on stats. Yes he blinked or closed his eyes when swinging. With him he was literally the blind squirrel.

  • Gland1

    You too sir! It’s really a disaster over there. Nobody is left and the comment section is just ruined. It’s nice to find a place with some active conversation and a lot of posts to chat about!

  • Joey D.

    Jason,

    Do you really believe the Mets would have re-signed Reyes had they never inked Bay’s signature to a contract based on all we know about their financial problems?

    Think about what the situation still would had been with a Jason Bayless Mets.

    – The team would have still lost $55 million in 2011 instead of $70 million or if we take his two years off, the total would have still been a $40 million loss after 2011 no matter how one slices it.

    – The team would have needed to borrow $86 million through the end of 2011 instead of the combined $101 million, or $71 million if we minus the two years.

    – Bay’s contract is part of the operating portion derived from the net income. The operating income is dependent upon ballpark revenue. The rest of the net income is based upon other sources of revenue outside of operating income (television, merchandising, etc.). Those outside sources also included a dependency upon Bernie Madoff not just in annual returns but in the Sterling Mets portion of the half billion dollar investment.

    – It is estimated that Sterling Mets owes a billion dollars in loans. In 2011 minus Bay’s contract meant they would still have $970 million left to pay back without those outside revenue sources mentioned above.

    – After the 2011 season the Mets also dropped for one year their association with the St. Lucie rookie team which cost between $800,000 and a million dollars to operate. One baseball executive said the Mets had to be in a dire financial situation for it to make a petty cut such as that.

    – And now we will have a payroll that even with from what I believe is a combined savings of $37 million from his and Johan’s contract will reflect not much more than we had in 2013 and will place us in the bottom third – if not the bottom fifth – of all MLB payrolls.

    So even without Jason Bay, is it plausible to suggest Jose Reyes would have really been offered a contract to stay on the team after 2011 considering the big picture regarding Sterling Mets financial problems and that we find them today still managing on a very stringent operating budget with the television revenue already accounted for other purposes as Sandy explained a few weeks ago? I don’t think so.

  • JustSomeInternetGuyYouDontKnow

    He retired when he signed the Mets contract.

  • Nolrog

    His bat did, that’s for sure.

  • Nolrog

    Here here! Glad I found my way over here as well.

  • Just_Da_damaja

    also standing 5 feet away from the plate because he couldnt adjust to the inside FB fast enough

  • Just_Da_damaja

    the last RF to hit over 25 HR for us was Bobby Bo in 1992..

    Alomar was by far the biggest disappointment of any player we ever acquired and the only HOF on that list there…

    Alomar wasnt just a good player, he was by far the BEST 2B of the 1990’s and at the time, folks were talking about him as one of the best of all time.

    when he had came over…this is what his career looked like

    batted over .300 nine times (1992–97, 1999–2001)

    posted an on-base pct. over .400 five times (1992–93, 1996, 1999, 2001)

    scored 100 or more runs six times (1992–93, 1996, 1999–2001)

    drove in 100 or more runs twice (1999, 2001)

    stole 30 or more bases eight times (1989, 1991–93, 1995, 1999–2001)

    won four Silver Slugger awards (1992, 1996, 1999–2000)

    I think if he played for the Yanks in 2002 instead of the Mets, his career likely plays out very differently.

  • Just_Da_damaja

    they get tired of hearing the truth.

  • Just_Da_damaja

    the guy is talking in general.

    if it doesnt apply to you, dont take it personal

  • Just_Da_damaja

    he both got tons of slack for being a good guy and running to 1B hard…but his contract became the scape-goat for the wilpons not being able to field a team.

    both things can exist.

  • Just_Da_damaja

    How did Loria scam Reyes?

    Reyes is still getting paid.

    He’s on a better team, surrounded by a bunch of his friends from DR, playing in an awesome clean and vibrant city…

    and he is still getting paid that 106 million dollars..

    I wish someone would scam me like that

  • Just_Da_damaja

    and T Agee aka Jason Bay has no response

    as usual…

  • Benny

    Loria signed Reyes to a 6 year deal. The reason why he didn’t get a no-trade clause was because the Marlins don’t believe in that, but Loria promised him that he will stay in Miami for the long run.

    A year later he was traded to Toronto without any say, as a matter of fact Loria told Reyes to go ahead and buy a house in Miami, since he is going to stay there for the foreseeable future. About a week or two later the Marlins traded Reyes to Toronto, a place where his contract is going to be affected by more taxes (Florida has no state tax).

  • LIKayLGM

    You can play it, but it sounds ridicules. You speak in absolutes, which is not the way it is. Are you reading some of these comments, he’s hardly getting a pass or support from EVERY fan. Just as Beltran was not thrown under the bus by EVERY fan.

    Has nothing to do with race, and the fact that its the quick go to when people disagree is what makes it that much worse. There are still people that bring race, gender, ethnicity into decisions, this is NOT one of them.

  • R04

    I remember you from Metsblog. Everybody hated you.

  • Hotstreak

    You know my stance as I was the original one who saw Bay was a bust real early. Bay was given slack until he definitely had to go. But its time to forgetaboutit. The book is closed on a sorry chapter. Its ironic Reggie Jackson who I despise but with Seaver and Co. would have made the Mets a dynasty wore No. 44 and charged in his book the race card for NOT being drafted by Mets (interracial marriage). And Jason Bay’s (No.44) was given slack compared to even a guy like Santana (John Delcos) is made believe not to be the race card. I promise NOT to mention this again because chapter closed and I will forgetabouit. New slate and winning will cure it all. LGM

    PS John Delcos thanks for leading the charge to get Mike Piazza in HOF.

  • skyking26

    He retired when he laid off the juice. He had 36 HR’S 119 RBI’S before signing with the Mets which was justifiable for the mets to sign him but has never even come close to that player since.

  • R04

    Please pass out in traffic…see how that feels?

  • JustSomeInternetGuyYouDontKnow

    This is the problem with baseball now. Everything is juice this and juice that. Could it be he was playing in a bandbox in Boston and had a good lineup around him? Not that it matters…

  • Joey D.

    Hi Just,

    I understand Jason’s point if he wants to talk about it terms of poor judgement regarding the signings which one can agree or disagree with because it’s easier to look back with 20/20 hindsight rather than the situation and the players as they were perceived at the time (in 2010 I didn’t think Bay was a good signing myself because he was not going to fit in with Citi Field).

    It could also be argued that ownership under Sandy took a different stance regarding expensive, multi-year commitments.

    But Jason has also been contending that Bay’s $60 million was of itself the stumbling block toward trying to re-sign Jose – including the notion of being able to afford one or the other but not both – has no economic credibility to it for as demonstrated above, even if the Mets never signed Bay, they still would not have had the money to re-sign Reyes or anyone for that matter.

  • jason bay

    Yeah Joey,

    I am sure the Mets would have re-signed Reyes had Bay not been signed. He cost 66 M and the 2010 team had another 20 M pumped into it of which Bay (obviously) commanded the lions share of.

    Had Bay not been signed there is no question in my mind that Reyes would have been re-signed.

  • jason bay

    Pay attention here.

    Reyes didn’t sign up to play in Toronto, he signed to play in Miami. He lost quite a bit of money in that transaction going from a state with no income tax, to a country with a much higher tax rate.

    Not sure what you even mean by Reyes “being surrounded by a bunch of his friends from the DR.” What are you insinuating that he has a huge posse from Villa Clara following him around?

    **** if he wanted that I’m sure he could have ten times as many in Miami.

  • jason bay

    It was obviously a scam contract with an escape hatch, no different than Delgado.

    Surprised Reyes and his agent fell for it but they met his price and the rest is history.

  • Joey D.

    Jason,

    You mean all the fiscal hardships they still would have faced with the absence of Bay’s contract is irrelevant and it’s only a matter of looking at the roster payroll within the operating budget and not in terms of the operating income and expenditures being part of the total income and financial obligations that come under the net income which is actual bottom line total of the ledger book? That after the 2011 season they needed to raise $240 million in minority shares in order to pay back prior loans and meet their projected fiscal obligations for the year and if that figure had been $174 instead, that lower but still $174 million collateral figure required to be raised would have made a difference regarding the ability to then attempt to re-sign Reyes?

    Bay’s contract also did not account for the other $940 million or more of debt the Wilpons owe. You do not think that $66 million was needed for those more pressing issues related to the very economic survival of Sterling Mets than the re-signing of our shortstop?

    And finally, I am thinking about something you have mentioned many times in the past. If the Wilpons applied sound fiscal judgement they would have recognized it was not economically prudent to invest in any multi-year contract at the time they signed Bay due to the Madoff situation. So even if they didn’t sign Bay because of that line of reasoning, what makes you think they would have thought any differently the following year when it came to Reyes – based on your own line of thought?

  • jason bay

    Because SS’s that can play defense and bat leadoff are very hard to acquire, unlike LFer’s where you could throw together a platoon of a couple cheap acquisitions as you your self have spoken of in your example of Schierholtz and Gomes but really the possibilities are endless for filling LF on a reasonably decent short term basis at a relatively miniscule cost and no long term clogging of the payroll.

    SS’s that bat leadoff, not so much.

    Popular homegrown SS’s that have been to all Star games, won silver sluggers and are just at the beginning of their prime? Yeah I think it’s a no brainer that Reyes would have been signed had Bay not been, it’s not like we’re talking Moises Alou here.

    I say that Reyes would most likely have been re signed as the team would have lost 16 M less in 2010 and had 16 M less in payroll committed in the years 2011, 2012 and 2013 and as you are no doubt aware the Mets did in fact extend Dickey, Niese and Wright so how can you be so sure that the Mets would not have extended Reyes had they not committed 66 M to Bay?

  • nymetswinws

    The guy is joking…

  • Adam

    Oh, Jason Bay. I remember being at Citi Field and seeing you hit your first homer in a Mets uniform.

    It was a beautiful late April day.

  • Adam

  • Adam

    How dare he be present for the birth of his child?

    Is this really the quality of argument people are making now?

  • Joey D.

    Jason,

    How can I be so sure?

    Simply because for a popular homegrown SS that has been to all Star games, won silver sluggers and is just at the beginning of his prime I too think it’s a no brainer that Reyes would have been signed. Teams find the money for that type of player unless they are playing in a very small market or they are facing astronomical fiscal hardships…., which Sterling Mets is.

    If they couldn’t afford to re-sign Reyes with Bay, they would not have been able to do so without him One cannot ignore the total net economic problems pointed out and bring it down to a matter of $16 million a year.

  • Fonzie

    He put up 30 homer season’s in Pittsburgh too which is a pretty big park, especially in LF where he hits the majority of his homers. It will always be a mystery with Bay as to why he fell of a cliff. Robbie Alomar is another who had a great year befor coming to the Mets and then totally forgetting how to hit.

  • jason bay

    Joey,

    That doesn’t make any sense.

    Back in the off season of 2009-2010 the Mets spent 85 M on the 2010 team and spent ZERO on the SS.

    Back at that point in time it wouldn’t have taken much more than 85 M to sign Reyes spread out over 5 years. It was clearly a choice between Reyes and trying to patch the old rust bucket and goose the turnstiles, hence the outrage from Jr. Wilpon when Beltran’s surgery was reported.

    Even there the Mets did know the situation with his knee, their own employee (Rey Ramirez) told Beltran himself that he couldn’t help him anymore.

    Delgado couldn’t even DH and had to quit the PR Winter League after a couple AB’s. The rotation was Santana, Pelfrey, Niese (untested and coming off the same injury as Reyes) Perez, Maine to which they added Escobar (2 M) and Dickey (thought so highly of he was cut the first day of ST) and picked up or re-signed Cora, Tatis, Jacobs, Cattolonotto, Takahashi, igaraschi, Accosta, Dessens, Valdez, Nieve, then traded for GMJ, rushed up Parnell, Mejia and Tejada and had Francouer, Barajas, Blanco, Castillo., Sean Green, Chris Carter…..

    I mean C’mon, that team sucked, no amount of money was going to fix this disaster……It was a a last second Hail Mary to sign Bay. They signed Bay to sell a lot of tickets……An interest free loan if you will (start collecting on the ticket sales a few months before you have to start paying out a nickel)

    Had they not signed Bay, they would have had the money to re-sign Reyes, after all the put 85 M into a Hail Mary, why wouldn’t they have put 90-100 M into a homegrown superstar at a position that is a hundred times more difficult to fill then LF?

  • Tired_OF_FakeRumors

    I should have not make like general comments but just the fact that people feel uncomfortable talking about these themes mean that they are still factoring on our ways to behave.

  • Julian

    Race is just not a big part of the game anymore- Thank Gosh. In fact, the last time anything about race was even mentioned was when Orlando Hudson said Jermaine Dye and Gary Sheffield could get jobs because they were black- he never directly said this, but he hinted it. The reason people threw Beltran under the bus was because he never really wanted to play for the Mets from the beginning. Why people supported Bay? I have no idea. It was probably because he actually had success and they wanted him to tap into it again:

    April 19- July 5th 2010: .285/.370/.470

    Race is not a part of the game and in this case people got irritated with Beltran because he was the main focus of a failing team and the partner in crime of the Mets injury stereotype with Reyes. Bay got a “pass” because there were other off-the-field issues people focused on, rather than him.

  • Waz0787

    Thanks. I got killed with all the down vote. I hated the signing from day one. I wanted mets to sign holiday but ended up with mr canada. Anyway the fact he was a bust put fuel into my anger.

  • Waz0787

    Thanks. I got all this negative vote for displeasure regarding bay. I was not sure. I hated the signing from day one.

  • nymetswinws

    lol I get emotional when I hear Bay’s name too. Soon he will be nothing more than a distant memory.

  • Joey D.

    Jason,

    “Back at that point in time it wouldn’t have taken much more than 85 M to sign Reyes spread out over 5 years”

    So now you are suggesting having extended Jose’s contract during winter of 2009/10 instead of signing Bay? After playing all of just 36 games in 2009? He suffered a calf injury. Then he suffered a calf tear during a rehab game in early June. He tore his right hamstring during rehab in August and was through for the year.

    You would have called that an “albatross” signing of an injured player who depended so much on speed and a rushed decision because the Mets still had two years left on his contract to determine if he could still be the player he was before those three injuries and worth the money.

    You wouldn’t happen to be saying that now with the advantage of 20/20 hindsight knowing Jose is at this point in relatively good physical shape – which you had reservations about after the 2011 season due to past health issues and getting on in age – would you?

  • jason bay

    Joey,

    I didn’t have reservations about Reyes after seeing him train for the 2010 season. It’s not like he was 40 years old either and you haven’t responded to any of the points I made.

    You’ve just made a bunch of suppositions about what I might have said and a false one that i didn’t.

  • Joey D.

    You would have offered him a contract extension based on missing 126 games with three injuries to his legs? Yes, with the criteria you use to describe what has been wrong with the Mets with what you describe as “albatross” contracts and bad judgments plus how you point out the other ways that other organizations have been successful is why I do indeed think that would not be your reaction at that time – especially with a club that went 70-92 and blew big leads the last two weeks of the season two straight years before that.

    Also, you mentioned about re-signing him at the time Bay was signed and now it’s spring training? That would have been too late since Bay was already under contract.

    BTW – how could you have based that decision on how you saw Jose during spring training since he was shut down for most of it due to a hyper thyroid condition?

  • jason bay

    Throwing money at the 2010 Mets when you flat out knew that Delgado was done and Beltran iffy, with K rod coming off a poor year, Castillo and Perez on for another couple years, Thole your best long term bet at catcher, Kirk, Duda and Fern the only OFer’s backing up Pagan and Francouer and an entire bullpen after K Rod and Feliciano needing to be imported again as well as a bench (despite adding Chris Carter) and rushing Mejia and Tejada is sheer lunacy especially when it comes at the expense of your homegrown, All Star, GGer, Silver Slugger, leadoff hitting SS who is only 28 years old.

    Signing Bay was all about two things:

    1) “Reinvigorating” the Fan base AKA conning Met Fans out of hard earned cash, and

    2) Saving jobs.

    It would have been well known by the Wilpon’s that if the team, not just Bay but the entire team busted, Reyes was a goner so they placed their bet on #44 and came up losers and we lost #7 and that is an indisputable fact.

    85 M was put into the 2010 Mets and it might as well have been 8 cents for the way it worked out. GMJ, Jacobs, Tatis, Cora, Cattolonotto, Hessman, Jesus Feliciano, were all DFA’d, the team as usual had no depth. Barajas (and the supplemental pick he earned) was sold to LA for cash, Francouer exchanged for salary relief. K-Rod suspended. Lots of players on this team played either very sparingly or never again in the Majors.

    That 85 M could have been used to re-sign Reyes but instead it was used to put lipstick on a pig.

  • jason bay

    I wasn’t talking about Spring Training Joey, I was talking about his off season workouts in Long Island. The thyroid condition manifested itself after Bay was signed and wasn’t considered a big deal long term. Probably would have shown up during the physical if we had signed him when we should have.

    The Mets during Minaya’s tenure re signed many players. Valentin, Tatis, Castillo, Feliciano, Cora, Perez and El-Duque. They also picked up the options on Alou, Delgado and Lo Duca. All immediately tanked, got hurt or both but of course they were all quite a bit older than Jose so that is to be expected.

    Your also continuing to make thing up for instance about me “being concerned about Reyes injury” Being critical about the Mets signing injured players when you know very well it’s age that I have always railed against. Specifically 35-50 year old position players.

    Nice job in avoiding the points I have brought up however, are you in politics by any chance?

    Any thoughts on Alderson extending Niese, Dickey or Wright? any ideas what an unspent and uncommitted 85 M might have done in Reyes walk year?

    Yeah SS’s unlike LFer’s are hard to procure. You yourself opined how Schierholtz and Gomes (**** their defense) would have been a good LF platoon and it wouldn’t have been any worse than Duda, not to mention Bay and it would have allowed Alderson to sign reyes but the truth is Reyes should have been signed in 2010 instead of Bay.

    Nothing else makes any sense except it was done for the interest free loan and to save jobs.

  • 2aSupport

    But not by Mets fans…

  • 2aSupport

    Exactly. The Wilpons made Bay go from a 30 HR All-Star to a 6 HR albatross. There were no other variables, just “The Wilpons”. (Rolls eyes)

  • Just_Da_damaja

    Bautista, Encarnacion, Melky, and a few more. Follow him on Instagram. He’s basically playing with his friends from DR.

    as far as taxes, Forbes did an analysis on that and said that Reyes if he did no deductions would pay 600K in taxes on a 10 mil salary.

    he’s making 22 mil this season, so with no deductions, he will pay 1.25 mil in canadaian taxes, leaving him with about 20.5 mil to feed his family next year.

  • Just_Da_damaja

    Yup

    Hotstreak, you always been on the good side of things here.

    what folks dont understand is that much has not changed here.

    Look at an article on Roberto Clemente in 1961

    Clemente, one of his aptest pupils, agrees wholeheartedly with his coach on the advantage of not knowing what pitch is coming up.

    “Sometimes I seet on the bench, the fellows are sayeeng, ‘He’s gonna peetch curve now, now he’s gonna throw fast ball.’ I move away down the bench because I don’ want to know eet. I rather heet whatever he throw up there.”

    Now look at Boomer and Carlton making fun of another latino accent in 2012

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLjGL2Q5cfE

    and again in 2013

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEPv9aY_rFw

    Until u get diversity in the media, you are going to get the same BS

  • Joey D.

    “Off Season Workouts” are not like the rigors of spring training, Jason, we both understand that. More important, it’s his reactions in actual game conditions and one seeing if his injuries no longer hamper his performance under that ultimate testing – which is not like working out – that one needs to see. You can certainly understand that too – I mean, didn’t Chris Young appear physically OK during the 2010/11 off-season?

    And so with waiting until one had time to see how he was able to perform under the day in day out stress of game conditions what happened? He had two oblique injuries in which he played through one of them which caused him to give up switch hitting.

    But with two years left in his contract, based on what you saw during his off season workouts that would have been good enough for you to extend his contract with two years still remaining? Yet, when we discussed Sandy beginning negotiations with Jose’s agent in spring training of 2011, one of your many explanations for Sandy being correct not to negotiate at that time was because he didn’t know how healthy Jose was? This despite all signs that his legs were 100 percent healthy – also during workouts – the only criteria you needed in 2009/10?

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/26/sports/baseball/26citifield.html

    And Cory Hart is only 31 years old and averaged 24 home runs and a .272 batting average his past six seasons and was out the entire 2013 season found no team offering him more than a one year contract. Yet, with two years to go on his contract Jose coming off that injury plagued season was in-line for a multi-year contract based on his off season workouts?

    Jason, with all that you have let us know about your thought process regarding what one has to consider when trying to avoid being “burned” by multi-year contracts, including the state of the team as well as the individual, I just cannot believe that you would not have wanted to wait to see how two infield candidates in Reese Havens and Ruben Tejada developed before making such a commitment based on the health issues with Reyes and even though Castillo hit over .300, knowing his playing days were limited as well.

    This does not sound like the logic of one who promotes building with youth and avoiding injury riddled players when it comes to under-achieving teams like you have described the Mets from that time. Not signing Bay does indeed appear with what you have been telling
    us about your thoughts about what should and should not be done. But even with the absence of Bay, to then have re-signed Reyes at that time, taking into account all that you have told us about dealing with teams and individuals and the circumstances not only regarding regarding Jose’s health, the state of the Mets, but that you said even taking on the additional financial obligation of Bay for the next four years was a bad move considering the Madoff situation….

    …… I will take you at your word that you would have tried to re-sign Jose to a contract extension during the 2009/10 off-season but hope you can understand why that seems something completely the opposite of the Jason Bay we’ve grown to know here at MMO.

    I also apologize for not having worded it that way from the beginning. Because we are talking hypothetically, I should have expressed it in terms of my own “being surprised” rather than my own “doubt” and for that I was wrong. Again, my apologies.

  • jason bay

    No worries Joey,

    After the Madoff situation the job should have been to prioritize needs going forward, not try to “envigorate” the fan base by making ticket selling moves that would close off options if they failed.

    Throwing 85 M at the 2010 team was ridiculous given that Beltran was hardly a sure thing and Delgado couldn’t even DH in the PR winter League and Perez, Castillo, Francouer and Pelfrey were still being counted on for vital roles.

    Jacobs, GMJ, Cora, Catolonotto, Mejia, Tejada, Shawn Green, Tatis and Chris Carter comprised a full 1/3rd of the roster.

    Yeah sure if everything went as well as it possibly could then we might have a chance but if it didn’t…..we’d lose an extremely important part going far beyond 2010 which would only make the hill steeper in the future.

    Not worth it and a bad move.

    As for Alderson I don’t recall ever saying that Alderson was right to wait due to his being able to see his legs for himself. What I did say was that It is understandable that a new GM would like to see a player perform for himself, in person over a period of time before deciding to sign him or not.

    I do not see how that is unreasonable but I reiterate that June of 2010 would have been the perfect time to re-sign Reyes. His hamstring tendon surgery was proven successful, he had a year and a half to go before FA, loved living in NY where his wife is from and the 85 M spent on the 2010 team had it been there would have been all or pretty much all required.

    That option was taken away when Bay was signed.

    The signings and re-signings that i have been against have been for players 31-50 years years old of which we made plenty. Shame we couldn’t have made one for a 27 year old homegrown star.

  • Joey D.

    Jason,

    Thanks for your understanding.

    The bottom line is whether or not the Mets were willing to re-sign Jose if the price was right. Attached is an interview with Sandy the weekend it seemed Jose was headed to Miami.

    – His explanation as to why he did not make an offer:

    “Well, we talked conceptually about all the elements of a contract. So I think there was an understanding on their part of what we were talking about in a complete contractual sense. But we did not make a formal offer.”

    – On why if the Mets were to make an offer, it would have been less than Miami’s:

    “Well, you have to draw a line somewhere. And based on our experience — not just with Jose, but with multi-year contracts generally — and not just with our multi-year contracts, but all multi-year contracts generally, we decided that there were some conceptual limitations to where we would go. One of the reasons we held back for so long was to see where the market might take Jose. One of the reasons we had more communication recently than before was because there was at least some indication that perhaps the market hadn’t gone where some people had anticipated. If these current reports are true (laughs), the market may have accelerated considerably beyond where it may have been a week ago, or four days ago.”

    – On the financial restrictions that he had to consider:

    “Bernie Madoff and his specter are always referenced in these situations. I don’t really think Madoff has that much to do with it. But when a team loses $70 million irrespective of Bernie Madoff or anyone else, that’s probably a bigger factor in our approach to this season and the next couple than anything else.”

    – When asked if that $70 million loss was for 2011 only:

    “Big losses. Let’s put it that way.”

    – When it was mentioned that the pursuit of Reyes was restrained and they didn’t go all-out Sandy said:

    “I disagree with that. The way we went about it didn’t indicate anything at all about whether he was the most important thing in our agenda. He was the most important thing on our agenda, which is why we went about it the way we did.”

    – When that was followed up saying the Marlins were more aggressive Sandy’s reaction was:

    “Simply being more aggressive doesn’t necessarily indicate anything. There’s a certain amount of nuance in these things that goes beyond. The fact is if the reports are true, the only team that’s being aggressive at this point is Miami. Does that suggest that nobody, including the Mets, has any interest in Jose besides Miami? I don’t know. Maybe it’s part of an approach.”

    So:

    1) If Sandy’s desire was to re-sign Jose if it was at all possible from a Mets perspective and he was caught off guard with the Miami offer, it was due to not wanting to pay in the neighborhood or even having to go higher than the Miami offer in order to retain him and not the issue of Jason Bay and his contract.

    2) If he had no intention of re-signing Jose based on his business assessment as mentioned, it means the $16 million a year was not the issue as was the $70 million and/or what he described as “big losses” in just 2011 alone – for losing $54 million instead(without the Bay contract) would not have allowed him to do so anyway.

    3) If it was a matter of being unable to come up with the money to pay Jose and the only way to theoretically have that money was to not have signed Bay at $16 million a year to begin with, that makes the re-signing of Jose less an issue of retaining the services of a ball player than the bigger picture of it being a make it or break it situation for Sterling Mets. If it came to $16 million breaking the bank, then the owners should pack their bags

    So whatever points you make about how the Mets should have approached things back in 2010, the signing of Jason Bay might have been seen as an error in judgment (as said, it seemed that way to me because I thought the marriage of him and Citi Field was not going to be a good fit) but as far as having a connection with the re-signing of Jose Reyes, there is no connection for other than a small market team that has to operate under such restrictive conditions, it is not a case of either/or when it comes to a player of Jose’s talent – unless that big market team finds itself facing a much worse fiscal problem than any small market team has to usually deal with. http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/mets/post/_/id/36857/alderson-on-losing-reyes .