28
2012
Mets Bullpen Continues To Keep Mets Fans On The Edge Of Their Seats
An article by 
The thought crossed everyone’s mind yesterday afternoon – I can’t believe the bullpen is going to blow this three run lead for Dickey. They flashed to Dickey very briefly, as he sat in the dugout during the ninth inning of yesterday’s game, with his twentieth victory hanging in the balance, and he looked about as cool as a cucumber. Meanwhile, Mets fans across the land slumped back in their chair, as it seemed like the inevitable was going to happen. “Here we go again” is the thought that popped into everyone’s head after Rauch gave up that two run jack in the ninth. The bullpen was about to blow another win for the Mets, and this one was going to sting.
Maybe Warthen is coaching the bullpen to allow other teams back into the game, in order to provide added excitement for fans? I don’t think there is any other explanation. How can they be so bad? It seems like what we saw in yesterday’s game has happened all too often this year. Luckily, Bobby Parnell was able to clean up the mess, and close the door on the Pirates. How many times has that happened this year? But it couldn’t have happened in a more important game.
Dickey got to the twenty win plateau which has eluded Mets pitchers since 1990. Another magnificent moment for Mets fans in a season that has been packed with very forgettable moments. I bet Dickey wishes he opted to stay in that game, after Collins came out to check on him in the eighth, as that ninth inning probably caused a few new gray hairs to appear in his beard this morning.
The bullpen flirted with disaster yesterday, but managed to hang on. Nobody will remember that the bullpen almost blew that game when we look back on that crowning achievement for Dickey. But if that wasn’t a clear signal to the Mets front office, that a major overhaul to the bullpen should be coming, then I don’t know what is.
About the Author: Mitch Petanick
Mitch is currently an Editor and Minor League Analyst for Mets Merized Online. His baseball experience includes being a former All-Conference collegiate baseball player who had numerous professional tryouts, and he is currently a hitting instructor. He has been involved with the game of baseball for over 30 years now as a player, coach, and consultant. Mitch is also a former Featured Columnist on Bleacher Report. You can follow him on Twitter @FirstPitchMitch.
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While I agree that the bullpen needs an overhaul, I’m not sure these guys can make it happen. This would be the third consecutive BP Overhaul in a row and each successive time it has only gotten worse not better!
Third consecutive overhaul? How about 6th consecutive overhaul going back to 2007.
Getting a closer does not constitute an overhaul.
2012 4.71 ERA dead last
2011 4.33 ERA 28th
2010 3.59 ERA 9th
2009 3.89 ERA 12th
2008 4.27 ERA 23rd
2007 4.03 ERA 14th
2006 3.28 ERA 2nd
And the issues in 2007 and 2008 was mostly due to injuries not bad acquisition.
The worst BP under Omar is still better than the best one these guys have built!
Why the need to defend Omar? Did I say SA’s bullpens were good?
Yes, the acquisitions of Aaron Sele, Scott Schoeinweiss, Willie Collazo and Mota were wonderful, I must have forgotten. Not to mention Jorge Sosa, Matt Wise, Luis Ayala, Carlos Muniz,
and we have continue by acquiring boyer, thayer, carrasco, ramirez, frank francisco, bucholtz, boof bonser, rauch right??? But of course, those foremention have been the past 2 years and we all know better than to criticize sandy’s moves. when they’re great he’s a genius, when they’re bad BLAME THE WILPONS
AGAIN, did I say SA’s bullpen acquisitions were good? Making things up again, some would call that baiting.
How am i baiting? thing is you were quick to remember the guys Omar brought up but refused to mention the garbage SA has brought in… No baiiting on my end, that’s your job!
Try to follow along, work on your reading comprehension. Perhaps read the entire thread from the beginning again before making comments that make no sense……..
Lousy bullpens for many years now, but lets argue about which bullpen was worse by GM. Don’t bother with yet another year without post season play, it’s all about SA having a worse bullpen then Omar.
Lets Go Mets…………
I made it about SA? Are you kidding?
Amazing the crap you make up.
Notice Kay how the blown saves were left out. ERA won’t tell you how many games the pen blew. Lots!
Only 16 blown saves in 2010 with 36 Saves gotten!
So much for the SAVES saving you!
What about the 12 walkoff losses on the road? 6 of them walkoff HR’s. 5 of those walkoff losses Pedro Feliciano was on the mound. 12 walkoff losses doubled the nesxt worse team. Solid pen hah? LMAO!!!!
Blown saves:
2012 18 Blown Saves (Tied for 15th) Only 52 chances to Save the game though, 65% rate
2011 24 Blown Saves (24th)
2010 17 Blown Saves (Tied for 10th)
2009 21 Blown Saves (Tied for 14th)
2008 29 Blown Saves (28th) 16 Blown Saves AFTER Billy Wagner went down with an Injury.
2007 17 Blown Saves (10th)
Alex, would be a lot more blown saves if not for all the lucky 2-out runs. Their ERA and inherited runs scored blow away past bullpens by a ton. For example Rauch didn’t get a blown save yesterday, they need a stat for blown jobs. Lets call them BJ’s. The Mets bullpen have had plenty of those this season. Those 2-out runs prevented a dozen more blown saves at least. Take a closer look at the box scores for the all Mets league leading one-run victories and see how many were by the skin of their teeth and hanging on for dear life in the ninth. Looking at blown saves only tells a part of the story, in fact the stat sucks and has no value.
“Need a stat for blown jobs” LMFAO!!! Good one Maniac!
I think we all know these bullpen sucks, but i think it magnifies even more that they suck because all the sandy apologists were on full on “he revamped the bullpen” mode when he acquire these bums… fast forward to today, i along with a lot of other people are still waiting for an article APOLOGIZING for being wrong as hell… Again.. First Eamus, then the Genius , sandy did the right thing at staying put, then the He had a good day articles we have been put trough is a reason why the more he fail the more we are being proven right about the guy
They had 10 blown saves after Wagner went down not 16 and Wagner had 7 blowns saves of his own in 2008 out of 34 chances. Still had a 4 game lead in the loss column with 9 games left and choked. 7 game lead with 17 to play the year before and choked by getting their asses handed to them by the Marlins and Nationals.
Right fter our Closer went down to INJURY they had blown saves!
Whats the excuse this year?
FF went down in the last two weeks? You know when they actually GOT some saves?
I think by overhaul he probably means percentage of new personnel. For example 5 of 7 new faces in the bullpen as opposed to 2 of 7 from one Opening Day to the next.
Lmao, well mitch.. it’s good to predict things back in december, however, if you’re wrong admit you’re wrong. when right, praises should be thrown your way too.. back in december when those bums were acquired and the price we paid for them, most of us express our distaste for the move. of course, we were called haters, etc.. Most of us were not hating, just saying how we overpaid for guys who failed in toronto miserably. a lot of people like the ramirez trade, i didn’t think of it because, while pagan had a bad year, he had the chance to bounce back and somehow, ramirez was not as good as advertise based on having 3 teams in basically 4 year span. not impressed. fast forward to now, APOLOGY ACCEPTED.. it was obvious that sandy failed to find valueable bullpen players for the second straight year, and now he’s gonna have to try AGAIN… which, will prompt the few legion of followers to comment and even make articles about him having a good day ..
You know what the sad part is? That the same butchers are going to be in charge of fixing this bullpen again.
Has there ever been a worse bullpen than this? We could be looking at something historical.
2008′s was pretty bad.. but that one was more in place due to wagner’s getting hurt.. But it was baaad… This one, few.. is just no excuse~
As bad as 2008 was it’s still better than the best one Sandy has built!
WHO cares, a failure is still a failure is a failure. Just as long as it was better than Sandy’s? Is that another joke?
The difference is that Omar had good pen that got lost to injury!
Sandy didn’t really lose anyone to injury and they performed far worse!
As bad as you think that pen was Sandy made it even worse!
Omar had a good pen? My god, collecting enough jokes to take this show on the road.
To blame it on injuries is just plain turning a blind eye to reality……..wow.
Kay, let me help you out here. You might want to look at the results from this post they had here before speaking more on this matter.
http://metsmerizedonline.com/2012/09/revamping-the-bullpen-has-been-a-futile-endeavor-for-this-front-office.html
Always glad to help.
Have a “good day”.
Are you also kidding Maniac? Seriously what are you talking about?
What is SO hard to understand with you people. The NY Mets bullpen has been bad for YEARS, but you’d rather defend OMAR just to slam SA when the end result is still the same, failure? It’s really becoming a sickness with some of you.
Yep because a Top 10 Bullpen is just the worst thing you could possibly have isn’t it?
What was our Bullpen ranked in 2010 Kay?
I gave you the answer above!
I know you ladies hate to listen when us guys make a point and that works well provided your married to the guy in question but it isn’t going to work here!
Why do you feel the need to bring gender into a conversation?
Why do you constantly ignore what we are saying as if you are our girlfriend and can get away with it?
You say our BP has been horrible for years….
Well I showed you where our BP ranked in the MLB and in only ONE year 2008 was it ranked in the bottom half under Omar and all the other years we were top half of the league including two top 10 rankings…..
Yet you ignore that and keep on with the what are we talking about crap!
THATS what we are talking about!
Going to listen to us and actually debate or just keep insisting your right even though we have proved your point to be DEAD WRONG!
Ranked what in ERA? Tell us about the blown saves How about the 2010 Bullpen you’re so fond of that had 12 walkoff losses on the road, 6 of them by walkoff HR’s. 5 of those walkoff losses were with pedro Feliciano on the mound. 2007,2008 bullpens were the main culprits of the choke jobs. 2009 bullpen blew 25 saves. The bullpen has been the teams weakest link since Duaner Sanchez got hurt going out for a late night snack.
Kay, I didnt write the post. If you dont believe the numbers there’s not much more we can say to convince you that you are barking up the wrong tree regarding this bullpen debate.
Metsie provided you with the facts, the rankings, and all the evidence you need to make a rational conclusion.
Is Gary Cohen wrong? Is Ron Darling wrong too? Did you hear what Cohen said when Rauch gave up that homerun yesterday? Are you that blind and deaf that every bone in your body just wants to defend the undefensable?
To what extents are you willing to defend this awful bullpen of the last two seasons, quite possibly the worst in franchise history?
Fonzie, you are not saying this bullpen is better than 2010 are you? Was surprised at that comment you left. Is that what you think? They were all bad, but which was the worst?
Maniac, No matter what type of proof you provide, You’re wrong and they’re right.. Leave it alone
I cannot believe I am wasting more time doing this……………but in what post on this thread have I defended the bullpen of the last two years?
Calling me deaf, blind or whatever regarding something I NEVER said is just the ultimate in stubbornness.
You are all now taking the time to write things I never ever said, and fighting me on what I didn’t say.
You can’t make this up…………
Kay September 28, 2012 at 11:09 am .
Third consecutive overhaul? How about 6th consecutive overhaul going back to 2007.
Kay September 28, 2012 at 12:00 pm .
Why the need to defend Omar? Did I say SA’s bullpens were good?
Yes, the acquisitions of Aaron Sele, Scott Schoeinweiss, Willie Collazo and Mota were wonderful, I must have forgotten. Not to mention Jorge Sosa, Matt Wise, Luis Ayala, Carlos Muniz,
as soon as metsie said something you attacked omar’s signees to make SA looked good… You basically started this whole discussion… Not surprised by it to be honest, it’s what you’re good at..
No Maniac, I’m not saying that in any way. But for some people here to act like the bullpen hasn’t been a sore spot for this club for 6 years is a crock of shit. Sure 2010 was better but that’s like saying the Cubs are better than the Astros. People have short memories. Those pens from 2007 on blew a ton of games every year. The fast that the last 2 years have been worse doesn’t make those years good.
By pointing out that the bullpen has been the teams nemesis, I am “attacking” Omar’s signings? You say attack, I say pointing out the obvious. Those names I mentioned were horrible, but sorry if you are so sensitive you think I am “attacking”.
No matter how you twist it, I never defended the bullpen of the last 2 years, yet you and the “core” are comfortable with defending a bullpen simply because it was Omar’s and not Aldersons no matter how horrific it was.
Now that is genius.
BLAH BLAH BLAH to the Sandy Twins…
Yes you tried to twist the conversation over how bad the pen has been as opposed to what the subject actually was…
HOW IT GOT WORSE THAN EVEN YOU THOUGHT IT WAS BEFORE!
“Omar had a good pen?”
Yep 2nd best in the league in 2006 and top 10 in 2010!
Guess you missed it maybe there is a delorean around you can go back and revisit it!
Maybe Sandy should ask someone for Steve Phillips’ number because he seemed to do pretty well constructing bullpens. Probably one of the best Mets GMs in recent times to do so.
And we can we PLEASE stop with the Omar and Sandy comparisons? It’s not even close, Sandy has a lot of work to do to ever have the kind of success Omar Minaya had here, in fact it probably will never happen.
So let’s please stop the Sandy vs. Omar talk. Omar clearly was the better of the two, the results prove it, and there’s just simply no comparson.
Well, if Sandy had 150+ million to spend every year for a half decade, I wonder if he could do better than one playoff appearance and series win?
I wonder if he would give out contracts like Omar did which will literally eat up over HALF of the 2013 payroll when we pay Bay and Johan?
Sandy has indeed done a terrible job with the bullpen and the Pagan trade was a disaster, but let’s remember two important things:
1–Sandy has no money due to Wilpon issues AND the insane contracts Omar left the team burdened with.
2–Sandy has very little to trade since Omar left behind such a mostly awful minor league system. Yes, Niese and Harvey appear to be a great legacy—but in 6 years he should have done a lot more.
Nope because the issue isn’t how much he has to spend it is his willingness to spend at all!
He has never been a spender anywhere he has been and every team he is associated with has cut spending regardless of the baseball state of the team when they got there!
and notice how many names this guy left out of Omar’s minor leagues. He only mentions Niese & Harvey.
Imagine that – when talking about Omar’s minors he actually has the nerve to list only those 2 names. Not to mention Sandy’s LACK of creativity, LACK of vision, LACK of effort, and LACK of success when it comes to making trades.
Heck, Steve Phillip turned the Mets into contenders literally by trading them into contention his ability to make smart trades was that good. You know you NEVER here Phillips vs. Alderson arguments and you know why. There is even more of a disparity there. Phillps needed no money to build a contender at the beginning.
Guess money is the built-in excuse for the Sandy Lovers. Remember when sabermetrics and finding undervalued players using smart metrics and little money was supposed to be his strength. Remember that? Since that’s failed miserably (except for a few bench guys) now it’s money.
He just stinks, his legacy will stink and he will never be able to compare to Omar and Steve. Case closed.
Yes Bay and thats because the only way they can get what they REALLY want (MONEYBALL) is to say the Minors are Bare, the All Stars are not good enough to win, Money isn’t available and all we can do is make the team as bad as possible and hope some Kid manages to come aroud to change it all.
It used to be Harvey and Wheeler….
Note how they are all backtracking from thier impact as being the guys who were supposed to be worth waiting for to see the winning…
One is here and one is about to be and yet neither the guys who touted them or Sandy Alderson feel the team is ready to win with either of them!
So they will sacrifice Wright, Dickey, Davis, and Murphy for more maybes we can wait for….
Wait Wait Wait Pray Pray Pray when Sandy gets fired they will all claim they never supported him and hope no one looks back in the archives to expose it!
and Metsie what is even more telling is that you know how these saber guys here make fun of “seat of the pants”, emotion, clutch, grit. All of the stuff that if a talented player or coach has makes them better.
They refer to these intangibles as ghost, goblins, etc.
Well that’s the VERY PRINCIPLE they are basing their arguments on when it comes to Sandy! Things are gonna get better, we are on the right road, etc.
Where’s the evidence? Or are we just supposed to blindly believe things are gonna get better when the evidence we see on a daily basis is the EXACT OPPOSITE!
LOL Bay but they do love Seat of the Pant GMing don’t they?
He’s ready, no he’s not!
He’s a Starter, No Reliever , No a Starter again!
You know what we really are waiting for?
Sandy to make up his mind and stick to it!
If we were going to rebuild we should have had that fire sale in 2011 then we would be one year closer to the end.
If we were going to find guys to build around well you build around pitching by keeping the best regular fielders, we haven’t!
I think we have one more year of this crap before the media and fan pressure gets Sandy fired and we try to pick up the pieces from his roster smashing.
…and notice how many names this guy left out of Omar’s minor leagues. He only mentions Niese & Harvey.
Imagine that – when talking about Omar’s minors he actually has the nerve to list only those 2 names. Not to mention Sandy’s LACK of creativity, LACK of vision, LACK of effort, and LACK of success when it comes to making trades.
Heck, Steve Phillip turned the Mets into contenders literally by trading them into contention his ability to make smart trades was that good. You know you NEVER here Phillips vs. Alderson arguments and you know why. There is even more of a disparity there. Phillps needed no money to build a contender at the beginning.
Guess money is the built-in excuse for the Sandy Lovers. Remember when sabermetrics and finding undervalued players using smart metrics and little money was supposed to be his strength. Remember that? Since that’s failed miserably (except for a few bench guys) now it’s money.
He just stinks, his legacy will stink and he will never be able to compare to Omar and Steve. Case closed.
Guess money is the built-in excuse for the Sandy Lovers. Remember when sabermetrics and finding undervalued players using smart metrics and little money was supposed to be his strength. Remember that? Since that’s failed miserably (except for a few bench guys) now it’s money”
THIS^^
we forgot one little thing – injuries.
If not for injuries Omar would still be here watching the fruition of the farm he grew come into play along with getting players to keep the Mets in contention
If not for injuries (especially in 2009, in fact forget 2009) Omar would have not only had the team in contention but be here to see his plan come to fruition of staying in contention while developing the farm and seeing it rise to the majors like it has now. Omar ALSO would not have sat on his hands if not for major injuries to your biggest contributors. Heck, injuries even curtailed the Mets chances (Ike Davis, Chris Young) in 2011 despite Sandy Alderson’s lack of effort the previous off season.
So that’s that.
The only way Omar would have been fired if not for injuries would have been a third collapse but due to major injuries to your biggest contributors over sever seasons, and then all the other crap he would have still been here despite a couple of bad contracts because Omar was aggressive, proactive, and wanted to win.
Clearly the better man for New York than this current disgrace sitting in the GMs office.
Actually Alex not even Money should be a viable excuse for them because a year ago all we heard about was how you do not have to spend a lot to build a good team like Atlanta and StLouis did!
Guess they forgot about how they touted that reducing spending didn’t mean worse baseball in fact it would lead to better baseball!
He spent plenty with the A’s until ownership changed.
Hey, I agree—he has done a terrible job with the moves he has made, but clearly the Wilpons are not allowing him to spend. How can this not be clear to all?
Minaya spent insanely and had very middling results—we had one postseason appearance, two horrible chokes (which can to a big degree partly be attributed to the failure to re-sign Oliver and Bradford), and now we have four straight 4th place finishes.
This mess is mostly on the Wilpons, but clearly Omar and Sandy both have earned their part of the blame.
It’s the Wilpon-Minaya-Alderson mess, with blame in that order from most to least.
As for the kids—Niese and Harvey can be excellent, Ike and Tejada are good, solid, valuable players, but what else of serious quality is there?
Thole? Gee? Pelfrey? Parnell? Murphy? Duda? Kirk? Familia? McHugh? Den Dekker? FMart?
And Mejia may have been ruined by Omar and his terrible manager Manuel.
Let’s not forget that Omar hired Manuel, kept Bernazard around, was atrocious at PR, and even offended Delgado horribly at first.
And EVERY big acquisition Omar made–good and bad–Pedro, Beltran, Alou, El Duque, Wagner, Delgado, Johan, KRod, Bay, and the brilliant Ollie and Castillo deals—ALL happened solely due to him having the most money and years to offer—-he did not do anything anyone could not have done, and he sure didn’t get Johan due to brilliant strategy or a bevy of great prospects.
Six years, unlimited money—Omar is a good man by all accounts, but was a failure as GM.
Notice he hasn’t gotten a sniff of another GM offer in two years….hmmmm…..
Seems rational, huh… go figure.
OH please chest, Name another najor signing not named Henderson please!
JUST ONE!
He spent more on roids than players!
Spot on post Chest Rock!
Dave Parker, Dave Henderson, Harold Baines, Ruben Sierra, Tony Phillips, Don Sutton Jay Howell, Dave Stewart, Mike Moore, Denis Eckersly, Bob Welch, Storm Davis, Rick Honeycutt, Gene Nelson, Todd Burns, Willie McGee, Scott Sanderson, Willie Wilson, Ron Darling, Goose Gossage, Geronimo Berroa, Matt Stairs. Among others!
Yep, just as I thought. No response!
He obviously is joking. . calm down for a bit…
Fonzie, the reply button doesn’t work anymore for me. But yes I agree on that, it’s been a sore pot for years, only now it’s reached epidemic proportions, lol.
Chest Rockwell go home to Metblog. I can hear Cerrone calling you.
You have to hit the reply button to the first post that was replied to and then it goes through. Yeah that was my point. The pen the last 2 years were definitely worse but too act like they were good before that is a joke. Like I said that’s the same as saying the Cubs are better than the Astros.
I’m not giving away my age, lol, but as long as I can remember our bullpen has always kept me at the edge of my seat from Benitez, to Franco and now Francisco and everybody in between. Closing out games has never been easy for us.
This string is one of the more petty ones. The article was good.
I loved the TV shot of Rauch with his eyes bugging out. It is heart warming to see the tender vulnerable side of such a menacing looking man. Such introspection I have not seen since Frankinstein turned on his creator. Perhaps a lunch with the Wilpons is in Rauch’s future.
I hope Sandy does not seek Bull pen help. I like what we have in our system. Save some money and let our kids pitch. I would let Rauch and Ramirez walk. I hope they try to resign Young. I would like to see a change in philosophy. Let people pitch for three inning saves. Way too many pitching changes. It hasn’t worked. Lets go old school.