27
2012
Dickey Says He Has More Leverage, Calls Re-Signing Wright A Package Deal, Wants Commensurate Value
An article by 
I hate being right all the time…
In a must-read article by Andy McCullough of The Star-Ledger, R.A. Dickey spoke out on his current contract and his upcoming contract status.
Dickey made clear he wants “compensation commensurate with his production” these past three seasons. He also feels that he and third baseman David Wright are something of a “package deal.”
He struggles to envision himself inking a multi-year extension if the club doesn’t make “an aggressive attempt” to re-sign Wright.
“If I don’t see them pursuing David hard,” Dickey said, “I think it would be a message to everybody that they’re content to spend the next five or six years rebuilding this organization. Rather than trying to be competitive, and trying to rebuild it at the same time.”
McCullough said the Mets were going to sit with Dickey and try to work out an extension through 2014 before the season began, but decided against it and wanted to see how this season went. Big mistake and again the Mets get burned and paid the price for waiting. It’s becoming a habit with this group.
Interestingly enough, McCullough speculates that Dickey’s average salary for a pitcher of his caliber to be at $15.5 million. That’s just a half million more than what I’ve been speculating. Last week, in a post I wrote about this I saw some readers predicting extensions in the range of three years and $25 million for Dickey and I had to contain myself to keep from laughing. Then you have those who say Dickey is like Wright, they don’t care about things like money. Ummm… Yeah…. Okay…
Dickey turns 38 next month, but opposing executives believe his knuckleball could sustain him for years to come and I certainly agree. In knuckleballer years, Dickey is probably just 29.
So to summarize, now both Wright AND Dickey want to know what the plan is, and now it seems that at least one of them won’t sign unless the other does because he considers themselves a “package deal”. Oh yeah… And they both want and expect market value. Hmmm… Where did we hear that before?
It’s going to be a drama-filled offseason and it all starts on October 4th. Buckle yourselves in.
About the Author: Joe DeCaro
I'm a lifelong Mets fan who loves writing and talking about the Amazins' 24/7. From the Miracle in 1969 to the magic of 1986, and even the near misses in '73 and '00, I've experienced it all - the highs and the lows. I started Mets Merized Online in 2005 to feed my addiction. Follow me on Twitter @metsmerized.
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“He turns 38 next month, but opposing executives believe his knuckleball could sustain him for years to come and I certainly agree. In knuckleballer years, Dickey is probably just 29″
9 year difference because he throws a knuckler? I can understand 33-34 years old, but not 29.
Anyways, Dickey is right in wanting to maximize his value, this is his last big contract.
Of course, there is no way we can afford to pay him, so they should at least aggressively shop him around.
It could be 33-34, I was just making a point that his age of 38 shouldn’t scare people off and just threw a number out there for effect.
I have no doubt they will use the same playbook they did for Jose Reyes. Lots of sweet talk and saying the things fans want to hear and then the bubble will burst, they’ll say they tried, people will believe their story, and when Daniel Murphy gets a game winning RBI sometime in April at the team’s third baseman, the 7 Line will make t-shirts that say David Who?
I have no doubt they will use the same playbook they did for Jose Reyes. Lots of sweet talk and saying the things fans want to hear and then the bubble will burst, they’ll say they tried, people will believe their story”
Well, in all fairness, David too has been saying the right things, kinda like jose did, yet he left and he was consider the traitor etc.. it’s negotiations.. Trade the guy imo and keep rebuilding…
Almost the same things, Reyes never mentioned that he want to play for a winner like Wright always does. With Reyes it was a bout the money mostly.
Lmao, play for a winner???? So you mean to tell me, that if a team offers him $150 million and the yankees offer him $50 million, you think he’d go and play for the yankees???? You guys are a bit comical from time to time…
I dont believe we’ve ever met. Who is you guys? What does that mean? What I said was that Reyes never said that he wanted to play for a winner and Wright frequently does. What dont you believe about that? No need to make it more than it is. What they ultimately decide is up to the player, but for now I’m merely mentioning that the word “winner” was not in Reyes’ vocabulary when he was discussing his future contract, and that is a fact. The only time Reyes mentioned winning was when he told reporters that he took himself out of a game to win the batting title.
It’s a mythical clash of do-gooders vs the not-so-do-gooders. You didn’t know we had super hero groups on this community of mostly adult Mets fans?
Honestly, I’m a big fan of the site, but some of the people who comment here are legendary for their immaturity, so I tend not to partake and rarely do.
Devin, I am sure that Joe hates you feel that way and your comments are always welcome.
well, Devin is far from the only one that feels that way.
And Reyes was on the record clearly saying that he was really anxious to be able to test the FA waters, which is about money, but every player needs to do what is best for them.
Ditto!
Devin, i am sorry you feel that way,.. this site is great and to be honest, post as much as you can.. don’t be afraid. it’s just pure debate and internet conversations, hell, if people who own mets blogs are here 24/7 commenting ALL DAY then so can you…
this site feels the opposite of mets blog. great articles, not so great comments.
The articles are great and the have a great mix of views, much like the people who make comments.
The only problem with the comments is there seems to be this on going feud going on between some of the “Pro-Sandy/Pro-Sabermetrics” group and the “Anti-Sandy/Pro-Traditional” group.
While both sides can be intelligent and have great points… and I’ve had great conversations with both…there seems like there squabbling is an extension of an argument from every post from the past three years…they are already attacking each other with their first post and the poke at each other and bring the conversation down to a jr. high school level. and some of them are just trolling (very Subtlety) because they know how to get to each other.
It’s a lot like listening to people argue politics. it doesn’t matter what the facts are, both sides have already built up a wall and tend to refuse to listen to what the other side is saying…it’s comical sometimes.
I’m just glad the MMO is the opposite of Fox News or MSNBC and actually has people bring both sides of the argument and not just blindly post and skew facts to support their side of view (although some of their staff do)
US, the irony is that for the most part, the pro-sandy/sabers crowd you describe is actually neither. The anti-crowd (who clearly and self-admittedly are!) though is real.
Says one of the guys KNOWN to love Sandy alderson… Go figure..
USMF September 28, 2012 at 8:37 am
“…and the poke at each other and bring the conversation down to a jr. high school level. and some of them are just trolling (very Subtlety) because they know how to get to each other.”
Circle gets the square USMF.
Actually Joe your 29 assesment is pretty spot on.
If most players enter thier prime and peak around 29-35 before they start to decline then look at all the past knucklballers and you see many of them peak and hit thier prime sometime around 34 and don’t start declining until 40 or 41.
I would give Dickey five years 60 M instead of 3 years 48 M. He may like that deal. First two years I believe he will still be an elite starter. Third year maybe an elite starter or at worst a 4th type guy in the rotation. The fourth and fifth years of the 5 year 60 M deal he would be our closer ala Hoyt Wilhem.
I love the message he’s sending here and it’s pretty much how I have viewed this entire franchise’s situation over the last 12-24 months.
Wright is the key here. You show the fans, the players, AS WELL as potential free agent players that you take care of Wright and you are focused on winning and rebuilding combined AND you can spend $ when necessary, then they will be fine with a little patience.
You let Wright walk out the door then board up Citi Field for the next 5-10 years because the message will be clear.
Well something we agree on!
Take it to the next step and tell me how you expect Sandy to commit to the 150+Mil it will require to sign both and maintain his 90 Mil Payroll target.
simple.
Dickey and Wright are already in the 95mill budget for 2013 (their options).
in 2014, assume they get 35 combined. that is about 15mill more than they get in 2013. But, Bay drops off the books, counteracting the increase.
Santana’s 25mill dropping off can then be allocated to other players, still keeping in the same payroll range.
the total $ amount of the deal does not matter as much as the annual nut.
And what about replacing all those 1 year signings he made that expire?
How about all that Arbitration he will have to give out this year?
Murphy – He’s good for at least 2-4 Mil!
Davis – You don’t think his Arb number is going to add at least 3-4 Mil after hitting over 30 HRs?
All of that math your doing assumes Sandy is not going to have to spend another penny in the next two or three years!
And it’s not all factored in. The option on Wright and Dickey all go up as does Sanatan getting another 1.5 Mil Niese going up 2.3 Mil Francisco going up 1 Mil
Add all that up plus the FA signings that will be needed to replace those SMART CHEAP ONE YEAR signings everyone touted last offseason and your talking well over a 100M payroll to extend them! Thats before Bay and Santana expire.
Hi Metsie,
I find it interesting how one who is credited as being the grandfather of saber metrics – with the ability to analyze complicated advanced statistics and mesh them together to formulate a winning organization – cannot figure out there is no way he can keep Wright and Dickey, among others, and keep the payroll at the $100 million level.
…. unless he can somehow get them to both accept deferred payments that won’t kick in for a couple of years down the road.
Don’t be fooled Joey…
He knows full well about all of that.
What he is doing is merely saying what he thinks we want to hear until he can figure out some way to sell it to us or the Wilpons.
There is a good bet the Wilpons will insist he sign Wright and as a result agree to spend more on Payroll.
They stand to lose the most if Wright leaves.
All we are hearing now is just platitudes and non committal hedging to buy time until a solution presents itself.
Which is pretty much how the team has been run since Sandy got here…
Wait and hope something good happens or good change falls from the sky!
And if it never comes it won’t matter because they will get fired anyway and move onto the next franchise liquidation!
Hi Metsie,
Not fooled by it at all…, through his interviews and actions there is no doubt he is an astute legal and financial mind who knows exactly what has to be done and what can’t be done as well.
Again, in the long-run, he and the Wilpons know the Mets will survive and in time, the profits will start rolling in again long after he steps down as general manager. Sandy is like Bob, the accounts temps office termpoary there to do a specific job for a specific time frame.
The Wilpons are counting on a renassiance down the road to develop after this, the dark ages.
Metsie — In the New York market there won’t be a franchise liquidation, at least as the term is used in the classical sense. There may be some hard times, much of it stemming from national financial issues in the real estate market. The Wilpons will be impacted but not driven to sell. But there is light at the end of the tunnel. When the team knows it’s financially less painful to reward Wright, and to a lesser extent Dickey, than to cut them loose for dollar relief, they will move to sign them, even if it means borrowing money. Today’s rates are cheap and the Mets and the Wilpons will survive. The fans may wind up with a crappy overall product for several years but the tradeoff between payroll and revenues will find some sweet spot where the team is tolerable to most fans and the revenues are still sufficient for the Wilpons to maintain primary ownership.
Here’s the deal…after next year, Sandy and Co are all out of excuses. The only contracts on the books will be the one’s Sandy hands out or extensions he offers (but Bay won’t get extended and I don’t see giving Santana his 25mil option)
Plus Sandy will have all this young talent he’s been stock piling and a couple of drafts worth of players to build a foundation. The money problems should be in much better shape…with a year of stopping the leaking and now paying off debts…they can’t cry poverty anymore.
And say what you want about Wilpon, he’s eff’ed up, but he’s not the type who’s happy with losing…he want’s a winner and he can’t take this for much longer.
I’ve been patiently impatient with this FO…I think Sandy is an overrated GM…I think Bud placed him here to take over the Mets and get them back into spending and secretly forced all control away from Wilpon (notice how Fred hasn’t gotten involved in anything Mets other then selling off parts of the team? When have we ever seen Fred do that?) Anyone else think it’s strange that in the middle of the Wilpon’s darkest days and one of the worst periods in Mets history that a suit from the commissioner’s office all of the sudden became the Met’s GM…does anyone remember an interview process or other possible candidates in the mix?
Sandy is here to get the team back in the black. I hate the way he’s doing it, because he’s doing it the easy way by excepting losing and cutting payroll.
People ask if Sandy has failed at being a GM…Well, no…because he wasn’t forced on the team…errrrr….hired to build a winner…he’s here to get the money problems cleaned up.
The only reason why I’m being patient is because this may be a necessary evil. Sometimes a forest fire is needed to clear away all the dead brush so new life can grow. I think the day that Sandy retires is the day that we know that the team is going to be actively competing again.
Hmm, funny how you defenders of Wilpon ignore the permanent loss of fre money from his friends in the ponzii scheme business. Hate to tell you Wilpon defenders, but the free ride ride for their pocketbooks is over FOREVER….. Revisionist history won’t change facts.
Not sure if you’re calling me a Wilpon defender or not…I wasn’t really defending Wilpon…just stating the fact that Wilpon want’s to win and historicity has spent a larger percentage of team profits back into payroll.
You can say that that’s “defending” him, it’s just simple facts…don’t worry, I don’t ignore Fred’s meddling and poor choices in staff and players. (and don’t get me started on Jeffie-Boy)
As for his Ponzi money…if Fred and crew had any knowledge of what was going on he’d be in a cell right next to Bernie.
As for the money he lost…people act like Wilpon and other were getting his huge unbelievable returns on their Madoff investments. That’s not true…the returns were solid, but nothing fantastic…what was nice about them is they stayed steady even though the market fluctuated so there was no risk and dependable returns.
Anyone who knows what they are doing with the market could do better than what Madoff returned…but your returns wouldn’t be steady and you could take a big hit is something unexpected happened of the market crashed and you didn’t have enough to wait out until it recovers.
The hit Wilpon took was in all the money he thought he had in investments with Madoff suddenly disappeared. ($500mil is I remember correctly) and he’ll actually get a lot of that back once Picard starts handing out payments. Trust me on this, at the time i did a ton of research on it and didn’t rely on the trolls at the NY Post and Daily News.
No doubting what RA’s mindset is, that’s for sure.
I’m hoping they do right by him.
I want to believe in this front office, but when I read things like this my faith in them keeps diminishing. I dont know that I could handle losing Wright or Davis and still maintain any serious interest in watching this team play anymore. They’ve become a burden. I survived this in the late seventies, but I don’t think I can take another round of it.
Sickening to even imagine the possibility of losing both.
well, it really depends on who they get back/replace them with, and what it means to the immediate and mid-term future of the team (as in winning).
Every player leaves eventually.
Hi Stick,
Yes, it is all now in Sandy’s corner. I don’t see how he can do it with already setting the payroll limit for next year – even though he has yet to discuss it with his bosses!
And even if he does, it sounds like R.A. hasn’t seen enough to rebuld and be competitive at the same time for him wanting to stay. And with David, it was his acknowledgement of a “baby step”.
If Sandy does offer a genuine multi-year contract and it is refused by Wright, then it will send mixed signals to R.A. Was it the opportunity to make even more money or was it that David feels he already has enough financial security and wanted to go to a team with a better future. David’s explanation will be anticipated if he does go somewhere either as a free agent or before that in a trade after advising the Mets it’s a no-go.
In all seriousness, if the crew in charge of my team doesn’t retain these two stars, it will be that much harder to sustain focus and passion as a Mets fan for some time.
Usually, it goes without saying that you just cheer anybody in Mets “pajamas,” but when you have players that you just cannot envision wearing another set of pajamas, you realize that occasionally you really do associate your team with given men at a certain point in time.
Dickey and Wright=Franchise and Brand
LGM!!!
Just as with Wright until I see otherwise I have to believe that they (Dickey & Wright) will try to sign the best deal financially as possible. That is just the way it is with most MLB Players. Dickey is in a unique situation as he is doing what he is now at the age he is and unlike other knuckleballers he can not just throw an indefinite number of pitches cause he throws hard and gets tired and is then also at more risk of injury compared to other knuckleball pitchers. I can only speculate that with Dickey the bigger concern will be the years than monetary because of this.
Hopefully both sides can come to some agreement that is favorable to all but as with Wright if they find after talks that they can’t then they have to consider trading them.
15 Mil for a potential Cy Young award winner? Sounds like a Bargain to me!
How much do the Cy Young guys over in Philly make per year?
I think this is just more proof about what Burkhardt said about the kick in the teeth!
Sandy really hurt himself and lost the faith of his players this offseason with his lack of effort!
And now instead of him judging players on if they are worth keeping and paying the system is reversed and it’s the players who will be judging Sandy and his approach before they sign a contract.
If I’m betting I put my money on both being traded in the offseason and Sandy being fired sometime next season.
Then we can all get into going to the beach in the summer because there sure won’t be any reason to head to Citifield!
Hi Joe,
And to think I thought I scooped you when I attached a link in the prior David Wright article.
But as I mentioned in the other one, what does R.A. Dickey know – since it has been alluded to him just being another player last season who couldn’t see beyond his own natural desire to win.
I know attendance is down again this year, but I wish a more powerful boycott movement had occurred, with fans making clear that they wouldn’t attend another game (in their Mets shirts) until the Wilpons spent reasonably for a NYC team immediately or sold the team.
If that doesn’t happen this winter, with a decent outfield, catching and bullpen in training camp, Wright and Dickey will be gone—and so, too, should we……
Hi Steve,
The only effective way there can be a boycott is for each to decide as an individual not to show up. Whether that would have any effect I truly doubt because I suspect the Wilpons believe they can wait this out longer than the fans can.
Hey Joey,
You’re probably right–I see the fans cheering the inferior Wilponzian product that’s put out there. I think, however, that if Wright and Dickey go, that will be the last straw, and the fans will stay away in increasing numbers. Maybe my wishful thinking though…..
Boycotts don’t work and only hurt and do irreversible damage to the ones with no control of the situation. The players. Same thing with an educational strike, only the students suffer.
I will continue to support the Mets team regardless of owner, gm or record.
Well said and I agree.
Hi Tr,
Just because fans won’t show up does not mean they do not support the team or no longer follow it with a passion.
Fans not showing up will not hurt the team or the players either for, if anything, owners usually then take steps to bring the fans back by improving the team – to give them something to make it worth their coming back. Fans not showing up will not mean the franchise will have less revenue to invest into improving the team because it has NOT been investing money in the team for at least the past three seasons (let’s not let them off the hook for 2010 before Sandy was here – they did absolutely nothing to help the team while it was fighting for the division lead with Altanta at the all-star break).
Fans not showing up will only hurt the Wilpons one way or the other. Either they will continue to hold onto the team and have to experience more and more seasons of financial losses making it longer for them to recoup a profit or it will result in their selling of the team at a price tag way below it’s true worth because of the decreased revenue compounded against the increased debt.
As much as we all love the team and always will, it is also a question of who we are giving our money to. Had the Wilpons shown concern with the fan base by trying to make going to a game as affordable as they possibly could – no matter if that concern was for their own self interest profit wise without an ounce of altruism – instead of reaching out for maximum profit by the simple economic principle of cutting back to increase demand and prices (the same as OPEC and the oil companies do by cutting back production) there might actually be more support and understanding by the fan base in respect to the situation placed upon the Wilpons due to the Madoff scandal.
But the fact that they were trying to give the average the fan the shaft to begin with takes that possibility out of the equation for many. It’s not a simple matter of supporting the team. It’s a matter of giving money to a company that was already planning to screw it’s customers way before the Madoff scandal ever came to light.
Also go back to 2009 when we were picked by many to go onto the World Series. Already at that time many fans stopped taking their families to games because the ticket prices and added processing fees, the cost of parking and concessions were just too high. Does that mean one is guilty of not supporting the team because they would not go on spending beyond their budgets?
Well said, and I agree. I love the Mets (and have since 1962), but despise what the Wilpons have done to my team. Who would keep buying an inferior product year after year?
Hi Steve and thanks.
Since we are both original new breeders with a half century of memories, our loyalty to the orange and blue is beyond reproach!
When was the first Met game you attended? Mine was a doubleheader against the Phillies in mid April of 1962 at the Polo Grounds. Al Jackson pitched the first Met shutout 8-0 when Frank Thomas tied a major league record by getting hit twice by a pitch in the same inning. We were bombed in the second game after keeping it close the first few innings. But visually I still recall seeing Jackson as he was warming up in front of the Mets dugout before game one (at that time pitchers warmed up in front of the dugouts, remember?) as my Dad and I sat in the upper deck behind home plate and then seeing Casey come out to make a pitching change in game two as we moved to seats along first base in the upper deck for game two.
Can’t imagine why my Dad wanted to change seats for when I got to be his age I was more than content sitting where I was LOL. Maybe it was me because I was getting ancy, still not quite being an eleven year old at the time!
I don’t remember much about my first game in 1962, except that Roger Craig started. I was preoccupied with applying to colleges, and left NYC the next year to attend one. I was a fan of the Brooklyn Dodgers in 1955 and 1956 (my dad was from Brooklyn), and remember going to games at Ebbets Field. I saw Sal Maglie’s and Carl Erskine’s no-hitters, and Don Newcombe hit two HRs in game, all on a B/W TV. Newk also hit cleanup in a game I watched! My favorite players were Jackie Robinson, Carl Furillo, Roy Campanella, Gil Hodges, Duke Snider, and Big Newk.
As for the ’62 Mets, I loved watching Al Jackson pitch. He showed a lot of heart–even though he kept losing games. And I liked Frank Thomas, hitting lots of homers in the Polo Grounds, with its LF Foul Pole only 279 feet away. And two of my Dodger favorites (Hodges and Snider) still played pretty well as part-timers.
My gut tells me the Mets will no way pay Dickey 15 mil a yr. Simply no way. Mets will offer a 3 yr 30 mil and he’ll go elsewhere if he has a good yr next yr.
The knuckleball may reduce the strain on his arm, but even that’s not a given because he throws it harder than anyone else. But he still has a 37 year old body, and a long-term contract is as risky for him as for anyone else that age. And, after all, he’s only done this once. He doesn’t have the track record of some recent free agent pitchers. I can think of 2 ways a contract could work around the age issue–front-loading it so the older he gets the less risk there is, or with a base and incentives for games or innings. I think 3y/$30mil is reasonable but he’s more likely to end up in the $12mil/yr range. I hope the “brain trust” is willing to pony up that much.
Joe D……….you don’t and your not!!!
A couple or more points here fellas……Regardless of wanting to test the waters of Free Agency, or the idea of winning, players hold the upper hand these days. The only leverage that the Mets had and the determining factor for the front office was the Jose Reyes was always going to be a huge risk because of his history of leg problems.
This time around it is not the same. If they don’t make really good offers to David and Dickey then they had better trade them or be prepared to lose them!
The organization is counting on Harvey and Wheeler to be the young stud pitchers to lead them out of the wilderness and these two kids look like they will be major stars but if the front office lets Wright and Dickey walk…..they are making a huge mistake. I am sure that the front office understands the fans with this one…..let’s see if Fred and Jeff dig deeper into their pockets….Letting them go would be a disaster publicity wise in NY.
Exactly, Alan!
I THINK DICKEY IS PART RIGHT. THERE SHOULD BE A PACKAGE DEAL. ALTHOUGH, THEY ARE BOTH GREAT GUYS, THE METS NEED TO PACKAGE WRIGHT, DICKEY, AND JASON BAY , IN RETURN FOR ONE OR MORE OF THIER NEEDS. WRIGHT HAD A GOOD YEAR BUT HE IS NOT WHERE HE ONCE WAS, HE DOES NOT HAVE HIS POWER STROKE NOR HITS WELL IN THE CLUTCH. DICKEY HAS A PROBLEM, WITH HIS AGE. THE TEAM WITH MONEY PROBLEMS AS IS , SHOULD NOT SPEND THE KIND OF MONEY THAT WOULD BE REQUIRED. PLUS IT MIGHT BE THE ONLY WAY TO GET RID OF BAY, I WOULD ADD ANOTHER PLAYER IF NEEDED. THE METS NEED TO REBUILD WITH AS MUCH YOUNG TALENT AS POSSIBLE. FIRST I WOULD REPLACE COLLINS (WHO HAS DONE NO BETTER THEN THIER PREVIOUS MANAGERS ) WITH WALLY BACKMAN . MAKE THE PACKAGE TRADE. AND THEN BOYCOTT ALL THE MET GAMES NEXT SEASON, UNTIL THE WILPONS AND THIER BROTHER-IN-LAW SELL THE TEAM. THEY ARE DEFINATELY THE WORST OWNERS IN BASEBALL. AND WHY IS IT THAT A BASEBALL COMMISHNER LIKE BUD SELIG ALWAYS SEEMS TO BE PROTECTING THE MET OWNERS. HE SHOULD BE CONCERED THAT ONE IF NOT THE ONLY BIGGEST BASEBALL MARKETS, ARE THE NEW YORK FANS. THEY DESERVE QUALITY OWNERS. THE WILPONS PROVE TO BE THE WORST. I HAVE BEEN A MET FAN SINCE THEY STARTED . AND FOUND THE WILPONS AND BOTHER-IN-LAW THE WORST OWNERS EVER. PLEASE SELL, SELL, SELL.