I know Nolan Ryan was very wild when here and his future was unsure, but………..

Murphy just might be the fastest runner in the Mets infield. Certainly faster than Ike. Faster than Wright in the windsprints they ran in 2008 spring traning. Faster than Tejada.

I like Murphy but I do not believe he is a long term solution at 2nd base. I view him more as a somewhat supersub. The guy can really rake but his lack of speed, power, and athleticism
combined with his poor defense make him a player that can easily be replaced.

I would rather we keep Ike, and I believe he can fix the holes in his swing and become a legit power threat for the Mets. Although this year was sub par by his standards, Ike has the potential to be an excellent defensive firstbaseman. I think that having missed nearly an entire year really hurt his game this year and that he will bounce back. That being said, he is perhaps our most tradable chip and I think we could get some high quality prospects. So while I don’t want to trade him, I believe Sandy owes it to the franchise to at least listen to offers for Ike.

Johan being one of the worst trades in club history is one of the most ridiculously untrue statemants I’ve ever heard on this site. I understand he has missed time every year and that he is now well beyond his prime but the man but he has been a true ace for us and an absolute bulldog on the mound. He has been a mentor to many of the younger pitchers on the staff, pitched the first (and I know that it is a highly contested) no hitter, and has shown incredible toughness and grit in coming back from his surgery. He has had a winning record and good era every year he’s pitched, combine all of that with the fact that we gave up ABSOLUTELY nothing to get him makes the statement flat out UNTRUE!

he has proven over and over that he can win a mini-budget…

what people forget is that BEFORE sabermetrics…before the owner died in 1995….Sandy’s Athletics took a NOSE-DIVE after the WS. in 1990

this is why they traded off Dave Stewart in 1992
this is why they traded off Rickey Henderson

From 1983-1995….Sandy’s A’s had a good 3 year run…thats it…88-89-90

1995-1996-1997…these are the years Sandy had to run the team with a tiny budget…

the team was a disaster

these are facts.

Put him at 1B and he is fine
Put him at 3B and he is fine
Put him at SS and he is not
Put him at LF and he is not

No one would call David Wright a bad defensive player if they put him in CF and he made errors…but the met fans constantly bash Murphy…

Fact is: the mets have been doing this to a variety of players..

Murph – 3B, 2B, 1B, LF
Valdespin – LF, CF, RF, SS, 2B
Duda – 1B, RF, LF

Remember when everyone made it a big deal that Reyes was going to have to learn 2B in 2003

well we’ve been doing that over…and over…and over…and over…

constantly putting kids in a position to fail and get booed out of town…

I think a stud SS moves Tejada over to 2B and Murph over to 3B…positions where their lack of range is masked

if he can get movement on that FB, he would be a top closer in the league.

thats the thing with Bobby…he is either gonna be a top-notch closer..or a bum…there is no inbetween with him…and for the meager price we are paying him, it is well worth a chance

He has to show he is healthy so it won’t happen before Spring Training but is still possible to do,

I certainly do believe in re-building when the situation calls for it. At this point, I believe it is in the best interests of the Mets to do so because the moves of the past two years has given us no choice. Two years ago before Sandy came on board and Beltran and Reyes were coming off of injuries I felt we were just two or three role players (not big name, just good ones) away. But instead of adding, we subtracted.

And yes, a team can focus on both the farm system and the major league club at the same time. Atlanta and St. Louis are two prime examples of that having remained competitive while slowly replacing older stars from within and making key signings over a period of two decades. And with the advantage of the resources the Mets have playing in the New York market they can financially pursue that dual focus quite more easily compared to other clubs.

I also cannot say that the Mets put less emphasis into building from within and focused on more on a year to year basis when the finances were there. Look at the many players the farm system has produced so far: Davis, Neise, Gee, Parnel, Duda, Murphy, Tejada, Kirk, and Harvey along with potentially good ones in Mejia, Familia, etc. 2011 and 2012 could have been much different and we still would have had our future ahead with us.

If the Mets were an aging club ready to collapse – let us say like the Yankees are now (with too many holes to fix just due to age alone, that being third base, short stop, left field, and a rotation that includes Petite, Kuroda and Garcia, plus a first baseman who has gone down hill three straight seasons, a catcher who can hit just .211, and part time players that includes a 35 year Jones and 38 year old Suziki) then it would seem time for a changing of the guard and one or two years wandering in the desert as the kids grew and matured. But the Mets problems after the 2010 season were nowhere the ones being faced by the New York Yankees today. The only difference is that the Yankees will go out and buy some replacements and go year to year and I think that is going to hurt them now more than help them.

And imagine what the state of the team would be today had that not been so…

Though maybe not a post-season participant, we could have been a legit contender and though many would obviously second-guessing moves made by our general manager, nobody would be second guessing the motives behind those decisions. Don’t know if Omar would have still been our general manager but I am confident Sandy Alderson would have definately still been working with the commissioner.

I don’t know if the Wilpons realize how much long-term damage they caused themselves with the mistrust of the fans and the resentment over the arrogance with Sandy’s double-talk which is an insult to many a one’s intelligence. As mentioned before, when Billy Beane was asked if he considered signing arbitration eligible Gio to a long-term contract he was honest in saying:

“We had had some conversations last year, but not right now I don’t think, because of some other things more immediate, more pressing.”

After the trade, though he did talk in terms of of re-building, he also admitted:

“The fact of the matter is, for us to compete, we’re going to have to have a new stadium, and I don’t think there was a move we could have made that would put us in a position to compete with a club like the Angels or Texas given what they have and where they’re headed and some of those signings.

“You’re talking about two clubs in the division that are probably in the $150- to $170-million range, and we’re not a business that can put that payroll on the field.”

When he came on board, Sandy told us that 2011 would be a transition year due to certain contract commitments we would not have in 2012 and a few months later upon the beginning of the exhibition season – when news about the Mets needing that $25 million loan just to meet operating expenses became public – Sandy still said the Wilpon’s financial situation due to the Madoff situation had no affect on his operations.

Had he perhaps been more open as he is now, saying the Mets don’t have the money to compete (like Beane did) would have stilled the anger many of us have toward both he and the organization. If one chooses to cover-up for the owners, then he is just as guilty because of complicity.

I have which I believe is a legitimate question. Do you believe in rebuilding at all in the NY market. Omar Minya said NO. Look at the bad contracts. Yes he did good to with salvaging Dickey from the scrap heap. As you see in my posts I am of the philosophy of a strong farm and sustained competitve teams which the Mets franchise never had such as a ten year run of being competitive. FA cost valuable draft picks. Yes SA screwed up big time by not signing Reyes or trading him before the 2011 season begun. One more question please explain how to have a strong farm without rebuilding and just spending on FA. I know you say we got rid of three all stars. But how long could they carry us. The Wheeler deal wass the way to go. In the short rebuilding SUCKS big time but we need an adult in the room and delay gratification. Please do not talke that remark personally as the “we” means Mets fans in general.

Have to disagree with you that Santana’s (along with the totlal of others) “salary became an anchor that dragged down the franchise”. Even $135 million, though perhaps not well invested, does not put a drain on a big market’s financial resources and if the team is successful yields a lot more in return. Not with SNY and merchandising brought into the picture.

The “anchor that dragged down the franchise” was dropped by Madoff with help from the Wilpons who were too ambitious in securing loans to buy out the Doubledays, finance a portion of the new stadium and create SNY all at once. Santana and Bay would only be considered as write-offs in the overall financial scheme.

Fred and Jeff also didn’t help their cause by assuming they could charge whatever outrageous ticket prices they want and the fans would still come. Even with the Mets doing well the first half of the past two seasons they did not draw well for even with the price drops, the added processing fees and cost of concessions made going to games either less affordable or just deemed by others as being too much to pay for simply going to a baseball game.

I am sure that technically the Mets lost money these past few seasons just as I am equally sure that the Mets technically ALSO made money these past few seasons as well. All parent companies are able to juggle their books legally to create the illusion of losses for a few of it’s components for business and tax advantages. There is the selling of television rights which the Mets make and the dividends (even if due to re-financing) which SNY then creates which both go to the same exact source – Sterling Equities.

But Sterling Equties also invested that half-billion dollars with Madoff and ran off annual returns of approximately 16 percent on that investment which suddenly went up in smoke. So it is due to the Ponzi Scheme wiping out both the initial investment and the annual returns, the decreased revenue due to fans getting turned off and the loans that the Wilpons thought they would be able pay off by is why the revenue still beng earned has to be concentrated on paying off debt rather than being re-invested. And, there is still the question of Sterling Equties still making a bit of cash for it’s ownership in any event.

I agree with your assessment of his hitting. He is clutch. I am always amazed at all the “trade Murphy for anything; he sucks” crowd. Murphy is a proven .300 hitter. I dont know if people understand how rare that is. Sure the guy doesnt hit a ton of homeruns. But if I am managing and can write in .300 with 40 doubles to start the year, I will take a team full of him.

Hell the Yankees might still be playing if they had a guy like Murphy on their team who could hit with RISP unlike Cano (and the rest of the bombers).

my dude was practically playing in shallow RF to compensate for his lack of range…sorry…but we could use a stud SS, which moves Tejada to 2B and puts Murphy in the “who can replace David Wright at 3B” pool of candidates….

no team wins w/o strong up the middle D….no way u have Murph at 2B and still have strong up the middle D….

i like Murph’s grit, his fire, he is one of the most clutch bats on this team, even more clutch than David Wright

part of that is the fact that he doesnt have the weight of the franchise on his shoulders…

David has Delta commercials, and 100 other sponsors looking at him….when a pitcher is in a tight spot and needs to get David out….its almost a sure thing…

Murph on the other hand….has ice in his veins.

With a runner on 3rd and less than 2 outs…he is batting .321
With a runner on 3rd and 2 outs…he is batting .429
With 2 outs and RISP, he hits .343

he actually gets BETTER when there is more pressure

David Wright wont be traded before season ticket packages go on sale….

the same way the mets started offering season ticket packages early last year before the reyes fiasco…

the mets are trying to rope in as many suckers as possible for 2013 before they push the button on David Wright

this probably means not getting the best possible package…

David Wright will be a 1 year rental for any team that gets him…

and depending on if the mets pay salary…the team that gets him could get him for FREE ( should they part with a BOATLOAD of prospects )

If the mets are TRULY rebuilding…they pay David’s 16 mil salary and demand 2 more top 10 prospects to the 2-3 they were already getting

at the end of the day, I want to see the mets get a Texiera like return for David Wright…not a Billy Wagner type return…not even a Carlos Beltran type return…

then we turn our attention to Dickey….

If Dickey wants to resign with us…then cool…we keep him…if he doesnt…then bon voyage…

get another 2-3 top prospects for him…

at the end of the day, I want to see the Mets have 5 of the top prospects in baseball out of these 2 deals…if it means having to give up a Kirk and/or Havens in the deal…then so be it…