Comments on: The Nieuwenhuis and Edmonds Comparison

By: eraff

eraff — Sun, 22 Apr 2012 02:18:47 +0000

Beltran and Cameron had GREAT speed. Edmunds ran extremely well….Neuwenheuis runs very well.

Any comparison to Edmunds is purely Euphoria aided at this point. Technically…talent wise…defensive production—-Edmunds was a startlingly great defensive Centerfielder. Post Willie Mays, he has few peers as a Ball Hawk( Paul Blair, Gary Maddox). He was a very good thrower. He navigated warning tracks and elevated to outfield walls with few peers (Young Griffy Junior and Adam Jones).

Throw in the almost 400 homers…….. at least wait 20 games until you compare Kirk with Edmunds!!!!

By: jdon

jdon — Sat, 21 Apr 2012 23:12:44 +0000

There seem to be some serious sun concerns playing center at Citifield. Too bad they cannot rotate the stadium for different times of year. But seriously, I like the way butch plays center. Torres took an Angel Pagan angle on that ball he blew out his calf on opening day.

By: Fonzie13

Fonzie13 — Sat, 21 Apr 2012 21:05:03 +0000

I don’t remember ever seeing Edmonds muff a pop up like Kirk did today. What a difference a day makes.

By: jdon

jdon — Sat, 21 Apr 2012 16:47:31 +0000

Of course, I am assuming that Kirk does NOT use steroids, whereas I always assumed the Edmonds 9just look at the size of the guy) did.

By: Hoegy

Hoegy — Tue, 17 Apr 2012 17:43:02 +0000

This is a NO BRAINER. Kirk, whom I have heard Duda call Butch, can play CF. We need not do comparisons but that is what media is and it makes sense. Butch has the tools. The problem for the Mets is Ron Darlings dreaded “station to station”play. We are so conditioned to the Reyes game that we have a need to envision Torres has our answer to swiping bases. This gets replaced easily by the doubles game and Ruben is leading the league in them. Torres is great for a spot starter and defensive replacement to stay healthy and help to get wins all season long. Butch needs as many at bats as possible. I have not heard about Butch’s arm but I have seen Hairston throw. Forget the platoon effective now.
Duda and Butch are projects that can learn and get better at the pro level. Nimmo, den Dekker, Ceciliani, and Valdespin all have great promise. They also keep us in prospects and will be up in a few years. It may be time to give Ceciliani a shot much like Butch. Time will tell. A healthy young Butch with a leader like Bay is a magical thing. He has the tools and does not lack the speed to be a CF. He has a significant jump and will not be free of a few bumps like missing signals, taking a wrong route, and throwing to the wrong base. This day and age who doesn’t. Joe Dimaggio would certainly bring about more flak than any Edmonds comparisons. They are not necessary. Keep Butch! Send down Baxter. I know the homegrown thing and the sentimental value thing but it is inevitable. He is the odd man out in the equation when and if Torres returns.

By: mattreed

mattreed — Mon, 16 Apr 2012 20:12:18 +0000

I don’t believe the comparison was so much on the career Kirk will have, but more so on the physical abilities, size, speed, etc. Kirk can play CF, I’d prefer to see him in LF but he can for sure stick in Center

By: Mookie

Mookie — Mon, 16 Apr 2012 19:13:12 +0000

I happen to think we struck gold with Kirk. I don’t think Torres is getting his job back if and when he ever comes back. I know it’s early but I see good things in Kirk’s future.

By: stick

stick — Mon, 16 Apr 2012 18:49:17 +0000

the only knock I recall ever hearing on Kirk sticking in CF had to do with speed. He was considered a good CF otherwise (and I think he has shown enough speed/range to do the job).

hey, way better than bay, right?

the Edmonds comparison does not bother me. 1st, it had nothing to do with batting. Simply just that they are similar build guys that aren’t considered to be truly fast. So it is a model for Kirk to follow to an extent.

By: Russell Zanca

Russell Zanca — Mon, 16 Apr 2012 18:21:04 +0000

Yes, pagan as athletically-gifted as they come, but not a tremendous fielder. For the mets right now, I see Duda as a way bigger OF liability than Kirk N. The little bit I have seen…KN has something close to natural OF instincts, and Duda–not too much.

No one has mentioned this but doesn’t the Cap’n have a strong arm to boot?

By: Donal

Donal — Mon, 16 Apr 2012 17:46:16 +0000

I completely agree about Beltran and Cameron. I’ve heard a few people say that is why Beltran was under appreciated here. It seemed like he rarely if ever went diving for a ball. What some people will tell you is a lack of heart or “grit” knowledgeable people will tell is an abundance of ability. He did a great job following the ball off the bat, took the proper routes to each ball, and positioned himself perfectly. All that added to his physical talents made it unnecessary to fling himself about. He made so many hard plays look easy.

By: ConnorUAF

ConnorUAF — Mon, 16 Apr 2012 17:43:40 +0000

The comparison to Edmondsis a bit of a stretch right now. We don’t know how much better Kirk will get with his reaction time, positioning, and routes. We know that he has the potential, but he is a long way from being worthy of a Jim Edmonds comparison at this point.

By: Metsie

Metsie — Mon, 16 Apr 2012 17:33:12 +0000

It depends on two factors….

1 – Who has the stronger arm will likely be the RFer…
2 – Do you really want to put two guys at new positions and start the learning all over again?

By the time bay is done (granted if he hits 15 more HRs between now and July maybe it’s soon) Duda will be well accustomed to RF and it might not be such a good thing to mess with that and throw him to the other side.

By: USMF

USMF — Mon, 16 Apr 2012 17:14:48 +0000

I haven’t seen enough of Kirk to say for sure, but you don’t need speed to be good, or better yet…speed doesn’t mean that you will be good.

Look at Beltran and Cameron…neither guy I’d consider as “speed” guys, but neither guy was “slow footed”, but I don’t think Kirk is considered “slow footed”

But both guys (Beltran and Cameron) were great because they played smart and played hard and knew what to do and when to do it.

Look at one of the most physically gifted players the Mets have had in Angel Pagan. He was fast and very strong. (Not to be weird, but look at the guys legs, they were huge) despite all of Pagans gifts, he was very inconsistent as a fielder. He looked great two years ago, but last year and three years ago he was just plain awful. He took bad paths to the ball, he ran back when he should have been running in or in instead of back..he made terrible throws to the wrong base and over threw the cutoff man and missed his target by 15ft.

By: Metstheory22

Metstheory22 — Mon, 16 Apr 2012 17:13:44 +0000

Kirk does not have the flair of Edmonds. He reminds me more of Rick Monday body and speed

By: LA Mets Fan

LA Mets Fan — Mon, 16 Apr 2012 17:13:43 +0000

But is it necessary to be a “burner” to play CF effectively?

No it’s not and as you pointed out Edmonds wasn’t a burner but was one of the best defenders I’ve seen in CF. Getting a great jump on balls and taking good routes is what made Edmonds so good. If Kirk can emulate that, he’ll be fine.

By: trs86

trs86 — Mon, 16 Apr 2012 17:01:06 +0000

Don’t you think it would be more likely that he moves to RF with Duda moving over to LF?

By: Joey D.

Joey D. — Mon, 16 Apr 2012 17:00:44 +0000

Kirk seems to have all the tools – it will just be up to him to prove he can do it in the majors, like everyone else. We will know more about his bat once the pitchers learn more about him. As far as his fielding, he looks as if he gets a good jump on the ball and if he’s intelligent enough to follow the directions of his coaches and teammates before he gets to better know batters, pitchers and situations he will be fine.

By: trs86

trs86 — Mon, 16 Apr 2012 17:00:10 +0000

“Not at all, I am just saying it’s most likely not a very good comparison.”

If that’s what you get from it….

By: Metsie

Metsie — Mon, 16 Apr 2012 16:51:56 +0000

I have seen nothing about Kirk that would suggest he can not be a very good CF.
He will have some growing pains as do all Rookies in the MLB.
Positioning is as much about learing the tendencies of the batter as much as anything else.
Getting a good jump comes with the experience of playing in the varying parks and recognizing how the ball looks off the bat in each and what weather conditions exist for each field.
That said it is far more likely that Kirk will move to LF whenever they are done with Bay and they will look elsewhere for their eventual CF.

By: Alex68

Alex68 — Mon, 16 Apr 2012 16:46:40 +0000

So he’s not allowed to make HIS prediction??? gotta be WHAT YOU WANT??? i thought you were against telling others what to do….