Dickey Seeing Red After Losing Bracelet In 6-1 Mets Loss

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• Matt August 15, 2012 at 10:47 pm

  Let’s see……looks like this team has shown no improvement whatsoever from 2011 to 2012.

  At least we had the no-hitter.
  • Joey D. August 16, 2012 at 12:00 am

    Hi Matt,

    Regarding 2011 – now, many of us believe the Mets should have held onto both KRod and Beltran because we felt the team had a legit shot at the wild card while others feel it was such a long shot and thus worth both dumping salary and landing a prospect like Zach Wheeler in return, especially considering that Beltran most likely was going to walk at the end of the year. We must put aside the injuries to Murphy, Beltran, Neise plus the second one that befell Reyes for that would be looking back in hindsight and nobody knew that was going to happen (unlike the Giants whom many suspect got Hunter Pence in anticipation of Milky Cabrera’s suspension).

    But there is another point that Joe Benigno has been raising of late on the FAN that when a team has a shot at something they must go for it for they do not know when they might have that opportunity again. I’m not inferring he was referring to the Mets last season but rather that he was talking more in general terms. However, keeping that thought in mind – and not taking into consideration the injuries mentioned above – are there those who agreed with the moves made last season now having second thoughts based on the position we were in, the way we were playing at the time, and the subsequent behavior of the front office from that time until now? Take into consideration that even though there was no way to avoid this season’s collapse, 2011 must be looked in terms of the season each player was having till the trades were made.

    No need to challenge me on my thoughts or defend your own opposite stance so please no personal remarks – I am only curious how many might be having second thoughts due to the changing sentiment expressed by many of late in relation to the front office and ownership.
    • Fonzie13 August 16, 2012 at 4:32 am

      LMAO. Just like clockwork. Like I predicted Wednesday night you would bring up the Beltran trade tommorow for the 10 billionth time. 12:00 on the dot Thursday morning. You can’t make this up. lol. tune in Friday morning at 12 AM for more info on the 80′s A’s. lol
      • Joey D. August 16, 2012 at 10:05 am

        Well, Fonzie,

        Since you accuse me of being a “liar”, I will play by your own rules and point out that by your own standards, you must include yourself as being a liar as well. You wrote:

        “LMAO. Just like clockwork. Like I predicted Wednesday night you would bring up the Beltran trade tommorow for the 10 billionth time. 12:00 on the dot Thursday morning. You can’t make this up. lol. tune in Friday morning at 12 AM for more info on the 80′s A’s. lol”

        That was in immediate resonse to a disucssion I was having with Jessep about the Rigney/Alderson debate – and since it was Jessep who earlier brought up the fact that we both have sharply different opinions of things but treat each other with cordially and with respect I then added about people stopping with the insults and starting all over again. No mention of 2011 at all.

        But in response to that, at 11:17 PM – 43 minutes before my post – who was it that brought up the subject of the Beltrade trade?

        “Maybe if you’d stop repeating the same 2 topics every single day to instigate a flame war you’d be treated cordially by everyone. You choose to repeat yourself every day. Why else would anyone keep repeating himself but to get an all out flame war started. I’ll take a wild guess tommorow you will beat the Beltran dead horse again and friday the 80′s A;s, saturday Beltran, sunday the 80′s A’s. etc…”

        By your own standards, that means you a “liar” – not by my own standards – but by yours.

        And now let’s look at the circumstances. Did I bring up 2011 or respond to someone? I replied to this:

        ” Let’s see……looks like this team has shown no improvement whatsoever from 2011 to 2012.”

        And why did I raise it? To make a point or to ask a specific question to see if 2011 correlated to the changing opinion many have about Sandy Alderon now:

        “I am only curious how many might be having second thoughts due to the changing sentiment expressed by many of late in relation to the front office and ownership.”

        I was creating my own informal sort of survey. In fact, doesn’t that then leave me wide open with more people saying the play of 2012 only re-inforces their belief that Sandy made the right move with Beltran?

        If you don’t think it is valid to wonder if the growing doubts about Sandy Alderson as expressed by so many might might also mean some may be re-thinking their feelings about what transpired in 2011, fine with me. But that is the only reason I raised the Beltran trade. And, I did it in a neutral manner, acknowledging the reasons from both sides of the equation with equal respect:

        “Regarding 2011 – now, many of us believe the Mets should have held onto both KRod and Beltran because we felt the team had a legit shot at the wild card while others feel it was such a long shot and thus worth both dumping salary and landing a prospect like Zach Wheeler in return, especially considering that Beltran most likely was going to walk at the end of the year.”

        As I said, I was opening myself up to an avalanche of people who could say what happened in 2012 actually re-inforces or even changed their opinion and agreee me with where you stand.

        I wonder why I can have these types of conversations with Jessup (see his latest post to the Rigney/Alderson and you will find he is being quite friendly) and most others but not with you? I guess I’m opening myself up again to sarcasim because I anticipate what your answer might be. Why not surprise me and just say something like:

        “Joey, you were wrong then and you are wrong now about the Beltran trade and I am sure others who respond are going to look at it in the same way that I do. Wheeler is going to be a major asset to stabilizing this club and making it a year in and year out competitor in the future”.

        As I said, I will not venture a comment to anyone who resonds to my original question – even if asked. What I am doing now is only responding to you about once again inaccurate accusations about my personal self.
    • srt August 16, 2012 at 9:32 am

      Don’t know about anyone else but none of what I’ve seen last season or this has changed my mind about anything.

      I still believe many of you are shooting the messenger – which in this case if the FO.
      IMO, their main goal is to get spending to whatever point it needs to be for the Wilpons to hold onto this team.
      Secondary goal appears to be improving the farm system to leave the next FO with something to work with. SA isn’t going to be here long enough to see the results of any drafts under his tenure.

      Wilpon’s Mets are still broke. I’ve seen no evidence that has changed at all.
      Given the attendance figures I’ve seen this season, I expect I don’t expect to see increased spending for next season and it might be a bit worse.

      Just about all money deals from the MLB loan to the bridge loan to the minority investors appeared to have been made to meet debt going into the 2012 season. With revenue figures that project to be lower due to attendance figures this season, I can only imagine what this means going into 2013.

      Oh and anyone who references Joe Benigno and his opinions loses some points for credibility in my book.
      • gorgeguy August 16, 2012 at 9:47 am

        If they are focusing more on development, you get higher-end draftees and you SIGN them.

        Not signing half of their draftees (the fewest of all teams I do believe) has me doubting the notion that they are working harder on the farm.
        • srt August 16, 2012 at 9:54 am

          I doubt they’re not focusing on the farm. They just about turned over most positions there, including scouting.

          Your point on not signing half the draftees in the later rounds is a relevant one though. I’ll confess to not knowing how the new CBA rules might have had an effect on that – or what their mindset is. Do they get extra picks and/or higher money pool next season for not having signed so many?
• Matt August 15, 2012 at 10:49 pm

  And nice job Sandy on the Moneyball. On base percentage is everything. We are learning this O wise one.
• gary s. August 15, 2012 at 11:35 pm

  It’s David Wright and the Buffalo Bisons vs the world.When he leaves we will be the worst team in MLB.
  • Alex68 August 16, 2012 at 7:27 am

    Well, to be fair, it is not like DW is lighting it up. he is having a miserable second half, he’s a streaky player, what else can be said about the guy? HE had an awesome first half but cooled down, so i guess you must include him in the buffalo bison lineup as well.
    This team is lifeless. But hey, it’s ok to blame everyone, except the man who basically put this team together ok. So fire away
• Heybatter August 16, 2012 at 12:58 am

  Come on Joe D…….R.A. is a highly paid professional. If he was thrown off his game a little because he had to remove a bracelet we got a problem here!
• L.J. Phipps August 16, 2012 at 1:48 am

  Was the bracelet a Dusty Baker Ploy? Did he have convo with the umps before the game about Dickey and the bracelets? In any case the Mets are flailing and in free fall mode ……
  • srt August 16, 2012 at 9:38 am

    According to both Terry and RA on the post game, it didn’t come from the Reds bench. They were told the umps were getting directives to enforce the rules that have been in place for some time now.

    All BS, if you ask me. Leake had a big old necklace on that no one asked him to remove.
    The umps didn’t bother RA until the second inning. Why not at the beginning of the game, if their story was true?

    RA also said one of the umpiring crew told the home plate umpire he was part of a crew earlier in the season where they made RA take off those bracelets. RA said absolutely untrue. He put them on prior to the climb and he says they haven’t come off since. I have no reason to doubt this.

    So are the umps lying? Was it really the Reds bench? Or is there something going on with the umps and the Mets?

    I hate conspiracy theories but this one really had me scratching my head. Especially when the umps continued the conversation on the mound in the next inning.

    You could tell Terry was beyond annoyed at the whole scenario but he wasn’t going to give the media any fodder to turn this into ‘bracelet’gate’, if he could help it. Kept his cool, gave the company line responses.
• Donal August 16, 2012 at 7:03 am

  “Bobby Ojeda says the Mets now have a growing reputation in the league that they are passive offense and that teams are pounding the middle of the zone because they know the Mets batters are not going to swing.”

  By “pounding the zone” he must mean “working the corners and locating breaking balls” because that is what Leake did last night.
• gorgeguy August 16, 2012 at 8:51 am

  Seemingly small mental speed bumps, like having to cut off a bracelet that ties him to his daughter and a major climb, can throw your focus off physical tasks significantly.

  Rock climbing at Charlotte Dome, I was 400 feet off the deck. Had to execute a small move but I started dwelling on the fact that maybe I was slightly off route .. hesitated on the 5.10 move as my brain shifted back and forth between on route/off route … then fell. Only a 15 foot drop, with a spectacular view below (I still have a visual picture of the base!), but once I re-focused on the move, it wasn’t that hard.

  For the climber, if you finish the route (and I had 600 more feet of vertical rock to go), there is little reminder of the mistake as you climb. For a pitcher like RA, your moments of scattered focus leads to runs against you on the scoreboard. Then your lack of offense keeps reminding you of your mistake which compounds the difficulty in focusing on the original task.

  Climbing isn’t easy, but your partner is almost always supportive because he or she know that his or her success depends on the leader. Being a professional pitcher is mentally daunting, as you have the added stress of teammates who may doubt if you’ve “got it” today, in addition to fans jeering your every mistake. It’s no wonder why sports psychology has become quite prominent with successful athletes.
• jessep August 16, 2012 at 9:46 am

  Dickey was clearly bothered by the bracelet but I don’t think it impacted his innings AFTER it happened. I’d hope he’s more professional than that.

  On the topic of the bracelet, I heard what SRT said that they were told it was the umps doing not the Reds.

  Frankly – that’s embarrassing for MLB and the umps. Where were they before the game started? If they knew that this was an issue then why did they choose that moment to enforce it?

  Dickey has worn it all year, you can go and look at the game where Dickey came in relief – same ump crew and he was wearing it.

  Regardless though – it shouldn’t be used as an excuse past the inning in which it happened.
  • srt August 16, 2012 at 9:52 am

    RA said he was angry about it initially, especially when they came back out to the mound the following inning and continued to discuss it – but stated it wasn’t on his mind after that. His focus was on the game and his pitching.

    Watching that game last night, you could tell early on – even in the first before that whole controversy started, that the knuckler was really moving – especially since Thole could barely catch them pitch after pitch. The Reds though were swinging aggressively and not what I’d call conventionally either. Heck…don’t remember who it was but he went down on one knee to take a knuckler into the OF.

    One of those nights I guess where the knuckler was really dancing to the tune of having an effect on the control, maybe?
• gorgeguy August 16, 2012 at 10:06 am

  I’m RA and these umps pull their crap in the weirdest of moments. I’m pissed, but trying to let it go. My brain’s thinking I’ve already given up 1 so I have to get it back together. Then I look at our lineup and the weaknesses over the next 2 innings…. distracted ….then give up another 2 runs because I am scattered. The dominoes start tumbling.

  When RA had back-to-back one hitters, which seems like 20 years ago now, he had razor-like focus and an offense that produced in the clutch. The fans were talking about him as an All Star, and eventually a Cy Young award guy. This could mess a player up but since he’s so grounded, I think it only increased his focus on pitching to perfection.

  Now he has all of these negative things piling up, I see his job as 3 times more difficult. Incidentally, the Reds announcers were talking about Cueto and the fact that he’s a better Cy Young candidate than RA because he’s on a “winning” team. I heartily disagree. If RA gets back on track and has as many wins, he is twice the candidate for being on a “losing” team because of how much harder it is to pitch against all of the outside adversity.
• Metfan Lou August 16, 2012 at 11:02 am

  Some of these guys take the mound with so much junk on you would confuse them with Tiffanys. I have said it for many years now that the umpiring is getting worse every year and the umps have chose teams and pitchers and players they like or dislike andyou can see on the calls which players and teams they favor. Some of the announcers I guess out of prodfessional courtesy try to make excuses for them and give them a pass but even that is starting to get lame. If these umps were serious about these rules they would inspect the players before the first pitch and not wait till the game started. They are ruining the game.Batters step into the box with gloves. shin and elbow guards, pine tar all up the bat and all sorts of things, yet two small bracelets distract a hitter? what crap.
  • gorgeguy August 16, 2012 at 11:47 am

    Nice to hear/see someone else noticing the same stuff.

    I’m thinking you (Metfan Lou) have been aware that the umps have been especially against the Mets than for them the last 2 months? As soon as the Mets began to slide, many strikes were called balls (Young had this happen multiple times in this series) and they call out/safe depending on which they perceive as the “better” team.

    Can’t say much about the umps previous to this year as I didn’t have MLB access then as I do now, but they are definitely playing favorites this year.
    • Metfan Lou August 16, 2012 at 12:43 pm

      And you could see it on Harvey’s last start in the first inning. He wasn’t getting the calls on the outside that were clear strikes. This led to the first inning troubles and the Braves won of course. There are two pitchers the umps always favored, Smoltz and Glavine. They got strikes called on pitches that a batter couldn’t reach if he had a 10 bfoot bat wagging out there. I always said that Glavine got the cheapest 300 wins in the history of the game. Even the late Skip Carey made silly stuff up when he got those calls.