24
2012
Mets Would Like To Trade Pelfrey
An article by 
PELFREY: Will it ever happen for him?
Jon Heyman of CBS Sports reports that the Mets would like to trade Mike Pelfrey:
Tough market. But rival exec says, “best thing for him might be to get out of New York.”
It’s time. Just do it. – Joe D.
Original Post 3/23
Mike Pelfrey continues to tick me off. This time, it is hearing the news has been pitching with a high right ankle sprain during spring training. Pelfrey said he injured his ankle in the offseason and aggravated it the beginning of camp.
There are several ways to look at this, none of them good for the Mets:
- If Pelfrey is injured, then he’s a complete idiot for not telling the Mets’ trainers and medical staff immediately. It is common knowledge in the sport that leg injuries often lead to arm injuries because it alters the pitcher’s mechanics and puts a strain on the arm. As a pitcher, how does Pelfrey, either not know this or chooses to ignore it? Just plain stupid. Pelfrey came to camp saying this could be a make or break season for him, so given that, why would he take such a risk? Just dumb.
- These players get their ankles wrapped every day. How could a trainer miss this? There has to be tenderness, soreness, slight swelling or change in color.
- What does pitching coach Dan Warthen have to say about this? Warthen told reporters the ankle is why Pelfrey has primarily pitched out of the stretch most of this spring and why his velocity was down. So, with that answer, Warthen is saying he sent Pelfrey out there knowing he had a bum ankle. That’s got to be a new level of stupid.
Still, it goes back to Pelfrey. It’s his ankle. It’s his career. He’s been around long enough to know what to do and hiding an injury always comes back to bite you. It’s proof he really doesn’t get it.
In 9.2 innings this season, Pelfrey has given up 18 runs on 20 hits and six walks. That stinks by any measure.
I read where sources close to the team suggested if Pelfrey were dealt he’d be great somewhere else. Sources close to the team DOES NOT mean affiliated with the team. Even if that is the Mets’ thinking, it shouldn’t be. That was the fear in releasing Oliver Perez, remember?
If Pelfrey does leave and develops it will be because of a change in the pitching coach and the light suddenly goes on.
Currently, Pelfrey is not pitching well enough to deserve a chance in the major league rotation. Sending him out there just to accumulate innings is not a good explanation. It’s the same thing as saying “we got to get this over with.’’ It is also an admission they have nobody else.
The Mets’ best hope with Pelfrey, as it was with Perez, for him to somehow turn it on. Given the remoteness of that happening, their next best option is to send him to the minors, have him heal and hopefully fix himself. Perhaps he can then come up, give the Mets a handful of quality starts to attract attention at the trade deadline.
As far as who would take his place? Sign a major league reject off the scrap heap or go with the Mets’ highest rated prospect. As far as going to a four-man rotation, there are enough off days in April for that to work, but it is uncertain how that might impact Johan Santana if he were to make the Opening Day roster.
Santana is another thing keeping Pelfrey around. The Mets don’t dare do anything until they are certain about Santana.
About the Author: John Delcos
I am an active member of the BBWAA and have covered Major League Baseball in several capacities for over 20 years, including ten in New York working the Mets' and Yankees' beat. I covered the Baltimore Orioles for eight years and the Cleveland Indians before that. I currently serve as an editor and senior staff writer for Mets Merized Online. Follow me on Twitter @jdelcos.
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NL East Standings
| Team | W | L | Pct. | GB |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Braves | 42 | 30 | .583 | - |
| Phillies | 35 | 37 | .486 | 7.0 |
| Nationals | 34 | 36 | .486 | 7.0 |
| Mets | 27 | 40 | .403 | 12.5 |
| Marlins | 22 | 48 | .314 | 19.0 |
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The guy doesn’t need a coach who’s a friend who pats him on the head and tell him ‘don’t worry, everything is going to be okay junior.’ He needs a coach who will beat him over the head with pitching mechanics and emphasis on mental toughness. You’re absolutely right John, the guy doesn’t get it. And the organization is at least partially to blame for babying him since he’s come up.
In early 2010 when he got off to his good start, I hoped to hell they would sell high at trading deadline. Since that trading deadline he’s gone downhill. They should release him now and spare all of us the pain of watching him pitch.
I’m not sure but I think yesterday was the last day they could release him and only be on the hook for a portion of his salary. I think it’s too late to cut him without eating the whole 5.7 mil.
I just can’t wait to get his guy off the team.
I got the impression the Mets were well aware of Pelfrey’s ankle problem.
This article reads otherwise. Is that an assumption or is it fact? If it’s fact, I missed that.
I thought it was something they were dealing with that the media didn’t know about, therefore neither did the fans.
Pelfrey doesn’t need a coach he needs a shrink!
And while I agree in principle with the assertion that leg injuries can cause arm injuries because you need the leg drive to get your velocity…
One of my problems with Pelfrey is he may just be the exception to that rule!
My biggest knock on him is he doesn’t use his legs enough and always tends to look like he is just throwing batting practice (which he usually it as the stats show!)
His shrink died. Only the Mets.
Are you serious or or just joking there? LOL
No, it is serious. He was working with a sports psychologist, and the guy died (before last season I believe).
The “only the Mets” part was just an editorial garnish.
I honestly did not know that…But as macabre and distastefull as this will sound….
It might be a good thing because he obviously wasn’t helping!
Time for a new guy!
Thanks for that!
He was helping him in the first half of 2010. That’s the last time I could remember Pelfrey attacking the hitters and not pace around the back of the mound licking his hands.
It is well known that Pefrey got to the majors with counseling from a sports psychologist who taught him to excel at Wichita State. Once he got to the Mets, that counseling was no longer available to him and his performance tanked. The psychologist died a couple seasons ago and with that Pefrey’s career died also. Warthen is clueless to provide guidance to Pelfrey and he is not smart enough to figure it our for himself. So he is now an innings eater with substandard performance not worth the contract the Mets have chosen to embellish him upon him. It is a hopeless situation. Forget about releasing him. The cheapskate owners won’t take that hit to their pocket book. Mets fans are stuck with this guy. Just for carnival interest, it will be interesting to see whether he can break Anthony Young’s record of futility in this year of the Mets 50th anniversary.
LOL Anthony Young…
I was at the game he finally broke the loosing streak! LOL
You know since most of Pelfrey problems have been in the head (I have always said that just never knew about the shrink part makes sense now) He might just do a lot better awau from NY in a smaller market where the pressure would not be so bad….
Maybe a change of location would be good for him and he might turn out to be what he was supposed to.
On target about his mechanics!!
You know Russel I have an old old system for evaluating Starting Pitchers and their mechanics…
It’s called Dirtometrics! LOL
If the guy has a dirty knee when he gets off the mound he is a keeper!
You know he will maintain his velocity long term, will be keeping the ball down and is using his legs as much if not more than just his arm meaning he will be less proned to arm injury!
Seaver Koosman even Gooden all had a dirty knee!
LOL
seaver was amazing at that.
http://i2.cdn.turner.com/si/2009/writers/michael_bamberger/07/08/seaver.tribute/tom-seaver.p1.jpg
Just because it _could_ alter his mechanics doesn’t mean it is. Presumably this is being monitored, and maybe he’s pitching out of the stretch because it doesn’t hurt that way?
He still has to build up his arm strength to 100 pitch strength for the season. He’s still better, no matter what you believe, than Miguel Batista or ‘scrap heap’ guys. He’s been pretty consistent, with most of the fluctuation coming due to batted ball luck. There’s no reason to think this season will be any different, and his numbers will likely fall anywhere between 2010 and 2011 numbers which is good enough to keep the Mets in most games and add value and win over the long haul.
Hey! Don’t I know you?
No.
Also, Lucas Duda is awesome.
Damned straight.
Ha!
very weird. But not even the Mets are dumb enough to send the guy out in ST if it is bad. At some point it could be minor enough to just be something you play through (like during the regular season when guys play with all kinds of tweaks/pains/strains/pulls.).
But I will say that I believe 100% that Warthen is somewhere between worthless and a dangerous menace.
I’ll be interested to see what sort of impact (not that we’ll be able to tell/know) Ricky Bones has this year.
Big Pelf was a BIG letdown. Maybe he wasnt a total bust, but definitely a big letdown.
Well, If Mike’s injury occured during the winter and became aggrevated enough to prevent him from throwing properly, a stint on the disabled list would seem appropriate come opening day so not to make the injury even worse.
Talking about pitchers with compounded injuries, wonder if the evil eye hovering over the Mets has reached it’s way to the bronx.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/baseball/mlb/wires/03/23/2010.ap.bba.yankees.chamberlain.2nd.ld.writethru.0420/index.html
@Kranepool7, that’s what happens when you get skipped through the system at a rapid pace. They screwed him up from the word go.
When has Pelfrey ever “got it” to begin with? If it wasn’t for the fact that brass wanting Harvey to get more seasoning, because obviously he will be here later in the year, Pelfrey wouldn’t be here. Just cut his ass. NOW. I’d rather deal with Javier Vazquez, who had a fantastic 2nd half last season & somehow hasn’t signed anywhere as of this post, than have another headache just from watching Pelfrey pitch.
That’s because he retired.
Really? I’ve heard retirement rumors all offseason, but nothing official. Last I heard, he was “50-50″ on playing in 2012 and wants to play on the East Coast if he does.
Nope they were talking about it the other day on MLBN that while he isn’t “officially retired” he has no current desire to play again. He left it open because he doesn’t want to be the type to retire and unretire so I guess you could say he just quit… LOL. IF he wanted to play he would be on the Marlins.
Ahhh I see. Guess he just wanted to go out on a great note. Best to leave the door open than to pull a Brett Favre. It’s a shame because I wouldn’t have mind him signing a 1 year deal here.
C’mon this injury isn’t any kind of breaking news or big secret. It was reported weeks ago that Pelf tweaked his ankle early in camp.
Thought I read that too.
Here is the story back on Feb 24 SRT,
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20120224&content_id=26833098¬ebook_id=26843604&vkey=notebook_nym&c_id=nym&partnerId=rss_nym
That’s right. Thanks!
So this wasn’t a matter of Pelfrey ‘hiding’ anything from the Mets.
goes back to what I said earlier. Having to decide how significant it is, and whether he should play through it (the old it won’t make it worse idea!). During the season, guys play with tweaked ankles, tight groins, achy hammys, etc. all the time.
Harder to shut down a pitcher than it is a hitter also, if you are doing it “just in case”. Wright can get season ready in 2 weeks, a pitcher can’t.
Agreed.
I have to assume since they knew about it and Pelfrey wasn’t shut down, it’s not all that serious. Pelfrey himself refused to use it as an excuse for poor pitching so far this spring.
At this point, just cut pelf… at that salary, you could prob turn that into a backup CF and 2 SPs…
It was time to cut ties in December.
But the belief that he was a “valuable innings eater” won out. And be fair Mets fans, many of you believed that as well.
Sandy Alderson believes that. And he’s correct. And I trust him over you.
it is never about 1 guy in abstract. It always involves more, such as who you can get to replace him, his future contract status, what you project him to do ongiong, will you be able to trade him later, what impact it has on guys in the minors (maybe having to be rushed up). And money of course.
LOL…..it was a mistake by Sir Sandy. And 75% of Mets fans. Pelfrey is awful.
If you type these 3 keywords in google and make sure the name is in quotations – “Greg Pomes” Pelfrey Metsmerized
Look at the first 2 search results – too funny. Sorry Greg didn’t mean to throw you under the bus but this is just toooo funny and some coincidence LOL
Metsi,
Eating innings was what many praised Chris Capuano for as well and I think it camoflagued how bad he was really pitching. But whether we should give up on Pelfrey does depend upon who can replace him in the rotation. Don’t rush Harvey at the moment or obtain a starter released by another club who wouldn’t be any better. If there is another disappointng starter that another club also wishes to unload, perhaps a trade could be worked out (don’t claim to know for whom) but the change in venue could possibly help both players. Either way, we wouldn’t be in worse shape that we are now.
Otherwise, give Pelf the chance to pitch himself back into something until an opportunity to replace him in the rotation comes up.
It’s a shame Omar’s vision of a big three (Perez, Pefrey, Maine) didn’t work out. Perhaps his vision for Niese, Gee and Harvey will.
I don’t consider a guy getting to the 6th inning on average to be eating innings…but maybe thats just me!
Especially when he leaves there are 5 or 6 runs on the board!
I call that FILLING innings not so much eating them! LOL
Well couple of things, I don’t think anyone considers one game of 5 innings being a innings eater. Now if they pitch 32-34 starts and over 200 innings then yeah that is closer to the definition of an innings eater.
Lets think about sample size though. IF Pelfrey is only pitching 5.5 innings on average (which most of the time it’s closer to 6 but I digress) and has an ERA between 4.00 and 4.50 which Pelfrey does then most of the time he has given up between 2 and 3 runs. It just feels like 5-6.
I definitely prefer Capuano over Pelfrey. Can’t believe they gave this man over 5 million, he’s not worth 500,000.
They should have kept Capuano and let Pelf go. I personally think the injury is just an excuse.
The injury very well could have been an excuse.
I liked Cap but he did sign a 2 year contract worth 10M with a 3rd year option and a 1M buyout. That’s a lot for a guy that in his healthiest season since 2006 pitched 185 innings and a 4.55 ERA. In his last 65 starts he is 20-28 with a 4.66 ERA. For those that love wins, Cap has had one winning season in his entire career. This is why the Mets did indeed pay Pelf what they did because this is what back end guys go for. Would you rather have Pelfrey at 1 year 5.5M or Pelfrey at 2 years 10M?
Hi Tr,
And in regards to Capuano, notice how hard he was hit (except for the one gem pitched in August) since early June? From that point on his ERA was five.
Observers said they noticed no change in velocity any time during the season – it was consistent throughout the 162 game schedule. They noted the change was due to Cappy being out so long that it took hitters a while to get familiar with him again. Once they did that, he was easy pickings.
Maybe the Mets didn’t resign him knowing he could only pitch worse with a more hitter friendly Citi Field for he certainly did not do well when it was pitcher friendly one.
Back to Pelfrey, the facial shots of him on the mound remind of the way Calvin Schiraldi appeared on the mound in game six – scared. Pelf has lost his security blanket which has been the downfall of many a pitcher besides Oliver Perez.
So much for Miggy being a better replacement for Pelfrey. He got rocked today too.
John,
I agree with you ten thousand percent! I mean really, enough with this guy. At the very least, send him down to the minors to get ‘fixed’ for a few months. When Ollie was around they sent him down a few times and they should do the same with Pelfrey. Unless there’s an options issue where the team can’t send him contractually, but not sure how that works 100%.
John, he can’t throw strikes for the life of him. He constantly gets into unfavorable counts, 2-0, 3-0, 3-1, and is then forced to throw meatballs. Sound familiar Oliver Perez?
We’ve been saying this on our site and posted eye popping stats. Check Pelfreys home runs given up at home v road. Mental Mike Pelfrey has (ready for this one) given up TWICE as many home runs on the road than at home. Cavernous Citi Field has saved him ass. And now with the fences in it’ll get worse.
Can they just bring up one of the young guns? Doc was 19 or so, it’s been done before. Get one of these young guys up and get him some major league experience. Who knows. We’re not expecting anyone to be like Doc, but if we can get someone who’s half of what Doc was, I’ll take it.
Doc was ready physically. These guys do not appear to be. Lets not forget though that bringing Doc up at that age may have not done him any favors either. Was he mentally ready? Mature enough?
get rid of warthem and the medical staff both are the worst in baseball
It’s about time the Mets sent this idiot packing. They’re a few years late, but still, it’s the best thing for them to do. While they’re at it, show Warthen the door too.
I’d like to trade Pelfrey too
I just made a post about this on TRDM. I have been saying all along that just because the Mets tendered him a contract and offered arbitration doesn’t mean he will be on the opening day roster. That deadline allowing them to only pay termination pay is quickly approaching and if he provides another stinker today that might be all she wrote.
I thought the new CBA changed the rule but apparently not. They have to cut him 16 days before opening day and then would only have to pay a portion of his salary. Unless they changed that part of it, the 16 days before, I think it’s too late.
It was reported yesterday that they still have until next week some time.
It may be the 29th I have read a few other players having that as the date.
Okay, thanks. Someone posted a link the other day saying clubs have until the 16th day before opening day. Maybe it was on older link and I didn’t bother to check. In any event at least thy have that option and I hope the go that route. I can’t stand watching him meltdown, even in the spring it’s driving me nuts
You don’t hear a lot about baseball teams trading for draft picks…but, without question, I think Mike Pelfrey could be worth a trade for 2 picks between the 35th to 40th rounds.
you don’t hear about it because they aren’t allowed to do it.
It was a joke…I’ll try to dumb it down next time.
these days around here, always safest to assume the dumbest out of posters. Nothing personal!
Yesx. Mike Pelfrey is an idiot. Watching his facial expressions and seeing the smoke coming out of his ears is excruciating. Every game his approach changes. When I see he is starting in ST, I do not watch the game.
Well, Pelf has again eaten innings, less then two weeks to go to opening day and he made into the sixth. Of course, those five runs means he’s already in mid season form – and Ike Davis just saved him from giving up a sixth. He got through the lineup the first time around and was then hit hard after that.
Bob Ojeda said it best early in the broadcast. Mike’s 28 and this is his sixth season in the majors so at this point he should no longer still be trying to find himself.
Fact: Pelfrey was dumb to attempt pitching this way though I am sure his intentions were good.
Fact: Dan Warthan is a terrible, absolutely horrible pitching coach! We fired Rick Petersen and hired this moron and all that has happened since for Mets pitching as a whole is complete regression. He inherited a winning staff and under his watch it has completely fallen apart. The Mets would do themselves a service if they fired him before the season started.
Pelfrey is a head case and he cannot handle NYC they should have traded him when he had some real value.
Terry Collins is protecting this guy. He made what I call “the pre excuse” the first week of spring training when he laid the blame on Josh Thole. Go back and read what Collins said about Thole and the game he calls. He threw Thole under the bus and all but said Pelf gets a free pass. I caught hell from all the Terry Collins’ lovers but I am having none of it.
You know who also protected this guy?
Peterson. (although he actually made Pelfrey somewhat decent)
Manuel.
Minaya.
Warthen.
Alderson.
I never understood why he was coveted so much for years. Somehow, all these people thought he had what it took to be a ML roster when fact is, if he wasn’t a Met, he would’ve been cut a long, long time ago. Remember during the offseason, when guys like Kuroda & Oswalt (I know he’s a Type A FA, but…) were available, Alderson said something along of the lines of that the guys currently in the rotation were deserving of a spot? My first reaction was, “Mike Pelfrey is deserving of a spot?!?!” You’re right about one thing: Thole may be mediocre, but he surely didn’t deserve to have all of the blame on him.
I like what you said and I might add that the Mets wouldn’t be in this mess because they could of had a journeyman pitcher in Jason Marquis, a NY boy who wanted to pitch in New York and probably would have taken a contract for 2 mil. He signed with the Twins for 3 mil, still pretty cheap for a quality starter.And here is something else. Chipper is undergoing knee surgery again and the Braves will need their outfielder Prado to 3rd so they have an abundance of pitching and want to move Jurgens and possibly one other guy for an outfielder. I wish we would eat Bay’s salary and move him for one of these pitchers. but I am in fantasy land now.
I think the fantasy is the Braves wanting any part of Bay!
While I really like Jurrjens, I wonder why the Braves, an organization who knows something about pitching (although they gave up on their hometown kid who became a star elsewhere in Adam Wainwright), would give away Jurrjens on the verge of hitting his prime. Since Chipper’s retiring at the end of the season, and Wright is gonna be a goner for the most part after the season (add to the fact that he’s a southern kid), you’d think the Braves would be keeping a close eye on Wright before the deadline. Just throwing that out there.
The Braves are stocked with pitching in Jurgens, Hudson, Medlen, Hanson, Minor,Beachy, and two kids Tejan and one other guy that is ready. Heck the’ve got two bonafide closers in Venters and Kimbrel. What they have in pitching they lack in power and this is why I think within a week Jurgens goes and a hitter comes in, an outfielder with pop.
Listen, they are not dumping Pelf anytime soon no matter how much we want it to happen…the sad fact is, Pelf isn’t an innings eater (a guy who has only barley reached 200 innings twice in his career topping out at 204 is not a innings eater), Pelfs a guy who can go out and make 30+ starts a year. With the questionable health of Johan and Neise and knowing that Gee has never made it through a full season and the is no one ready to fill in, we need a guy like Pelf.
Yes Pelf sucks, I hate that we still have him, I hate that Sandy did nothing to improve the rotation.
We can take turns pointing the blame on Fred or Alderson or Warthen all we want, but unless someone gets released before the start of the season, what choice do we have? Sadly, the idea of another teams reject sounds like a upgrade from our “last years Ace”.
USMF — “Pelf isn’t an innings eater ”
What’s your definition of an innings eater? A guy who throw 245 innings a season or more? I think you’re setting the bar awfully high.
Maybe his problem IS to many innings. Less innings= less run giving up.
Have you heard the news? This just in…coming across the ticker tape:
Mike Pelfrey Still Sucks!
Ha! If you changed ticker tape for text message you have yourself the makings of a AT&T 4G commercial.
A few years ago Kevin Burkhardt did a great interview with Pelf’s old college coach Gene Stephenson. The old coach was disgusted with the way his prodigy was pitching. He wanted Pelf to go back to his curve and attack the hitters with his fastball. It was a great interview. I hope SNY will air it again.
This is why I don’t find it impossible to believe that Pelfrey could still have a good career. He’s never been injured and there is no question that his first half season as a pro he dominated, then was brought to the Majors and has never come close to dominating since, even back in the minors.
Very strange to lose it just like that for no apparent reason other than poor development. Rarely if ever does he even throw his curve which was a strong pitch for him at Wichita State.
Hope they take their time with Harvey.
Pelfrey’s velocity declined in minors before he got promoted. His k/9 rates also took a hit. I blame Peterson. He took away his curve, told him to pitch to contact, made him less effective.
Well his 4 starts in St. Lucie were fantastic. His 12 starts in AA kept the same strikeout rate but his walks quadrupled. He then got two starts in Norfolk where his walks went way up again while his K’s when down by a 1/3rd but that’s only 2 starts.
Naturally he was brought right up after just 16 minor league starts even with seriously deteriorating results especially in AAA. He’s never had significantly better stats for an extended period than he did at Norfolk. It’s hard to believe that he could have just lost it after on 14 games as a pro.
Peterson would have worked with him in ST and when Pelfrey came up in July but it would seem more like Pelfrey wasn’t pitching to contact in AA and that was only more pronounced in AAA. His hits against stayed fairly similar through out his first season in the minors except in AAA where they actually improved quite a bit (again just 2 starts) so it wouldn’t seem that he became afraid to pitch to contact.
Really is just a mystery how he could have settled in at such a low level after such a great College career and a decent start in the minors, at least through AA.
T,
An even bigger mystery was what ever happened to Steve Blass some forty years ago. Though there is no definitive explanation why he went from a near Cy Young winner to being washed out just two years later (one theory was being unable to handle the loss of his very close friend Roberto Clemente in that plane crash)
http://www.baseball-reference.com/bullpen/Steve_Blass
tag — The arm and shoulder are often fragile. He seems to have lost some command after his first season. The Mets brought him up with less than 100 innings pitched in the minors. The first year he wore four different Mets organization uniforms. Maybe it’s as simple as desperate GM’s do desperate things — dumb to say the least.
I’ve got a good reply for that tagline, ala Austin Powers: Well, I’d like a golden toilet bowl but It’s just not in the cards, is it? Too little, too late.