9
2012
The Anti-Mets Agenda: Whatever Happened To Journalistic Integrity?
An article by 
In the space of an hour today, I saw a series of posts from various ESPN journalists on Twitter that really had me scratching my head this morning. Check these out…
Those are just Marchand and Olney, there were more. Law decides to rank the Mets farm system 22nd (a total cheap shot), Rubin took an unfair knock at MetsBlog referring to it as an SNY owned venture rather than by it’s name.
It’s like ESPN’s CEO and President handed all their minions marching orders to trash on the Mets…
I don’t really get all this hate toward the Mets, seriously I don’t…
I mean when when exactly did ESPN lose its journalistic integrity? Does objectivity matter anymore? What about facts, do facts matter anymore?
On that note I thought I’d respond like this:
Next topic of discussion…
A couple of days ago a real online melee ensued after renowned Mets fan and well known journalist Howard Megdal had his credential revoked by the Mets because they did not like his reporting. Whether you agree or disagree with that is a matter of semantics, but I would argue this:
If Adam Rubin had authored “Wilpon’s Folly”, would he have been as staunchly defended as Megdal was throughout the Mets blogosphere without one post even giving the Mets an iota of the benefit of the doubt?
This isn’t about whether or not you agree with what the Mets did, it comes down to being fair and objective. I got a word of thanks from the Mets yesterday, although they didn’t need to thank me because on Metsmerized we always present both sides to a story regardless of what the story is. That’s how we roll. As a fan site all opinions are fairly represented here whether I agree with them or not. Sure it leads to some heated debates that sometimes go over the top, but I would rather have this than the alternative which is a site that takes on the monotone personality and philosophy of the one running it.
After this fiasco, I’d say the Mets would be well within their rights to revoke access to all Mets bloggers. Now I can certainly see why MLB Advanced Media and all of the 30 MLB teams were so reluctant to give independent bloggers and freelance writers a press credential for so many, many years. Too many loose cannons, too little accountability, and hardly any benefit for the teams.
I’m not a writer and I don’t pretend to be one. I’m exactly what I’ve always said I was – a die-hard Met fan with a never ending thirst to talk about the Mets. As I’ve told so many and as it states in my bio – I started this site to feed my addiction to the Mets. That doesn’t mean I’m not critical of the moves they make or don’t make, or some of the things they do. Those who read MMO know fully well how critical I am – almost to a fault. But that’s why I’m glad I have about two dozen or so other writers on board to counter my occasional outbursts. And unlike me, they are writers, journalists, former beat writers and even a member of the BBWAA.
Anyway, regarding this whole Wilpon/Madoff/Picard mess. Let me urge you not to rush to judgement on either side – as difficult as that might be. There is an agenda-driven army of media types who seek to lead you away from free thinking and onto their agenda-driven path. Don’t be a sucker. Don’t take the bait.
More importantly, don’t let your dissatisfaction for how this team has performed, turn you into something that you’re not. Don’t let it blur the difference between a pastime and real life for you. Don’t let it effect the way you view this legal matter.
Don’t wish ill will on a family who has done so much good for the team and this city and for veterans just because Omar Minaya signed Jason Bay or Steve Phillips traded for Mo Vaughn. Let’s use some common sense and know that there is a difference between this legal matter and the operational choices the current Mets owners have made. It’s a vast difference, and one should have nothing to do with the other.
I have my opinion on all of this. I posted repeatedly not to believe all this bankruptcy stuff everyone is circulating, and that the demise of the Wilpons has been greatly exaggerated. I’ve said again and again that it was all just wishful thinking. I couldn’t care less that it put me in the minority and on the firing block, I blog for my benefit not yours. So let me close this out in the form that some of you will find somewhat familiar – a Haiku:
Justice will vindicate.
It was all folly.
You’ll see the rising son.
******
We broke a traffic record here yesterday, thanks to those of you who joined in especially the spiders. Coincidentally, we also got our Google Page Rank 5 back today. So the rumors of our own demise were greatly exaggerated as well. 
About the Author: Joe DeCaro
I'm a lifelong Mets fan who loves writing and talking about the Amazins' 24/7. From the Miracle in 1969 to the magic of 1986, and even the near misses in '73 and '00, I've experienced it all - the highs and the lows. I started Mets Merized Online in 2005 to feed my addiction. Follow me on Twitter @metsmerized.
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NL East Standings
| Team | W | L | Pct. | GB |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Braves | 22 | 18 | .550 | - |
| Nationals | 22 | 19 | .537 | 0.5 |
| Phillies | 19 | 22 | .463 | 3.5 |
| Mets | 15 | 23 | .395 | 6.0 |
| Marlins | 11 | 30 | .268 | 11.5 |
Last updated: 05/17/2013
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Ruben’s tweet was pretty funny. Between that and the Megdal tweet war, Cerrone’s had a tough week.
Just easier to kick someone when they are down…
I agree it was funny, I laughed at first. But then I thought, man that was so not cool, especially from him.
You are absolutely correct. Rubin should lead by example seeing he is now the main Mets blogger at ESPN. Seeing Rubin is “owned” by ESPN it was a pretty hypocritical statement. People should work together to get blogging more “legitimized”. It is still evolving but many sites are actually putting in better research than the REAL reporters.
but it was funny.
Someone on here last night said Rubin was a Met fan.
Is he? Couldn’t prove it by me.
Rubin is a mets fan.. he took a shot at a mets blog owned by the mets… what is wrong with that???? We all take shots at him all the time, who the hell is cerrone???? my god you guys make it seem as if he’s some sort of great reporter or journalist who we all need around..
seriously stop this.. who cares!!! you don’t think rubin is bitter about being ridicule by minaya in front of everyone the way he did? he’s been modest to say the least, ohh, and by the way, adam rubin on reporting and journalism is what? 1000 times better than cerrone!?!?! something like that? yeah…
Rubin is a joke. I don’t understand how ESPN can keep him. He goes out of his way to dig the Mets. I can’t wait until the Mets are good again and they can stick it back to ESPN.
It’s a shame, Rubin has talent, but either he’s not capable of thinking of a good topic, so he defaults to negativity, or he’s a mean prick (most people say he’s nice, but they’re ass kissing bloggers hungry for a RT), or he’s still pissed off about the Omar thing.
He’s got a ton of good info, so he’s good to follow.
In keeping with this theme here is an interesting exchange Coutinho had on Twitter today.
Mark Healey
@coutinho9 This season will mark the hardest to date for anyone covering the team, IMO. On the field/Off issues will bleed into each other.
Rich Coutinho
@BD_MarkHealey could be and I accept that as part of the job but I refuse to engage in degrading or disrepecting any of people I cover.
Mark Healey
@coutinho9 That said one can be critical w/o being disrespectful or degrading.
Rich Coutinho
@BD_MarkHealey we agree but the truth is far diff than using hidden agendas to make urself bigger than story.
http://twitter.com/coutinho9
Kudos to Rich, he just DMed me and agreed to do a Take 5 for MMO.
Nice. I like Rich, even if he does have a tendency to sugar coat. In fact, maybe because of that.
You’re kidding right. You’ve been spewwing bitter, overly pessimistic, rants about the front office and ownership for the better part of 3 months now and now you feel equiped to observe a lack of objectivity or integrity in media persons? The constant stream of negativity you’ve posted disqualifies you as a credible source of such criticism. What a joke. Grow up.
I don’t get paid like the people who are paid to accurately report and be objective. And I’m not selling you any books about how I feel on the matter of their unresolved and yet to be tried legal issues. Or passing off my opinions as facts. Thanks for reading though.
funny part is I haven’t read anything posted by you for about 2 months because the bitter pill was predictable and who wants to listen to someone bitch & moan all the time. But the title to this piece was too ironic to pass up.
This isn’t a news site. It’s a fan site with fan submissions and editorials.
That’s journalism across the board these days, Joe. In High School and College I took journalism classes (being I was an English major) and I can remember the first week or two in the classes we would discuss “Journalist Integrity,” such as being Objective (reporting the facts and only facts) and not Subjective.(interjecting opinionated words and point of views into an article that’s not a editorial).
News today in this country is a JOKE 2x’s OVER! CNN, Fox, MSNBC are closer to being MTV than a credible news source. And ESPN has gone to the rout of where they can’t report objectively, and have to tell you how you should feel about a team or player. ESPN has become unwatchable between Skip Bayless, Stephen A. Smith, Chris Berman, and countless other yelling wind bags.
If you want to really know what’s going on these days, turn off your major news network.
Sorry if I ranted off subject.
No apology necessary your point was made and well taken and I enjoyed the back story.
This is one of the best quotes I’ve heard this year…
“People watch today’s news for affirmation, not information”
It’s no wonder this country is getting torn apart.
That’s an awesome quote! I’m definitely going to use that. Pinpoint right that it’s tearing the country apart. Too much “Liberals do this” and “Conservatives do that.” Nobody’s working together for the best possible solution. “United” States is a term that should be used loosely nowadays.
That drives me up the damn wall. We have more access to information and knowledge than at any point in human history and people still insist on living in their echo chambers.
At a time when information no longer flows one way, when you don’t just have to sit there while someone tells us something because that’s all we know, we still just want to hear the same old schlock over and over.
Great first tweet by Sandy:
http://twitter.com/#!/MetsGM
MetsGM Sandy Alderson
Getting ready for Spring Training-Driving to FL but haven’t left yet. Big fundraiser tonight for gas money. Also exploring PAC contribution.
That’s freaking awesome. But did he take a dig at Gingrich? lol
I admit I am surprised to find out the Mets GM opened a Twitter account though in today’s world of communications I don’t know why I do. Michael Kay went on Twitter and even Francessa with YES but of the 3 Alderson, Kay, and Francessa Francessa is the only one that boasts having a dedicated person doing his tweets for him in Anthony Griek.
Francessa just rolls like that.
You can hear Kay cry about the nasty tweets he gets on his show. But, I wouldn’t recommend it. It is such an awful show.
Pretty sure in the Mets GM case whomever set it up is also very familiar with the how to block people feature.
LoL, when i 1st saw Alderson’s twitter accout he had 779 followers. It is now up to 2,849 and rising.
I think you answered your own question:
It’s like ESPN’s CEO and President handed all their minions marching orders to trash on the Mets…
Blame Mike and the mad dog or howard stern but it does seem like the “shock sells” disease is taking over. ESPN has seemed awful agenda and “look at me” driven. And the mets are a favorite whipping boy now.
#blameBeltran
This is what people don’t understand about TV, Radio, Newspapers. YOU ARE NOT THE CONSUMER! YOU ARE THE PRODUCT BEING SOLD!
For those of you who are saying…”Wait, I pay for my TV and buy my newspaper, what the Eff is he talking about?”
The revenue that these media outlets make off of you is nothing compared to the money they pull in from advertisers. These outlets are selling you to advertisers. They don’t care if the information they give you is correct, intelligent, nice, factual or insulting. I fact, being controversial is one of the better ways to get ratings.
That’s why I love bloggers…most of them do this for love (the real one’s at least, not the I blog for my TV station/newspaper fakes). They don’t say things just for effect, they say things because it’s what they believe.
These jokes of reporters (who think they’re above the average person and much above the average blogger) are doing what they do for effect…they know you’ll react and they’ll get another click to add to their totals for the day.
Strange, this is the 2nd time today that I’ve complemented MMO.
“The revenue that these media outlets make off of you is nothing compared to the money they pull in from advertisers. These outlets are selling you to advertisers. They don’t care if the information they give you is correct, intelligent, nice, factual or insulting. I fact, being controversial is one of the better ways to get ratings.”
Another thing that pisses me off. Aren’t I cutting a check to the Dolans every month so I don’t have to watch commercials? Wasn’t that the point of cable?
Exactly. Those of us that are old enough remember that was the big selling point to get us to pay for TV. No commercials.
That didn’t last very long on most cable stations, did it?
Off Topic: Sandy Alderson is on Twitter.
http://twitter.com/#!/MetsGM
My bad Salty already covered it.
Muhahah
I see they’re reporting they think this is a fake account?
AdamRubinESPNAdamRubinESPN: Mets personnel verifies it is Sandy Alderson. At least, was “almost certain.”
LOL…..don’t they know? Sounds like SA took them by surprise.
I’m surprised Rubin didn’t say:
“A Wilpon owned entity that is in financial turmoil confirmed that it is Sandy Alderson.”
LoL, nice…
LOL.
The official Mets twitter confirms it’s real.
http://twitter.com/Mets
Check out #SandyAldersonTrollTweets
We’ve been the favorite whipping boy for the media since the summer of ’09. Not news to me.
I cannot be bothered with a twitter account.
TRDM gives me a great Twitter roll to check on if I want to see what the beat writers are throwing out there.
TRDM gives me a great Twitter roll to check on if I want to see what the beat writers are throwing out there. >>> Or Flinging…
I’m sure you could use alot of verbs there. But, how many would get past the auto censor?
hahaha
Reading here today, I’m getting the sense that I’m missing some great stuff not being on Twitter.
Joe, this isn’t an isolated incident. I see it in a lot of places I turn to news and information on a lot of subjects. Sports, politics, tech etc etc it is all opinions and commentary before the facts. And I’m not talking just the blogs like Gawker network or anything. Respected, credentialed, mainstream, supposedly “real” outlets and reporters.
It is probably due to the rise of cable and internet. You have x number of channels pumping content about any subject 24/7 all trying to compete with each other for your ever decreasing attention. Then, they are competing with websites that not only can update faster, but are interactive and can reach you anywhere you are.
Everyone one, consumers and providers, are still learning how to adapt to it. Right now, it is about being faster, louder and more attention getting than the next guy. And what really annoys me is how so many journalists want to be the story rather than just report it. They want Cronkite level fame with out the work Cronkite did or the respectability he built.
Off Topic: In other Mets news.
AnthonyDiComo (Beat Writer / Columnist) #Mets minor league RHP Scott Moviel and catcher Dock Doyle suspended 50 games each for positive drug tests.
http://twitter.com/AnthonyDiComo/statuses/167715555174924288
“In the immortal words of Frank Barone,” by way of Joe D, “Holy crap!”
Wow Moviel? Imagine how much he’d suck without PED’s. lol
Bayonne wastes no time tweeting to Alderson….
Hey I can’t access Twitter at work, post it so I can get a good laugh.
He’s up to ten already, he’s on a friggen tear… Give me one second.
BayonneMetsFan BayonneMetsFan
@
@MetsGM How about a fund raiser for some SP and catching – things U should’ve addressed in the 1st place
35 minutes ago
@MetsGM You can look this fan base in the eye & say you’re trying to win w/the last 2 horrible off seasons you’ve given us?
31 minutes ago
@matthewcerrone @MetsGM How about he start spending SMART! He hasn’t in 2 years as indicated by all the nice/cheap signings by other teams
17 minutes ago
@matthewcerrone @MetsGM I thought Sandy was supposed to read market smart?/use sabermetrics to find value? BS-he’s being outdone regularly
16 minutes ago
@MetsGM You have come to NYC w/small market mentality/refusal to win & have made a bad situation WORSE. You’ve done a LOUSY JOB as GM
14 minutes ago
@MetsGM YOU inherited a competitive roster last year & did NOTHING! Emaus/Hu/Boof Bonser? While other teams sign good players cheaply?
11 minutes ago
@MetsGM And your box of chocolates snarky remark about a player who SHOULD’VE been part of the future? How often U watch #mets b4 hiring?
10 minutes ago
@MetsGM Trying to fit square peg in round hole w/ Murphy at 2B is UR CALL imo, he can’t play 2B – any intelligent baseball person knows that
4 minutes ago
Wow, the disrespect this person shows has no bounds at all. Joe, I know he contributes to your site and has been here a while but you may be treading on thin ice with this loose cannon. Things like what he is doing now will only serve to limit the new found access we have to the media and the Mets. To protect your own interest I would disassociate myself with this guy as quickly as possible.
While I know I am setting myself up for the same from Bay, at least I am just a blogger. To disrespect someone who is even giving you the privilege of speaking directly to him is a new low.
Oh so I can’t tell sandy alderson directly what I feel? That I think he’s doing a LOUSY JOB and his moves for the most part STINK and he’s making a bad situation worse?
That’s disrespectful? Boy I hope you’re grabbing your Sandy inflatable doll tightly and holding on for dear life because I’m just getting started.
What a BABY
TRS you’re a JERK
That’s disrespect. I’ve done NOTHING of the sort when addressing Alderson. I’m tweeting things to him I would say to his face and there has been NOTHING disrespectful about it. Emotional and emphatic? Yes. Confrontational maybe? Yes. Disrespectful? No
In the immortal words of Frank Barone, “Holy crap!”
Just wow.
I try to give the benefit of the doubt with the passion some Met fans show but it’s obvious some Met fans just cannot help themselves.
#crossingtheline
*sigh* This is why we can’t have nice things.
Yeah because i’m going after YOUR GOD on my own time, on my own twitter account and somebody chose to copy and paste it here? Not that it matters cuz it doesn’t bother me at all and may not be a bad thing anyway.
My God the way some people react in here because i’m telling the GM what i really think about him? And i’m far from done too.
Sandy Lovers before Mets lovers – like i called it.
Seriously, you have the social graces of the Unabomber.
I disagree. His tweets are nothing but a waste of time.
Sandy’s dog Buddy now has a Twitter account:
http://twitter.com/BuddyAlderson
BuddyAlderson BuddyAlderson
Jon Rauch is 6’5″, that’s a lot of leg to hump
And while the Mets have a gm that is running the franchise into the ground with bad move after bad move and alienating a fan base from coming to watch games because of his turpentine personality……we have to laugh at this? A post about his dog?
I’m not laughing.
Sandy Saves!
Now that you have direct access to Sandy, why don’t you hit him with your “Too bad it wasn’t you that got hit by a car” thing you said? Yeah, your not disrespectful at all. You may not have been able to read that since I didn’t ALL CAPS certain words. Seriously, keep this up, your worth a laugh a second. (And not the “We’re laughing with you” type. We are laughing at you).
Yeah, let’s bring up something that happened a long time ago and apply it to today’s circumstances.
Bayonne is already at it tweeting Sandy’s dog!
BayonneMetsFan BayonneMetsFan
@BuddyAlderson Why aren’t you ever out chasing cats, you’re a lousy dog!
35 minutes ago
@BuddyAlderson What kind of a bark is that? Ruben Amaro’s poodle can run rings around you!
31 minutes ago
@BuddyAlderson The kennel has gotten worse since you got here and you’re constant shedding is making us look bad!
17 minutes ago
@BuddyAlderson What kind of a name is Buddy? What about Bobby V or Steve-O or just plain Ruben!
16 minutes ago
@BuddyAlderson You have a small dog mentality! This is New York, Buddy!
14 minutes ago
Those are false tweets made up by Kramer67
I did not do those tweets.
Kramer67 is the guy that takes on a million fake names to get at me.
But that’s okay for some people because it suits their needs
So now add fake tweets to cloning names and stalking to this guy’s resume
Joe D? What say you?
Can you just have a sense of humor for once. Pretending that you said “@BuddyAlderson You have a small dog mentality! This is New York, Buddy!” is pretty funny dude.
This poor guy from “baseball prospective” is trying to reason with Bayonne:
http://twitter.com/jay_jaffe
@BayonneMetsFan not sure what’s dumb about cutting $50 Mil from the payroll given the financial straits the team is in
10 minutes ago
@jay_jaffe 12 mill for reliever on broke team? How bout 1 mill for Lidge, use that 12 mill for SP. 3.5 mill for Rauch? 1 mill for Qualls
7 minutes ago
@BayonneMetsFan point taken on Francisco, but he did make K-Rod disappear and avoid that vesting option.
3 minutes ago
I can’t wait to get home and crack open a beer, this has been great stuff.
Justin Turner on Twitter.
Justin Turner
“@maxinabillion: @redturn2 @metsgm are you in his carpool to Florida?” nope, wasn’t any room left, Buddy has the whole back seat
http://twitter.com/#!/redturn2/status/167726148355239936
Listening to Francesa on wfan talk about Alderson’s 1st tweet.
“Just kidding isn’t going to work” regarding the joke about the fundraiser.
Deep breathes Francessa have a coke. Not everyone can have a dedicated Tweeter like you.
I really wonder why guys like this bother to have a personal twitter account. What good can possibly come out of it (as oppsoed to what has been posted here?)
Though I do smell a restraining order coming.
I think Sandy should just invite the man to come to a game with him. Kind of a get to meet the people deal.
Joe–a fair and objective media? Where on this planet will you find that?
Hi Joe D.,
If your hunch is correct about the Wilpons facing bankruptcy being over-exaggerated, then what justification do they have for the salary dumping and not going after free agents of better quality? I’m not referring to reducing the payroll as I am stripping the team down to the bare bones.
If the Wilpons are in better financial shape, why the need for such extreme cost-cutting measures? It hasn’t been limited to just the payroll but throughout the organization. It would seem unnecessary for such downsizing and not to the point that they hired CRG to get their house back in order. It just doesn’t seem to make sense otherwise.
you need to separate the Mets and the Wilpons here. A MLB team has to “pay it’s own way” basically. And the team was running in the red lately. So even if the wilpon’s themselves are OK financially the team isn’t necessarily. So, payroll was cut to be brought in line with revenue.
so unless they are going to borrow more (not a good idea) or fund losses out of their own pockets (not something team owners normally do) until revenues go up, payroll will stay lower.
There is also the fact that the team had way more than 1-2 holes to fill (more than a couple of FAs would cover) so it made sense that as they are doing a quick rebuild/retool, the payroll would be lower (but at least in line with expected wins!)
again, smarter spending last year and this year would have alleviated a lot of that.
He did a lousy job securing talent with little money last year and how many of those guys wend down or are already gone? Bad job even though you refuse to admit it.
And he’s doing worse this year as everyone can see nice ballplayers being signed almost on a daily/weekly basis for salaries well within the Mets financial constraints.
Stop the excuse making already and remove that book keeper’s visor and waist change dispenser
not to mention some creative trades would have been nice. The only trade he’s done in 2 years is the Pagan for Ramirez trade (i don’t count salary dumps)
I would bet money that another more traditional GM would have been able to pull off more trades and improve this team WITH THE SAME MONEY
No way would you ever acknowledge that scenario
How about giving us an example of a smart trade rather than just complaining.
Give us some ideas in terms of players we could target or send out.
Who would you like to target and how can we help them?
What would you propose to address the catching situation in a trade? How about the rotation? Who would you like and who would you give up?
done that a million times here already and u keep asking – u see anybody else asking?
But that won’t stop t agee – he has his own pathology he follows. He says I never first guess among other silly ramblings. He’ll come back with something.
And to the other guy I don’t consider Beltran for Wheeler that a good trade yet – it was more of a salary dump and he was able to get something for it, too early to tell. I’m talking about straight out trades like the Ramirez one
It wasn’t close to a salary dump. Once again, your “knowledge” of the game takes a giant hit.
oh be quiet already Mr. Semantics/game player
they wanted to get rid of Beltran in the worst way and everybody knew it and he’s lucky he got a an allegedly decent minor leaguer for him. I’m talking about a real trade and most people know what i’m talking about – the Ramirez for Pagan deal was an actual trade to try and make the team better – not the Beltran move.
So it’s semantics when you’re called out for your lack of knowledge. Got it. And the trade did make the organization better. Much better.
yeah because i feel the Beltran move was not a real trade and more of a salary dump that they happened to get something for it’s a knock on my baseball knowledge.
this exchange is now over, no time for taking things out of context and semantics – that’s what saber goons do.
Of course it’s over. Because you can’t backtrack your way out of saying a trade that the Mets paid nearly the entire salary for was a “salary dump.” Do you not understand what a salary dump is?
It’s always over with guys like bayonne when it’s time to put up or shut up.
When it’s time to add substance behind the bluster they always head for the hills.
Their no good in the clutch.
They always pee on their leg.
Well where are YOUR creative trade proposals?
Got anything of substance to bring here or just a lot of whinning and second guessing?
I’m not kidding. I’d like to hear ideas.
2 idiots that want to get me on a stupid technicality. The Beltran trade was not a real trade in the true sense of what i’m talking about and most sensible people know what i mean.
I’m talking about a regular trade. But the two losers ESPECIALLY the pathological one who lives by his own perception – are foaming at the mouth.
Doesn’t matter. I’m talking about a REAL TRADE of which Alderson has really only done ONE.
Don’t weasel out bayonne. Give us some of you ideas of some creative trades that we should consider.
I’ll take take that hit X. I’m man enough enough to take one for the team, unlike that chronic whinning, excuse making second guessing antagonizer who’s next comment of substance will be his first.
Oh okay, looked it up…..so it was cash considerations or they sent money over, however it worked out and they got Wheeler
These are the types of things normal people go “oh” and then get right to the point. But not these 2 Clowns. They’ll twist the post around and go off point. Ho hum.
It was STILL not a real trade like the Pagan for Ramirez/Torres deal and most people know what i’m talking about.
And I see the psychotic is still asking for me to name the deals I would do….figures.
Dude don’t be a biotch and block me from your twitter account. I’m not gonna bother you, I just want to follow the crazy.
Man it’s impossible to get anything of substance out of that guy.
This vast resevoir of “knowledge” and all you can get out of him is remarks that can be heard in any Jr. High School locker room.
Big hat no cattle.
In his defense, he’s serenaded us tons of time with his fantasy/video game trade scenarios involving Wright and even more fantastical scenarios where Reyes was re-signing. So I guess by the way you worded it, he’s not entirely wrong.
You should have asked what he would have done in the realm of realistic transactions. I blame you.
How can you call the Beltran trade a salary dump when we paid almost all of his salary?
Because he has no idea what he’s talking about, as usual. I should apologize, because I set him up for that. I knew he had no idea what the terms of the trade were and purposely set out to make him look silly. It’s so easy, though. I should apologize. But I won’t.
whatever you want to call it, so maybe it wasn’t the biggest dump but the plan right from the beginning was to get rid of him
It wasn’t a true trade like i was talking about. Maybe my finances were wrong but not my baseball knowledge wise ass.
Well, that IS part of baseball……..so…….to-may-to, to-mah-to?
And your knowledge of Semantical Manipulation of the truth is unparalelled!
The trade of Beltran was just as much a Salary dump in July as it would have been in November! The only difference was we didn’t dump COMMITTED salary!
We traded him because we could not pay to renew him. Knew we had no intention of resigning him nor anyone else with the money we DUMPED by doing that!
Just because it was not money we had committed to does not technically or SEMANTICALLY mean we did not DUMP salary when we traded beltran!
We paid everything we owed him yes and did not RE_INVEST that money in him or anyone else!
We merely DUMPED the money we spent on him from the payroll!
So nice try with your little semantical version of the truth but Beltran is as much a Salary DUMP as Reyes is!
If you want to make a point that we didn’t DUMP those salaries then tell us all who we spent that 40 Mil on this year?
If you can’t show that we have an 140 Mil payroll this year you SEMANTICALLY just lost this Salary Dump argument!
Cause where did it go if we didn’t dump it?
All that, and not one point made. The Mets paid every cent owed Beltran. And to Reyes, although no one mentioned him. The Mets didn’t save any money at all, except for K-Rod’s option. That was a dump. They didn’t save one red cent on what they expected to pay out in 2011. That’s not a technicality. That’s a reality. Learn the difference.
Sure they did they saved all that money in 2012!
Who said anything about what YEAR the dump occurred?
Semantics…. it Bites BOTH WAYS!
I don’t get it. Explain to me the semantics involved in the following sentence:
“The Mets owed Beltran $18.5 mil in 2011 and $0 in 2012. The Mets paid Beltran $18.5mil in 2011 and $0 in 2012.
If you want to try to twist that into saving money, well, we can all see who manipulates and uses semantics.
They saved 18+ Mil in 2012 compared to 2011 by not resigning Beltran!
Did they spend it on anyone else?
NO!
DUMPED!
Hey Metsie when they had it they spent it, cheaped out elsewhere and got pennies on the dollar value wise but the circumstances have taken a turn. Get used to it, the Mets are never going to have the largest payroll in the National League again regardless of who’s the GM.
Not until we are averaging 40K a game.
I know your angry, so am I. That’s the way it is. Pick up a copy of who moved my cheese.
Metsie now your playing playing the technicality card but I’m not going to. Have it any way you want the trade as it was stands on it’s own and can in no way shape or form be referred to as a salary dump and as a long time Met Fan you should know the difference.
Take Wagner for instance. That was both a salary dump and an avoidance of paying signing bonus dump.
Speaking of which I’m going to take a dump and that’s my final word on the matter.
Yes TAG I am!
I am a firm believer in Fight Fire with Fire! LOL
but like I said Sandy decided in July he was going to reduce Payroll next year (2012) and as a result the Beltran trade was Born!
He knew he could or would be outbid or that he really didn’t want to make that investment and since he couldn’t get anything in compensation he traded him to get something in addition to the dumped salary!
If we were flush with cash and determined to DUMP Salary from the payroll Sandy probably gets MORE for Beltran than he did!
Reyes is a Salary dump under those TECHNICALITIES too!
The only reason he didn’t HAVE to make the decision on him in July was because he could net compensation!
Both leaving are a result of the decision to DUMP over 40 Mil of Payroll from the books!
K-Rod is the only one that actually SAVED 2011 money…and not much at that!
But 17 Mil is Dumped from the 2012 Books as well!
Do you feel if the Mets were only 2 games out of the WC the trade would of went down?
Metsie Beltran got paid every single cent we committed to him back in 2005, by us.
By paying his salary through August and September, quite a marked departure from previous practices in this regard, we extracted a very highly regarded prospect who many people unafilliated with the Wilpon’s, Mets, Omar or Alderson feel is the best minor leaguer in the system all for the last two months of a player we weren’t going to be able to sign, sure as hell wasn’t going to sign here even if we could and wasn’t going to leave behind anything if he stayed here until October 1st.
Salary dump it was not both technically, categorically and factually.
What dos that have to do with dumping Salary Tag?
Do we still pay that money to someone? Or has it been DUMPED from the payroll!
The only relevence the trade makes is did we have the first opportunity to say NO we are dumping your payroll from the books or would they have to wait until they could negotiate to NOT negotiate?
You mean to tell me you don’t think we DUMPED Reyes’s Salary by not even entertaining the thought of resigning him and since we haven’t spent any of that money of someone else it has been for all intents and purposes DUMPED from the payroll!
We didn’t dump 2011 Salary we just dumped Salary for 2012!
By refusing to KEEP either of those players!
Any way you slice it we dumped their salary from our payroll and did not replace it!
Beltran was just an attempt to get something for what they knew was going to happen in 2012 anyway!
That’s an entirely different subject though. What do you want to do include every transaction involving finances since 1962?
Yeah they dumped salary in 2012. Tons of it. 50 M or so. K-Rod was dumped for the same reason last year, on the other hand they also dumped two players last year and paid the whole freight to the tune of 18 M and turned a 5 M committment to Bonilla into a 28 M one starting this year 13 years later. None of that changes the fact of the Beltran trade one iota.
It was not a salary dump, period. For once.
Not really Tag…
The decision to trade Beltran was all about the decision of NOT WILLING to keep him and the expenditure required to do so!!
The DECISION was a Salary Dump!
The Trade was nothing more than an attempt to get something for that DECISION!
Would Beltran have been traded if we had not decided to dump major Salary in 2012?
Maybe he would but that woould only be NOT a SALARY DUMP if it was spent on Beltran or someone else!
The fact that they made their decision to dump salary before Free Agency even opened does not usurp the fact that they decided to dump salary for 2012 and as a result they decided to get something for a guy they had no intentions of going after in FA to facilitate that decision!
Beltran was a much a Salary dump as it would have been in November when we dicided not to sogn him or replace him using the money we no longer had to pay Beltran!
Bottom line is the Salary was dumped from the 2012 budget!
That it was dumped in July doesn’t matter!!
Yeah it’s pretty clear we were going to dump a lot of salary. Wouldn’t have gotten us anything more for Beltran though. We got as much as one could ever expect due to having a number of offensively starved teams in on him.
When Atlanta lost Chipper again as soon as he got back and McCann went down in the same game Sabean panicked. thought Atlanta would get Beltran and gave up Wheeler and he did it the very next morning.
Money coming off the books is not going to be reinvested. That’s that. If there were to be another opportunity to “buy” a prospect or two in a trade for Wright, Bay or Santana that’s where the remaining salary will go and that’s what should have been being done all along, but wasn’t.
Now it’s an either or and instead of buying another Bay the focus is finding another Wheeler and Nimmo and so on and that’s something we should have been doing all along as well. Putting real money into the draft instead of drafting the cheapest players.
Games changed out of necessity and not by Alderson either. The owners are not taking on any 3-7 year deals until we’re at 40 K per game and that’s that. Regardless of who’s the GM.
Get used to it.
Yep and you need to get used to Fans complaining about what you percieve as the new reality!
Believe what you want about the return, But teams saw the second we traded K-Rod for payroll relief and table scraps that We were having a firesale and were dealing from a position of weakness!
They will know it again when it comes time to trade Wright!
Tell me something how is this TRADE STARS plan supposed to work if all you do is trade one KNOWN star for a MAYBE STAR 5 years from now?
How do you get ahead that way?
How do you stock the Minors enough to create MORE TALENT when your losing more talent than you get back and still have to deal with the potential fail factor of what you get back?
You forgot Beltran for Wheeler.
How can you not consider salary dumps to be trades when you have constantly referred to Piazza, Leiter, la Duca, Delgado and Santana as “Great Trades?”
And if you’ve already given us some of your ideas on some creative trades we should pursue they should still be fresh in your mind?
C’mon give us some ideas. Give us some names. Tell us who would like to trade and for whom.
Hmmm. No answer. What a surprise, what a surprise.
Hi Any,
As discussed before, Sterling Equities is the holding company of the Mets and thus the Mets are just one of the many business components that makes up that corporation.
The team itself doesn’t have to necessarily pull in a profit to still be a tremendous source of revenue for Sterling Equities as a whole. A simple example is SNY. Without the Mets there would be no SNY and even though the network is currently in financial trouble, the Wilpons (i.e, Sterling Equities) refuse to part with any portion of their SNY holding – which shows how much of money generator the network is. And again, it’s the Mets that makes SNY such a lucrative venture and source of major revenue for Sterling Equities.
Another example is being the landlord at Citi Field. A tremendous amount of money is generated from the leasing of Citi Field storefront space to independent businesses. So again, without the Mets there would be no Citi Field and thus another less source of revenue for Sterling Equities.
Then there is the merchandising, both directly and via the contract with Nike for items sold not just at Citi Field but throughout stores in the tri-state area and websites. Merchandise is a big money maker and again, without the Mets, there would be no merchandising agreement and thus one more less lucrative source of revenue for Sterling Enterprises to have.
So the Mets are the force that generates tremendous profit for other aspects of Sterling Equities. The team can afford to take a financial loss in lieu of all the other revenue it helps create (and many in the financial industry and media doubt the credibility of that $70 million figure).
The team itself is too valuable for them to water down since the profitability of so many other business ventures taken on by Sterling Equities (aka the Wilpons) are dependent upon the Mets being successful. So for the Wilpons to strip the team as much as it has means that their troubles go way beyond the Mets – I can’t see it any other way from at least my limited understanding of the situation.
I think “its cool” to be down on the Mets right now. Frankly, some people here are to blame as well.
I do think you were a tad harsh on Olney and Law. I don’t really see anything wrong with what they said to be honest. Law ranking them 22nd on the farm, I’m not sure why that’s so wrong of him?
Marchand’s post is ridiculous. Your job is to report, not to start a campaign to get new owners.
But as I said, it’s cool to be down on the Mets, and everybody wants to be cool these days.
Some posts here, where everyone are supposed fans of the same team, are much more vial.
“Sports Journalism” today is like Dick Young on steroids.
ESPN is nothing more than a highlight reel posing as a news organization!
The teams that make a nice highlight get all the accolades! Win or Lose! They talk about them to death!
The teams that don’t never get mentioned unless there is bad news to talk about!
Thier analysts all talk about how important whatever position they played when they were a pro will be in the next game
And for the most part the entire coverage is all about promoting how smart the ESN staff is regardless of how wrong they are time and time again!
And ABC dismantled the BEST SPORTS DIVISION on the Planet after buying that crap!
none of that was insulting or a cheap shot
Don’t know if this has been mentioned but Mets bashing, especially at ESPN, has been the norm for quite a few years, it seems that very little positive features involving the Mets have found their way to teleprompters and reporters there.
Any way you look at it Joe, this season will be tough, though the few years after Grant demoted Seaver were hard but at least a good GM was brought in, Cashen, to build the team; I don’t know what SA is going to go other than cut payroll and hope the youngsters in minors produce.
Boycotting the team will not do anything to make the Wilpons sell if anything they will cut more payroll, maybe, but I’ll continue to support my Mets despite the negativity and ownership, my team good or bad!
Know I’ve said it before, but any team five games out in the loss column almost two thirds into the season would not rid itself of it’s closer and top hitter. Even if the fans had no faith in the team and believed it was headed nowhere, that’s not the kind of message the front office should send to Terry Collins and his players.
And if the front office did have faith in the team’s chances, then the moves they made would only prove that winning came secondary to down sizing.
Either way, what was up to that point a very pleasant and satisfying season ended up as a bitter disappointment — no way the team was going to remain competitive being stripped of those two players (Duda would have remained at first so his bat did not replace that of Beltran).
Nor can they expect to draw 40,000 fans each night, not with with the prices they are charging. Even in 2009 when both Citi Field was brand new and the Mets were picked by many to go all the way, they had trouble selling out opening day or any of three games of the subway series.
The Wilpons only concern is holding onto the team and making it through this financial mess. So during this time period, at least, it is they who are not supporting the Mets, not the fans.
I was watching SNY tonight, Loudmouths, and this guy who I think was hired last year, Sal Licata, showed this passion on TV i never seen for someone who is not associated with the team at all on TV. He really fueled my fire even more for this season, he made me say “hey, I’m not the only Mets fanatic in NY who really can’t wait any longer for spring training and beyond”. The key word I used was “fanatic”. I believed that maybe my opinion on what that word means might not mean anything to anyone so I took it upon myself to look it up on dictionary.com as reference and the definition proceeds as, “a person with an extreme and uncritical enthusiasm or zeal, as in religion or politics”. The word that stands out is “zeal” and the metaphor I frequently use just as this definition is “as in religion”. Zeal for those who don’t know what it may mean is basically another word for desire/devotion. I believe it is very rare to run into anyone who is considered a fan of anything from my generation (1990-present) because everyone is more of a follower to winning than anything else. Everyone that considers themselves a “Mets fan” are complete liars and full of blasphemy. These fake fans are the same people who instigate just to fit in and could have something to talk about. A real Mets fan is someone who refers to an off season as a nightmare because their one true love that takes them away from the harsh struggles of real life away is gone and realize that theres nothing to wake up to but to the same boring job, college day, school day, just day period. Until spring training starts it’s like a shot of adrenalin through your body that takes over you because you finally see these people who is like family that was taken away from you (that father meets son for the first time after 30yrs in movies). Then it’s regular season and you are completely devoted to this team that you look at as if it’s your religion and you try attending, watching, listening any way possible and makes you do things that makes people think you’re crazy (not going to work, skipping class, missing a whole class day, leaving a date, hell even postponing your own wedding), why you may ask, because at the end you believe it’s good luck, showing love, dedication but no, all you say is “ITS THE METS” as if you were encountering god for the first time. Then comes August and September and you do things that you never do just to bring the Mets good luck to enter the playoffs, you do research on the opposing team that faces them tomorrow, look at the standings as if you are waiting for the ball to drop in times square and you even watch rival games in September and pray for their failure on a daily basis. Season ends after the World Series, NLCS, NLDS or regular season and you just tear and cry as a man should because his one true love is gone and his family is off to rest. Thats a Mets fan not these phony people who just trash my team, Joe D.’s team, Flushings team, hell NEW YORKS TEAM as if their trash but once playoffs come their swear they live by a Mets oath. You people are like cancer; start off nothing and try to destroy a persons spirit for happiness until they die. Well guess what, you can only hide for so long until your found. Just ask Osama.
I think everyone has the right to bash the Wilpons and this organization. We havent won a championship since 86. I think without all the loyal gullible fans the Wilpons would be nowhere. I love the Mets and will continue to watch and buy some tickets but they deserve every criticism. They have reduced this team into the joke of baseball. We had this city by the nuts in the 80s and let it slip away. Now every team in our division has a brighter future and the Phillies are a power house every year. We had plenty of good teams over the past few years but the Wilpons always seemed to tighten the purse strings when we needed the extra reliever or big piece to the team. Good teams add and improve year to year and the Wilpons failed to do that, Vlad, Arod, to name a few that we made excuses for not adding. They deserve everything they are getting in the media and if you think a 40 year friend didnt know about a shaddy Madoof they we are all stupid. We have all put up without many years of embarrassment and this year lost our best position player since Straw…AGAIN..Bash away bloggers..These crooks have plenty of money for their entire family, they dont choose to spend it on the team or care about the fans..Check out Ebbets..I mean Citi Field, they even botched that.What about 4 straight years of “We will be major players in the free agent market” just to sell tickets..obtw. Metsblog has been on the take for years and good for him..Hes being paid by the Mets..I dont blame him but its true…Screw the WIlpons..Lets go Mets!!! 10 days to pitchers and catchers and enjoy the last months of another homegrown DWright.. Sad but True, but unfortunately this is the life of a Mets fan.
forget espn, has anyone else noticed that suddenly nym basher sal licatta is now jumping on the garbage truck( couldn’t afford a band wagon this year per Alderson)lol. I’m gussing Licatta despisede Reyeas sooo much that he chose to denigrate the entire team for years while Jose was on the roster. Did Jose pee in his soup? Suddenly bald Sal is ferclempt over Wright,Davis, Bay, Duda in the middle of the order. Who knew?
I feel there is an across the board anti-New York sentiment when in comes to sports reporting. Not only the Mets but all New York teams. I’m not a huge fan of sportwriters, they have their own agendas, and sometimes reporting the truth isn’t part of the agenda. I prefer to get my Mets news on the Met blogs because the guys who are passionate enough to write a blog entry about the team, know the team, and care about the team (disclosure statement, I’m on staff here at MMO). I think pretty much any blogger knows more about the team they write about than the media. The bloggers also don’t have a hidden agenda.
Some of us older fans, have forgotten more baseball than some of these sportwriters will ever know.
Totally agree with you Gregga. I feel the same way. All I need is Metsmerized and Metsblog for all your Mets news and all your Mets passion. They dont miss a beat.
Who knows anymore?
Bottom line is that there was always a level of journalistic integrity one either did or didn’t abide to. Depends upon the integrity of the organization one works with and the standards they set for their members of the fourth estate. Do they demand the journalist report the news or allow he or she to be the news? Does the publication or station want to go for the facts or for sensationalism to get more readers/viewers and thus more advertising revenue. Is there a political agenda that purposely slants a story to report it in a certain vein?
I think there are so much less restrictions when it comes to sports reporting and leaving opinion in the editorial column as opposed to the story for today one has become meshed with the other more often than not.
But as readers, we also have to understand that there are things that are going to be reported properly without bias that we don’t want to hear for it goes against our own beliefs and thus we shouldn’t kill the messenger.
Just some philosophical approach to the whole Rubin scenario.