Mets May Trade Scott Hairston

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• Mr North Jersey August 13, 2012 at 12:12 pm

  Really the title should say “Now, Ken Davidoff Wants To Trade Scott Hairston?!?!”
  • Donal August 13, 2012 at 12:59 pm

    Yup. It is obviously an opinion piece by a writer, not someone who actually works for the Mets.
• Seligman August 13, 2012 at 12:19 pm

  But what really irks me is the comment Alderson made alluding to the fact that Hairston had priced himself out of the Mets plans for 2013. You say that, and know that, and yet you STILL hung onto him because you feared the team needed him more than the return we could have gotten for him? Smart, real smart…

  That’s the story right there, not what Davidoff wrote. Your one paragraph says a thousand times more than Davidoff’s idle speculation.
• stick August 13, 2012 at 12:44 pm

  wait, what is the core philosophy now? Trade everyone that you can, or try to actually keep players to help win games?

  who cares what was reported that Sandy was asking for in return a month ago? that is just a combination of writer speculation, and smoke blowing gamesmanship. And you can’t believe anything a GM says anyway.

  If another GM wanted him, they would have made an offer. Obviously they did not get one that they thought was worth more than keeping their only RH hitting OF on the team, to actually try and score more runs and win more games.

  and no where in this does it even allude to a met source saying this is the plan, just Ken D. speculating. Somehow not putting a guy on waivers means you want to trade him?

  and still harping on that price comment? that was nothing more than a compliment in that Hairston was having a year that might convince some team to offer him a deal like a starting OF. Which yes, should price him out of their plans. Not that they could not afford to pay him 3m instead of 2m (or whatever he gets).
  • Alex68 August 13, 2012 at 12:52 pm

    Trade everyone that you can, or try to actually keep players to help win games?”

    Which one is yours then?? The CORE phylosophy is to win games, be good and competitive and compete for the ultimate price.. the WS Championship. This FO has no intention of doing any of that. shaved off payroll as much as you can, built a team of crappy players who will play at a cheap cost and get out of town…
    • Mitch Petanick August 13, 2012 at 7:27 pm

      the CORE philosophy is to win games…lol…love it
• Metsie August 13, 2012 at 12:56 pm

  They should trade Hairston and Young too!
  And if they don’t then they should consider extending them right now so that they will be part of the plan for the next two years or so.

  This is a classic example of Sandy not being able to make a decision.
  He wants Hairston because he thinks he helps him this year but he doesn’t think he can help us next year?
  Why Not? Whats going to change from now till next August? (other than the price which is going to be the same or more in November as it is now!)

  There are only two reasons for sitting on a fence….

  1 – Because your clueless as to what to do…
  2 – To Hide the puppeteer who has his hand stuck up your butt to make you sound like your in control when your reall not!

  I know most people think it’s #2 and the Wilpons are the guys behind the fence but they have never played puppeteer before and I can’t see them changing that now.
  Certainly Jeffy isn’t controlling Sandy in this regard!
  • stick August 13, 2012 at 12:58 pm

    you don’t think the wilpons were controlling what Omar did to a large extent?
    • Metsie August 13, 2012 at 1:18 pm

      Nope! They let him sign Jason Bay didn’t they?
      They let him spend money pretty much whenever he asked them to!
      They let Harazin do the same as well!
      They have pretty much stepped back once they hired a GM and did whatever he requested!

      People think the Owners meddled but the truth is they have always let the GM do what he wanted and that is what caused the problems they have had since 86!

      People wrongly believe the Wilpon’s financial situation is what determines what the team spends on salary.
      But it’s not what the Wilpons have coming in it’s what the team itself has coming in.
      We didnt lose a penny in 2009 despite having a 150 Mil payroll. So the Wilpons didn’t have to have a penny of thier own money to pay the bills that year! And they made money to boot!

      We reduced Salary by 15 Mil from 2009 to 2010 and still lost 50 Mil!
      We reduced salary again by another 16 Mil and then lost 70 Mil!

      The WIlpon’s financial situation would not be in play if attendance had not dropped like a rock and we keept fielding a team that you didn’t have to say season over in July!

      It’s not the Wilpons holding us back from spending it’s the fans all sitting around waiting for something so if you really want to know who is holding the strings but refusing to move them so sandy can go and do what needs to be done the truth is we are the ones holding him back not the Wilpons.
      That is if anything is really holding Sandy back at all and this isn’t really just his philosophy at work because he has said time and again whenever a big contract or resigning is brought up that you can’t carry more than two big contracts on an MLB team.

      He may very well believe that but the Yankees say otherwise!
      And they have been a lot more competitive for a lot longer than any team who subscribes to Sandy’s way of thinking!
      • Joey D. August 13, 2012 at 10:05 pm

        Hi Metsie,

        I do think that Omar took the hit for the Wilpons regarding how the Willie Randolph situation was handled – not that Omar wasn’t going to let him go but by allowing Willie to board that plane and tell him not to worry about a decision being made on the road when Willie asked him to be up front with him.

        Just an opinion.

        But I don’t think Sandy Alderson is anybody’s stooge. From what we see of the man, like him or not, respect him but disagree with him, etc., one thing is for sure – he is no puppet but rather a puppeteer. He does not come across as one who can be pushed around but rather one with the firm conviction that he is the boss!
        • Metsie August 13, 2012 at 10:34 pm

          A lot of that confusion came from the fact that Jeff is the conduit through which the GM used to have to go through to talk to the owners.
          I’m sure Fred wanted Willie fired for citing racist reporting from SNY.
          I’m sure Omar fought to keep Willie too but did not have a direct line to Fred and instead had to go through Jeff.
          And when he finally got through to Fred the plane had left and Fred said no get rid of him.
          No one said the Wilpons don’t make decisions on firing management. But they rarely if ever get involved in the team and roster building.
          Willie didn’t just get fired for the chokes…he got fired for what he said about SNY’s coverage as much as anything else!

          I do not believe Sandy has to go through Jeffy anymore!
          And if Warthen got fired tomorrow I doubt highly anyone would blame it on Wilpon!
          Sandy is running this team without hinderance.
          It’s not Fred who set the Budget Sandy set it based on what he wanted to do and Fred said go ahead because no boss is his right mind is going to stop a manager of his company from cutting costs if he thinks he can do it and get the job done!

          If it was just a matter of Fred set a hard budget then we would not have the quotes from Sandy last year where he said we would have a roughly 105 Mil payroll which means he still has another 10 Mil to spend that he chose NOT to spend all on his own!

          SO even if Fred set the 105 Mil mark we all heard about Sandy still is the one who decided to come UNDER that low budget!
• srt August 13, 2012 at 1:04 pm

  Still shooting the messenger.

  Hard to say one way or the other if not trading Hairston last month was any big deal. What were the offers, anyone know?
  Middle relief arms maybe? We’ve got plenty of those.
  B or C prospects who may never see the big leagues? Yup, got plenty of those too.

  Now if Hairston was included in some package deal for a piece that would actually help this club going forward and this FO said no, then I’d probably be all up in arms about it.

  ‘And Hairston is the one player whose value could be maximized at this juncture of the season.’
  I’ll believe it when I see it, if any team is willing to give up a decent piece for Hairston.
  • MTM222 August 13, 2012 at 3:38 pm

    No one even offered a top 30 prospect, nonetheless top 3.

    “Though teams including the Tigers, Giants, Braves and Rangers were all searching for a right-handed bat, Alderson indicated that no club was willing to give up even a top-30 organizational prospect for Hairston, a pending free agent who is hitting .307 with nine home runs and a .606 slugging percentage in 127 at-bats against lefties.”

    http://mlb.com/nym/news/article/2012073135895686/
    • srt August 13, 2012 at 5:17 pm

      Thanks, but that link is no good. I read the same articles I’m sure most Met fans did – no one was willing to give up a top 30 prospect for Hairston.

      Doesn’t answer my original question, which was what exactly were the offers that we turned down? Hard to make a judgment call when I don’t know if what was offered was any better than we were giving up.
      • Travers August 13, 2012 at 5:59 pm

        Excuse me but that’s a dumb question. What are the offers any GM turns down? All we know is that there were offers and he admitted as much.

        All we know now is that whatever offers he had will certainly be better than anything he gets now via a waivers deal which may only be a PTBNL that wont even be on the team next season.
• jessep August 13, 2012 at 1:18 pm

  Here is what I guess confuses me about this entire Hairston thing.

  Through the trade deadline, Hairston was the Mets best outfielder based on performance. Good or bad it was the truth.

  What I don’t understand is why the same people who say the Mets gave up on the team by NOT ADDING at the deadline, are the same people who wanted Hairston traded?

  Now don’t get me wrong – he’s very tradeable and was very tradeable in my view.

  I just don’t get what they could have gotten for him that would have done the Mets any good – and in fact the court of public opinion would have viewed it as a “white flag” move.

  I just do not understand why people who say he gave up on the team also wanted him to trade their best outfielder at the same time…. it’s almost as if anything and everything they do will be ripped apart no matter what.

  I also do not care about a player going on waivers – practically everybody goes on them at this time.
  • Metsie August 13, 2012 at 1:28 pm

    Nice try…We didn’t GIVE UP on the team no Sandy did and if that was the decision then why didn’t he take the next logical step and get something for Hairston while he could?

    You see this is why we say he has no commitment to anything he decides!

    He makes a decision and then his actions go against what he claims to have decided!

    The team was not worth making better because there was nothing to make 2013 better but then he goes and keeps a guy who is not going to have an impact on next season, cost more than he does now in the name of staying strong till the end of a season he has already given up on!

    His Actions do not match up with his words or stated decisions!

    There is no underlying LOGIC that runs through what he says and what he has done!

    He says it’s about the future yet all he signs is short term crap that won’t be here past this season.
    He says he is about hoarding and stockpiling draft picks but then doesn’t sign half of them.
    He says he wants to rebuild the Minors so he will have chips to trade and thehn refuses to trade any of them for what he needs!

    The guy is moving in every direction and then none. For every step he takes he takes an immediate step back!
    Thats not the sign of a man with a plan it’s the sign of a man who knows he needs to make a move but is too afraid to make one in any specific direction!
    • Amazin August 13, 2012 at 9:42 pm

      Nice response Metsie but its for naught as the cult of the lord and false god is excellent at revising history, twisting truth, blessing lies and supporting and worshiping total incompetence.
• chuck August 13, 2012 at 4:48 pm

  Moneyball in NYC is getting really old.
  • GameGeezer August 13, 2012 at 8:00 pm

    Better get used to it. I don’t see anything but smoke and mirrors and lip service from the Wilpons and the FO for the foreseeable future.
    My fear is the Mets becoming the St. Louis Browns to the Cardinals or the Boston Braves to the Red Sox in this city, sad sacks teams doing everything on the cheap and that just breaks my heart.
• Martin August 13, 2012 at 5:11 pm

  Joe is very critical of scenarios and decisions and conversations he knows nothing about. We don’t really know who was or could have been offered for Hairston by who and when.
  • Amazin August 13, 2012 at 9:44 pm

    But we do know sandy cult member Martin that this Winter Hairston will sign with another club and the New York Mets will get absolutely nothing for him. I guess nothing is the best! Or are you and you fellow cult members going to tell us that the lord will get a draft choice from him thinking nobody knows the new rules?
• Travers August 13, 2012 at 6:04 pm

  Alderson is kind of patsy. Why you think he gets paid more than most GMs considering his awful resume? It’s because no young GM in their right mind would take a job where you do the bidding of an owner like Wilpon. No self respecting human being would take a job like that, so Selig’s errand boy did. Alderson is worse than any GMs we’ve had because every time his lips move he is lying about something else. He’s just a lawyer who is here to do the bidding of his client Fred Wilpon. He couldnt care less what fans think, they are not paying him.
• larman August 13, 2012 at 6:54 pm

  The on;y thing wrong with the mets is their owners, why don’t people see this is beyond me, ike davis is having a bad season, that does happen to players who go into their second full year, he still has 20 hr’s does anyone else have more. Like i said, the mets need to clean up from top to bottom, Get rid of those owners they suck, they don’t care, and they want our money to make up for the stupid mistakes they made including the madoff situation too. So let’s get rid of the junk the owners and start new so that we will be contenders and finally take over the new york right’s and prove to everybody they can do it without the wilpons.
• Mitch Petanick August 13, 2012 at 7:26 pm

  I wouldn’t take anything less than the top three prospects from a team for my cleanup hitter either
  • Joey D. August 13, 2012 at 11:07 pm

    Hey Mitch,

    I was a game in 1968 when Gil Hodges had J.C. Martin batting clean-up!
• Joey D. August 13, 2012 at 10:22 pm

  Personally, I wouldn’t mind Hairston coming back too but that is, of course, the least of our problems.

  I don’t think Sandy is the problem. As you know, I sincerely believe he was hired to save a sinking ship financially and that is his main concern. I do not begrudge him of that whatsoever. He is approaching it as a businessperson. And I do not hold against him the inconsistency of his statements for those are just for public consumption.

  My problem is with those who see in Sandy a baseball person with a sound vision on how to build a team. Yes, he wants his club to win as badly as others, but that is not his call. And if it was, the records show that he was awful at doing it.

  Take in point the Oakland clubs. There is the ongoing disagreement about Bill Rigney being the chief architect of matters related to team personnel. Let’s forget about that argument. In 1991 as Rigney’s responsibilities dwindled, Sandy took over the area of baseball matters.

  Now, he was either calling the shots or hired those who agreed with his overall principles, let it be economic (i.e. money ball), saber metric or a combination of these two with traditional principles. Whatever the case, this is the record of Oakland subsequently after taking over the reigns starting 1992 and the year after he left (1998):

  1998 74-88 .457 4th last
  1997 65-97 .401 4th last
  1996 78-84 .481 3rd
  1995 67-77 .465 4th last
  1994 51-62 .447 2nd
  1993 68-94 .420 7th last
  1992 96-66 .592 1st

  With Sandy in the position – supposedly – to be on top of baseball decisions, Oakland went from first to last in one season, a drop of 28 victories. They went six straight seasons never better than six games below .500. Now part of that drop of course is due to players getting injured, getting old or just leaving. However, that raises the point about Sandy’s “vision” and “philosophy” in terms of baseball. What about his focus being on draft picks and continued concentration on the farm system so Oakland would always be able to rebuild from within?

  In short, if he was in charge of personnel matters his skills to keep Oakland from sliding so deeply failed and his teams weren’t even “competitive”. And important to note that he wasn’t stifled with severe money problem until ownership changed after the 1995 season and he was ordered to cut costs back dramatically. So, if this decline was of his own doing, then there is ample evidence that his prowess as a baseball person was not just over-rated — the media and supporters of saber metrics and money ball actually created a myth.

  And, if he wasn’t in charge of personnel matters, then his “vision” is one of running a business and not a baseball team.

  And if he was in charge of both, then again, look at Oakland’s record and his inability to keep them competitive. After all, it is his “vision” to keep the stockpiling talent in the minors. It is his “vision” that calls for the draft picks. And, it was his insight with computer analysis that at the time was supposed to have kept him ahead of other general managers.

  Again, my problem is not with Sandy Alderson. It is with those who have created a myth about him being a baseball person instead of a baseball executive handling his teams in the manner of M. Donald Grant. Don’t forget, the fiasco with the Mets didn’t start with Tom Seaver wanting to leave on June 15, 1977. Tom’s problem with the Mets began a few years before when he saw after Mrs. Payson’s passing an ownership not taking action to improve the club but trying to make profits with as little investment possible. That is not to say Grant didn’t want his team to win. That is not saying Sandy Alderson doesn’t feel the same way as well. It’s just accepting where they are coming from.

  And again, having the extensive legal and financial resume that he does, to me it doesn’t seem possible he was unaware of the extent of the Wilpon’s financial troubles and that deep cut backs had to be made. I think these were of his choosing.
  • Fonzie13 August 14, 2012 at 12:55 am

    You’re still trying to pass off that bullshit that Rigney was the architect of that Oakland team but all it is is Joey D’s continuance of bullshit. Whether you want to believe it or not it was Sandy who built that Oakland team. There is no ongiong disagreement. There are 2 misinformed posters here that have no idea what they’re talking about that’s not an ongoing disagreement.

    I’m still waiting for a shred of evidence linking Rigney to any of those moves in between the years 83-97. All you have is your daily routine of non stop bullshit. if your not brining up the Beltran trade everyday your trying to bullshit the rest of the readers into thinking a semi retired consultant who was in the broadcast booth was the one who built those A’s teams. Stop bullshitting and show something linking Rigney to those decisions. There’s thousands linking Alderson to them not one linking Rigney.

    BTW it’s statistical analysis not computer analysis. Get it right of your gonna bullshit. At least make it seem like you know wtf your talking about. Especially if your going to repeat yourself everday, know what your talking about.
    • Metsie August 14, 2012 at 1:22 am

      That stuff you called Bullshit was proven over and over again with roughly 20 seperate links…

      All you could come up with was a slideshow that said Sandy was a GM at the same time the decisions to make trades were made!

      The only one trying to pass off bullshit is you!
      • Fonzie13 August 14, 2012 at 1:30 am

        How many different topics do I have to prove you wrong with? You’ve never once proven anything except that you are a habitual liar. You didn’t come close to 20 links and the few you came up with roved my point. All you came up with is what Rigney did in 1982, one year before Alderson took over. I again proved you wrong just last week when you tried to claim he’s cut payroll everywhere he’s been.You never learn. Even SRT an Sane Met fan made a fool of you last week. You’re like MMO’s punching bag.
        • Metsie August 14, 2012 at 1:39 am

          YEah Yeah Yeah the Liar Liar pants on fire defense…

          You proved nothing and me and Joey handed your ass to you!

          Just because you refuse to admit it doesn’t mean it didn’t happen!

          YOU LOSE!
          • Fonzie13 August 14, 2012 at 1:56 am

            You and Joey proved that both of you are full of shit. I helped to speed along the process of exposing both of you. You guys must share a brain.
            • Metsie August 14, 2012 at 2:08 am

              No we proved your full of shit and will simply lie and swear to it and call that evidence!

              Insistence is no substitute for the truth!

              No one else is supporting you on this or haven’t you noticed?

              YOU LOSE!
              • Fonzie13 August 14, 2012 at 3:21 am

                Yes you will lie and swear by it my point exactly. you lie Joey swears by it.. I’ve already had much more support on this than your one person. Even those who dislike Alderson like you two don’t dispute the facts of what he did. As a matter of fact I have never seen you come out on top of any debate you get involved in no matter who it is. If you did a little research and stop making shit up you may win one eventually.
                • Metsie August 14, 2012 at 10:30 am

                  With reading skills like yours no wonder you think everyone is a liar around here!
                  YOU LOSE!
• Metsie August 13, 2012 at 10:36 pm

  I think most would be happy if we resigned Hairston as he has played his way to his eventual raise.

  The problem isn’t if WE want him or not the problem is will Sandy be willing to pay the price to keep him…
  He wasn’t ready to pay that price for Capuano!

  If they want him next year the time to extend his contract is now. Same for Young.
• jjmooney August 13, 2012 at 10:57 pm

  Winning is hard, losing is easy.

  Constantly taking the negative stance, predicting doom, claiming incompetence will generally be right more times than it is wrong. Losing is easy, so predicting a negative outcome is easy. But is adds no value. Writers write because the cant play, they cant manage. People cant get all decisions correct. If you win more than you lose, judged by quality as well as qantity, that is the measure of success.

  Is the ball club as a whole, value v spend, farm system and development program better. It would certainly appear so.

  So may I suggest that you write something righteous and positive for once. Be brave try and pick a win!
  • Amazin August 14, 2012 at 7:17 am

    Here’s something positive. Sandy Alderson is POSITIVELY the worst GM in baseball. Here’s something else positivie. Being a puppet for your cult leader is positively a pathetic waste of a human being. Being a blind follower positively leads to bad things. You and your cultists friends are positively failures in life becuase you positively refuse to use your brain to what were once some positive capabilities. Losing is easy. positively wrong, losing is hard unless you positively are not a fan of the game.predicting a negative outcome adds no value. positively wrong, predicting apositive outcomne based on the meaningless lies from a cult leader is positvely absolutely hapelsss. is the ball club as a whole better…. Poitively a meaningless claim because its based on the lies of your cult leader. Now you have some thing positive , someone else can write the righteous BS. At least your more interesting than the clown cult leader j…..p.
• Alex68 August 14, 2012 at 7:46 am

  Alli can say is, i am glad people are starting to be on board wih the CORE about how much of a loser sandy alderson is. the guy is here to cut payroll, be a small market GM in a large market city. for those who love sabermetrics and the old Oakland A’s (this A’s are anything BUT moneyball. .303 on-base % is 2nd-lowest in AL. And they’re tied for 3rd in AL in stolen bases) i have two words for you: You lose. Despite numerous attempt to try and defend sandy and the methods and way of him running the franchise it’s quite obvious this man has no idea what he’s doing and is nothing but a liar.
  Yes, we wanted hairston traded, at the deadline, when it was clear this team was going nowhere, when he first gave up on the team, not before, we wanted to keep the team intact and add help, but to him the goal is to finish at or around 500 (7 straight losing season as a GM might have something to do with that) to keep people coming to the ballpark. Well, this ain’t SD or Oakland, this is NY, and fans will not go to games to watch crap. and it’s been 2 years and counting with this man bringing nothing but garbage to NY, glad to see many people starting to see this Loser for what he is. defeding him is making a few people in here more stupid than what they already were
• Joey D. August 14, 2012 at 9:19 am

  Hey Jessep,

  Remember when you said:

  “You’re trying to paint a general picture – you’re trying to act like people think Cashman for example came off the streets and was hired. Nobody is saying that. You’re missing the point.”

  Well, don’t you think Fonzie is a “people”? He just said:

  “You’re still trying to pass off that bullshit that Rigney was the architect of that Oakland team but all it is is Joey D’s continuance of bullshit. Whether you want to believe it or not it was Sandy who built that Oakland team. There is no ongiong disagreement. There are 2 misinformed posters here that have no idea what they’re talking about that’s not an ongoing disagreement.

  I’m still waiting for a shred of evidence linking Rigney to any of those moves in between the years 83-97.”

  This is Sandy’s resume. He attended Dartmouth College on a ROTC scholarship and graduated in 1969. He then joined the United States Marine Corps and served a tour of duty in Vietnam. He graduated from Harvard Law School in 1976. After law school, he worked for Farella Braun & Martel in San Francisco, California. Sandy left private law practice in 1981 to become the Oakland A’s General Counsel. He then served as Oakland’s General Manager from 1983-97.

  From private practice in law to being Oakland’s legal Counsel through 1982. No professional baseball experience at all, but according to Fonzie he “came off the streets and was hired”.
  And Fonzie adds about my remarks about Bill Rigney building those teams and not a totally unexperienced Sandy Alderson “bullshit”. He said “I’m still waiting for a shred of evidence linking Rigney to any of those moves in between the years 83-97.”

  So which bullshit is right? Your’s when you said “you’re trying to act like people think Cashman for example came off the streets and was hired. Nobody is saying that” or 2) Fonzie’s when he says “Whether you want to believe it or not it was Sandy who built that Oakland team”?

  Because otherwise it means somebody came off the streets and was hired and built that Oakland team.
  • Fonzie13 August 14, 2012 at 12:49 pm

    You still have nothing to prove Rigney was the architect do you? Unfortunately it doesn’t exist. He also didn’t come in off the street. He was in the front office as legal counsel for 2 years first. Worry about now instead of what happened 30 years ago.
    • Metsie August 14, 2012 at 1:29 pm

      And you still have yet to prove Sandy made a single decision before 1991!

      So your as full of it and lying way more than either of us who showed proof that Eisenhardt took over the GM duties of Billy Martin, Rigney led the search for the next manager and Sandy said in 1989 everymove that was made since he got to Oakland had something to do with Rigney!

      All the evidence points in our sirection not yours.

      Show a link that says SANDY DECIDED with a post date BEFORE 1991…
      Until you do….

      YOU LOSE!
  • Fonzie13 August 15, 2012 at 5:11 am

    Joey try and once get your facts straight. You said he came off the street not me. I said he worked as legal counsel the first 2 years so please for once stop lying. Your getting just as bad as Metsie.
    • Joey D. August 15, 2012 at 11:28 am

      Fonzie,

      No, you did not say “came off the street”. And I never said you did. I quoted that phrase from Jessep.

      Or is it simply that you could not understand that in the context of the discussion at hand – that being Sandy Alderson – and when one says came off the street it refers to coming in cold and given the responsibility of making player decisions – and thus the tie-in?

      So one is not lying when responding to one who says an individual just can’t come come in off the street with no prior experience or background in the game and follows up with reference to the exact argument you make in regards to Sandy Alderson.

      So stop the implication about me being a liar.

      Or are you now trying to imply that being the team’s legal counsel for two years was experience before being handed the job? If so, this is the definition of a General counsel:

      “A general counsel is the chief lawyer of a legal department, usually in a corporation or government department. A general counsel may have associates in the office to assist him. The general counsel protects the interests of the entity by reviewing contracts and pointing out legal risks in a company’s path.”

      This has absolutely nothing at all to do with making decisions about draft picks, the minor league system, making trades, signing players, etc. It’s not even remotely related to player moves other than working out the terms of a contract with the other’s lawyer.

      If you believe this means that Sandy did not come off the streets (as Jessep put it) “cold” are you then implying that Executive Vice President and General Counsel, David Cohen, is also involved in doing the same with the Mets? That his tenure with the Mets as their General Counsel qualifies as experience in the area of player personnel he could just step right in now as well? This is Cohen’s resume:

      http://www.law.columbia.edu/magazine/153309/david-p-cohen-95
      • Fonzie13 August 15, 2012 at 6:01 pm

        “No, you did not say “came off the street”. And I never said you did. I quoted that phrase from Jessep.”

        Yes you did say I said that read below.

        “From private practice in law to being Oakland’s legal Counsel through 1982. No professional baseball experience at all, but according to Fonzie he “came off the streets and was hired”

        See you did say I said that. You are a liar. I never said that. You did.

        .”Or is it simply that you could not understand that in the context of the discussion at hand – that being Sandy Alderson – and when one says came off the street it refers to coming in cold and given the responsibility of making player decisions – and thus the tie-in?”

        “So one is not lying when responding to one who says an individual just can’t come come in off the street with no prior experience or background in the game and follows up with reference to the exact argument you make in regards to Sandy Alderson.”

        “So stop the implication about me being a liar”

        I’ll stop implying you’re a liar when you in fact stop lying. When you stop making up stories to
        prove a point I’ll simply stop calling you out for being full of shit.

        “Or are you now trying to imply that being the team’s legal counsel for two years was experience before being handed the job? If so, this is the definition of a General counsel:

        “A general counsel is the chief lawyer of a legal department, usually in a corporation or government department. A general counsel may have associates in the office to assist him. The general counsel protects the interests of the entity by reviewing contracts and pointing out legal risks in a company’s path.”

        This has absolutely nothing at all to do with making decisions about draft picks, the minor league system, making trades, signing players, etc. It’s not even remotely related to player moves other than working out the terms of a contract with the other’s lawyer”

        Did you even bother to read any of the links I showed? Or do you lack reading comprehension skills? They point out clearly what he did, who he leant on and how he learned about player evaluations etc… You have no idea what went on behind closed doors so stop making shit up to fit your agenda. How come Friedmans playing college ball counts but Sandy playing 3 years at Harvard doesn’t.

        Get off your ass and do some research instead acting like you know what went on. It’s clear you have no clue but yet you say the same old bullshit everyday looking to instigate another flame war. Same thing with Beltrans trade. Every day you bring it up. Are you not capable of discussing anything else? You are a drag to this site. All you do is repeat the same old nonsense everyday and never give any insight to anything about baseball except once in a while you’ll tell an old baseball story. Other than that you are a bore.

        “If you believe this means that Sandy did not come off the streets (as Jessep put it) “cold” are you then implying that Executive Vice President and General Counsel, David Cohen, is also involved in doing the same with the Mets? That his tenure with the Mets as their General Counsel qualifies as experience in the area of player personnel he could just step right in now as well? This is Cohen’s resume”

        Has David Cohen been elevated to GM and VP of baseball ops? Not that I know of. And who’s to say that he would not be able to do so if he was. You? So because you don’t have the intelligence to pull something like this off that means these highly educated men can’t?

        You keep saying he came off the street which is not the case. He was with the team for 2 years before being named GM.
• Donal August 15, 2012 at 11:40 am

  Huh, changed the title but still implies that this is in fact the FO’s plan rather than a proposal from a writer.
• Joey D. August 15, 2012 at 7:48 pm

  Hey guys,

  Can you believe this? Is this a voice of reason or a voice of irrationality?

  Fonzie13 August 15, 2012 at 6:01 pm
  “No, you did not say “came off the street”. And I never said you did. I quoted that phrase from Jessep.”

  Yes you did say I said that read below.

  “From private practice in law to being Oakland’s legal Counsel through 1982. No professional baseball experience at all, but according to Fonzie he “came off the streets and was hired”

  See you did say I said that. You are a liar. I never said that. You did.

  .”Or is it simply that you could not understand that in the context of the discussion at hand – that being Sandy Alderson – and when one says came off the street it refers to coming in cold and given the responsibility of making player decisions – and thus the tie-in?”

  “So one is not lying when responding to one who says an individual just can’t come come in off the street with no prior experience or background in the game and follows up with reference to the exact argument you make in regards to Sandy Alderson.”

  “So stop the implication about me being a liar”

  I’ll stop implying you’re a liar when you in fact stop lying. When you stop making up stories to
  prove a point I’ll simply stop calling you out for being full of shit.

  “Or are you now trying to imply that being the team’s legal counsel for two years was experience before being handed the job? If so, this is the definition of a General counsel:

  “A general counsel is the chief lawyer of a legal department, usually in a corporation or government department. A general counsel may have associates in the office to assist him. The general counsel protects the interests of the entity by reviewing contracts and pointing out legal risks in a company’s path.”

  This has absolutely nothing at all to do with making decisions about draft picks, the minor league system, making trades, signing players, etc. It’s not even remotely related to player moves other than working out the terms of a contract with the other’s lawyer”

  Did you even bother to read any of the links I showed? Or do you lack reading comprehension skills? They point out clearly what he did, who he leant on and how he learned about player evaluations etc… You have no idea what went on behind closed doors so stop making shit up to fit your agenda. How come Friedmans playing college ball counts but Sandy playing 3 years at Harvard doesn’t.

  Get off your ass and do some research instead acting like you know what went on. It’s clear you have no clue but yet you say the same old bullshit everyday looking to instigate another flame war. Same thing with Beltrans trade. Every day you bring it up. Are you not capable of discussing anything else? You are a drag to this site. All you do is repeat the same old nonsense everyday and never give any insight to anything about baseball except once in a while you’ll tell an old baseball story. Other than that you are a bore.

  “If you believe this means that Sandy did not come off the streets (as Jessep put it) “cold” are you then implying that Executive Vice President and General Counsel, David Cohen, is also involved in doing the same with the Mets? That his tenure with the Mets as their General Counsel qualifies as experience in the area of player personnel he could just step right in now as well? This is Cohen’s resume”

  Has David Cohen been elevated to GM and VP of baseball ops? Not that I know of. And who’s to say that he would not be able to do so if he was. You? So because you don’t have the intelligence to pull something like this off that means these highly educated men can’t?

  You keep saying he came off the street which is not the case. He was with the team for 2 years before being named GM.
  • Fonzie13 August 15, 2012 at 9:57 pm

    That is the voice of someone who doesn’t need to make things up in order to fit an agenda.