Either it matters and it’s worth mentioning or it doesn’t and some are just grabbing at straws to promote thier Sandy agenda…

Which one you want to go with here?

I give the Jays credit (and for that matter the Mets too) more so than the phillies because I CAN’T STAND THE FILTHIES!!!!

Trs & Sheawasbetter

Pipe down! I like the question. JK!

However, because D’Arnaud has spent significant time in the Jays system, and because they are the team he was with when he got to AAA, I’d give the Jays all the credit.

At some point you have to streamline and generalize things or it becomes an endless pointless exercise trying to attribute blame or credit. Which is why I say that at this point in time, the major league club is all Sandy’s team. But you just know if they get off to a good start, Sandy’s critics will find a way to give all the credit to his predecessor.

As for the Santana trade, Johan had the Twins over a barrel and he practically wrote his own ticket to the Mets. He had vetoed an earlier trade deal the Twins had made with another team. And the Twins preference was to send Johan out of the AL. It’s not as if Omar drove a hard bargain to get him; he practically fell into Omar’s lap. Delgado was a pure salary dump. Plain and simple. No other team was willing to eat all that money. And the Mets paid for that contract with the last year being almost a total waste.

I don’t hate Omar “so much” and if you had been reading my posts you’d know I said I’d rate him a 4 or 5 out of 10 and think he is terribly mediocre. I’m really glad he’s no longer GM, and couldn’t wait till they fired him. But I don’t “hate” him.

And, LOL, no one is saying Wheeler will be a CY pitcher. Way to go with extreme exaggeration and hyperbole!

Did Omar blink first with Santana or Delgado trades, his two most significant?

Why do hate him so much?

Did he take a piss on your head or something?

Always the people who scream agenda start in with the agendas.

I present facts, and you present distortion.

I give up with you fanatics. Yes, Alderson has transformed Wheeler into the next Tom Seaver. He took a crappy pitcher and turned him into a jaw dropping phenom who will have the best walk rate in the world and win 5 Cy Young s.

Discussion over, you and Sandy win. Omar is a Latino POS. Everybody applaud.

Sandy got them into the system. You can’t take that away from him. So if Reyes was traded for a great outfielder, you’d thank Steve Phillips???

Come on, just be happy they’re here.

Here’s his BB/9 rate throughout the minors:

5.8 — Giants A
4.8 — Giants High A
1.7 — Mets High A
3.3 — Mets AA
4.4 — Mets AAA

A 4.4 walk rate at AAA is high but not as as bad as what it was with the Giants at the lower levels. And he only logged 33 innings at AAA.So if you’re going to dismiss his St Lucie walk rate because it came in only 27 innings, then you have to dismiss his AAA walk rate in 2012 because of the similarly small sample size. You can;t have it both ways.

And, yes, it took a star like Beltran to get Wheeler. But I don’t believe Omar would or could have made the same deal. Omar always seemed to blink first in trades and would too readily accept marginal talent back or quantity vs. quality.

BTW, when d’Arnaud makes his debut with the Mets, who will you give the development credit to?

Wheeler pitched 27 inning for Mets with 1.7 walk rate and that means he’s fixed? Really? Only 27 innings?

Lets ignore the fact his walk rate was 3.7 in AA and 4.4 in AAA and that was done in 149 innings. Is his walk rate improving or declining?

You take a small sample size, err tiny sample size, and you want to say Mets get full credit for fixing him?

And you say his walk rate went “way down”????

Sorry but it did NOT go way down.

Also there is this. His strikeout rates:

10.7
10.3
9.1
8.5

Is that more fixing and development?

We got a top pitcher who was highly regarded before he got to the Mets. Lets see how those walk and strikeout rates hold up in the majors before proclaiming any success and dishing out credit.

All I know is that the Giants drafted a solid pitcher and that it took a star like Beltran to get him. Those are the only facts. The rest of the story has yet to be told.

I’m sorry but making adjustments on a player you just acquired as being claimed here by some is NOT developing the player over a few years. Fixing a bump in the road is not the same as developing a player over several years.

That’s just flat out wrong. Oh and somebody said he will wind up with more innings pitched in the Mets farm system than in the Giants? WRONG AGAIN. I will bet you $100.00 that kid will be with the Mets long before he ever sees his 400th inning in the minors.

He was developed by San Francisco.

I agree completely with you. Wheeler Syndergaard, like Harvey are Met developed. d’Arnaud is 100% Toronto developed. No sharing credit with any on wheeler, especially since the mets corrected his issues and absolutely no taking development credit for d’Arnaud if he’s nearly majors ready. The only way to take credit for an advanced level prospect is if you rehab or correct a major flaw that turns them completely around.