31
2013
Alderson Says He Is Responsible For Lack Of Spending, Not Ownership
An article by 
Mets season ticket holders were gathered at the Caesar’s Club at Citi Field tonight, where Sandy Alderson and his front office fielded questions about a variety of issues.
Adam Rubin of ESPN New York did a nice job of covering the event and retweeting some of the quotes from those who were on hand.
Regarding the lack of spending this offseason, Sandy Alderson insisted this was his decision and not ownership imposed.
“The reason we haven’t spent the money is not because of Fred Wilpon,” he said. “It’s because of me.”
“Since last year the Wilpons have had nothing but good news regarding their finances. Their financial capacity is far more than adequate and from a baseball perspective.”
When asked how he will navigate future offseasons when there will always be high priced free agents and over-aggressive bidding, the Mets GM replied:
“We understand what the market dictates and we have to be prepared to exist in that market. Am I going to recommended that we sit here in New York City and function like the Oakland Athletics for the next 10 years? No I’m not.”
“I’m not asking you to believe me until you see some manifestation of that, which I hope is sooner rather than later. I’m not getting any younger.”
As I’ve pointed out before, ownership authorized an increase in payroll for 2013. Money was also freed up because of deferred salary by David Wright and Jason Bay. I estimated that Sandy Alderson had about $25 million to spend this offseason if he wanted to. That number is probably closer to $17 million now.
Here is a summary of some other things that were discussed this evening:
- The front office is very high on the minor leagues, especially with Travis d’Arnaud and Zack Wheeler recently named among the top ten prospects in baseball by Jonathan Mayo. Much is expected from those two in 2013.
- “Success of big-market teams is not just money, but a successful farm system. We have a renewed effort in the draft.”
- Regarding the state of the Mets outfield, Alderson was very disappointed when he learned Hairston had signed with the Cubs. Sounded like he woke up to the news that morning and didn’t see it coming.
- The Mets were never in legitimate trade talks with Arizona for Justin Upton because they wanted either Harvey or Wheeler. Can’t blame him for taking that stand, folks, and I wanted Upton bad.
- He will no longer make jokes about the outfield, and admitted the outfield will not be a strength for the Mets this year. Reportedly by those who were there, Alderson looked uncomfortable when discussing the outfield.
- Regarding Wilmer Flores being moved to left field, there are NO PLANS for Flores to transition to the outfield and he is slated to play both second and third base for Triple-A Las Vegas this season.
- Regarding Michael Bourn, Alderson doesn’t believe he’s worth losing the 11th overall pick over. The Mets were in serious pursuit for Bourn.
- The National League East is the toughest division in baseball, but “changes you make in December and January don’t mean you’re going to win the pennant.” Also regarding how good the NL East is, “There are no easy outs.”
- Dillon Gee is good to go and will be ready for Opening Day… John Buck is a first rate catcher… Collin Cowgill and Jack Leathersich (an MMO 2013 sleeper) will be two players to watch this year.
- They are very confident about the bullpen, and will have plenty of solid options will in camp.
Great job by all the Mets season ticket holders who attended including a few of our own writers. They covered a lot of ground and hit on many of the big concerns of the Mets fan base. Well done, guys.
About the Author: Joe DeCaro
I'm a lifelong Mets fan who loves writing and talking about the Amazins' 24/7. From the Miracle in 1969 to the magic of 1986, and even the near misses in '73 and '00, I've experienced it all - the highs and the lows. I started Mets Merized Online in 2005 to feed my addiction. Follow me on Twitter @metsmerized.
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NL East Standings
| Team | W | L | Pct. | GB |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Braves | 24 | 18 | .571 | - |
| Nationals | 23 | 20 | .535 | 1.5 |
| Phillies | 20 | 23 | .465 | 4.5 |
| Mets | 16 | 24 | .400 | 7.0 |
| Marlins | 11 | 32 | .256 | 13.5 |
Last updated: 05/18/2013
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Nice job with the summary. Season ticket holders did a good job making their thoughts heard. I don’t know if they allowed people to film the event but hopefully the next 24 hours we will start seeing some turn up.
Ed Leyro and Taryn “Coop” were there and they took some nice pictures. (Including one with Sandy holding Joey Beartran, lol) Not sure if there’s any video available, but as you say maybe some will turn up tomorrow.
Oh actually he just posted his own summary with that pic. Check it out:
http://studiousmetsimus.blogspot.com/2013/01/q-highlights-with-sandy-alderson-pals.html
Hahahaha…. Wow!
They did a good job with the summary as well. Good read thanks for the link.
This guy is intentionally doing this. There is no other explanation for not trying to get better other than intentionally not giving it your all for 2 things:
1) Believing this is not a year the team can make the post season
2) So we may as well go for the higher draft pick and take our lumps one more season.
I wish someone would ask him these things already. I don’t see how there are any other reasons for not doing anything the way this guy does.
Or maybe someone should grab David Wright on the side and ask him is this the plan? He knows the plan right? Maybe David is okay with taking a hit one more year?
David Wright is probably praying he gets traded to the Yankees…
right now…a trade like that would work for both sides…
He doesn’t care. He got his money.
thats cuz he is the franchise darling now…
wait til he has the 138 mil bullseye on his back…
Thanks for the summary of this. I started seen all these random tweets on my timeline and had no idea what was going on.
I’m ready for some real baseball, who’s with me? LGM!
Hi Joe D.,
Seems I heard that remark of not functioning like Oakland before.
Same thing about the finances being adequate, though using a different adjective to make the same point.
It’s interesting how certain things pertaining to money being said today sound like they did three years ago
http://www.amazinavenue.com/2010/12/10/1869167/transcript-of-sandy-aldersons-conference-call-with-bloggers
EXACTLY
Mr. Harvard is cutting and pasting his responses now
Hi Just,
LMAO – was going to do that for Sandy to take some of the burden off him.
Nothing really earth shattering here as far as any real news. But it looks like we’re done in the outfield and that pisses me off as I was hoping that he was just waiting to pull the trigger on something significant. So why didn’t somebody ask him about who the big name we were getting was? It wasn’t Upton or Bourn, who was the big name outfielder?
Juan Rivera
( that was not a joke either )
Is JP Riccardi’s hand in Depo’s lap ?
DO NOT WASTE YOUR TIME ON THE METS FOLKS. UNLESS SANDY IS HOLDING HIS BEST FOR LAST THE METS WILL FINNISH NO HIGHER THAN FIFTH PLACE IN 2013.
ALL IS NOT LOST IN THE OUTFIELD. SANDY CAN SWING A DEAL FOR COCO CRISP.
People seem to forget that the Yankee dynasty of the last 15 years or so began from within. They didn’t just go out and spend. Their system produced, Jorge Posada, Bernie Williams, Andy Pettite, Derek Jeter and Mariano Rivera. Two of these players are definite HOFers and arguments can and have been made for the others. That’s five All Star players and 2 definite HOFers…Think about that, and take an open, honest look at what the Mets farm system has produced over that same period of time. What do you have? You get David Wright and Jose Reyes and that is really it. I think that pretty much sums it up. Also, Reyes is gone.
Side Note, you could add Robinson Cano to this statement as well.
But the Yankees didn’t sit and wait for those guys to come up. When Jeter came up the team was already a play off team and packed with high priced veterans. The Yankees never did what the Mets are doing now. Never. They played to win all the time and eventually Jeter, Posada, Rivera, etc. came along.
They didn’t get rid of guys like Beltran, Pagan, Dickey, etc. Never.
They did exactly that. The Yankees were a miserable team from the late 80′s to the mid-90′s. When they were finally started winning again, they were led by farmahnds Don Mattingly, Pat Kelly, Bernie Williams and indirectly Paul O’neill, whom they traded for using fam hands. When they final made the playoffs in 1995, they had Mattingly, Kelly, O’Neill, Williams, David Cone (whom they acquired via trade for farmhands), Sterling Hitchcock, Andy Pettitte, John Wetteland (whom they acquired via trade for farmhands), Bob Wickman (acquired via trade), filled out with under-the-radar, cheap signings of Mike Stanley and Luis Polonia. Their high priced free agents? Wade Boggs.
They did exactly what the Mets are doing. Avoiding long-term big-money deals for the short term until the farm can pay off for sustained long-term winning.
You’re forgetting the signing of former all-star free agents Jimmy Key and Tony Fernandez, as well as trading minor leaguers for high salaried Jack McDowell and trading high salaried free agent sign Danny Tartabull for high salaried Ruben Sierra. But I don’t think this is really the point. Look at who they didn’t trade (Jeter, Williams, Rivera, Petitte, and others) and who they did trade. They traded lots of young players, and by and large were successful in those deals. The other thing about Jeter and company, they were drafted or signed as amateurs, thacquired it acquired in trades for veterans, or in trades at all. And when they developed a Bernie Williams or acquired a Paul O’Neill or David Cone, players who were doing well, they re-signed them. Aside from David Wright the Mets don’t seem to be keeping their successful and better paid players around, and the ones they are moving are still playing very well on their new teams. The Mets are trying to find overlooked talent at the lowest ends of the pay scale, but Scott Hairston and others are too expensive, so no Mike Stanley’s or Luis Polonia’s. There is a difference between not spending recklessly or irresponsibly and simply spending very little. But Buck is paid more than Thole, and Marcum if he does well will get more than Dickey this year, and almost as much as Dickey was asking for (and almost as much as the Mets offered) for his free agent contract. He isn’t as old as Dickey, but he has more recent injury concerns, and does not have a Cy Young award. It’s confusing. We’ll have to wait and see what the plans are and how they work. But as far as the Yankees go, they developed players, signed expensive and cheap free agents, and traded young players for veterans, veterans for veterans, and even sometimes traded for young players too. Maybe it’s not so much that they did those things but that they seem to have been very smart and/or very lucky when they did them.
And the Yankees re-signed Paul O’Neill to a 4
“There is a difference between not spending recklessly or irresponsibly and simply spending very little.”
exactly, thats the difference between efficient and effective…and just being cheap
Don’t tell him facts Morgan. Afterall facxts get in the way of the fairy tale. Next decade all these clowns will be selling their book. Sandy Liarson. the failure in Queens.
Yeah they signed all these 4A players until those kids came up….
Names like:
Joe Girardi
Mariano Duncan
Wade Boggs
Paul O’Neil
Tim Raines
Darryl Strawberry
Kenny Rodgers
Dwight Gooden
Jimmy Key
David Cone
SCRUBS all of them! Not one of them can hold a Candle to names like Marcum or Cowgill…
Oh Please….
The year before:
Girardi: .262 .308 .359 .667 (brought in 1996)
Boggs: .259 .353 .358 .711 (brought in 1993)
Mariano Duncan: .286 .285 .403 .688
Paul O’Neil: .246 .346 .373 .719 (brought in 1993)
Tim Raines: .285 .374 .422 .796 (brought in 1996)
Darryl Strawberry: had played in 104 games total in the previous 3 years to a line of: .210 .317 .374 .691 (brought in 1995)
Kenny Rodgers: 3.38 ERA year before, 5.11 ERA with the Yanks (brought in 1996)
Dwight Gooden: Did not play the year before and had an ERA over 6.00 in the last year he played (brought in 1996)
Jimmy Key 3.53 ERA the year before, good pick up but you are talking 1993.
David Cone: I loved Cone so got nothing there (brought in 1995)
So not one single hitter brought in that had over a .800 OPS and much more concentration on pitching.
However, what I noticed is that you are all over the place with dates. I am not sure if you are using 1992 and 1993 examples to say that they should be doing those now and then make a push in 4 more years? Or that Omar should have signed more long term solutions 4 years ago? What is the point of showing names from a 5 year span?
I used those names to show they did NOT do what WE are doing…
They didn’t sit on thier hands WAITING for something to happen, for kids to come up, for the Minors to be ranked high on someones organization list….
Yet you guys try and say at every turn they did what we are doing…
it’s Bull!
ummm….% wise, the yankees pretty much had a 75/25 mercenary vs home grown team…
jeter was surrounded by tino, boggs, knoblauch….tim raines, strawberry, o neil, etc
Well so much for that Excuse….
Time for some to go back to the drawing board…
I expect there to be an emergency meeting of the Firm to discuss strategy!
LOL
Metro12: I never take anything a GM says seriously…unless its Omar Minaya… then I scrutinize his grammar
in reality….
we all know Sandy is paid to be a pinata for the wilpons….
IMO what he says is so ridiculous, its almost as if he is trying to tell us he is lying…
the only 2 OF he had his eye on were Michael Bourn…and Juan Rivera ??? ( a guy who just signed with the Yankees to be a backup ??? )
So Juan Rivera is starter material…but not Hairston ????
read b/w the lines….
whats scary…is that DePo and JP are even more clueless than Sandy…
:-/
Long Live the Firm !!!
LOL, indeed. Wow. I’ve never commented on Omar’s grammar/speech on this or any other forum. Maybe you cross swords with so many who are critical of Omar that you just mix us all up? Or more likely, you just like to make things up out of whole cloth.
I know your grasp of the facts is really poor. (ie, Bourn, coaches hired by Sandy) But in this case I think you just have no hesitation to make things up you know may not be true! Sad.
It’s interesting how you try to inject Omar into every conversation. 50 times a day, every day of the week! They could be talking about polar bears and you’d find a way to bring up Omar. That is an abnormal excessive obsession that underscores a mental sickness on your part. If anyone has their head up another’s ass, you have yours up Omar’s!
I think it’s obviously a double standard that you chose you use the polar bear for your example instead of the grizzly or panda.
Or that dude that survives in the wild. Bear something or other.
A grizzly Adams reference. That is reaching way back.
Classic racism.
LOL, good one. But amazingly, not too far off the mark in terms of how some here think!
Why on earth would I talk about Omar….
I mean what does he have to do with the current state of our team and minor league system??
LMAOOOO
Is acting like an imbecile on MMO your full-time or part-time job ?
Why on earth would you talk about Omar when the topic has little to do with him?
Because you are insanely obsessed with his legacy and his rep.
Acting like an imbecile on MMO is your CAREER!!!!!!!!!!!
Most of this is pretty much non-news.
At the current stage of team building, it doesn´t make any sense at all to invest heavily into shortterm help. Especially in a pretty overheated free agent market where back-end rotation SP get 8 million or so per year and declining veterans such as Shane Victorino end up with a 3-year, 39 million $ deal.
2013 will be all about gradually establishing a 1st wave of young talent – mostly pitchers – in the majors.
Harvey – Wheeler – Edgin – Familia – Mejia – McHugh – maybe Gorski and eventually maybe a couple of potential impact bullpen arms such as Mazzoni, DeGrom or Leathersich who could be on a fast track. Plus of course, D´Arnaud as hopefully the longterm C and maybe Wilmer Flores as a bat who can help at multiple positions along with future backups like Centeno or Lagares.
That group along with those already here is pretty much the hope for a solid foundation that you can start building on and then add missing pieces (like major league outfielders) via trades and / or free agency.
And again, money should not be an issue anymore.
There´s plenty of payroll flexibility with only 60 million $ or so in terms of obligations for 2014 (including deferred payments to Bay already), 10+ extra million from the new TV deal along with SNY profits and newly acquired cash funds from ownership.
Whether it works out remains to be seen. But it´s certainly a valid and worthwhile plan.
This.
Nothing new here, except for maybe his confidence in the bullpen as it stands now. But we all knew that this winter he had money to spend but hadn’t spent it up to now. Bourn wouldn’t be a consideration if that weren’t the case. It was his first two winters that Sandy had just “pennies” to spend.
It’s that statement about the bullpen I find interesting. I’m not sure what all that confidence is about but am interested to see it play out. Unlike most, I am more concerned about the bullpen than the OF. The Mets can compete with a below-average OF. They can’t compete with a below-average bullpen. You only have to look at the 2000 Mets and last season’s Giants to know that a weak OF is not necessarily a stumbling block to the postseason.
I believe he is counting on contributions from some of the kids. We’ve got an awful lot of young arms down on the farm and there is every reason to believe that we can get some meaningful innings from some of them in conjunction with some of the vets who have been added.
Hi Boomer,
What vets?
The vets he had to work around he dumped – including Hairston and Rauch just recently.
Joey- He has signed Feliciano, Atchison and now Hawkins.
Yes, I know those of you who don’t like like Alderson will say these are just old, broken down castoffs that nobody else wanted.
So was Dickey.
LOL, what was Hairston at the time we acquired him? I think he had around a .650 OPS the year before we signed him.
Hi Boomer,
So you mean he let go of Rauch on the hope that Feliciano could come back? Why not just try to re-sign Rauch if he could? Who do you think has the potential for more meaningful innings would come from?
I said Atchison was a good signing – if he is physically sound that would have been an added plus. But still, why get rid of Rauch when we could have potential good innings from two relievers in Rauch and Atchison combined?
LaTroy Hawkins at age 40? Elmer Dessens was a year younger, had a good season prior and a long history in the majors but was let go as well. We know what happened to poor old glue-all.
And what about quality at-bats? He let go of Hairston too and replaces him with Cogwill who had all of 216 plate appearances with Oakland the past two years and was traded for Marte who’s progression has gone down as he advanced up in the minor leagues?
Boom, I know you are the eternal optomist always looking at the glass half full, but there comes a time when one must stop and see that at times the glass is also half empty. What you are saying about Hawkins, Feliciano and Atchison is the same so many were saying in 2010 with Young, Capuano, Carasco, Boyer, Bucholz, Harris, Hu, etc.
Has Rauch signed? What does he have to do with a LOOGY?
Joey see above, Hairston was a dud when we brought him in too.
HI TRS,
But what was Hairston when we released him? That ‘”dud” signed a two year deal with the Cubs and Theo Epstein is well respected – I think.
Again, like mentioned to Boomer, even re-signing Hairston would not have frightened the Braves or Nationals or any wildcard contender – but maybe just the Marlins in the battle for fourth place.
The Mets didn’t release Hairston, and despite Hairston getting a contract he is still penciled in as a platoon bat – the Cubs were just more desperate for a 4th OF than we were because we have 3 of them.
Man you missed the point. When we signed Hairston, just like Valentin and Tatis he was a scrub. Sometimes you get lucky and hit but often you have to know when it’s time to let that player go as well.
Right, Hairston was a great sign specifically for 2012.
Realistically, Hairston was scorching in May and July, and other than that he was pretty pedestrian.
you mean like Darren Oliver …or O’Day….or Heath Bell ?
Joey-
I am not the eternal optimist. Far from it. I probably seem that way as this placed is infested with eternal pessimists or people who are just down right negative about everything.
What I am is a realist. I can do math. And having run a few businesses I understand what it means to be in perilous financial condition and have to work your way out of it.
Rauch cost the Mets $3.5 million last year and delivered a 3-7 record, 57 innings pitched, a 3.59 era and was demoted from the setup role for lack of performance. What was the urgency to resign Rauch? Atchison was healthy the last month of 2012 and had a better year than Rauch and he is coming onboard on a minor league contract. If he makes the team he will cost a fraction of Rauch.
Please do not taunt me about the age of a relief pitcher when I have to bathe in the tears of those who daily bemoan the loss of “A CY YOUNG PITCHER ZO MY GOD!!!1!!1″ who is just about the same age and will be putting many more innings on an arm that lacks a fairly significant ligament.
I would have liked to see Hairston return. But the idea that he is an everyday outfielder in this league is laughable. He’s a serviceable part time/platoon player with occasional power. I don’t remember anyone throwing a playoff party when Hairston was first signed by the Mets and he turned out to be a pleasant surprise. No reason why one of the guys signed to fill what is going to be an outfield by committee can’t surprise us with more than we thought either.
I have no allusions as to where this team is right now or more importantly why and where I think it is headed. I’ve been a Mets fan longer than some here have been alive and that alone ought to prove I’m not an eternal optimist.
But I am optimistic that we are done with the bust and boom, lets go overpay for a few high priced FAs and pretend we have built a dynasty nonsense. I am optimistic that we are actually building not just a team but an organization for a change, one that has the ability to contend year in and year out. Are we there yet? Of course not. Are mistakes being made by this FO. Yea, last I looked they are just a bunch of humans. But I believe we are on the right track and I am optimistic for the future.
Good points Boomer.
Hi Boomer,
With what we have in the bullpen and you ask what is the urgency to re-sign Rauch when we can instead sign somebody to a minor league contract? I don’t get it, unless you are looking at the ledger book instead of the record book. If so, I am fine with that, but at the same time that is not a move in regards to competitive integrity – no way.
No matter that Rauch did not work even as a set-up man, he was one who in the second half provided solid middle relief work – even I, who taunted Sandy for signing him to begn with, admitted that overall the transaction worked out.
And remember, despite his good season in 2012, Sandy only signed Atchison to that minor league contract which shows he is not convinced he has recovered from his injury.
No matter what, we these moves are not going to frighten the Braves, Nationals or any of the two wild card contenders.
Joey-
Well you are certainly entitled to your opinion but no, I do not agree that this is not a baseball move. Again, Atchison had a very solid year last year pitching to one of the best eras in the league in the bandbox that is Fenway. And grabbing him at a low salary provides a good deal of payroll flexibility. There are no guarantees in baseball, of course, Atchison may get hurt or maybe Rauch’s knees will need to be drained again but if he stays healthy I like Atchison piching in Citi.
Yes, Alderson signed him to a minor league contract. Prudent. You know who hasn’t been signed by anyone to any sort of contract? Rauch. The Mets may still pick him up but only at a considerable discount over last years $3.5. See this is where the payroll flexibility comes in. They could conceivably get Rauch and Atchison for what they paid Rauch last year.
Oh and you know who else first signed with the Mets on a minor league contract?
Dickey.
so basically…instead of a mixed bag of players, we ONLY go for the ones absolutely nobody wants…
Omar signed 1,000 scrubs on minor league deals before he struck gold with RA
The difference is he ALSO signed proven players !!!
and like all gm’s ..
some work out well….others not so much…
HI Boomer,
Where did I ever say this wasn’t a good move? Look at my posts and I say it is.
I specifically asked why not add him to instead of replacing someone else. It’s not exactly that our bullpen was 15th in the league in ERA – it was 16th.
Joey-
So you admit our bullpen was horrible last year and you are wondering why aren’t racing to bring the guys from last years bullpen back?
I’m not sure how else to answer this. Rauch did not deserve his contract last year. Unless he is willing to come back for substantially less, which he still may as nobody else seems interested, why in the world would you want him back?
Hi Boomer,
Better explain the context of the overall situation regarding my opinion of Rauch’s place on the team. Do I want him back? It’s not so much a question of wanting him back as it is the answer of who else do we have?
No, I am not keen on him but without major changes to revamp the bullpen with potentially better arms I would not even mention his name as a returnee. But we aren’t. So we have to make due. If we got from the outside a reliable if not spectacular closer and kept it at that, then Rauch is still a necessity in middle relief along with Francisco – where he is more comfortable – and hoping Parnell maintains the improvement we saw in him perhaps as the set-up man. Then our bullpen would be in a bit better shape – not great, but perhaps passable. Francisco was misused and not having a closer so was everybody else.
Get us a few relievers and Jon is no longer part of the equation. Get us at least a closer and we can use Rauch differently and not in the late innings. But since we are not, he is at least better than the lot that we do have – which is not saying much.
So Rauch gets the nod out of default. That is all I mean. Get us a few good arms – not invitees signed to minor league contracts – and again, then no need for me to enter him into the equation.
Yeah but Dickey wasn’t coming off an injury…..For that matter neither was Hairston…
Big Difference!
Neither is Atchison. The reporting around here has been a little sloppy on that. He pitched 5 scoreless games for the Red Sox last September after returning from his elbow injury. If you don’t believe me ask the Boston Herald who referred to Atchison as “one of the few bright spots on the roster last season”.
http://bostonherald.com/sports/red_sox_mlb/boston_red_sox/2013/01/scott_atchison_moves_red_sox
Oh 5 games in September is enugh to show his Elbow can last a whole season in the rotation?
I guess Mejia is ready to start then as well, His Elbow isn’t a concern anymore either….
Name the injuries that Dickey and hairston were coming off of when we got them?
For a reliever, yea actually it is. The only reason he isn’t back with the Sox is because their bullpen is loaded, possibly the strength of the team. They also offered him a minor league contract but he thought he had a better shot with the Mets as they have more open spots in their pen.
I never said they were coming off injuries so burn another straw man. What I said was it was prudent to sign Atchison to a minor league contract. What was the logic is signing Dickey and Hairston to minor league contracts?
All that hate and negativity is gonna eat you up. Try taking a deep breath every now and then.
Ok you go right on believing that…If he misses time due to injury you know who is the smarter of the two of us….
But what I said STILL APPLIES….
Neither Hairston nor Dickey had to PROVE they were healthy at all…Because they WERE HEALTHY!
None of the guys we have signed this year can say that!
Gee thanks for your permission allowing me to believe what I already believe. I’ve read your comments and your incessant need to type in capital letters as if that makes your point any more emphatic or true and I’ve pretty comfortable with my own beliefs.
Hairston and Dickey were both signed to minor league contracts because they were considered long shots to make the major league roster. Dickey, in fact, did not. He was sent to AAA before being brought up. It was a smart way to proceed with an older pitcher who had a pretty undistinguished career to that point. Same with Hairston. Same with Atchison.
You don’t have a crystal ball anymore than I do. You have no idea how things are going to play out and neither do I. I think the team is taking a prudent and wise approach to digging out of a big hole and building a core with young players under their control. You don’t. Fine. But no amount of shouting or insults or insisting you have a corner on baseball knowledge or wisdom is going to convince that I have to accept your views when I don’t agree.
Still circle jerking around the issue aren’t you?
Were hairston and Dickey injured AT ALL the year before we signed them?
NOPE!
These guys we signed WERE!
They ALL missed time due to injury last year….
But there is something good in what you said that I will hang onto….
Since 5 Game sample is enough to convince you no more SMALL SAMPLE excuses from you will be accepted!
If everyone was convinced that Atchison is 100 %, then I´m pretty certain he gets a major league deal this winter after being very good in 2012.
It´s nice that he seemed alright in late September again – but he obviously comes with a big risk.
Still, it´s a far better flyer to take than signing Jon Rauch for 3.5 million $ guaranteed for sure.
September results ae very much like Spring Training results….
Many teams are playing thier Kids to audition them, even the Playoff teams are resting and making quick subs to get thier players healthy….
September is not a good barometer of how good a player is and just slightly better than ST only because No one is RUSTY by the time September rolls around.
Just throwing this out there… Has anyone considered moving Wilmer Flores behind the plate?
True story… Way back in 2007 or 2008, Daniel Murphy was an invite to Met spring training. A lot was made of HoJo’s influence in bringing him here. He was at 3rd base, and it might have been Ron Darling’s first year in the booth. Two thing were noteworthy. First, I noticed that Darling was doing a great job analyzing the game.
Second, Daniel Murphy made a routine foul pop-up at 3rd base into an adventure. He didn’t catch the ball, not even close. He was running with his arms outstretched, a habit I wean my Little Leaguers from in the 2nd practice. However, Murphy displayed a strong arm and someone in the booth suggested they put him behind the plate.
Since then, I always thought Murphy would’ve been a good candidate to don the tools of ignorance, and it’s definitely too late for him and probably too late for Flores. d’Arnaud’s acquisition makes it less compelling, but we need to start thinking along those lines early on when bringing guys up through our system.
I think the problem with that is that it takes YEARS in most cases for catchers to develop. There is so much more to catching than just the ability to catch and throw the ball.
It does take several years – and that idea would only have worked several years ago. If you put Flores at C now, odds are, he needs at least 2 if not 3 full seasons in the minors to learn the position – and he´ll be out of options by spring 2015. Without any guarantee that he even reaches a Josh Thole sort of level there. Also, Flores is pretty big and not the ideal size of a C anyway.
If Flores can play an at least passable 1b, 2b and 3b, I can see him as a very valuable super-utility player down the road. Somewhat in the Kevin Mitchell way of 1986 who also didn´t have a set starting position but appeared all over the field. Flores is a “bat” 1st and if you give him 350 AB per season – also as a DH & PH, of course – he could be quite valuable on a deep club. And also serve as a nice hedge against injuries to Wright, Ike or even Murphy (or whoever the longterm 2bman is). And if he hits better than most experts think he will, then he´s either a prime trade chip or could succeed Ike Davis at 1b (if he´s really good). For now, most see more of a .285 BA, 15-20 HR, .775 OPS type of bat. Not good enough to unseat Davis at 1b. Even worse defensively at 2b than Murph and obviously not on a level of Wright at 3b. However, that´s a very valuable utility bat right there.
One problem that the Mets have had with their last two contenders has been a lack of depth. Everything needed to break right to succeed. By having players who could start elsewhere on your bench, you increase your chance to remain good even if injuries strike.
In order to be a perennial championship contender you need to first develop a core of young players. Once that happens, you can afford to spend and overpay for free agents.
It doesn’t work the other way around though and there are no shortcuts. The Marlins failed miserably last season by trying to buy their way into the playoffs and I will bet all the money I have that the Blue Jays don’t make the playoffs either.
Eventually the Mets are going to have to spend, but you don’t sign big ticket free agents (or trade for guys like Upton) until the foundation is set. Once our young players establish themselves then by all means overpay for free agents or trade surplus prospects for top players, but you can’t do both simultaneously. It just doesn’t work.
I think Alderson said it best…”Am I going to recommended that we sit here in New York City and function like the Oakland Athletics for the next 10 years?” he continued. “No I’m not. … I’m not asking you to believe me until you see some manifestation of that, which I hope is sooner rather than later.”
Talk is cheap. Back it up.
Hi TJ,
Read between the lines. Sandy said he was not going to recommend to sit around and be like Oakland for the next ten years. That doesn’t get him caught in a lie because it does not rule out him doing for nine, right?
Well the only manifestation I see is the Oakland model….
Only deviation from it was signing Wright, and most agree WIlpon pushed him to do it for the PR factor….
and thats Oakland from 92-96…NOT Oakland from 98-present
and unless we get Billy Beane and HIS FOLKS, we will never see Moneyball level of excellence.
JP, Ricco and Depo are not in beane’s class
This guy really believes the NL East is the toughest division in baseball? He said it. Well Mr Alderson do you think the Met faithful are so stupid to believe this so they will support you and believe your dumba.. excuses of why the Mets are a 500 team. The AL East is far and away the BEST division in baseball. Baltimore, Yankees, Toronto, and Tampa Bay with Boston rebuilding. And you’re a baseball executive? Heaven help us!
Yankees old and fading. Boston rebuilding. Baltimore was a fluke. Tampa is reloading. Toronto hasn’t proved anything yet.
The AL West is tougher than the AL East. And so is the NL East.
Aren´t the Nats considered as the best team in Baseball by most folks right now ?
And aren´t the Braves rated close behind ?
While I believe the Phillies are about to collapse for good and the Marlins may not have a legitimate position player beyond Giancarlo Stanton, that´s a pretty good start for a division.
The Red Sox lost 90 games in 2012. The Orioles totally overachieved.
Sure, the Blue Jays look strong. The old Yankees should be around. The Rays just traded their # 2 starter, ace reliever and lost their CF to free agency while adding a few very nice prospects and 3rd tier free agents.
So, at least at the top, the NL East looks stronger. And depending on how much you believe in the Phillies, that´s a 3rd team that´s strong for now (while Alderson certainly can´t say “and well, we´re basically looking to stay ahead of the Marlins in 4th place”)…
Team for team the AL East is the most dominant in baseball. Once you get past the Braves and Nats the rest of the NL East are suspect. Pluse he actually said , please read the article
about the NL East “There are no easy outs.” All I can say is WHAT A LOAD OF CRAP!
1. It is not your job to defend against every comment that is against Sandy.
2. We get that you love this plan of his to be good in 2016. We just think it’s a fairy tale and we don’t like sacrificing five seasons in hopes of being .500 or a lil’ better in 2016.
3. Thank you.
#Bang ===> We just think it’s a fairy tale and we don’t like sacrificing five seasons in hopes of being .500 or a lil’ better in 2016.
If this team is merely .500 or slightly better by 2016, then this entire procedure has been a big failure. It´s as simple as that. Pretty much, 2014 needs to be that type of season – above .500 on the way towards success. Then 2015 and 2016 need to be playoff seasons.
Some may be very skeptical.
Others – like me – believe it´s the right way to build the team and it has a very good chance to get there.
Thing is, if it doesn´t work, this current FO deserves to be fired. And you can still bring in a more aggressive sort of GM who then goes out and tries to quick fix this again.
The Mets better win more games overall from 2014 through 2016 than they will have lost between 2011 and 2013, for sure.
HI DrD.,
Well, it means another year before the argument is settled. If Sandy goes into 2014 acquring from the outside those he needs to compliment that which came from within, we will see what his plan truly was – with one exception.
As stated, the projected payroll for 2016 is expected to rise to within $5 or $6 million of the current one (depending on Marcum’s incentive bonuses). If those he signs in 2014 are just for two years – then they have to be looked at as fill-ins, even if expensive. They could very well be quality players with one or two good years seemingly left – like a Carlos Beltran-type who signed with St. Louis for just two years.
And since next winter’s crop is mostly of older free agents than now, who most likely would command contracts the length of more than just those two years and at higher cost, that is why if wanting to wait one more year to add to that nucleus because he felt it wasn’t yet quite ready was actually Sandy’s reasons for holding off, that is actually counterproductive.
If he does not have the money to re-invest this year and is waitng for that extra $25 million windfall the next two seasons, that still is going to be counter-productive and in certain ways, not achievable if it is only a two-year financial window.
Sandy is said to be an analyst who thinks in the long term so I think he understands these scenarios and the possible risks associated much better than we do.
So that is why even next winter, we have to see the type of free agents he goes after. Again, many of them won’t fit the mold of settling in with a young team for a period of many years when in their prime.
Dooby please describe what you believe is the right way to build a team
I’m betting you confusing what we are doing as Building from within…But we are not really building from within we are instead Youthanizing the team by trading away our BEST performers for Younger promising maybes.
Teams who REALLY build from within build via the draft not by trading all thier best players to get some kids to build with….
Some teams that HAVE built from within have traded away performers to add to the rebuild they have already done via the draft but none START OFF via the trade and then hoping the draft fills in the gaps.
Most teams you can cite that built from within did it by drafting good players (usually with high round picks) and once those picks were close to being promoted they would then trade off one or two PERFORMER pieces that would soon have no place to play without holding one of those kids back.
So I’m guessing you believe building from within is the best way and no one would argue otherwise….
The problem is we are NOT building from within!
We are merely cannibalising the MLB squad to get some kids, And unfortunatly not enough kids to fill the holes the trades to get them created.
What we are doing is not building from within. Hell it’s not even a Home grown team!
The guys that are have been here for 2 years, with Harvey being here just one.
Neither Wheeler and d’Arnaud are homegrown and after they get promoted we are pretty much right back where we started, 24th in the league Minor League prospect rating.
We did not do what it is you think we have done, hell we haven’t even rebuilt at all because we created 4 holes to get two kids we didn’t have when we started this rebuild!
I just can’t understand the anger and vitriol from all the anti-Sandy people on the board. Why such venom directed at anyone who dares support or applaud some of what he’s done?
I think its clear the Wilpons are broke and have no money to spend. And if you believe that, then what is it you expect Sandy to do? You get mad at him for not telling us the truth? What’s he supposed to say? “My bosses are broke and have no money to spend now or for the foreseeable future.” Then what? He gets fired and someone else with no baseball talent who is merely a puppet for the Wilpons comes in and we get even more lies and silence? Your anger in this case should be directed at Fred and little Jeffy the moron.
And in terms of spending, if there is limited money to spend, if any, where should he have spent it? Name specific people he should have signed and how that would have helped the current and future situations. I would have liked to have seen Upton, but that trade wasn’t available to the Mets. So who then? Sign Swisher? Overpay Cody Ross? To what end? So they can win 5 more games this year at the expense of flexibility in the future? When you’re dealing with limited funds, money spent in one place means less to spend elsewhere, right?
For the first time since, maybe ever, the Mets have a very very deep well of arms in the minors. How many years did we spend looking at one name, and one name only, and waiting for him to come up. it was always one prospect at a time, whether a Pitcher or one of our untouchable five start outfield guys (Milledge, Payton, Fernandez, etc.)
Now we’ve got Harvey just promoted, Wheeler up next, Syndy a year or two away, Fulmer, Montero, Tapia, Mateo, DeGrom, Mazzoni.Leathersich, Robles, Ynoa just to name a few. And that’s without mentioning Mejia and Familia who may still turn into real assets at the big league level. Of course some, or many, may not pan out. But they are prospects, they have value. They give hope for the future and they are assets for trades.
This is how you build a sustained winner. This year may very well suck. But then, starting in 2014, you’re looking at Niese, Harvey, Wheeler, Gee, 1 rotation spot to fill, 2 outfield positions to fill, a system full of depth for trades, and maybe, just maybe, some money to spend with all the big contracts off the books. Maybe you upgrade at 2B. Maybe at SS. Who knows.
And as happens every year, 2 or 3 guys in the minors will come out of nowhere and prove to be future assets for the Mets or offer even more trade value.
But whether or not you agree with any of this, why such anger for those of us who do? We’re not blindly supporting a guy or the team. We’re all frustrated. We just see logic in some of what is happening and we also accept the reality of the situation. Direct your anger elsewhere.
The Mets owners WERE broke (or close to it) in 2011 (lasting deep into 2012). However, they aren´t any more. Thanks to Sandy´s job as “C.R.O.” (and part-time GM) over the last couple of years.
The business model that Sandy has built is absolutely fine in theory. The question is whether it´ll work going forward on the field. 2013 is the final rebuilding / cut payroll season, from 2014, results will have to start being there. There certainly are positive signs. However, there´s a lot of work left to do.
Hi DrD,
Just because the Mets are no longer BROKE (where they do not need any more bail-outs to meet the end of the month expenses) does not mean they have enough capital to do anything more than pay their bills and work on a shoe string budget due to the re-financing of the loans.
And that business model Sandy put together – it’s after all the downsizing put into place by himself and with the recommendations of Deloitte CRG. How much does it allow him to begin re-investing? Nobody knows. But based on his actions – and the statements about he himself making the decisions not to spend money – there is valid reason to speculate that it does not offer him that much as far as that re-investment.
Also, we know there is that two-year windfall on payroll savings in the area of $25 million per year. Let us say that all does go into player re-investment, what happens when $20 million of that is eaten upn in 2016 based on the players he has under contract now with their obligations and projected raises? What happens if working on the same shoe-string budget in 2016 as he proposes for 2013 – and this year he does not have to contend with paying back those loans. In 2014 he has to start.
Yes, we can only guess but the indicators that right now, with the burden of the loans being put off, he is still cost cutting instead of re-investing. Even in terms of the payroll – which is still part of the complete operating budget – by ridding himself of the salary commitments of Pelfrey, Hairston, Cedeno, Dickey, Carasco, Rauch and the $1 million saved by Bay being taken on by Seattle, by adding on the same for Buck, Cogwel, Hicks and Marcum (even with all his signing bonuses coming through) he still saved a few million and weakened the already weak bullpen even more and the same with what little we had in the outfield. Buck will make Thole look like babe Ruth.
I’m noticing DrDooby likes to mutter..er… pontificate his own versions of how things are going.
If the budget is frozen in the 80 to 100 million $ range for the next 5+ years, then obviously all this is not going to work (barring a best case scenario of pretty much every prospect panning out and reaching his upside).
A reasonable payroll plan (and going forward, payroll & cash flow should be close to each other again) could look like this:
2014: 85 to 95 million
2015: 100 to 110 million
2016: 115 to 125 million
2017: 125 to 135 million
2018: 135 to 145 million
The assumption is that you can do these – and meet payments at all times – because payroll is aligned with on-field success and thus revenue again (which it wasn´t in 2010 or 2011).
One thing you try to avoid in all this is longterm commitments to players that have a high likelihood to turn into albatrosses by the 2nd half of a deal.
Rather hand out a 3-year, 45 million $ deal than a 6-year, 78 million $ deal for example. And instead of signing 32-year-old free agents, you trade for 27-year-old players who remain under team control for a couple of more years. For that you need a deep & productive farm system.
I think that is the hope that once the kids start to perform wins will increase as will attendance and you can again gradually up payroll while maintaining a stable organization instead of a all or nothing philosophy.
That´s it.
Take a look at the SF Giants payroll over the past 5 years for example.
As their core group of players such as Cain, Lincecum, Sandoval, Wilson and more recently Posey, Bumgarner, Romo became more expensive or veterans were added, the payroll gradually rose from the low 80 million to 130 million range in 2012.
Phillies are a great example of this.
Hi TRS,
Why are we not starting to add some from the outside to our young nucleus as the Giants did?
In 2007 the Giants were a 71-91 team when they acquired Aaron Roward, Bengie Molina and Barry Zito. The year before (2006) Matt Cain wasn’t yet Matt Cain (4.15 ERA), Lincecum hadn’t yet thrown a pitch in the majors, Brian WIlson was a rookie with a 2-3 record and 5.40 ERA, in 40 innings rookie Jonathan Sanchez had an ERA just below five and Sergio Romo was still another year away.
I don’t think anyone can say their young, future “nucleus” of pitchers was any more ready than the “nucleus” of young pitchers/infield that we have now.
Perhaps we are the 2006 Giants and not the 2007.
Matt Cain (Matt Harvey) wasn’t Matt Cain yet and
Tim L (Wheeler) hadn’t pitched yet.
Hi TRS,
As you know, in 2007 the Giants were a 71-91 team when they acquired Aaron Roward (29 year old whom in 2006 was a .300 hitter with 27 home runs), Bengie Molina (hit .284 29th 19 home runs at age 31) and Barry Zito (28 year old who had been a 16 game winner in 2006). These were not inexpensive players meant to fill in
So again, why did the Giants start to add those veteran free agents to start complimenting them then and we are not? Their “nucleus” of young pitchers was no more ready than the “nucleus” of young pitchers/infield that we have now yet why is it still too soon for us to start doing the same thing?
Agreed, this team is still not ready to make the plunge into a young contender but neither was San Francisco after 2006. 71-91 in 2007, In 2008 they were still just 72-90. It was in 2009 that they began to jell at 88-74. Yet, they started building around that nucleus three years prior to them becomng respectable and they floundered for two more seasons before accomplishing that. Not wasted years at all – the team learned how to play together during that time.
So again, why the wait? If you think it isn’t the time yet, I respect that. If Sandy feels the same way, I respect that too. But what I do ask is for anyone to compare the steps Sandy is taking to those as San Francisco did in the same period of “rebuilding” because the comparison shows that he definately isn’t. And we know two days ago at that confab with season ticket holders, Sandy said the decision not to spend was his, not the Wilpons. He also said a few weeks before that though he has more money to spend doesn’t mean he had to.
Agreed,. nobody from that trio acquired after the 2006 were impact players on that 2010 World Series Champion team. But the fact is, San Francisco was still trying. All three were in their prime and the Giants were willing to take the risk into the next plunge. Just because those three didn’t work out doesn’t mean it would be the same for us in a few years.
Well they will all be up by the end of the year….
5 Year clock on control of your core….
How gradual do you think you can go before the money you want to spend has to go towards KEEPING the core as opposed to getting players that could help them win something?
What you still fail to recognize Dooby is that the Budget is FROZEN to the REVENUE!
If they lose 23 Mil again next year or even if they lose just 10 Mil then Payroll is NOT going up in 2014….
And even if they turn a profit somehow in 2013, it is highly unlikely they will risk spending more than HALF of that profit to increase Salary….
SO you have better start praying for Attendance (or get out the checkbook and buy some tickets) otherwise the 2013-14 Offseason will look a lot like this one with the exception of no David Wright signing and Dickey Trade to make you feel good.
Well I like honesty. He continues to blow smoke up our a…. The Nl East is the strongest in baseball and their are no easy outs. I am repeating myself from previous comments but pleeeez I just can’t take this guy anymore.
Last Mets GM to tell the truth?
You seem to be the one with all the answers, why don’t you tell us?
Hell if I know. I haven’t ever seen one. You might think this one lies more, that’s fair if you do. Just saying.
Next one will be the first. And pretty much any GM that tries that operating model won’t have his job for long!
I was going to say if you do find one he was a one year guy.
Like I said, it’s the age “rationalizing” by the numbers crew. Now it’s okay to lie. They now openly support “lying” since it’s okay since in their own mind all GMs do it. Funny, when I see Brian Cashman interviewed and I’ve been watching GMs get interviewed for ever – he obviously cannot tip his hand and has to measure his words when discussing other things and I’m sure he can’t always be forthright. But I wouldn’t say he’s “a liar”. That’s different. Sandy Alderson is a flat out bold-faced BS artist and we have idiots here defending that and now advocating “Lying”
“It’s perfectly okay to lie to the fans as long as you know the truth.” – J.P.Ricciardi
So far we’ve had:
- Alderson is charting a “smooth” course
- “Mission Accomplished” by either DrDooby or Boozer, Bowzer? Or is it DrBoomer? One of those 2 i mix them up anyway. Can you believe that? Mission Accomplished???? Already? And without a World Series too. News to those goons. There is only ONE Mission Accomplished and it’s happened 2 times in Mets history.
- Suddenly like a switch, the Mets turn it on and NOW try to win. Just like that.
- Nimmo being compared with Wilmer Flores.
- The Farm is now one of the elite by “acquiring” 2 pieces of talent instead of growing them on their own which has not happened yet.
- Gotta throw this one in there again. Alderson is charting a “smooth” course. Smooth. Nice easy post season and World Series wins huh? No problem. We ARE going to be good. Guarantee it. And it will be nice, easy, & smooth.
- We now have the revelation that Ike was rushed according to DrBoomer, or was it Doobie?
I think sacrifices in Alderson’s name are next.
Truth is Bay they WANT to hear the lies….It helps them with thier theraputic approach to looking at the team….
“Everything is ok….In Fact it’s going GREAT! I don’t want to hear otherwise and if you try to tell me I’ll just claim you need the therapy not me….”
Last GM to tell the truth?
They all do the ‘spin’. It’s in the job description.
You’re looking at this with your agenda glasses on. The problem is that those who worship Sandy see no wrong in him, he walks on water.
Everything he says that sounds good must be true, and everything he says that sounds bad must be the Wilpons who put him up to it.
What a great deal. Built-in excuses no matter what he does, right or wrong. Don’t look now, but Alderson is the Teflon Don.
Wasn’t Omar the original Teflon guy? Does Sandy have to borrow that phrase from Omar? I
Minaya was killed from day one. From signing Beltran on down. WFAN’s Joe Benigno actually said the Omar Watch has begun after the Los Mets fiasco began in the Media 3 months into his job. Why pretend as if that didn’t exist, and there were also those calling for his head after the Beltran strikeout (2 years in) or the first collapse (3 years in). If you dont believe that than just don’t reply because I wont buy whatever it is you’re selling today.
I defended Omar up until his last year on various blogs and he was always called Teflon so that is the point I am making.
Yeah it’s always the Anti-Sandy crowd who bring up Omar…Right…….
Welcome to the Anti-Sandy camp then if the above is true….
Hi TRS,
Actually, it was President Reagan that was originally called teflon, however, I think it was moe JFK and RFK.
Sadly the last two wouls still be here if they were Kevlar no Teflon.
But that’s where you’re wrong. Who is worshipping him? Who sees no wrong? He did an awful job with our bullpen last year. His drafts have been mediocre thus far. And he lies to us. We all see that.
What’s my agenda? I’m looking at a team that has owners with no money. And I don’t buy into the idea that they’ve solved their financial issues. I’ve worked with guys who were ” billionaires” but in reality were leveraged to their eyeballs and I think i know exactly what is going on behind the scenes. These guys will sell the team in the next couple of years, when they are assured of getting proceeds out beyond just paying off tons of debt.
But in the meantime, we who compliment certain moves and applaud an approach that is taken in light of the unavoidable financial circumstances, don’t have an agenda.
Sandy isn’t teflon. But he is very very smart. And he does have a plan. And if you get past the fact that he cannot tell us the truth because his bosses won’t allow it, and you just watch what he’s doing, he and his team are building a franchise. They are implementing a lasting plan.
And I don’t see anyone they should have signed or traded for in the past 2 years that would have been a better course. And I also don’t think they could have done better than they did with the two most significant moves they’ve made, the Dickey trade and the Beltran trade.
You hate the guy. I don’t know why. You love Minaya? That’s strange to me. But in any event, stop attacking those of us who see some sense in what is happening here. Disagree. That’s fine. But counter us with logic and productive suggestions. The anger and mean spiritedness and accusations make no sense at all.
Well then let me commend you, but please know you are the exception and not the rule.
I wanted Minaya out and all of those who get the rap for loving him all wanted him out. It was clear he was not a GM and should have stayed in scouting.
What I hate are the idiotic statements that things are infinitely better with Sandy when it’s far too early to tell.
Counter those claims with the evidence that we are on a winning tract?
Counter those claims with one impact player on the 25 that was developed or signed by this regime?
Counter those claims with evidence that this team is no longer the bottom division team it was four years ago.
There’s a lot that needs to happen before ANYONE can claim Alderson is better than Minaya who was a mediocre at best GM.
A LOT!
“What I hate are the idiotic statements that things are infinitely better with Sandy when it’s far too early to tell.”
Who is making those statements? I have said all along it’s too early to judge Sandy’s tenure and it was clear the goal is 2014 and beyond like it or not.
What the hell is wrong with you and why are you taking my comments as though they are pointed directly at you? Are you kidding me? WTF is wrong with you? You haven’t seen any evidence of Alderson knob polishing? LOL Do you navigate these blogs you go to while in a comatose state? Give me a break. I told you not to reply, and yet you do so with an asinine comment that expresses bewilderment that some haven’t said Alderson hasn’t been a change for the better? You need some first rate pharmaceuticals..
Ohhhh, you told me not to reply. I missed that. Otherwise I would have never replied on a message board with one of those reply button thingies that should only be used when you are speaking to people that you agree with.
Anyway, what I keep reading and even Joe noticed was this propensity to group anyone who does not agree with your point of view as an absolutist. There seems to be no way to have a middle ground anymore. I might see a few posters say Sandy is great and a few say that Sandy has never done anything right, those are extremist yet for some reason we don’t see it that way and have to side one way or the other.
TRS is on the fence Maniac….He says he is not defending Alderson….
He is just defending the guys who defend Alderson….
Sort of like a mouthpiece to a mouthpiece….
I predict TRS will be the Second to turn away from the FIRM….Salty has to get credit as the first here…..
Please don’t lump me into any fictional groups. I have always been critical of the moves I didn’t like and positive about the others. It’s only because I spend more time at other blogs, that I get lumped into categories. I gave a 2 year pass for the team to get through the financial crap. 2 years have passed, the financial uncertainty is gone, and they are retracting the team even more. That is why I am more vocal. I have no desire to play this Sandy vs. Omar games, I just want the team to start investing back into the team and whoever is in it’s way will get my ire.
Salty I was putting you in the fence group not the Firm, Same place TRS says he is in and in SOME cases has made statements to back it up (as you did).
The FIRM (Sand People, SL_PERS, whatever) Will never turn they will either fade away and stop posting or bitch about the next GM the way many of Omars supporters (and some of his detractors as well) Bitch about Sandy….
Me personally I don’t care about Sandy…He Sucks I don’t need to say it….
I’m not arguing with Sandy I’m arguing with those who think everything he does is the smart move!
And it mostly started last year when he had that GOOD DAY making the Pagan trade….
Dooby, Taskmaster and Metro to name three…
They all believe things are so good that 2014 will be a good year…..
I note in a few posts Dooby slipping and sneaking a 2015 and 2016 in there hoping no one saw or heard that can get kicked down the road a further two years….
“looking at a team that has owners with no money…”
And then replying to an article that proves the Owners are not the reason for the lack of spending….
Is he lying about that too?
Should we from now on just assume that the OPPOSITE of whatever he is saying is the truth?
And we can’t understand all the praise for a GM who has not won more games in a season than the last season of the guy who got fired for not winning enough games…
OF was not that great in 2000 when Mets went to WS, infield, pitching and Piazza carried them, so maybe this is the year that Ike, Murph, David and Tejada have really good years and Buck then T’Arnad can come up and provide defense and hitting plus rotation looks good.
Weakness even going with 2000 model is BP, which killed us in WS..
Well no one in that OF hit below .266
The WORST hitter in that OF would have outhit anyone we intend to start this year….
Cowgill being just .004 points better than our worst OFer in 2000…
Hi sarge,
What I really think killed us more than our bullpen was our attitude. I mean, a part-time rookie like Timo Perez doesn’t wait until he sees the ball clear the fence to dog it on the base paths and is subsequently thrown out at the plate and is then rewarded for his lack of hustle by starting game two? He cost the Mets a run, ran them out of an inning and I remember how Keith Hernandez was FUMING on the post game show, angry at the Mets for losing a game because of their laxidasical play.
If what I just read is true than this guy should be FIRED AS SOON AS POSSIBLE!!!!!!!!! he had a chance to make a difference last year and did nothing and now we are about to go into the season with what looks like a AAA outfield….BRILLIANT!!!! does he know he’s in new york now not a small market team, according to him though we are going to kill it when all that money comes off the books BUT we have all the money we need to get anyone we want right now, so who’s LYING TO US NOW?
Jon Daniels losing Hamilton to chief rival Angels and all the lost pursuits like Greinke, Upton and Dickey. Add a monumental collapse of the Ranges and two lost WS. Interesting article I provided link and highlites.
http://www.bbtia.com/home/?currentPage=2
And you thought the collapse over the last three weeks of the season was bad.
It pales in comparison to the worst off-season in the history of off-seasons, which took another dramatic turn for the worse Thursday afternoon.
[...] Did I miss something? Don’t the Rangers have three consecutive 90-win seasons? Haven’t they been to two of the last three World Series? Doesn’t money go farther in Texas than elsewhere? Isn’t Ron Washington an easy manager for whom to play?
The answer to all five is “yes.”
So how come, all of a sudden, nobody wants to deal with the Rangers?
For this there are only theories. None of them are very complimentary. If it can be summed up in a word, that word would be hubris – extreme pride or arrogance. Committing hubris would entail Rangers management thinking it had the baseball world by the tail, would entail thinking it could “win” free agency and trade negotiations, that everything would fall into place and that players are simply assets or liabilities to be moved around like stocks and bonds.
The Rangers appear foolish, but worse yet, they also have come across as absolutely clueless, with some arrogance thrown in. Idiots? Yes, that, too.
But suddenly, Jon Daniels, the general manager who appeared to be in total control of the Rangers’ winter moves, well, Jon got hit upside the head with a fungo.
Funny that you brought that up….Because I was thinking the other day when we were talking about MODELS for success that the Angels appear to be using Omar’s Model for quick contention….
Go all out of a Top Pitcher and Top Hitter in FA the first year (and coincidentally that hitter struggled in his first year in the new stadium)
And now they went after another top Bat to add some more to the winning….
People pointed to the faliure of thier spending last year….But if the Angels are truly operating under the Omar Model then this is the year they make the playoffs and provided Pujols can hit a curveball it might work out for them better than it did for us….