19
2012
A Slippery Slope: Mets’ Pitching Is Precarious
An article by 
Sandy Alderson did it again, speaking on WFAN he said he thought the Mets could compete in 2013. What he didn’t say was how he thought they’d be able to compete, much less define what he meant by compete.
He asked for patience and hoped some of the Mets’ young pitching talent would surface this coming season. Again, hope is not a strong building plan. Without saying so, he indicated this summer will be another long one.
There were no definitive answers as to the make-up of the back end of the Mets’ rotation. Assuming Dickey’s 2012 wasn’t a fluke, the Mets’ top three priorities were building a bullpen, coming up with an outfield, and to acquire catching help.
Now, the top priority must be finding another starter. It always begins with pitching and the Mets have some holes in addition to those elsewhere in the field.
“First of all, you think about how to replace the 240 innings. That’s where it’s got to start,’’ manager Terry Collins said. “Somebody’s got to step up, certainly.’’
Dickey threw 233.2 innings last year, arguably one of his most significant stats. That is 43 innings, or nearly five games worth more than Jon Niese.
Niese’s 190.1 innings were a career high, followed by Johan Santana’s 117, Chris Young’s 115, Dillon Gee’s 109.2 and Matt Harvey’s 59.1. Even had Dickey returned, the Mets had pitching questions.
After a strong first half, Santana lost a career-high six straight decisions before he was injured and again finished the season on the disabled list. Young was not tendered; Gee is coming off surgery and Harvey’s major league window is all of ten starts.
If Dickey turns out not to be a one-year wonder, then where are the Mets going to come up with those innings? If they don’t, and coupled with the rotation’s other questions, we’re going to see a lot of the Mets’ bullpen, which isn’t a pleasant concept.
Alderson spoke of finding the answers from within and didn’t regard Zack Wheeler until the eighth option. Inside options include Jeremy Hefner (a 5.09 ERA in 13 starts); Collin McHugh (7.59 ERA in four); Jeurys Familia (one career start) and Jenrry Mejia, whom they don’t know if he’ll start or relieve.
Alderson suggested the free-agent route, which might include a return of Young, but whomever the choice is he must come cheaply.
First, it was wait until Oliver Perez and Luis Castillo are off the books and the Mets would have latitude to spend for 2013. Now, it is wait until Jason Bay and Santana are gone and the Mets will write checks for 2014.
About the Author: John Delcos
I am an active member of the BBWAA and have covered Major League Baseball in several capacities for over 20 years, including ten in New York working the Mets' and Yankees' beat. I covered the Baltimore Orioles for eight years and the Cleveland Indians before that. I currently serve as an editor and senior staff writer for Mets Merized Online. Follow me on Twitter @jdelcos.
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NL East Standings
| Team | W | L | Pct. | GB |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Braves | 24 | 18 | .571 | - |
| Nationals | 23 | 20 | .535 | 1.5 |
| Phillies | 20 | 23 | .465 | 4.5 |
| Mets | 16 | 24 | .400 | 7.0 |
| Marlins | 11 | 32 | .256 | 13.5 |
Last updated: 05/18/2013
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i think it would be clear already that the FO is planning for 2014 . And sure SA says they have a shot , what else can he say? Mets , believe it or not , have an outside shot like 20+ other teams. its baseball, lets hope for some addition till march, and maybe a nice run , some nice ball you know . And THEN its 2014 and we will see what SA got us . My only hopes for 2013 are some nice games, maybe a .500 record and seeing the kids grown . Ill take it from there
Sorry to break it to you Angelo…
But if Sandy had any plans for 2014 or even 2015 he would have signed Dickey to the three year deal…
not necessary, dont act like that would be the one and only move to proof
Ok Name the next move to make next year a winner?
Uh no. He does have a plan for the future and it involves building with good young talent instead of aging stars. Even David Wright has bought into it.
http://espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/story/_/id/8762418/david-wright-says-new-york-mets-set-nicely-dickey-trade
Same coaching staff
same bullpen
no outfield
worst defensive team in baseball
yup, David believes in the plan !
John,
Please in this open forum, suggest what moves should have been done or NOT done this off season on a budget of 100-110m payroll. I honestly would like to know.
I know the OF has not been addressed yet, but I am sure it will. SA is not that stupid. He said him self: “what OF”.
I’ll answer….
MOVE ONE – Get off this notion that Payroll should be limited to 110-110 Mil
125 Mil would not be crippling and it could get you that Power Hitting RH Bat to play the OF that would lead to wins (provided you had a Cy Young type Pitcher) and get more fans into the stands to pay for it at the same time!
Metsie:
I have always said the Mets need a minimum of 130 M payroll with players contributing that is NO Santana, Bay and Thole types of last year. I agree with you. Please write to the Wilpons and tell them:
“25 Mil would not be crippling and it could get you that Power Hitting RH Bat to play the OF that would lead to wins (provided you had a Cy Young type Pitcher) and get more fans into the stands to pay for it at the same time!”
I did not set the restriction, SA did not set the restriction, the owners are the ones who did.
Well Hotstreak all I’m saying is if we agree that shorting our budget on Payroll is the problem that we should not EXCUSE mistakes caused by the initial mistake made….
Is it really the Wilpons?
Sandy says he HAS money but has no plans to spend it…
if he HAS MONEY then the Wilpons are not limiting him are they?
Well let’s not argue who is lying because they lye in bed together and at our team’s expense.
Hi Metsie and Hotstreak,
As alluded to, there was no baseball rational for the Mets to be put into such a position as they are now. Yes, we are now re-building but not because the team was falling apart after 2010 and we had key players on the way down. We had a good club that needed some extra parts, that’s all. Further player investment in that team had less risks than rebuilding it. There were also other venues to take than depleting a farm system of it’s top prospects.
After Omar was fired but before it became apparent that Sandy’s goal was to cut the payroll, did anyone expect the club to be in the shape it was after 2011, let alone 2012 and going into this upcoming season?
Sandy was brought here for his near 35 year legal and executive level corporate experience in and out of baseball and because someone with that background was required (actually forced onto them) it meant the franchise was in deep, deep trouble on the business end and that drastic measures were inevitable. Had there been an option for those measures not to have included the roster, I do not know. Metsie has pointed out how more investment could have led to more revenue – we know that is a position Sandy didn’t take, both here in New York and with Oakland when it came to shipping off the then Babe Ruth of his time (steroids aside).
But as alluded to, rebuilding has to come more from a combination of draft selections, trades and free agent signings. It is very rare for a team to hit pay dirt with the approach Sandy is taking since there are at least two holes in the outfield, almost a complete bullpen to contend with and (if we discount Santana) and two fifths of a starting rotation to fill as well.
Thank you Angelo!
It is nice to see other fans who do see the forest for the trees!
I find it amazing that so many people here do not understand that Sandy A is not going to say anything that admits the team is not quite ready to SERIOUSLY compete for a playoff spot. These same people refuse to accept the fact that ownership is not yet able to SERIOUSLY compete in the free agent market either….
Too many people here in fantasy land that they own or run this team!
Funny isn’t it how we were pitching strong until we trade one pitcher away and once again we need starting pitching?
Guess we were not as strong as we were led to believe by the Trade Hype Agenda folks….
Or maybe its the Sell Negativity Hype people.
It is the difference of understanding organization from team.
So why don’t you enlighten us as to the difference between the team and the organization….
Knock yourself out!
Simple. Team is the philosophy that you adhere to that focuses only on the big league club in the next year. It is a failed strategy and one that is proven not to work long term. The Mets 2005-2008 are prime examples. Nothing to show but a lot of movement of older players and then the collapse.
Organization is a philosophy that success is built upon. Every move is the strengthen the organization. This has been used repeatedly throughout the last 40 years (that I have been watching). Every success gets their pillars in place first then adds to it. Even the great Yankees started their 15 year run in this way.
The playoff teams this year, TX, Oak, Wash, Atl, Det, Cin, SF, and Balt (look at the Bedard deal 4 years ago for a bunch of minor league players) all used this blueprint.
Amazed you have not picked up on it yet. But then again, you are like the Wilpons, looking what is the team going to look like immediately. Never think about down the road.
Ahhh IC…So it’s fine if your MLB TEAM sucks as long as your Minors win….
so THATS the difference….
DUMB way tp run an MLB club since the focus is not on the MLB club….
This trade makes letting reyes go for NOTHING!
We took Plawlecki with the comp pick and now he is useless because he wasn’t good enough to stop you from trading a Cy Young Pitcher to take his position from him!
Actually, the last 4 years both the minors and the major league team have sucked. The difference is understanding that developing good minor league players can lead to a winning big league club. Look at the last 10 world series winners…except for the two Sox teams, every other team was developed from within and players added.
But no you prefer the same spend on garbage players who give you nothing. Jason Bay is the poster child for that mindset.
AND do you know why the Minors sucked?
No you don’t do you?
Because of all those HOMEGROWNS you keep insisting we should have BEFORE we start keeping our best players that are already here….
Ike Davis
Reuben Tejada
Johnathan Niese
Dillon Gee
Bobby Parnell
Matt Harvey
Capt Kirk
Valdespin…..
The last two all due to the fact you traded away all the GOOD players and were forced to play them before they were actually ready!
Thats why the Minors sucked the last two years because we have played firesale with all out preforming MLB talent (in the name of 2015 and beyond) and had to sap them of anyone that showed any promise before they were ready to move to the MLB!
Thats what you fine and you say SMART philosophy has done to the organization!
Now you will have to rush Wheeler as well because you traded away your best pitcher and the only options available to get are all mediocre at best!
But you liked everything that did that because you have given up on this team for 4 or 5 years….
Maybe by then you can afford to go see them play so they won’t have to buy off the crap pile.
The Blue Jays, Orioles, Royals, Pirates, Indians, Twins, Athletics,Padres, Nats, Rays have been using that method for years. Top 10 draft picks plus comp picks every year and only successful team out of the group has been the Rays…..
The Nats have been successful lately by spending money and after drafting 2 once in a lfetime prospects in Strasburg & Harper.
The best way to build a team NOW in the free agency era (where there is no collusion) is a mixture of homegrown talent and shrewd signings/trades for Veteran ball players….There is no exact science….but many blueprints
Funny we are catching weak until we give up in a trade two catchers.
“If Dickey turns out not to be a one-year wonder, then where are the Mets going to come up with those innings?”
Huh?
That is like when DeNiro said it took him 10 years to become an overnight success.
It took Dickey 3 years to become a 1 year wonder.
Dickey is a one hit wonder.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RueNY7cyslI
This might be a last place team. Dickey probably cost them 10 games. There have been no additions thus far that add anything. Can Santana win 10 games? Can Murphy improve at second? Will Tejada improve? Who plays CF? Who plays the OF? This is a bad team don’t let Sandy kid you.
i love RA but the chances are higher that he cannot duplicate his 2012 performance, maybe not even close . He signed with toronto and NOTHING better could happen to him , he will have a much better supporting cast over there plus he will start minimum half of his games ina dry dome with his knuckler . So Dickey can´t be any more happy . And i DO think we will not get 20+ wins to fill his hole BUT Harveys will eating up alot of Dickeys innings, Santana, if god will, has way more innings to give, and Niese shouldnt be on his peak also . So a NEED for another starter in 2013 is not there , it would be some kind of insurance to not make it a desater , but actually , for the 2013 season , mets have starters to eat up those innings dickey left
Don’t forget to add Gee to that list. We only got 17 starts and 109 innings out of him last year before he went down. His surgery was way less invasive than Santana’s and he should be able to bounce back to his production of 2011, 27 starts and 160 innings.
yes Gee is a great 5th starter, maybe 4th
Hi Angelo and Boomer,
One thing to consider is that Terry did use other pitchers to make up for those lost starts from Gee. Even if Gee, Parnell, Harvey and Santana don’t miss a turn this year, they will still not be able to make up for the lost starts from Dickey and assuming there will be some starts by each in our rotation that will need to be skipped over, that doesn’t leave the Mets much flexibility with others to be used to fill in those games – like last year. Wheeler will probably take Johan’s place in the rotation and not start alongside him instead.
And as John pointed out, it wasn’t just the starts but the innings that R.A. used up. With our bullpen the way it is, the last thing we need is to call on them even more next season.
thats why i say we rather need RP´s
Joey, don’t get me wrong. I still think we need to add a horse at the back end of the rotation who can eat innings, but I think some of the production can be made up by guys on our staff who had less than full workloads last year. Harvey’s slated for a big jump as he will have a full year in the rotation and Gee and Santana should add considerable production after 2011 which was a big down year for both.
People seem to forget that Gee was 13 – 6 with 160 innings in 2011 and was thought to be an emerging stud before he had surgery last year. And Santana is now 2 years removed from his shoulder surgery and when he was first going under the knife it was suggested by his doctor that it could take up to 2 full years for him to regain his form (assuming he does).
Theres no question losing R.A. left us with a big hole but he also filled a big hole that was left by the lack of production from some of the guys who were already on the staff.
How about a 6 man rotation? This will allow the starters go deeper into a game and the Mets dont need the shaky relievers like Acosta and RamRam last year.2 of the starters (Santana and Gee) coming off an injury. 2 rookies (Harvey and Mejia??) who will have limits on their innings. And Niese did better on 5 days rest during the 2nd half of 2012. Using Hefner for those starts??
Go back to your moneyball. Young, healthy, inexpensive pitchers developed from within.
The only way another starter will be added is it is an inexpensive deal with a big upside.
Santana will have a strong healthy year (amazing how that happens to players in their walk year) and be traded at the deadline for a prospect. He will be replacer in the rotation with Wheeler.
Harvey will become dominant. Neice will contine to improve. Gee will recover and continue to be a solid, inning eater.
For the fifth spot Hefner, McHugh, Familia and Mejia will be given a chance to see what they can do.
If your counting Harvey should be +100, Gee +50 and Santana/Wheeler +50. Now you’ve almost made up AJs innings, but the question become, what type of innings. No pitcher in baseball as deep into games as AJ did last year, so the challange will not be where to get innings from starters, but how to improve the bullpen.
““First of all, you think about how to replace the 240 innings. That’s where it’s got to start,’’ manager Terry Collins said. “Somebody’s got to step up, certainly.’”
Finding someone to replace 240 innings is the easy part….Anyone can do that someone has to pitch,Right??
Now….Finding someone to replace 240 quality innings is the hard part
My Choices
1.Francisco Liriano – High upside could sign for 1yr deal not sure how much it will cost.
2.Tim Stauffer – Pitches well when healthy….besides Alderson loves Ex-Padres(see Young,Hairston,Dykstra,Hefner etc.)not to mention worst case scenario Stauffer can pitch out of the bullpen he was awesome in 2010 in that role
3.Brett Myers-Innings eater the last 2yrs he started for Astros in that ban-box…worst case insurance for Frank Fran-sicko as a closer
4.Jeff Karstens
5.Carlos Villanueva
Loriano is an interesting choice…has he been hurt the last few years?
Recently just a Shoulder strain in 2011 that ended his season
M. Donald Alderson. Sandy is the biggest moron of a Mets GM ever. Worst than Omar. I warned you guys that we will be in the Mets dark ages and now we are in the period of the dark ages.
The need for a stud catcher and building through youth is more important than winning 75-80 games with or without Dickey. Alderson and his crew have stripped it down, and are beginning to rebuild. We are not in the position to “win now”…..lf we were and Dickey were traded, I would agree that Alderson made a mistake. Put yourself in Sandy’s place for a minute….If you were on WFAN and they asked you about 2013 would you come out and say…AAAH we’re just gonna have to write this season off guys…see you in 2014….I don’t think so….In his position, he has to remain positive, but he knows they won’t be ready for the playoffs yet. If this team competes every day (which Collins does hold them accountable for) and guys like Harvey, Davis, Parnell, Niese continue to improve, and Wheeler shows up later in the season and they play some exciting baseball, but don’t make the playoffs, I can accept that. I don’t know if anyone notices, but he is also bringing in guys with the right attitude. While that doesn’t always win, it certainly doesn’t hurt. Good luck in Toronto R.A. and thanks for your positive attitude and determination. …Oh yes and beat the Yankees will ya please!
So few ever learn their history. The 2013 season is not a wash. If the rosters were able to determine that, there would be no reason to play the games. The 2012 A’s and 2011 DBacks show how teams can pop out of nowhere. So did the 1984 Mets. Does anyone remember that team? Lets us look at the powerful roster that was there….
3 of the starters were rookies along with Walt Terrell and Bruce Berenyi. Starts were also made by greats such as Tim Leary and Mike Torrez. Certainly there were question marks about this staff especially since Gooden didnt even break camp with the team.
As for the lineup, other than Hernandez and Strawberry, what bats made people think they could compete. Foster was a shell of his days in Cincinnati having a disappointing run with the Mets. Hubie Brooks was a good player but not one who was feared. The rest were role players who performed up to task but certainly were not hall of fame guys.
The point is there is no way of telling. The early 80s (in addition to the late 70s) were a bad time for the Mets. Suddenly, in 1984, things changes. All those “minor” moves that Cashen was making turned into something. Will it happen again? At some point. Will it be this year? Who knows. But do not forget Strawberry did not get called up until end of May in 83 and went on to win ROY. Could D’Arnauld do the same thing? Perhaps. Or maybe Wheeler could chip in 10-12 victories when he gets to NYC. That is what makes baseball interesting.
Puzzling how few Met fans appreciate the concept of building from within, and adding on as your core matures.
An historiography of the Mets would illustrate that the successes enjoyed both in 1969 and in 1986 were preceded by years of building from within. Donn Clendennon was a key addition in 1969 and Gary Carter a key addition in 1985. But all of the other pieces were in place, including a manager capable of manning the ship.
I have always believed the Wilpons to be too impatient to be responsible owners. The would not allow time for aging veterans to go fallow and replenish the major league squad systematically with a combination of prospects and a judicious selection of free agents. Indeed, their practice was quite the opposite, which is how one accumulates aging veterans with humongous contracts, over-priced mid-range ball players and a farm system depleted to the bone by the cost of free agency and 4-for-1 ball player swaps. It’s a blue print for “what not to do if you own a major league franchise”.
Alderson’s approach is correct, almost to mathematical precision. I would say he dropped the ball on not trading Reyes for prospects, but I’m sure his hands were tied.
Looking forward, we’re in for some surprises this year, although I don’t see this team taking the division or competing for the wild card. By 2014, however, I believe firmly that our team will be in playoff contention and will be so for years to come.
“Looking forward, we’re in for some surprises this year, although I don’t see this team taking the division or competing for the wild card. By 2014, however, I believe firmly that our team will be in playoff contention and will be so for years to come. ”
AMEN , GO METS
First off Tommy…
If you looked at the History you will see at NO TIME did we give away our best player to get the kids we needed…..
Mazzilli was not the best player on the team, he was the best player on those BAD teams of the late 70′s early 80′s…
Two History also shows that it wasn’t trades that got the kids we needed it was the losing for almost a decade netting us top draft picks that did.
The 69 Mets were a product of 8 years of losing…..
the 86 Mets from 10 Years of losing and none of the trades in 77 did anything more than net you Backman!
You guys seem to think that Building from within is defined the way Oakland does it…
Find anyone good and trade them for 3 or 4 maybes….
Yet you can build from within WITHOUT having to trade away your BEST player each year…All it requires is to draft smart and sign the guys you picked…Something that can’t be said about this FO….
SO this idea that Building from within REQUIRES purging your best players from the roster is the key philisophical problem you have and can’t sell…
K-Rod, Beltran, Reyes, Pagan, now Dickey (Soon to be Niese, Davis, Harvey and Wheeler) and what did you get for those 5 guys towards buliding from within?
Wheeler and d’Arnuad with a longshot possibiliy of Snydergard….
FIVE KNOWN GOOD QUANTITIES to get THREE GOOD BETS…
The Picks you got for Reyes are now SQUANDERED!
We took Plawlecki and he obviously wasn’t worth waiting for which is why we went and traded a Cy Young Pitcher after letting a Batting Champ go just to fill the same Catcher position.
Thats not building from within…It’s spinning your wheels and going in NO direction.
Maybe if they didn’t waste Reyes, K-Rod and Pagan they could have solved the Catcher problem not just midway through this season but from the beginning!
We can platoon Kevin Pawlecki with Daniel Murphy at 2B !
You know what is more likel to happen?
In 4 years when D’Arnaud has had a good year they will trade him and start Plawlecki then….
Willie goes round in Circles!
Or Juan Centeno ( crossing my fingers )
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/mets/madden-dickey-trade-carter-like-article-1.1221782
http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/mets/final_verdict_on_dickey_deal_will_9HhquGstjwFVNk59g8qZzH
Boston Red Sox trade Jeff Bagwell to the Houston Astros for Larry Andersen
Detroit Tigers trade John Smoltz to the Atlanta Braves for Doyle Alexander.
I believe these trades were at trade deadline and while both veteran pitchers helped their new teams the prospects lasted many years with their new teams.
I totally agree baseball is a results business. If DW is on a non-contending team in his remaining pime years his extension is foolish. He could have hauled in a huge amount of good prospects. I realize prospects are just that.
“Again, hope is not a strong building plan.”
Every GM in baseball all they can do at the end of the day is hope that what the moves they are doing will prove to be right. Even Anthropoulos can only hope that Dickey proves to be a worthy addition to his plan of building a W.S. winning team.
From the outside it appears they are trying to build what they hope (there goes that word again) will be a nucleus of players from the likes of Niese, Harvey, Davis, Wright, Tejada, Wheeler and d’Arnaud where if their gamble is correct they may add that pitcher down the road the same way that the Nationals did last year with Gio and the Blue Jays did this year with R.A. or they can possibly go the free agent route.
At the end of the day though it all comes down to a hope that whatever the so-called plan is proves to be a successful. Lat season Miami had a plan they hoped would prove successful and it failed miserably. Now they have a new plan.
its one of the wonderful things in baseball, almost ANY team can win it all when pieces comes together . We as mets fan only have hope left since ……… So who are we to judge a GM for having hope
Look at the deal Seattle made in 2008 getting Erik Bedard from some minor league players that they shipped to the Orioles. Bedard was garbage after that (and he was only 28 at the time of the trade) while one piece in that trade was Adam Jones.
So there is risk no matter what side of the trade one is on. Will the veteran keep performing at a his previous level or will he fall off. At the same time, the other side is betting the prospects in return become productive major league players.
Agree there is always risk and this trade is a risky gamble on the Mets part indeed. To me the safer move would of been to retain R.A. and have a returning CY Young winner that Mets fans loved sell tickets in 2013 but it appears this move was not about selling tickets in 2013 or being safe but about trying to build something bigger. It’s a risk that may blow up in their faces bigger than the Pagan for Torres & Ramirez trade last season but it seems it’s a risk they feel is worth taking.
Would you hire a Doctor who says to you if we do this procedure the HOPE is that you will be fine?
I personally prefer to hire professionls who don’t HOPE they have the answer but FIRMLY KNOW they have it….
If this guy only has HOPE to convince him he is making the right moves then he is not the guy who should be running this team….
The Cowgill deal was meh! for me I could take it or leave it….doesnt push me either way…It was good however that he got a fairly young player
BUT….What I really want is a POWER HITTING Outfielder….If Alderson cant make a trade for a proven tale4nt at least acquire someone with Power in the mold of a Cowgill that has some Right handed POWER in the Outfield.
PLAYERS I WOULDNT MIND
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
1.Jerry Sands OF (BOSTON)
http://www.milb.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?pos=LF&sid=milb&t=p_pbp&pid=543742
2. Michael Taylor OF (OAK)
http://www.milb.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?pos=LF&sid=milb&t=p_pbp&pid=446345
3.Thomas Neal OF (CLE)
http://www.milb.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?pos=LF&sid=milb&t=p_pbp&pid=489166
They are not game changers but if we’re taking flyers on Young unproven players I wouldnt mind these players…..
Jerry Sands would be my 1st choice he showed potential in his pro debut with the Dodgers in 2011….And he killed LHP in a small sample size
60AB..20Hits..7doubles…3HR…14RBI…7BB…8K…367AVG…433OBP…633SLG…1.066OPS
Sandy is in selling tickets mode:
“I think we’re happy with what we got from Murph. He developed into an acceptable, probably average defensive second baseman. I think there’s more offense there. I’m little disappointed with his power production, which we think he has. He can be better on base. I hope going in to 2013 that he’s more comfortable at second base now and can focus again on his approach at the plate. He’s an outstanding hitter and we know that, but he can be even more productive and I hope he will be.”
Murph had a -9 UZR, playing a crucial up the middle defensive position.
Tejada is not exactly Ozzie Smith either. His range is mediocre at best.
NO CF, NO RF
Defense will be our achilees heel again
This is proof positive that Sandy is either an absolute liar, a bad salesman, clueless, or a lil bit of all 3
“Murph had a -9 UZR, playing a crucial up the middle defensive position. ”
Would you like to know where the failure is there, or will it fall on deaf ears?
Are you seriously going to tell me that a guy who plays 2B, positioned damn near on the outfield grass, just to make up for the fact that he is slower than mollasses is even a decent option for 2B from a DEFENSIVE perspective ?
At this point, we are just happy that he didnt hurt himself doing the job
Murphy compiled that negative UZR in the first half alone. In the 2nd half it was basically neutral – not surprising considering he was finally left alone at that position and didn’t have to play 1b, 3b or LF in between.
Of course, to be really valuable, Murph needs to hit better. .300 BA, .350 OB, .450 SLG should be the goal here.
As for Ruben Tejada, while he’s an average defensive SS, he’s clearly better than Jose Reyes used to be there defensively in recent years – while obviously not being anywhere near the hitter Reyes used to be.
The Infield of Davis – Murphy – Tejada – Wright is and should be fine.
The problem remains the OF which COMBINED for a – 0.1 WAR in 2012.
And replacing Torres, Bay and Hairston with Cowgill alone obviously won’t do anything about the problemeven if Nieuwenhuis and Duda improve some…
There is no hope. Our most noble and interesting player is gone. We still have no outfield or bullpen to speak of. I just unsubscribed from the NYMETS email list. not interested in their propoganda.
how about getting Pedro Beato back for a start?
BadBadLeroyBrown- some good out of the box thinking! I certainly wouldn’t mind Sandy and his think tank taking a flier on Jerry Sands for RF with some sort of minor trade with the Red Sox. I think whatever little $$$ Sandy has left to spend is going to spent on a SP and a veteran support reliever not on an expensive OFer in FA. My 1st choice for SP off the scrap heap would be Jeff Karstens. I think Liriano is too risky and Oliver Perez like. I think the need for a RH power bat for RF was lessened with the additions of Buck and D’Arnaud who might hit 20-23 HRs between them next year.I think there is a greater need for an athletic, speedy CF that can skate out there and that can serve as a speed, SB element and run manufacturer atop the batting order instead of Tejada. I would love to see Sandy and his think tank work a trade with the White Sox for CF Alejandro De Aza. I think TC wants that element for the offense and defense too- allegedly he was pushing for Gose to be in the Dickey trade too.
Really would you like him to come on and say we’re going to suck next year. Why, he’s got enough know it alls to say it for him. The same ones who picked the O’s and A’s to come in last and the Phillies and Marlins to run away with it last year, It’s time to wake up baseball is not played in December
Yet the whole justification for trading Dickey was that it was a SLAM DUNK 2013 (and right on through to 2015 when the three year extention would have expired) was a lost season(s) which is why we were smart to trade Dickey because we COULD NOT (definitive) win WITH him….
Sure anything can happen but you made and justified moves made based on the definitive assumption we were not going to win anything!
Now that we got RID of a Cy Young Pitcher we will?
Thats patently rediculous!
Hi Vinnie,
All Sandy had to do was stick with what he was saying about 2013/14 being a learning year instead of not punting away the season. He talked about that on the Francisa interview in late September, stating the 2013 and 2014 would not at all be a waste and that it will be exciting to see the kids as they develop. And he did say one never knows what could happen, indeed citing Oakland.
There is nothing wrong in saying one was going to see improvement with the infusion of more youth than to feed us all the other double-talk about not punting away 2013.