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2012
Mets Make The Right Move, Do Nothing At The Deadline
An article by 
July was a terrible month for Mets fans. After exiting the All Star break primed for a post season run, the season has spiraled out of control. Poor pitching, compounded by poorer execution at the plate and shotty defense have seen the Mets post season dreams, along with those of fans, shattered in short order. Understandably this has left the roster frustrated and the fanbase angry, but I’m happy to see that the front office didn’t stray from its plan.
If you want to say that Sandy Alderson should have made a trade to aid the bullpen in late June or early July, it’d be difficult to argue with you. The Mets have had the worst pen for the large majority of the season, so change was necessary. However, I’m yet to see anyone propose a realistic scenario where the Mets could have acquired a reliever in a not yet developed trade market. Due to the second Wild Card spot, there weren’t nearly as many sellers as in previous years. Even fewer who were prepared to throw in the towel in late June, when the Mets really needed help, will have certainly effected Alderson’s options, but again it’s hard to argue that a move wasn’t needed at that time.
Fast forward a month and although the Mets find themselves out of playoff contention, fans were still seeking change. Trade Hairston.. trade Turner.. for the love of God trade someone! Fans have correctly determined that this group of players aren’t going to reach the promised land, but fail to acknowledge change for the sake of change may not be the proper course of action either.
One trend that appears consistent amongst Mets fans is the tendency to overvalue our own players. With the exception of Wright and Dickey, and to a lesser extent Niese and Tejada, the Mets didn’t have any players with a trade value high enough to return a Major League caliber prospect. Fans must not only accept that fact, but also realize that just because the front office was contacted with regards to Scott Hairston doesn’t mean a player was offered in return who could of helped the Mets in the near future. If such a trade couldn’t yield that type of return, why bother?
Trading away bench players is not the answer. Trading away bench players who will likely find their way on to the 2013 roster for peanuts certainly isn’t. Sandy Alderson still has plenty of heavy lifting to do in terms of turning this roster over, however I still believe much of that work has to be completed in the offseason. There were no moves to be made this summer, that had the capability to reshape the franchise. If fringe players were sent packing, it would have been change for the sake of change and that’s not the way any general manager should do business.
The end of the 2012 season will mark the second on Alderson’s watch to end in disappointment. It’s a trend which can’t continue. While many fans appear fed up now, I believe it will be this upcoming offseason that defines Sandy’s legacy for better or worse. Another winter of low profile additions, culminating with the Spring Training cut of Jason Bay won’t, and shouldn’t, be enough to put this team in position to move forward next year. If that’s how the future plays out, fans will be well within their right to be upset. However as the Mets trudge into August, being upset about a dormant trade deadline is little more than wasted energy and misplaced frustration. Alderson has played the cards he’s been dealt since arriving in Queens, this time there was no move to be made whether you like it or not.
About the Author: Rob Patterson
Ultimately, I owe nearly thirty years of Mets related torture to my mother, who is the reason I became a fan. I was too young to remember the 86 run, but hope to see one I'll be able to recall much sooner than later. I enjoy writing about the team and welcome your feedback on my posts. Oh..and I am not with 28!
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When will it actually be time to improve this team?
So far we have seen two Offseasons and Two Deadlines.
Neither Offseason has produced an improvement and while everyone points to Wheeler as the messiah he has yet to pitch a game in the MLB!
SO pray tell when is the right time to start improving this team?
When it’s so bad that any move improves it because there is no place to go BUT up?
I ask this again.. What move would you like to see made? Who do you trade? For who? It’s ridiculous to demand change when their are no viable options. None of the major pieces who were traded were going to end up in NYC. Pence, Victorino and Ramirez would never be traded within the division and Greinke and Dempster didn’t want to go to NYC. The Mets don’t have the prospects to trade for a big time Major Leaguer without completely depleting the farm system.
Basically, everyone wants Alderson to make something out of nothing right now. The Mets will need to make moves via free agency, significant additions, to piece this together sooner than later. The wild card there remains the teams finances…
So you believe it was impossible to make a minor deal to improve on Ramirez even?
The problem would appear to be a lack of imagination on the part of the fans and the part of Sandy!
It would seem that you, he and his supporters can’t seem to find a deal that doesn’t start off like:
Who do we have thats worth anything? Lets trade him for an Impact Player!
And when you can’t find one resign and say there is nothing to do here we should just stand pat!
I ask again when will it be a good time to make improvements to this team?
I’m not talking Impact blockbuster trade here I’m talking improve on the guys who are not getting it done instead of sticking with the scrubs and hoping they do what you wrongly thought they were capable of and leaving everything to hope and luck!
All you guys who agree with Sandy ever do is suggest trades for our BEST players!
Try thinking about how Quanitiy can be a substitute for Quality to get something back!
The names that could be traded to improve this team but have no role with us is long, distinguiseh and posted many times by guys like VinnyB, Maniac and others including me!
But all you guys think you can trade is what is on baseball america’s list!
Which is why even when you make a trade it turns out poorly!
Pagan was a trade made on tnat premise!
Hey he is pretty good and we can get two guys for him! Great Trade!
Yeah and how has it turned out?
Any idiot can trade his good players but when you do that you usually don’t wind up imp[roving your team just play whack a Mole by substituting one weakness for another!
Thats if you actually lucky enough to get back as much as you gave!
Which sure isn’t the case in the Pagan and K-Rod trades!
For the record I didn’t like the Pagan trade, but the KRod move was about dumping payroll not getting prospects.
You can trade anyone, but if you package 2-3-4 players on the 25 man roster to make the type of move your talking about, you’ll have to fill out the roster with other lesser players an the fan base will gripe about that.
If it helps the team long term them by all means make the move, but just bc the team has plenty of expendable players doesn’t mean anyone wants them.
And the advantage to dumping payroll is?……..
Has it allowed us to pay someone else worth having?
Who was that? Rauch, Francisco…Who?
Did they pass the savings onto Met Fans?
If it didn’t allow us to keep or get someone good then what was the point?
Exactly it was a pointless move and if it had not been made we might not be 8+ games back in the division right now!
I forgot t ask…
Why does it have to be players from the 25 Man roster we trade?
Familia, Flores, Den Dekker, Mejia would not get you a thing? Are they as worthless as the others?
Wasn’t Broxton available for not much? Maybe Broxton’s not much, but…
Just a suggestion.
Like to bundle Ramirez, Valdespin, Parnell and Cedeno, what could we get?
Of that group, only Spin has a decent trade value although Bobby has a ton of potential. Ultimately, I don’t think that package would get much in return.
I also think Torres sucks, but he’s the only competent CF we have until Newie learns to hit better.
Hopefully Sandy realizes that Kirk, Valespin and Duda aren’t part of the future and finds a team that values them more than we do.
I would keep Duda since he has the best chance of success and trade the other two for young pieces that fit our needs better…
I’d actually argue that Kirk and Spin have a better likelihood of being here long term. Both need to improve their approach at the plate, but if they can they’re better than there counterparts who are currently on the roster.
How about the guys the Marlins traded in their fire sale? They were all dealt on the cheap. Would I take Hanley Ramirez over Ruben Tejada or Ronny Cedeno at SS? You bet!! Also the Phillies didn’t get much in return for Victorino and Pence. Either one of those guys would be better than our current outfielders!! Also, who exactly did the Yankees give up to get Ichiro!?
All these teams made moves to improve their rosters and didn’t have to give up a king’s ransom to do so. Sandy is the worst GM in the history of the New York Mets! He’s worse than Steve Phillips, Omar Minaya, or any other GM we’ve ever had! Get him out of here! Oh and can someone please run the Wilpons out of town with him as well?!
It’s VERY rare to see big names traded within the same division. That alone limits the chances of Ramirez, Pence, etc. coming to the Mets. In regards to Ichiro, what use do the Mets have for an aging rental player, even if he is cheap?
Granted, the Ichiro comparison probably wasn’t the best one, but your argument about not trading within the division is flawed. Think back to 2006, when the Marlins had heir last fire sale. Who did the Mets get that year? Carlos Delgado and Paul Lo Duca. Those guys helped the ’06 Mets get to within one game of World Series. Last I checked, the Marlins were in the NL East then too. Why didn’t anything like that happen this year for our beloved New York Metropolitan National League Baseball Club? Because of the incompetence of our Front Office.
The difference was when we traded for Delgado it was a guy we had wanted to sign in the first place. And we were willing to pay his Salary because he actually took less money to sign elsewhere than we offerred.
But it’s a good point you made because that is the type of player we SHOULD be trading for!
Sandy should be looking ahead to who he might want to sign in Free Agency next year and making a trade to give him first crack at signing him before the Market gets a chance to set the price.
People all mention the two months of rental but the biggest advantage to those two months is not what you get on the field but what you get in a discount for extending the player beyond the two month rental!
Sandy did none of that because he really doesn’t see ANY Free Agent he is willing to pay because he is barely willing to pay Wright when the time comes and will only do so because he knows if he doesn’t they will play to Crickets for the rest of his tenure!
Thats the reason why no one who supports Sandy can think of a trade that should be made or makes sense much past October…
Because they like him don’t think we should pay for good players just wait around until we hit the draft lottery and become instant contenders!
By the time that happens those kids they keep hoping for won’t have the players around them to make them look good and we will be forced to suffer through “In the Last 25-50 years” crap we went through this offseason!
How hypocritical can one be Robert. That’s you!!! You claim and aging player is worthless to the Mets which is true, but that makes you a hypocrit because you praise the worst and laziest GM in history for keeping three aging and therefore worthless players on the Met roster.
Javi – Good to see you comment! I respectfully disagree with you though.
“How about the guys the Marlins traded in their fire sale? They were all dealt on the cheap. Would I take Hanley Ramirez over Ruben Tejada or Ronny Cedeno at SS? You bet!!”
We differ here. I’d much rather Tejada. The Marlins dealt their former franchise player away because he’s been under performing and has been a KNOWN clubhouse problem with teammates and 2 managers in the last 2.5 years. Sorry, that doesn’t interest me for the Mets at SS. I’d much rather a kid like Tejada play SS. Hanley’s making a good chunk of salary too, which LAD had to take 100% of. Take Hanley’s attitude and under performance out of the equation – do you really think the Mets were in a position to take on a big contract like Hanley’s?
“Also the Phillies didn’t get much in return for Victorino and Pence. Either one of those guys would be better than our current outfielders!! Also, who exactly did the Yankees give up to get Ichiro!?”
- To me you’re starting to say “lets deal just to deal.” Victorino and Ichiro have expiring contracts. What good would either have done for the Mets? In Ichiro’s case he’d have to waive his no trade rights to come here. As for Victorino, what exactly could he do for 2 months at age 31 that every other OF the Mets have can’t do? He’s a .260 hitter with a low on base. Don’t we have that type of hitter already in guys like Spin, Kirk, even Duda?
I love Pence as a player. But again, he makes a lot of $ (probably over $12m next year) and do you really think this franchise was in a spot to take that kind of salary? I don’t. You say the Phils traded him for nothing, they got a big league OF and a catcher prospect along with a righty arm. What catcher prospect do the Mets have that beats Tommy Joseph?
You can’t make trades just to make trades. The truth is this entire team faltered in July. Not just the bullpen, not just a GM, everybody. The offense, the starters, the manager, the GM, the bullpen…everybody.
But the thing is, the players on the field performed to many of “our” original expectation. So what can you get at the trade deadline that fixes all of those spots? You can’t. You can get a bullpen arm sure, but if you value your youth more than 2 months of relief… then you’re not staying on track.
a very typical Jessup comment…. Writing a novella to try to claim that getting better is a bad and stupid thing to do, just like claiming that a horrid bullpen is good , and spewing out venom on Ike because he didn’t go to the minors………
Are MLB teams allowed to make 3 team trades
You can have a 30 team trade. The problem is, the more hands in the pot, the more complicated it becomes.
Sigh…. Robert, then again, think about this for a second… sandy alderson gets paid a lot of money to do his job no? should we also make trade moves for him as well? don’t you think that for example, a prospect and a guy like ramirez/parnell would’ve maybe swayed huston street? there are million of possibility, yet you choose to write an article to defend sandy. in the first place he dismantle the 4th best bullpen a year ago to save the wilpons some cash, then tried to rebuild it by acquiring a bunch of bums, then weaken our OF by trading pagan for a bum CF and what turn out to be a bust for us in ramirez. yet, people in here try to defend his every move, like some idiot saying hairston wasn’t traded because he’s the mets best OF.
This article is another asinine article slurping alderson
Honestly! He could have gotten the next Babe Ruth for a bag of balls and the We Hate Sandy Army would still be out screaming about how there may be a shortage of balls someday. The Pegan trade was a trade of potential for potential. Everyone liked Ramirez when the trade was made and Torres was a throw in who was only one year removed from a solid year. There may have been a minor deal to be made at the deadline but that would be more like making a deal just to make a deal.
I’m all for packaging certain prospects and imroving the big club but those who are ready to ackage Spin with a bunch of other to get a nominal ugrade in the pen just don’t have a clue! I would prefer we cut ties with some of the non hackers currently in the pen and giving some of the younger guys a shot over just packing them for someone who may give you a month or two of decent service (and that is the way most relievers not named Mariano Rivera are). Spin has a future in the bigs. More so than many others who a few short months ago some posters were raving about (read Lucas Duda).
Getting rid of KRod last year was an out and out salary dump and that fact was NEVER denied!!! Even if the Wilpons were not cash strapped paying him $17million would have been INSANE! Many “experts” were amazed that Sandy was able to unload KRod when they did. Let’s not forget some of other issues.
I don’t consider myself a “Sandy Appologist” or what they’re calling it but to call him the “Worst GM” is just flat out stupid. Do we need to reminded of Al Harazin, M. Donald Grant, or Steve Phillips (who felt it wasn’t important to sign nearly have of the players he drafeted and once said “Potential will get you fired” when speaking af prospects (I think it may have been Izzy he recently traded). I do believe that this time around they are attempting to build an organization that is stable and will have some long term success. Call me crazy but I will take that all day over our current system of success one year followed by around 20 years of futility.
And he could have signed Oliver Perez to a 25 Million dollar per year, 5 year contract and someone here would try to re-jigger the metrics to make it sound like it was a good move as well!
“who felt it wasn’t important to sign nearly have of the players he drafeted ”
It should be noted that in this years draft, the Mets didn’t sign half of the they drafted either…….
half of the players they drafted*
Perfectly said Sloats!
jessep, you kinda make a decent point there. I guess I didn’t read the fine and i must admit that I don’t follow the minor leagues much other than what I read here from time to time.
Question for you: are the guys that CIN gave up for Broxton, who a couple years ago was a stud closer for the Dodgers, any good?
I’m just frustrated at the apparent apathy that our General Manager has towards this club.
I’m just saying that there was talent out there to be had that could have improved this team and perhaps prevented this second half tailspin if SA had acted sooner.
Now that I think about it, Sandy doesn’t deserve all the blame. The Wilpons are the biggest culprits here. They hang on to the team dragging it into a big hole. Then they claim that they don’t have any money and start selling minority shares of the team. That’s not good enough. If ownership is broke, they should sell the team!!!
I think the Mets should have tried to get Brandon League. He’s not pitching great this year, but even with the way he’s pitching now would be a big improvement over Manny Acosta. And only just last year he was an all star, so maybe with a change of scenery, he could revert back to the all star pitcher he was last season.
And the two prospects the Dodgers gave up to get him, did not rank in the top 30 of their teams prospects before the start of the season – So they gave up very little to get him.
It would have been a nice “low risk high reward move”. It wouldn’t have cost much in terms of money and prospects, and we would then have a guy who has the potential to be a very good closer.
They didn’t want rentals. He said he wasn’t bringing anybody in that’s not under control past 2012.
But he sure is keeping guys not under control past 2012 instead of trading them for ANYTHING that might be useful in 2013 is he?!
Hairston, Young, Rauch, Ramirez, Carrasco, Cedeno, and Byrdak
I’m sure there are one or two more I’m Missing here….
They are all not signed past 2012 and all should not be resigned or in Sandy’s plans much past next week other than Hairston and Young.
But we all know why he is keeping them don’t we?
So when they go we can use thier absence as an excuse for buying K-Mart Wholesale again because…..drumroll please…..
WE HAVE SO MANY HOLES TO FILL!
same crap we hard last year for buying cheap and in quantity yet here we will be again right back where we started because we didn’t fill a single hole in Free Agency in two years!
Yeah I’m sure those guys would bring in a nice haul of prospects and I’m sure Sandy gets a hard on at the thought of slashing 50 million off payroll and signing cheap crap. I heard he told Fred to sit down and shut the **** up when Fred told him to spend some damn money already. You know since the Wilpons are flushed with cash like you claim.
Ah yeas it has to be a haul right jackass? And if it isn’t a haul or some guy on BA’s list then it;s better to get nothing right?
Hell Ramirez and Torres should at least be worth a Pagan no? If not then guess what…Sandy got taken on that deal!
SO tell us how has that 50 mil in cuts improved the game on the field?
Please feel free to tell us…
lack of answer will be taken as admitting it didn’t help at all!
“Ah yeas it has to be a haul right jackass? And if it isn’t a haul or some guy on BA’s list then it;s better to get nothing right?”
Hairston, Young, Rauch, Ramirez, Carrasco, Cedeno, and Byrdak. WTF are any of these guys bringing back? You just wanted a trade for the sake of a trade. Yes it’s better to do nothing then to trade those guys for similar guys who don’t do anything for the team you moron. Maybe we could’ve traded Cedeno for Omar Quintanilla.
Hell Ramirez and Torres should at least be worth a Pagan no? If not then guess what…Sandy got taken on that deal!
Pagan has had one good month in May the rest of his season he’s done jack shit. We’ve gotten better run production from our CFers than Pagan has given SF. Plus Pagan is still worse defensively than both our CFers and that’s saying something because Torres has taken a step back defensively. Sandy got taken my ass. I wouldn’t take Pagan back for nothing.
Have you noticed K-Rod lately? Still want to have him back? He’s wrose than all 3 of Sandy’s nightmare. But you’ll pay 17.5 for a 5.35 ERA, a 1.70 WHIP 5 losses and 6 blown saves, the last 3 in a row. You’d make a fine GM.
SO tell us how has that 50 mil in cuts improved the game on the field?
How the fk could it. That’s the whole point you dumb fk. How can cutting 50 million make the team better? See what happens when you play checkbook baseball like your hero Omar did which is your favorite way to run a franchise. It sets you back years. Are you that stupid? Do you have any idea how this game works at all? You see when your company is losing 70 million a year you trim expenses. Simple concept. It’s like talking to a 50 year old with a 5 year old mentallity with you. Maybe you should try NASCAR or something. Baseball is far too complicated for you.
“Pagan has had one good month in May the rest of his season he’s done jack shit.”
Be sure to get in touch with us and let us know when either Torres or Ramirez even have one good month!
“WTF are any of these guys bringing back?’
ANYTHING is better than the nothing we are going to get in the offseason!
And obviously you can get something for them just not some BA Top Lister like Sandy insited on getting!
“Have you noticed K-Rod lately? ”
Have you noticed how well Francisco has pitched the last two weeks as well?
“How can cutting 50 million make the team better?”
Precisely!
So you agree that Sandy has made the team worse!
Thank you for finally admitting the truth!
OH I forgot to mention that Omar made the playoffs in his first year as GM!
No I don’t agree he made the team worse. The team is still as mediocre as it was when it cost 50 million more. He was forced to cut payroll he didn’t cut it so he could put the 50 million in his bank account. Omar made the playoffs in his first year? Really? Think again genius. Lets compare resumes. Omar 1 playoff appearance, no rings. Sandy 4 playoff appearances. 1 WS ring and 3 AL championship rings. Omar spent the most money in franchise history and had 1 playoff appearance, 2 choke jobs and 2 sub 500 seasons. 50 million less was spent this year for the same results, mediocrity. Imagine if Omar had to cut 50 million. We’d break the 62 mets 120 loss record.
So you disagree with yourself do you?
Why does that not surprise me?
Good read Robert. You make some good points.
The return on Hairston was apparently not enough to justify trading him. There is not much more to it than that. You already knew that the FO said they were not going to overpay for a reliever and they would only consider moving low level prospects and they were not doing a trade unless it benefited the team this year or the next. Based on that alone there was not really much to be expected in return for a reliever. Add to that the teams overall poor play to start the 2nd half having an impact as to how far in the FO was willing to go.
Adding another option as a right handed catcher to compliment Thole would of been nice but I also am not going to get too worked up over not getting one. In the end if the Mets had a player in Hairston or Byrdak that could of returned them something better than a marginal prospect they may have moved them but a trade just for the sake of a trade was not happening.
What a joke that people blindly accept the lord liar’s claim that the return for Hairston wasn’t good enough. Hoe can anyone still believe a man that has spewed out nothing but lies for almost two years!!!!!!!!!
Great move – can’t wait for the rest of this season, going to be great… I mean I think we can really turn it around for here on out and play maybe .500 baseball… wow great job sandy!
On the plus side, Harvey and Edgin look good. LETS GO METS.
You read my mind with this post and I feel the same way dude. Lets not detract from our goal which is to build a top caliber team that is sustainable for a long time.
I admire that the Phillies had the courage to hoist the white flag.
THANK YOUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU
I Love you sir. Thank you for this amazing gift we call a Metsmerized post.
FINALLY SOMEONE USES THEIR BRAIN.