24
2012
I Like Ike, But This Is Ridiculous
An article by 
Geez, What the heck is up with Ike Davis? Spare me the “It’s only April diatribes” I’m not in the mood for cliches and simplistic excuses this morning.
Ike Davis stranded the bases loaded three times in Monday’s doubleheader sweep by the Giants, although the first baseman cautiously noted that the final instance — a called third strike in the nightcap as a pinch hitter — was not entirely his fault. Davis and Terry Collins clearly said the final pitch was low. Davis flinged his bat after the at-bat. He left 11 runners on base in two games.
Low my ass… It was too close to take… You’re down a half dozen runs and have two strikes on you, protect the damn plate.
Instead of Collins making excuses for him, maybe he should set his head straight and tell Davis to stop lunging at everything.
Last week in this post, our own Drew (72MetsFan) referred to Ike Davis’ tirades at the plate.
Another thing that concerns me is Ike’s demeanor at the plate and how he reacts on close pitches that don’t go his way or his emotional displays after every strikeout. When a a Cy-Young type pitcher like Cliff Lee barely misses the outside part of the plate, he’s gonna get that call every time. There’s no use jawing about it to the ump and Davis’ reputation in that regard is growing quickly and will only serve against him. If not Hudgens, than Collins or somebody else needs to have him tone it down up there.
And there he was, taking a called third strike in the eighth inning with the bases loaded, popping off and slamming his bat and helmet to the ground as he turned from home plate in protest. Keep up that routine and see how many close pitches will go your way, Ike.
Collins was finally asked about Davis’ antagonistic protests aimed at the the men behind the plate and whether it plays against him in the long run as I mentioned last week:
“I don’t necessarily agree with that,” Collins said. “In our league, you have to be professional. … Years ago umpires could hold a grudge. Because there are so many TV cameras today, and with all the stuff being aired today, they really can’t. I don’t think they do that stuff anymore. They’re human beings. Once in a while they miss a call. We make mistakes. But I don’t think they really screw guys like they once did.”
Is he kidding me?
He thinks umpiring has improved instead of gotten worse? Really Terry?
That may be the most asinine baseball quote I’ve heard all year.
In the last week, Ike has gotten worse, not better. I loved hearing about how great he felt after batting practice yesterday, it really touched my heart, but I’m more concerned with results.
Is his head in the game? Of course it is, it’s one of the things I love about Ike – his focus and determination. In Spring Training Davis referred to himself as “pure chaos” at the plate when comparing himself to teammate Daniel Murphy. I thought it was cool at the time and a perfect nickname for him, but what was I thinking? He admitted he was a hacker which is okay when you’re hacking at a .295 clip and hitting home runs in bunches, but this… This slump is intolerable and he’s clogged up the middle of the order while batting cleanup. We’re getting tons of people on base… Haven’t you heard how awesome the Mets’ OBP is? How about getting some players in the middle of the order to drive in some runs… You know those things that leads to wins…
Time for Plan B… Time to get him a few days off, not one… You have Valdespin here, perfect timing, put him at second base for the Marlins series and let Daniel Murphy cover first base.
The goal here is two fold.
One, Ike would be served better to disengage, recharge and come back with a new approach and attitude. Let him huddle with Hudgens or anyone else who could help. Show him some tape from 2010 so he could see how pitchers have adjusted to to him and that he now needs to do the same. Hey, whatever it takes…
Two, the bottom line here is to win some baseball games. Batting Ike Davis cleanup while he’s a complete mess is a terrible idea. We’ve lost five of our last six games and we can’t afford a dead out deflating the middle of our lineup. Ike’s a flat tire right now and it needs some Fix-A-Flat.
Yesterday I told Andy Martino of the Daily News that Davis could be in the throws of a sophomore slump that is in late bloom. We all love to believe our young stars are immune to such things, but that’s what happens when the league adjusts to you and all you do is flail at the plate like nothing is different. Lucas Duda be forewarned as well.
About the Author: Joe DeCaro
I'm a lifelong Mets fan who loves writing and talking about the Amazins' 24/7. From the Miracle in 1969 to the magic of 1986, and even the near misses in '73 and '00, I've experienced it all - the highs and the lows. I started Mets Merized Online in 2005 to feed my addiction. Follow me on Twitter @metsmerized.
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Joe D, I have saying this for the last week The lack of production by the 4 5 and 6 slots are killing this team.I have been home on the mend from surgery and have witnessed all his at bats.He is early on the curve and late on the fastball.Bad combination for a clean up hitter.Either sit him off a few games or drop him in the line up.I agree with u on moving Murph and getting Valdy in for a few games.Shake up the line up Collins!!!
Collins has shaken up the lineup about as much as possible. If your 4-6 hitters are going to stink not much you can shake up. As for Ike, last night he was early on everything. Fastballs, curves… he’s jumping at the ball. Perhaps some time in AAA would do him some good. Maybe call up Lutz and give him a shot. Let him start this week at 1B in the minors and see if he can play it. As for moving Murphy, I guess it’s an option but to me he’s got to stay this year at 2B.
Yup…..and to think that before the season a lot of thought this team had a decent offense. LOL
Ike and Duda and Bay are killing this team. And Murphy is a grinder and a good hitter, but he has no power. Same with Tejada. So if you have no speed – which the don’t – your mashers better mash. And its not happening.
Based on previous performances of Ike and Duda there was a lot of reasons to hope they continued to develop. Anyone who says they expected them to be this bad is way out there. Murphy is not going to be a power hitter for sure but he does have 5 extra base hits out of 20 hits. He seems to be the prototypical #2 hitter.
I said it before and I’ll say it again…
You can’t protect a struggling lefty with a struggling lefty batting behind him!
Duda is making good cuts at least, Davis looks lost!
They have to move Wright in between them and maybe hit Davis 3rd Wright 4th, Duda 5th.
Duda will see some good pitches then. Maybe Davis they will be less willing to nibble and possibly walk him with Wright behind him.
As far as Davis’ approach, they are throwing first pitch strikes he is letting go by and then junk at him the rest of the AB. He needs to start swinging at any strikes that come his way because not many ARE coming his way!
Right now it wouldn’t matter if they were throwing beach balls on the first pitch he still would miss.
I agree that you can’t have those two back to back and said as much earlier in the year. Unless one proves they can hit LH pitching you can’t have them back to back. It may be time to move Murphy down.
Go Tejada/Kirk, Kirk/Tejada, Murphy, Wright, Davis/Duda, Bay, Duda/Davis, Thole.
Bay is not going to make those tweo lefties see better pitches!
For now the better play is:
Tejada
Murphy
Kirk (I will never spell his last name!)
Davis (until he gets himself in order)
Wright
Duda (Will switch with Davis if Davis gets it together)
Bay
Thole
As it standa they throw a lefty at Duda Davis late in games and nullify both!
Gotta break them up with a strong hitting righty and Wright is the only one who fits that description!
You might think that but I just looked at Bay’s splits and game logs….
.290 .353 .613 .966 the last 9 games with a hit in every game he has started. He is also hitting .273 .438 .818 1.256 vs LH this season with .353 .400 .765 1.165 vs LH starters. I would think him splitting those two LH vs LH pitching is perfectly fine.
Yes he’s geting hits but they are not threatening hits in any way.
He’s getting pitched to and getting better pitches, Put Duda or Davis behind him and that stops as they will pitch around him and pitch to whoever comes next!
What do you mean he is not getting “threatening hits”? I know you are not big on SLG% but you can’t have a .818 SLG without some threatening hits. Also for much of the season Bay WAS splitting those two. They just stink right now, not because of Bay not hitting.
Dude the difference between Duda and Bay is marginal and the difference is the non threatening hits and walks.
Bay 57PA 12H 2D 3HR 6BB 17K 5RBI
Duda 62PA 12H 2D 3HR 7BB 16K 5RBI
Really tell me what is the difference in threats there?
the 5 more PA?
Your percieving Duda as struggling because he has done better and Bay as better becausehe has sucked far worse before…
But they are practically identical in the minds of a pitcher as far as hitting threat is!
In fact they are probably more scared of Duda because he has been making good hacks, hasn’t rolloed over and GDPed as if the far better power threat than Bay is!
The fact that he is RH. Again you are discussing the issue of what happens when Ike and Duda are back to back. Yes Bay on deck vs a LH would be more threatening than Duda.
A RH who hits as well as duda is not going to change a thing though!
Putting Wright in there with his sky high SLG is way more conducive to have them pitching to Ike or Duda to get the out before Wright makes it to the plate!
get one Lefty on track and then you can deal with the other!
Again if you sandwich Ike or Duda with Wright and Bay that’s about as good as you can do on this team for one of the LH vs a LH pitcher.
Two lh hitters together isn’t the problem, Two guys who aren’t hitting is!
And Bay despite how he looks compared to his previous self is not really hitting any better than either of them!
Against LH he sure the hell is.
Yeah how many of them have we faced?
Really TRS you don’t rejigger your lineup to only work against LHP you build it to work against all!
Wright needs to be inbetween the other two big hitters to get them what they need!
Guy in front won’t be played with as much for fear of putting a guy on base for Wright and Wright getting a hit or being walked to get around will force the pitcher to not get too coy with the guy behind Wright for fear of walking the bases loaded for Bay and Thole!
The reason the Mets lose is because they always fail to see the problems as they are. Ike Davis at this point, has no business batting anywhere in the middle of the order. In fact, he should be in a platoon with Turner at this point. Better yet, bring up Zach Lutz and let him play 1B.
Duda is nearly as bad and you have to ask yourself this question: what have Duda and Davis really done in a consistent basis in the ML to warrant such loyalty from Collins or the Mets?
If you do ask, you will find that Davis had 1 good year and Duda had a good half a year. That’t it.
So the question becomes do you continue to lose using these players or do you adjust and try to win? If it was up to me, I would adjust.
Bay platoons with Hairston, Duda with Baxter, Ike with Turner or Lutz.
To just continue to run this lineup hoping for the best is just insane.
I think it’s also what I said earlier though. What is the longterm prognosis if Duda and Ike fail? Platooning them is not solving the long-term problem. For Ike, he needs to most likely go down to AAA. Moving him down to 8th and slotting Thole higher is not going to make the lineup any better. They have got to let him calm down and start the season over. He’s started this one as cold as he did hot last year.
Murphy plays first, Davis gets traded, Duda platoons with some player we don’t have yet or Kirk (two lefties seem like an odd platoon though but it’s not a platoon of R/L Splits)
or until Flores get converted to OF.
Remember we still have Havens and Valdespin to take over 2nd so losing Davis is not that big of a deal considering how many 1Bs we have on the field even today! (Duda, Murphy and Davis are all 1Bs and Thole is too to be honest!)
So the loss of Ike is not all that bad in the grand scheme.
Duda’s bat is not as bad off as Davis, Look at the cuts he has been taking, the cuts and mechanics are good the results are what haven’t come through yet but he will break out eventually he always starts off slow just look at his history!
Their failing is not a disaster by any means. All it will do is put a severe power drought in the lineup.
The bigger worry is what happens if Harvey, Familia and Wheeler fail…If that happens then we won’t be arguing about Sandy anymore!
He won’t be here either!
Actually based on what we thought Ike might be based on his performance last year before the injury it’s a huge loss. Also what good would trading Ike do if he is so bad that the Mets have even decided to go in a different direction? LOL. You would not be able to get Jerry Manuel for him.
And yet we lost him last year then went on a .519, .593, .519 Win Pct tear….
As for what he is worth, there is always someone out there who think they are smarter and better at teaching players than you who will go get him with the idea they can fix him!
If Ike fails you have bigger issues to worry about than losing Ike.
If this coaching staff can’t get him back on track the the problem is the coaching not the player!
and that is far worse than anything we might suffer if Ike busts!
You can’t always blame the coaches when a player struggles. Keith has even noted that Ike has been very stubborn about changing his swing. That being said sure they can “survive” without him but it’s a big blow to what they were most likely counting on. Also, yeah someone might take a chance but do you think you are getting that much on someone taking a chance?
In this case you can though…Ike’s stance has changed!
Now you can say he did it on his own but it’s still the coaches job to say don’t do that do what got you here!
I agreed with the attempt to quiet his swing (dropping hands way down)
he is holding his hands higher these days and I bet if he dropped them down to start he would not be able to drop them down lower and instead bring them up to time making for better contact and a more flowing swing!
Early in the season Keith was talking about it and how the coaches were working with him on that so I would say they are doing their job in that department but it’s up to Ike to make the final adjustments. I think right now he is just in a funk and needs to relax a little. I don’t know if moving him to 7th or giving him some time off or sending him to AAA will help or not but if the funk continues you have to weigh some options.
Twice last year in the booth – before Ike went down – Ralph commented about Ike’s swing vs. Duda’s. He said Duda had the more natural swing. Went on to say if Ike doesn’t start making the necessary adjustments, he’s never going to be successful up here.
Ralph actually sounded like he had a bit of insider info – implying that Ike’s stubbornness was getting in the way of improved hitting.
Keith said as much as well recently.
And if you look at Duda’s cuts compared to Ikes you see it quite easily!
Dude has a more level and compact swing. He is less vulnerable to pitches with movement!
Ike has problems with anything that breaks and always has!
He is also taller and can not get to those low pitches.
Well maybe he can get to them but he choses to let them pass and they get called as they did yesterday!
He needs to look for something low and start hitting it!
Too much waiting for something that is not going to come!
This is why I have all these debates over plate discipline…
It only works if you can hit the balls that are called strikes!
If you don’t all the discipline in the world isn’t going to inspire fatter strikes!
And your not going to walk unless you expand that strike zone with two strikes on you!
Pitches off the plate get called strike three all the time!
Pitches just below the knees do to!
You can;t allow the Umpire to determine your faith and Ike has to learn if you really think the UMPs are killing you with called strikes stop allowing them to call them and start hitting anything close enough to call!
Plate protection is WAY WAY more important than Plate Discipline!
You protect the plate you take away a place a pitcher can throw a strike!
he has to find someplace else to get them where you can’t hit it!
And if you foul off enough he will make that mistake you were looking for when you got into the Batters box!
Actually if he had plate discipline then he would be swinging at the pitches he can hit and laying off the ones he can’t. Does that sound like Ike right now?
Ike is laying off everything BUT the fat first pitch strike!
As Bayonne pointed out he is not being aggressive and he needs to start getting aggressive to stop all those called strikes that are killing him!
Ike believes all those called strikes are balls!
he isn’t getting ANY fat strikes except maybe the first pitch which plate Discipline says you let go assuming you’ll get another…
But that doesn’t work unless you get another and Ike isn’t getting them!
Sometime you have to hit balls that are not that easy to hit!
As Keith says pick a part of the plate to own!
Inside or Outside doesn’t matter!
Take away his ability to throw strikes there and hit them when he does and they will have to pitch to the other part of the plate.
I personally like to protect the outside part and go the other way with it. Then when they come inside thier misses will more likely be down the pipe or I get a HBP!
And thats where you get the ball you can pull over the fence!
Plate discipline isn’t just about taking pitches though and Hudggens will say as much. It’s about hunting pitches to hit. So based on your philosophy if he is letting pitches go that he should be able to hit then he is not showing good plate discipline. Plate discipline also includes fouling off pitches that are border line late in the count and he isn’t doing that either. Right now Ike LACKS plate discipline.
Only works if you get a pitch to hit now doesn’t it?
If you don’t but strikes are thrown then your out and discipline is useless!
SOMETIMES you have to hit pitches that are NOT great to hit and take them where they want to go instead!
Going the other way and going with the pitch is required when they don’t give you the pitch you LIKE to hit!
Waiting for a pitch that will never come is only going to lead to a caslled third strike!
Again, I think by your comments you are not really sure what plate discipline is all about. It’s not just about taking pitches and if you think so then I can’t change your mind.
I know full well what it is…What you seem to get wrong in all of this is that the Pitcher HAS TOP give you what your sitting there waiting for with the bat on your shoulder!
But he gets paid big bucks to never give you that pitch your “DISCIPLINE” is waiting to hit!
Sometime you have to hit a pitcher pitch!
If you can’t all the discipline in the world isn’t going to get you what you want! He will just keep hitting that spot until you give him a reason to not throw there anymore!
Your system only works with Pitchers who have control problems!
If they don’t have control issues then waiting is not going to get you the pitch you want to hit!
You have to hit what he gives you and take that pitch away, even if it isn’t a pitch that is easily hit or desirable to hit!
You go with it, make contact and do that enough and he stops pitching there and pitches it someplace you like it better!
Forgot to add that the Mets also have 3 useless players on their roster and it doesn’t help when the team is going bad.
Batista, Nikrais, Cedeno should be replaced with Valdespin, Lucas May, Zach Lutz
Cedeno is fine for what he is, a fielding MI.
Exactly. Nikeas and Cedeno have very specific roles to fill that you don’t want burn a prospect in. Putting ‘Spin there long term would be a disaster.
No argument from me on Batista.
May isn’t any better than Nickeas.
As far as replacing Cedeno with either Lutz or Valdespin…..you can’t have those 2 kids called up permanently to be bench players. Not unless it’s already been decided that’s all their ceiling is, which I’m sure has not happened.
Batista will be replaced by Carrasco soon enough
As for Cedeno? He’s better than Cora and fine for a backup MI. I bet if we released him the Phillies would sign him tomorrow. They have all the rest of our MI cast offs… LOL.
Was that notion supposed to comfort someone? LOL
May can hit which is something Nikrais can only dream about. On a team that is not hitting, you cannot have a lineup featuring Davis, Duda, Bay, Nikrais and pitcher. That is almost 4 automatic outs.
The most balanced lineup right now with the players we have is:
Kirk, Tejada, Murphy, Wright, Duda, Lutz (1B platoon), Thole, Turner (LF)
I think Lucas May sucks. I’d rather have Rottino catch and that’s quite a statement because he’s barely an upgrade defensively over Thole and you want your backups to be good defensively, but right now we need the bat.
The called strike 3 that Ike took against Linci was very telling. Slightly inside pitch that had barely any downward movement. As a lefty he should be used to having to fight those pitches off and he just stared at it hoping it was going to drop down further.
He has no confidence right now. When your afraid or hesitant you sit back and hope things go your way to the point of being crippled. When your confident you have that ability to fight back. He either needs a couple days off to clear his head or maybe some time in AAA. He had a poor spring and nothing has changed in the last month.
Yup he knows at least what he can’t hit. The problem is the pitchers keep giving him what he can’t hit…. LOL. I think if he continues his struggles through when Torres is ready you send him down to AAA for a while and call up Lutz. Between now and then let Lutz play 1B in the minors.
You can also move Duda to 1st and have Torres and Kirk in the outfield. In one regard it’s better to keep Duda in RF for learning purposes, but in the other regard I don’t know how much better his fielding will get and it might be nice to have better defense on the right side.
You could but I think that you might want to see if Lutz bat can help replace Ike’s (previous bat that is) and we know Torres’ can’t.
Ike Davis’ BABIP is .139.
he’ll be fine.
and you can look up and down the Yankee lineup at starting with their whiny classless captain to see guys bitching about every single freaking call. And they still get them, so let’s not pretend this is what’s hurting Ike.
whiny classless captain”
5 rings, over 3000 hits, gold glove (Some undeserved), WS MVP, all star Game MVP, 15 x all star, not a peep about him being a bad citizen, unnumerous record in the PLAYOFFS… Yeah, If david wright was to put up those numbers, I wouldn’t mind him being a whiny classless captain either…
Let’s not forget the autographed memorabilia he uses as “payment” for “services rendered.”
Those whinny classless Yankees have earned those rights. Just as Greg Maddux, Tom Glavine, Mike Piazza, and David Ortiz have. Ike Davis is a kid and there is nothing an ump hates more than to be shown up by a kid they believe has not earned it.
So you’re trying to say these guys didn’t do this prior to winning those rings? That’s not true. Umps don’t like to be criticized either. And they get graded so like Collins said, they can’t get away with penalty calls. Make Ike gets close calls because they don’t want the scrutiny that comes. If Ike doesn’t argue maybe we don’t see the replay or even know. now we do, and know the umpire. Umpires don’t want reputations as being bad at their job.
No major leaguer has ever even approximated .139. Ike won’t either. When that number rises, so will his hits and doubles. His second AB with the bases loaded yesterday would’ve plated 2 with the ball in a different spot.
They didn’t do it almost every AB this early. Take off the blinders for a minute. As a coach I will tell you that refs are human and do carry grudges and do talk to each other. So if a “kid” is showing them up they will teach that kid a lesson.
Also, calling Derek Jeter classless is just well… classless. I hate the Yankees as much as anyone but that’s going to far. Next you will be saying that Mo is overrated as well… LOL never mind you already did that
Also for the BABIP I have never understood this completely. Unless it is used in pair with his line drive percentage couldn’t it also just show how much he sucks? So a hitter who is in a funk is also hitting balls that results in outs? Well duh. If all Ike is doing is getting out ahead and either striking out or rolling the ball to the 2B, guess what? He will have a low BABIP. Just like if a pitcher has a high BABIP if that stat is not paired with something else couldn’t it just show that he is throwing meatballs out there?
Yes, sneaking girls out the backdoor to your place and then ditching them in the morning with a limo ride and giftbasket, that’s classy. bitching about every call, that’s classy. manipulating your finances to try to evade taxes, classy. Giving empty quotes and then running away to the training room as soon as possible after games, classy. Refusing to stand up for teammates when they’re being criticized and you’re asked about it, classy.
Is Johan full of class? Come on Ceetar, and they call me blindly optimistic.
Are we talking about Johan? no.
There’s a huge difference between marketing class and actually being classy. But then I’ve never been one to buy into advertising campaigns.
Also, so a multi millionaire bachelor in NY is not supposed to have some fun? You think that most of those girls don’t know what the deal is? Don’t hate the player, hate the game.
I have no problem with it. But there’s a difference between it being ‘acceptable’ (I imagine others disagree, but whatever) behavior and it being classy.
Well no one was talking about Jeter when they were talking about Wright.. LOL.
That being said athletes class is judged more by what they do on the field than off. Jeter has been a model for professionalism on the field and saying otherwise is just plain foolish. I would take Jeter on this team even in his dilapidated form.
Jeter at Citi Field for 81 games and people will be calling for them to move the fences in further, and perhaps suggesting they should add a 5th infielder to cover all those balls he misses.
LOL, never mind Ceetar.
I’m amused that in a thread killing Ike Davis for a small sample size you’re trumpeting Jeter’s small sample size on the opposite end of the spectrum. His .787 OPS over the last 4 years, adjusted for park, and I’d rather take my chances Ruben Tejada. He makes up for any difference in defense, never mind age.
Again, never mind.
sorry, I always forget facts get in the way of a good preconceived notion.
It isn’t about facts Ceetar, it’s about biases and rose colored glasses with you. I am going to get the core striking against me but I am firm in my belief that if Jeter was a Met in 2006-2008 instead of Reyes, we would have won a WS or at least made the WS. Jeter is a consummate professional on the field and that is why he is viewed as a leader by his teammates. Why do you think his teammates, who are stars themselves, consider him the leader in the clubhouse?
Hell, or even alex rodriguez at 3B right? instead of our own guy who came up smalls in regular season games and no show in the playoffs… You can make both arguments and be right… Right???
Hmmm, that’s a good question Alex. However, I think that Arod during that time was even more unclutch than Wright. I also think that Jeter’s vocal leadership might have pulled them through the slumps and maybe he wouldn’t have tanked every September that mattered during that time. Hell maybe if the Mets hadn’t choked as a team in 2007 then Wright would still be clutch to start with.
Well being a former musician as classless as you think that behavior is I bet not a single woman expected anything more from thier encounter!
Everyone tries to evade taxes even congressman who are charged with writing the tax law!
I dare you to cite a quote from Wright that was full of insight and chock full of something other than cliche…
But yesterday Wright did stand up for Davis and went to the UMP to try and stand up for his bat throwing…So in that comparison Wright wins hands down!
People are people and most people are out for themselves nothing more!
Dod eat Dog world and as bad as those fine ladies got treated by Jeter I’m sure they all ran to their friends to discuss his blessings, shortcomings as just another nbotch in their portfolio!
Because it’s my experience that most women whop pick up fame are in it just for the fame and the notch!
Same as any guy who does it for beautiful women who are not famous!
People in general aren’t classy!
This!!! Spot on Ceetar!
Yep. Ike’s batted ball stats are awful. His LD/GB/FB is 12.8%/56.4%/30.8% and his Infield fly rate is 16.7% He’s making terrible contact, and that’s why his BABIP is so low, not because he’s unlucky.
For reference, Wright, who looks like he’s finally coming down from a torrid start, is 32.5 %/37.5 %/30.0 % and he hasn’t popped out to the infield all year. Normal is somewhere in the middle. If you’re near 25%/35%/40% and your BABIP is still low, we can talk about unlucky at’em balls.
Ike’s BABIP has nothing to do with his slump, his slump is affecting his BABIP.
Agreed, BABIP without the rest of the story is pointless.
There is one story. It’s small sample size. There’s a song for that.
his BABIP is simply an example of it. So is his LD%. so is curveball-seen percentage. When the slump comes at the beginning, it looks ugly. We’re still at least a week from any real cause for concern. He’ll be fine.
Right but giving us his BABIP as an example of why he will be fine is also pointless.
sorry, but it’s the cleanest stat imo. It’s clearly showing he’s not getting a lot of hits that are finding holes. I’m not trying to deduce the reason, merely pointing out that it won’t continue. I could just say “16 games is practically nothing, it’s an extremely small sample size, yes obviously he’s slumping but how about we wait for a sizable chunk of time to pass before suggesting anything rash or trying to dream up ‘solutions’”
He’s not going to hit .136. I guess that gets it done too. whatever. small sample.
The reason he’s not finding holes is because he’s making weak contact and the fielders are getting there before the ball does. You’re telling us that if he continues to make this kind of contact, his batted balls will just miraculously find holes? That’s silly.
no, i’m simply telling you that regardless of the reason for his BABIP or his BA or his LD% or his “hitting the ball hard”ness, it won’t continue. it’s early. slumps happen. It’s early. It’s early. small sample sizes are not predictive. it’s early.
i.e. don’t worry about it.
Why won’t it continue? Why will he be ok? How long will he slump?
Would you have predicted a year of a .150 BA for Dunn? I bet his BABIP was low too?
Adam Dunn’s babip last year weas .240 down from a career average .293. His LD was 20%, same as league average and his 2010, but down from his career average 22%. his IF flyballs were way up, and his home runs/fly ball way down. His walks weren’t really down and his strikeouts were way way up. Probably have to drill down to the individual pitch types to figure out what it was. was he swinging at more curves and popping them up or something? *shrug*
Considering the slump is 7.7% of his total MLB plate appearances, I’d take the other 92.3% that suggests this won’t continue. The cause being his layoff, bad luck, nagging injury? who knows. But going to need to see a lot more than 60 at-bats to worry.
But BABIP by itself just shows how much a player is sucking. It does not show that it’s bound to improve. If a player is either striking out or rolling over and hitting every ball they do make contact with softly to 2B then yeah their BABIP is going to be low and so is their average. Just because it’s low doesn’t mean it will go up, not until he starts making good contact. You are implying that Ike is just being unlucky and that’s not true, he’s just being sucky.
His BABIP is low because he’s not making solid contact the few times he has made contact. This is not a case of bad luck, small sample or not. This is a case of the hitter being lost at the moment and a hitter who better start making adjustments if he wants to keep his everyday job. Lets not over analyze. He’s been awful.
Right and we have nothing to say that it will or will not continue or how long it will continue. You certainly can’t use BABIP right now to predict that he will improve only to the fact that if he doesn’t he won’t be here to improve.
here is the formula for BAbip, luckly we don’t need to refresh our calculus for this one:
(Hits – HR)/(ABs – SO – HR + Sac Flies)
So the intent to to show the effectiveness of his hits, and also the effectiveness of the opposing defense he plays against. I think it is on of the more interesting statistics out there. At this point his BAbip is only 3 points higher than his average, and that is because he is just not hitting the ball at all.
“Instead of Collins making excuses for him, maybe he should set his head straight and tell Davis to stop lunging at everything.”
Works for Jeter. He often gets 3 or 4 strikes each at bat.
Ike is in a slump – it’s going to be OK.
Ike is not going to the minors & Daniel Murphy is not moving to 1B. Ike is going to come out of it. This is the same type of knee jerk, uncontrollable reflex action that people do – just like articles like “Consider Me One Happy Fan” after like 9 days or “Do You Believe In This Team” after 8 days or so..or “Do The Mets Have A Snowball’s Chance” after like 5 days lol.
Now get ready for the cliche – April 23rd. He’ll be fine
I think and hope you are right but he is still basically a kid Bay. Don’t you think that if his struggles continue for a couple more weeks it might be time to send him down to AAA to get his swing straight before completely wrecking his confidence? I am not saying cast him aside and give up on him, just let him breathe for a minute.
“Ike is going to come out of it”
yep he is!
The Mets can either move Ike somewhere in the lineup where he gets some protection from a better hitter in hopes he sees some more fastballs and gets going or they can drop him in the order until he can work himself through his slump.
As crazy as it sounds to say it the most consistent bat B.A. wise of the 4-5-6 slots has been Jason Bay so even though I doubt Bay will strike fear to opposing teams when they see him on deck with Bay at the plate. Bay offers probably a better (though by how much can be debated) chance of Davis seeing fastballs.
Doing that though would mean batting Davis 4th and Bay 5th most likely and I hate to bat Duda 6th because I feel he may be coming around with his bat. That is why i’d rather just take the 2nd option and drop Davis in the lineup until he can straighten himself out.
So rather than Davis, Bay, Duda in the 4-5-6 slots I’d flip flop Davis and Duda and go Duda, Bay, Davis.
And if Collins really wanted to shake the lineup up.
Nieuwenhuis
Tejada
Murphy
Wright
Duda
Bay
Davis
Thole
Though how Davis would handle being dropped to the 7th slot would be a concern.
With the way Tejada is hitting, that might not be a bad way to go.
Your lineup is basically what I propose above.
What about
Tejada, Davis, Wright, Duda, Bay/Murphy, Murphy/Bay? Maybe Davis gets a few more FB and can slow down a little?
Pretty close on the guess about the lineup shakeup.
Tuesday lineup vs. Miami: Nieuwenhuis-CF, Tejada-SS, Murphy-2B, Wright-3B, Duda-RF, Davis-1B, Baxter-LF, Thole-C, Santana-LHP
http://twitter.com/#!/Mets/statuses/194862936265732096
I see three-four Mets I like at the plate when we need a hit, whom you might call CLUTCH:
Turner
Thole
Murphy
Tejada
Not power hitters, just good situational hitters. I wish there were more of a role for Turner on this team. He is a serious gamer, and I think he proved it last year. He’s exactly the kind of guy a great playoff bound team should have!
I like this article and agree. The one thing I would suggest different is to have Murphy stay at second. Move Bay down in the line up and put Neuwinhuis (I know i butchered his name) in at clean up.
Bay is just as bad of a rally killer and I think Neu is doing well and has an attack mode that a clean up hitter should have, not the power, but the ability to get things done.
collins is right – umps cannot hold grudges now because they are graded on every pitch. so joe d, you are wrong with your theory. ump grading determines how they are promoted and how much money they make…or even whether they keep their jobs. but the problem that creates is now umps throw guys out if you even look at them the wrong way. umps are a joke – instead of holding a judge calling pitches, they’ll just toss the guy out.
I’M SORRY; BUT DESPERATION,IMO, PUT IKE & THE TEAM IN THIS POSITION. WE SHOULD ALL RECAKLL HOW IKE’S MiLB CAREER WAS SHORTENED BY DESPERATION ON THE MLB LEVEL & HOW WHAT WAS TO BE HIS SOPHOMORE, CEWMENTING HIS CREDS SEASON WAS DEVASTATED BY INJURY CAUSED BY PELFREY’S BRAIN FREEZE, HOW IS IT POSSIBLE PROFESSIONAL BASEBALL MEN CAN CLAIM SUPRISE WHEN A FAST-TRACKED YOUNG TALENT LOSES AN ENTIRE SEASON TO INJURY COMPOUNDED BY OFFSEASON CONTACT WITH VALLEY FEVER PRODUCES HIS WEAKEST SPRING SEASON OF HIS PRO CAREER.
UNFORTUNATELY, THE THIN VENEER THAT IS THE DESIGNED DEPTH ON THIS TEAM WOULD NOT SUPPORT THE PROPER DESIGNATION OF IKE’S SEASON COMMENCING IN BUFFALO UNTIL THE RUST WAS TOTALLY SCRAPED OFF WITH DUDA @ 1B & ANY ONE OF THE OUTFIELD HOPEFULS IN RF.
RIGHT NOW, I FEAR THE ISSUE IS BEYOND CORRECTING QUICKLY & THIS COMPETITIVE YET NONCONTENDING COLLECTION OF AFFORDABLE WILPON KNICK-KNACKS WILL HAVE TO WEATHER THE RUST DISSOLVING MEASURES IKE WILL NEED TO PLAY THROUGH MEANWHILE, CAN ANYONE EXPLAIN HOW A SUPPOSEDLY OTHERWISE ASTUTE GM LIKE ALDERSON ALLOWED A CAPABLE RHH LIKE EVANS SLIP OFF THIS LH DOMINATED ROSTER?
WHO WAS IT THAT VALUED BAXTER MORE?
UNRELATED MIAMI GAME 1 OBSERVATION:
WHILE THOSE IN ATTENDANCE CHOSE TO BOO REYES VOCIFEROUSLY THE VASTLY EMPTY SEATS SCREAMED THE LOUDEST BOOS AGAINST THE WILPONS!
I think Ike will continue to be screwed up until he commits himself to hitting some balls the other way. That is the only way he will learn to stay back on the pitch. Then he can gradually adjust back to pulling the ball. He should not be a pull hitter though. I wonder if the fences have got in his head, since they moved right center in?