Johan = No-Hiiter

Ur right, I’ll take a No-Hitter everytime

But he was a very good pitcher for a few years – then he got hurt and missed a year, and then had a good half year last year bouncing back from the major injury before he suffered the ankle injury and then struggled.

In the end he probably didn’t end up being worth the huge contract, but I wouldn’t say he’s been a “disappointment”. It’s not that much of a surprise to see a pitcher signed to a huge deal get hurt sometime during the contract – those deals are notoriously risky. Overall, he’s still a good Met though

When you look at what Santana has given the team compared to what was expected after the money he was signed for then I believe even Santana will tell you his performance with the Mets is not what he expected of himself when he signed. Of course as is life sometimes injuries occur and such was a big part of what happened with Santana.

The thing is that words like hero can mean different things to different people so maybe Berg called him a hero for saving him from having to live the drought that was waiting for the Mets 1st no-hitter. I really have no way to know what Berg meant by it. Same as if the author doesn’t feel like Santana is a hero for whatever reason it is how he views a hero.

In the end maybe the better question would of been can we and what do we define as a hero when it involves the game of baseball?

Santana gave me a great memory. I will always remember where I was and more importantly who I was with when it happened and really isn’t that all that is really important?

I have the Daily News front page pullout of Santana with his hands raised with his fingers in a V pinned above my desk as a reminder of how special that moment was. For me I don’t need to raise Santana to any higher pedestal than the situation calls for. It was a great moment in Mets history. One I won’t soon forget.

If the Mets are hanging in there again this July due to the second wildcard and Johann is having a very good season, it’s going to be interesting to see what happens. No doubt, a healthy Johann is going to be sought out by a lot of teams short of starting pitching and looking ahead toward the post season knowing they need to upgrade their rotation where pitching is always key. Do we pass up a third season and this time look at Johann as a rental we can get prospects for?

I never thought of Santana as a Met hero but then, never thought of him as not being one, either. Whoever finally was going to pitch that first no-hitter was going to go into Met folk-lore for doing it no matter what. But in terms of being remembered as a Met hero (which is the true test, anyway) I don’t think so. I don’t think 44 years from now fans are going to look back at Johann the same way we look not at Seaver but of Koozman, Jones, Agee, Swoboda, Weis, Harrelson, Gaspar, etc.

But I did think Johann showed a lot of class that night, acknowledging how much it meant to the fans for never having one before. I know the next day I was shaking hands with strangers who just happened to be wearing Met caps or jerseys.

I do, however, have to disagree. Johan IS a hero. Sure, it’s frustrating knowing he came to camp overweight, of course. But 30 years from now, when people think Johan Santana, they will think the No Hitter, not the weight.

Ron Swoboda was a 242 hitter with us. Endy knocked in 71 RBI’s over 3 years (albeit a platoon player). And really, Mookie was a mediocre overall hitter as best. Yet, these guys are heroes to Mets fans.

If we can put JC Martin, Buddy, Todd Pratt and others on a pedestal, then I have no prob putting Johan above them all

I think you have to understand heroism in a baseball context is different than the heroism of a first responder or our military. Two different things.

While I respect your view, I think your premise is flawed: Santana isn’t a Mets hero by dint of a questionable NH, though it was a masterful performance from a player who had just battled back from a very serious injury and was pitching really well till that point in the season.

Santana deserves to be considered a hero because of everything he had done for the Mets till that point in time. IMO, this includes being a warrior on the mound who occasionally wears his emotions on his sleeve. He rallied his troops constantly in the dugout, even in seasons bordering on the meaningless. But more than anything, Santana always took the mound with a ferocious attitude and gave of every skill he had in game after game during some seasons when he got absolutely no run support. On Mets teams that fairly stunk, he was one of three or four guys one could point to and say to fans from other teams: “But we’ve got The Johan!”

This is why he’s a Mets hero.

What sort of person he is, what charities he runs, whether or not he helps old ladies cross the street, etc., are all rather beside the point when we speak of heroism in a baseball uniform; it’s about what the man does between the lines and what he gives the fans.

going into the no hitter, he had IIRC a 2.75 ERA. 5 games later (going into the ankle stomp game) it was at 2.76, and he was coming off a very strong 8 IP game vs. LA.

once he got hurt, that was pretty much it.