12
2013
Nieuwenhuis and Valdespin Battling For Outfield Spot
An article by 
The Mets are holding conclave this spring as they seek out a center field replacement for the departed Andres Torres.
Jordany Valdespin is not an easy person to like, and especially hard to cheer for, but he’s become a leading candidate. Ask him a question and he’ll often mumble an indifferent and inaudible answer.
He exudes confidence on the field, but crosses the line with a brash attitude, tendency to showboat and not always hustle. Off the field he wears a bright red baseball cap reading “JV 1.’’ He often carries himself with an “I own the world,” persona that goes beyond confidence, so much that manager Terry Collins has warned him to tone it down a notch.
Last year, Valdespin fell out of favor with the Mets despite hitting five pinch-hit homers. He didn’t help himself in the offseason when he was suspended in winter ball. Even so, with Kirk Nieuwenhuis out with a bruised left knee and Daniel Murphy sidelined with a strained right side, Valdespin is being given every opportunity to make the roster in the outfield or as a second baseman.
Valdespin has produced, but with a caveat: He plays to his own soundtrack.
“He plays with enthusiasm,’’ manager Terry Collins said. “He plays with a flair and, that’s not necessarily a bad thing.’’
It can be a painful thing, as over-the-top behavior, or shall we say, “showmanship,’’ angers the opposition. Collins warned Valdespin teams might retaliate against him. However, that wasn’t the case this afternoon when Justin Verlander plunked him in his following at-bat in which he homered in the 11-0 victory over Detroit.
Valdespin is outplaying both Nieuwenhuis and Mike Baxter, both of whom were the projected starters in center and right, respectively, at the start of spring training. Today he was at second as Murphy continues on the mend from a strained rib cage muscle.
“If they give me a chance to play, I can do the job,’’ Valdespin said. “That’s what I’m waiting for — a chance to play every day and then show everything I can do.’’
With all else being equal, Valdespin’s ability to play second base gives him the edge.
“If you’re going to be an extra player, the fact you can play a lot of positions means a lot,’’ Collins said. “But, we saw last year the fact he can come off the bench and be dangerous also.’’
Regardless of what happened last year, if he continues to produce and play hard – there has been no hustle issues this spring – it is hard to see Valdespin not landing a back-up spot in the outfield, presumably now as the reserve to Collin Cowgill in center if Nieuwenhuis doesn’t make it.
Thoughts from Joe D.
I don’t really care how brash or how cocky a player is as long as he produces on the field. To me, performance always comes first and all the other stuff is just background noise. Heck if we had worried ourselves with stuff like that back in the eighties, I doubt we would have won our last World Series in 1986. Maybe that’s what our problem has been the last ten years, too many choir boys and not enough players with brass balls…
I’ve said this before and I will say it again, there’s a catalyst-type quality about Valdespin that I love. He has a little bit of Jose Reyes in him. He brings a certain kind of electricity to the lineup when he’s in it and I get the feeling something good could happen at any moment when he’s in the game. I don’t get that with Lucas Duda or Mike Baxter or Kirk Nieuwenhuis.
If it’s true, as Adam Rubin reported, that this battle for a spot in the outfield will come down to between Valdespin and Nieuwenhuis, it’s clear to me right now who the winner of that battle is.
I’m not one of those know-it-alls who spout off every March about how spring stats don’t matter. What are they nuts? Of course they mater, and right now Valdespin is earning his place on the Opening Day roster because his performance has been off the charts and that does matter.
However, I don’t want to look at this as just a battle between Spin and Kirk. We have ten outfielders in camp and I just want to be sure that we go up North with the top five producers in camp this Spring – no matter who they are.
Nobody should have a leg up or be considered a lock at this point, especially after that embarrassing production we got from our outfield last season. That was a disgrace…
Like Terry Collins said today, “a lot things are going to happen in the next three weeks.” He’s right. So let’s just see how this plays out, and lets not make the mistake of ignoring a player who batted .375 and showing up on April 1 with a left fielder who batted .220 because he helped a little old lady cross the street this morning.
It’s time to man up, look at the numbers, and go with the hot hand. I’m not looking for five feel-good stories to fill some airtime on SNY in April. I’m looking for some big-time production, lots of attitude and plenty of moxie. If it means Lucas Duda and Kirk Nieuwenhuis end up in Sin City – so be it.
About the Author: John Delcos
I am an active member of the BBWAA and have covered Major League Baseball in several capacities for over 20 years, including ten in New York working the Mets' and Yankees' beat. I covered the Baltimore Orioles for eight years and the Cleveland Indians before that. I currently serve as an editor and senior staff writer for Mets Merized Online. Follow me on Twitter @jdelcos.
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If Camp ended today you’d probably go with Cowgill, Valdespin, Byrd, Duda and den Dekker.
reasonable, but I really don’t think they are dumping baxter (seems to be a favorite) but could happen. Besides, I still don’t think they are willing to take the leap that Dekker hits enough right now to roll with him.
Lets see how the next 2 weeks play out.
I’m just saying it based on the post’s criteria of taking the top five producers. Barring injuries I don’t think den Dekker makes the team when camp breaks at this point. I think the Mets like Baxters bat off the bench and I don’t think they will take den Dekker up unless he will play everyday and with how Cowgill has played thus far I don’t see that happening. For me if camp ended today I’d go with Duda, Cowgill and Valdespin along with Byrd and Baxter.
those are the 5 I see, with a chance that Kirk rebounds and muddles up the mix. But very possible he ends up at Vegas with dekker.
and everyone will be on a 2 month at most leash, so very good shot that anyone that does not make it OD will get their chance eventually!
Yea I think Kirk at this time looks like he will be heading to AAA also we are not even at the half way point of the month so a lot of camp still remains. Personally I will be more attentive to what the players do come the end of this week as we begin the next.
AGREED except probaly not den Dekker. Has to work on his bat a little bit but, glove is great.
Baxter is guaranteed a spot on the team based on his play last season.
Again, no shot Den Dekker makes the club…
Nieuwenhuis should be trade bait for a reliever. Can’t go wrong with more arms in relief.
I agree with Mr. North Jersey- If I was Sandy and TC, I would roll with The Dude in LF, a platoon of MDD and CC in CF and a platoon of Spin and the Byrd man in RF. Kirk and Baxter optioned to AAA.
He is definitly earning his way on the roster….
In fact you could say his Roster spot was his to lose and he didn’t do anything to lose it at all…
But I don’t see any amount of production in ST that can win him an everyday OFer job….
Platoon partner maybe….But he’s not winning a job outright…
But if he keeps on doing what he is doing he could win it by the All Star Break.
Mark my words, if Spin plays every day… he will be a 15-20 homer, 25 sb, 65-80 rbi guy. The kid wants to be a major league starter. We need some confidence out in the outfield. When asked, Baxter says he’ll be happy just being on the team. That type of attitude get us another 70 win season. Get rid of baxter, trade niewenhuis for anything. I dont understand the love for baxter. Is it because he’s from queens? Because he made one good catch during Johans no-no? The guy is an average pinch hitter at best on a 75 win team. Roll the dice here! Play Valdy!!!!
Valdespin is not full time player quality. His warts show on both sides of ball when playing on regular basis, part of which includes his ego and immaturity both of which are destructive to himself and team.
And insofar as getting rid of Baxter and trading Niewenhuis – I totally disagree. This franchise lacks outfield depth and here you proclaim getting rid of two of the better choices. Baxter is a pro’s pro – a professional player, professional hitter with above average speed and OK glove who can bat leadoff from time to time and add value off the bench or in platoon.
Niewenhuis has the tools to be a have a good major league career on both sides of the ball, to be a starting corner, but needs to refine his game and stay healthy.
So he’s a lot like, Daniel Murhpy? His warts are just as big. He can’t field, has no speed, runs the bases incorrectly, no power, and does not walk much. He is good at winning popularity contest on these blogs though for a “Punch & Judy”, soft .290 hitter.
Daniel Murphy and JV1 can be decent fielders if they were placed in the right positions.
The Mets historically have mismanaged these type of situations dating back to Gregg Jeffries, Todd Hundley, the list goes on and on…
Say the Mets stick with Murphy at 3B…
he hits .330 in the minors….
we trade him for a 2B…
but no…
the mets put Murphy in LF in 2008…and he did fine at Shea….
the Madoff crisis happens….
now in 2009, they only have so much money to plug up LF…which they were doing patch work with since Floyd left.
2007 – Alou 1 year deal….they got by…
2008 – Alou 1 year option….they got by….
2009 – Murphy…Sheffield…Tatis….they no longer got by…emergency time…
2010 – Hello Jason Bay
2011 – they didnt get by
2012 – they didnt get by
Alou – 2008 – they got by…….Wrong, he played 15 games, that’s not “got by”, that’s failure
No, I mean they were able to backfill his production with Tatis ( comeback player of the year ) + Endy, then Nick Evans/Daniel Murphy in Sept
Daniel Murphy’s bases loaded double off Brad Lidge in 2008 was to me the epitome of a Murphy AB
dude is forkin clutch in my opinion and to me he has ice in his veins.
same with Tejada, same with Duda,
In 2009, the wheels fell off the wagon, Murphy for some reason regressed under the immense spotlight….i felt so bad for him after the dropped fly ball against FL
it just seemed like he completely lost the ability to track a fly ball off the bat, he had it in 2008…not sure what happened in 2009….
Had Daniel Murphy played a decent LF and hit for avg, we NEVER sign Jason Bay….
Had Ryan Church not landed in Jerry’s doghouse, I think we never sign Bay….I was a big Church fan, esp in the #2 hole
What this town and organization have always lacked is cohesion…
and even with Sandy and his saber wizards in town…they STILL lack cohesion….
JV’s 2012 was Daniel Murphy’s 2009
and now, like Murphy, the org still doesnt know what to do with him…
Oh. I forgot to add that Murphy makes an annual trip or two to the DL!
Hasn’t Jordany also dealt with his share of injuries?
????
Has he? I don’t remember much about injuries with Spin.
Then again, I’ll confess to not really paying much attention to him before last season.
” He can’t field, has no speed, runs the bases incorrectly, no power, and does not walk much. ”
No power? Punch and Judy hitter? You don’t average 50+ extra base hits a year with no power.
And Murphy doesn’t need to walk. He has a good swing that covers a lot of real estate. He doesn’t strike out that much.
I love Murphy as much as the next guy…but to say he doesnt have alot of power is not a stretch…
Murphy can be a poor man’s Wade Boggs IMO
but Wade Boggs never would’ve been Wade Boggs if they played in 7 different positions per year
600 plus AB’s and he (Murphy) hit 6 homers. Two of which were in wind blown Wrigley field that barely creeped over. Valdy had more homers in a third of Muphy’s AB’s. Give Valdy 600 plus AB’s and I will bet he gets the same amount of doubles and more homers. If the Mets are telling you that defense at 2B isn’t important (which is obvious with Murphy penciled in again) then let the better all aournd butcher play. Don’t forget, Valdy was a rookie with only a limited amount of AB’s in AAA pripr to his call up. So he has a bit too much swagger. Who cares.
It is amazing how quickly people are to get rid of a .300 hitter. Murphy hit .320 a couple of seasons ago and .290 last season while admitting he never felt comfortable at the plate. As for his defense, if you bothered to watch games during the last two months, you would realize it improved astronomically. And as was mentioned, he did hit 40 doubles last year.
But then again, it is just about the long ball. People with that mindset would love to have Dan Uggla at 2B; a guy who fields worse than Murphy and hits about .220. As long as he hits it out, it is okay.
Here is some insight. The steroid era is over. BAs are going down along with ERAs. Pitching is dominating. A guy like Murphy is not a dime a dozen player. How many legitimate .300 hitters do you see around? How many do the Mets have? 2…Murphy and Wright.
Task I am sorry but this discussion is not all about the long-ball. It has many other heads.
When it comes to Murphy it is always about the long ball. The knock on him by most fans is his fielding and the fact that he doesnt hit HRs. If Murphy was a 15 HR guy, people on here wouldnt be knocking him. Valdy has more power than Murphy but has not proven to be any better a fielder. That is why the comment about the HR.
Valdy belongs in the OF because that is where the Mets need help and he is showing himself to be better than what is out there. Nobody questioned the athletic skills; the big issue was could he hit at the major league level. Thus far, he is showing he can.
Hi Task,
I bet you are as much in the dark as to why Murph has become the whipping boy and/or least appreciated player on the team by so many. I bet you it’s that WAR rating of 1.2 for last season which makes him appear as a role player. And if that is the case, how come not using his 2011 WAR which made him just a cut underneath being calculated as a “good player”?
There is also a limit as to how many times one can either trade or not re-sign an established player and hand a prospect his job all the time. We got adequate enough success with Tejada but we have not yet come up with a replacement for Krod, Pagan and Beltran. That’s one out of four. Do we want to possibly create if not a fifth hole than at least a second downgrade? Not taking away from Ruben but he is not a Jose – nor does he need to – in the context of overall team talent but without Murphy Ruben’s limitations might become more of a problem – even in WAR.
We see Murph day in and day out and besides his play in the field would also rate him a 10 WAR (winning attitude representation) which accounts for those intangeables that cannot be measured in calculations nor appreciated until no longer there.
Actually Joey, most of the ones casting off Murphy are the ones that are championing V-Spin. Hardly your “sabergooners”.
Hi TRS,
That is why I concentrated on Murphy as himself, only referring to Ruben in how his absence could be felt in the scheme of things in so many ways.
Yet when you say it’s about WAR that is what you are implying which couldn’t be further from the truth.
Hi TRS,
Again, I only referred to Murphy’s WAR (hey, wasn’t that the title of a movie?
) and what the rating implied for 2012 which was .
1.2 = role player.
As you know, many of us see him as being more than just a role player but a solid every day player. That’s why I raised the question of WAR because that is what one would conclude going by saber stats.
But again when you say that it’s possibly his WAR that is leading people to think of replacing him it implies that it is those who use WAR that want him gone when it seems to be the contrary.
Hi Trs,
Will not deny my feelings about those type of stats and if I’m wrong making such a general statement, I appologize, but then that presents a catch-22 for sabers who do support Murphy since the saber analysis shows besides being only a role player, he is also below average in RAA, WPA and average in RC. Would be very curious to know what caused them to go against the “numbers”.
Know there are many out there who do not have high hopes for Daniel who don’t go by stats but what they see but yes, I was expanding the conversation about Murphy by bringing up those stats because of the intangeables that cannot be calculated.
Some saber guys want him gone too, some don’t. That’s what I am saying. This argument appears to have nothing to do with Saberstats.
HI TRS,
As said, it opens up an interesting question as to why Sabers would want him as our every day second baseman when those numbers indicate differently and we have other potentials there to take his place.
HI TRS,
You might find this funny but it’s so representative of the debate many of us have over sabermetrics.
Streaks began to appear on every sheet of paper I’ve been printing here at the office. Left a message with IT, got a call back from a rep, told him the problem, he came over in the pouring rain, went through a barrage of PC settings and before making any changes to those settings suggested we turn the printer off and on again. Did that, problem cleared up.
We laughed and I asked why couldn’t he have asked me to do that over the phone before coming over and looking at all the diagnostics to figure out the trouble. He went through the advanced “stats” to look for the answer while all it took was to turn the darn thing off and on again.
Shouldn’t the competition be between Nieuwenhuis and Baxter? Or has Baxter already locked up a roster spot with his .380 OPS?
No…Baxter earned his spot on the Roster last year….
Kirk is still fighting to stay with the MLB team so the only ones he is competing with is Brown, Byrd, Cowgill, Valdespin and MDD
Who plays where and how often won’t be determined until they have figured out who is actually going to be on the team…
And with Kirk Missing time it’s not looking good at this point that he makes the team.
Of all the names that could play in the OF the only ones who have a roster position seemingly locked up to start the season is Duda, Baxter (past performance), Cowgill and Valde (good ST)
The rest are all fighting for a spot on the team…And so far MDD and Byrd look like they are leading that race.
How did baxter earn a spot based on 2012 performance
because he was very productive in a part time role…
A good performance in April and May off the bench with almost zero prior track record guarantees him a spot on the team the next season? Wow, talk about low standards…
Hi Joey D.:
After all , the Mets franchise player is very streaky. As goes Mr. Streaky as goes the Mets. Personally his cold streaks are a bit of a turnoff. But if you like his hotstreak as I do then whats in a name
Hi Hotstreak,
Very, very clever. But then, what is in a name? There are many different types of hotstreaks. How do we know you didn’t name yourself after that guy who came out from behind the curtain wearing nothing but his birthday suit 40 years ago when David Nivin was on stage during the academy awards? Don’t forget, he was was also a “hot” streak.
Duda, Cowgill and Valdespin. I want Matt and Kirk to play every day in AAA.
Baxter might be good coming off the bench and if Byrd keeps hitting this spring, he should go north with the team.
I agree 100% with Joe D. I don´t care how cocky a player is if he produces. If another player gets upset, then HE has to be professional too and suck it up. Some of the guys on the 86 team hated each other. Everybody hated Ty Cobb. It´s about scoring more runs than the opponents and winning games. Period.
I like Valdy…let him play.
I’m sorry but if Valdespin is hitting better than kirk and is proving that hes simply a better player then who cares how he is with the media or if hes flashy off the feild? To be honest i think this team needs some swag and im happy jordany is bringing some. I love the guy hes exciting to watch. If i was TC and had to pick my outfeild today it would be byrd cowgil and valdespin with den dekker on the bench. Duda and kirk would be in vegas. I want the best team on the field on 2013 and i think most mets fans want the see the same. This isnt AAA its the bigs and i want to see the best mets team possible out there. Jordany is better then anything else we got so lets talk him up rather than try to look for flaws. How can we complain about him when hes been hitting. 370 so far this spring?
It’s ok to be cocky..if one has the goods to validate that attitude…i will not make a Verlander comment here..LOL
Valdy reminds me of another player who was a pretty good leadoff hitter who had a very high opinion of himself….Rickey Henderson. And honestly, what has he done that is so bad? He hasnt been caught taken a gun through an airport, domestic battery, gotten caught with a transvestite prostitute, or faced drug charges. So what if he is a bit of a moron on twitter or has an occasional emotional outburst on the field…this team needs a bit of life.
Here, here Taskmaster. Put the better player on the field period!
Off topic – go Captain America!
USA
Rickey Henderson? I love Spin’s spirited play, but as Rickey himself once said, “the only player that reminds Rickey of Rickey, is Rickey.”
Wright just hit a bases loaded clearing double in the WBC against PR!!! The announcers are calling him Captain America!!! 10 RBI’s already this WBC
Excited for USA!
What a choice. I actually believe that den Dekker is better than Valdespoin and Kirk. But then, I think Spin is a sideshow freak and Kirk is a career minor leaguer. That does not make MDD a major leaguer at this moment, but I think he could be a good one.
Hey, Joe, D. Let’s focus on performance and not the “nice guys finish last” bullsh*t. How they play is obviously most important, but it’s SOBs like you who make the world a worse place preaching that crap for no good reason.
Carlos Gomez signs 3 year extension with Brewers 3/24. As Pagan got 4/40, And has Boras as his agent this is surprising.