16
2012
Wright Seen As A One-Year Rental And Injury Risk
An article by Hojo's Mojo
Paul Hoynse of the Cleveland Plain Dealer fielded a question about the Tribe dealing for David Wright in his mailbag feature.
Hey, Hoynsie: Just was watching the MLB Network and they suggested the Tribe make a run at David Wright. Matching Lonnie Chisenhall and a couple young pitchers such as David Huff and Corey Kluber could match up well. – Chris Zanon, Canton
Hey, Chris: Like David Wright, don’t like his contract. He’ll make $15 million in 2012 and is eligible for free agency in 2013. Hate to lose Chisenhall for a one-year rental. One more thing, Wright played only 102 games last year because of a stress fracture in his back. Back injuries and the hot corner don’t co-exist. Just ask Joe Crede.
With the potential for trading Wright a likely possibility for the Mets in 2012, it will be interesting to see how other baseball markets view the Mets third baseman.
About the Author: Rob Johnson
96 Comments + Add Comment
NL East Standings
| Team | W | L | Pct. | GB |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Braves | 25 | 18 | .581 | - |
| Nationals | 23 | 21 | .523 | 2.5 |
| Phillies | 21 | 23 | .477 | 4.5 |
| Mets | 17 | 24 | .415 | 7.0 |
| Marlins | 12 | 32 | .273 | 13.5 |
Last updated: 05/19/2013
Recent Comments
- Metsie: on Keep Daniel Murphy In The Leadoff Spot: And Connor? the RBI is AWARDED to...
- Metsie: on Keep Daniel Murphy In The Leadoff Spot: And your completely missing the point that...
- Metsie: on Keep Daniel Murphy In The Leadoff Spot: Let us all know when you have...
- Paul: on Sacking Terry Collins Now Would Be Unfair: In 2+ years, every Mets fan thinks...
- Metsie: on Keep Daniel Murphy In The Leadoff Spot: No what IS telling however is you...
MMO Mets Chat
Need Tickets To The Mets Game?
Check Out These Great MLB Links!
Photographs From Gordon Donovan
5363 Fans Follow Us On Twitter!
1269 Fans Like Us On Facebook!
2341 Fans Read Our Feed!
1702 Fans Subscribe via Daily Email!
Whoever would’ve said something bad about wright, or even something like this was consider a hater, a fool with lack of baseball knowledge or banned from the blog… ohh my, how things have changed…
How is what he said something bad about Wright? It is true… he is a one year rental that was injured last year and back injuries can be the end. That is why for you to get your wish your are going to have to root for Wright…. stinks huh?
TRJ86 read again. where did i say he said anything bad about wright? i said something like this.. meaning, even a conversation about trading wright will get you banned about 4 years ago.. noone could dare to even say anything bad if he went hitless…
Bull Alex. No one Ever got banned just for mentioning trading Wright. More revisionists history.
You seem to have forgotten how and why the CORE was created… because not many were able to stand up and criticize the guy as most mets fans and cerrone included prohibit the thought of david wright being unclutch…
Not true and also our friends on here have forgotten when you even invented the term. you invented the term long before MB booted all of us.
Back to the discussion you still never get that you get banned not for your beliefs but how you express them.
TRS86, David wright is unclutch. first of all, the word was banned, and if u use it, your comment was awaiting moderation.. seriously, unclutch was a word that could have you’re entitle comment await moderation.. that’s how bad it got in MB..
sometimes that was an accident related to banning a specific poster. i believe that is how the word “management” got onto the mysterious into moderation list.
Did not realize banned and moderated were the same thing.
Let it go already. It isn’t 4 years ago anymore!
Four years ago No one would have ever dreamed we could be without Reyes and Wright. Sad times indeed. Both of them did not help by getting injured. You also had that one ab by Wright and continuous poor play in September when it mattered by Reyes.
Assuming Wright get’s back to hitting somewhat like his norms, proves that he’s healthy and rebuilds his value, the above sentiment of not wanting to lose a decent prospect for a rental will melt. Wright is not going to be moved until the trade deadline at the earliest and could be around to the following trade deadline of 2013 if the right deal isn’t there. Granted, I think he’ll be moved this year, specifically for the salary reduction issues that Joe D wrote about.
There’s always some GM desperate enoufg at the trade deadline to trade a good prospect for some piece he believes will give them the edge down the stretch run. I give you Beltran for Wheeler.
This is why it makes No sense to trade him yet. His value will be at worse the same as now at the deadline in 2013.
What if the Mets are as concerned about his back injury as everyone else and dont want to get stuck with a $15M paperweight?
Then the other team is not picking up the 15 m either.
Seems to me that ‘the market’ has a short memory and evaluates ‘current performance’. IF DW rebounds nicely in ’12…on track to hit 25HRs+ / better OBP & OPS stats, he’ll attract a nice package in return. We nee look no further than the Beltran trade. And Carlos had more injury/performance baggage than DW has presently.
i do not want to trade David, but i also realize the pickle Wilpon has put the franchise in and so, i agree with many on MMO who say ‘he’s good as gone’. Sadly, he’ll be traded NLT 7/31/12. Just hoping he has a year that enhances both his market value and his trade value, given our circumstances.
In fact, IF BAY has a rebound year: 25Hrs+++…he’s gone too….maybe we eat ‘some’ of his contract, but he’ll be traded too, for something. Sad state, but facts die hard.
Bring on 2014 – ’16!!
But unless the return is high then why do it this year. You could get a higher return in 2013.
The only monkey wrench that plays into this though process is which value Sandy is forced to look at. The value of the return of prospects or the value of not having his 15 Million-ish on the books for either this year or the next. That will be the wildcard factor.
like Tex said, the sooner he goes, the sooner they start saving 2.5mill/month.
Thing is right now they would have to pick up cash to trade him only to lose more money in sales. Makes No sense yet.
Not saying they are this hard up on saving money, but if they were, having to pay 7.5 Million on his contract would mean they would be saving 7.5 Million.
His return in prospects would be low, but that’s 7.5 Mil off the books. I’m not a bean counter, not do I play one on TV, but it well could be a factor.
And I personally believe he’ll be traded at this years trade deadline, not before.
I am not sure when it will be. Could be in April 2013 just as easily. Team would get him for a full season then.
Yeah, that certainly is a scenario. Either someone goes all in this year for the playoff run or Wright’s option is picked up after the season is over and then he is flipped to a team who would get a full year out of him.
I believe that Wright will be fully healthy in 2012. I don’t think the stress fracture will be an issue going forward. It’s not an uncommon injury and doesn’t seem to be career threatening. Having said that, let’s remind everyone of what Wright is capable of:
162 Game Average: .300/.380/.508 w/ 41 2B, 27 HR, 106 RBI
Even in 2010 he managed .283/.354/.503 36 2B, 29 HR, 103 RBI all pretty close to normal. The only two hiccups have occurred in 2009 and 2011 due to significant injuries (getting drilled in the head in ’09 and the back injury in ’11). Assuming the back injury is behind him, and there is no reason to believe it isn’t, he should give the Mets a pretty near normal season in 2012. I’m going to go out on a limb and predict .285/.370/.500 with 25 HR and 100 RBI.
The beaning had nothing to do with his lack of power in 2009.He was hit in mid August and only had about 7 HR’s to that point..His bat speed is what has worried me about him the last couple of years.He often gets beat by 89-90 mph fastballs in hitters counts.He’s just not the same player.
I don’t see the Met’s Trading Wright at all if he has a good 2012 he will become the center piece of the team along with Davis and get a contract extension. The Wilpons are fools but they know attendance of 1.5-1.75 million fans will just mean losing more money. They are trying to dig out of this cash flow hole they made with the silly minority share deals ( don’t think it will work) look for the Met’s to be on the block in 2013 and Wright, Davis and a healthy Santana are a key to this teams value.
Now Bay I think Sandy will drive him to the airport if someone makes a decent offer.
The issues noted in the post at the top are actually baseball reasons that he might not get a LT contract extension, even if the money it there.
Have to be real comfortable that he is going to hold together, and not end up being another Bay (early fade) or Fonzie (star that falls off the cliff due to back problems).
I think 2012 could go a long way to answering some of those questions. If he does bounce back and perform something close to his pre-Citi levels than I think I’d be pretty confident in thinking Citi was the problem and, that he wouldn’t be too likely to fall of a cliff ala Bay.
Same with the back to a degree. It might always be a concern on some level, but its also not a typical injury…if he does manage to get through this season without problems, I wouldn’t worry as much about it recurring.
Why create a hole at third in the first place? David is more than just a dependable third baseman and a good (if not always clutch) hitter and now in his prime. What the Mets should concentrate is not creating more holes but filling those that now do exist.
David opting out because the Mets negotiated in good faith but could not reach terms on a new deal, that’s one thing. But the Mets opting out on David because of salary dumping is a whole other story. And that is the reality of the situation.
The Mets right now are not in the business of baseball as they are in the business of trying to be retained by their current ownership. It’s not so unusual for teams to build up their minor league systems while still producing post-season competitors on the major league level at the same time. Organizations do not suddenly break up the core of their teams that still have promise despite under-achieving – they instead make changes to retain it’s strengths and improving it’s weaknesses, adding some, getting rid of others, etc. They do not simply dismantle all the pieces at one time and say they are suddenly rebuilding.
Sympathizing with ownership and accepting that their financial plight might leave them no alternative loses sight of the fact that this is not like Oakland which contends with limited fan support and a small market. The Mets were a thriving franchise in the biggest market in America and we were buying tickets. Ownership brought these headaches upon themselves. Madoff alone would not have brought the situation to this point if the overall state of affairs with Sterling Enterprises was not falling apart is it is. Regarding the Mets specifically, that was due to the Wilpons not using economically sound judgement in creating Citi Field which included expecting their fan base to pay whatever they wanted to charge them.
So to offset their overall debt situation, the Mets are going to suffer just like their other investment ventures. Since Fred and Jeff made going to games too rich for my blood they shouldn’t look for me for any support, either.
Many good points but as you said, this isn’t about rebuilding – or at least that’s a secondary goal. I especially agree about your point that Madoff alone didn’t cause this situation. Down revenues didn’t either. But the 2 together was the nail in the coffin.
While I still believe that the Wilpons knew nothing about what Madoff was doing, they solely are responsible for the bad baseball decisions made since they took over in 2002. They know nothing about running a baseball club and they failed to hire the talent that did.
This is all about the money and nothing but the money – as in doing whatever is necessary to make sure the Wilpons retain ownership. Therefore, I believe trading Wright will come down to how much money they can save by that trade, period.
Sucks but that appears to be the game plan for the next few years. If they can dump portions of Bay and Santana’s contract by getting rid of them, they’ll do that as well.
Either way while I can’t stand the current ownership and the situation they got my favorite team in, I still support the boys in blue and orange. Sort of like hating the war but supporting the troops.
I won’t be turning away during these dark days anymore than I did in ’77 when Grant started what I considered up to that point to be the darkest years in this franchise’s history.
I still think that rebuilding had to be done and tough decisions had to be made. While money is a primary factor I don’t think it is the only factor. While it stinks we are paying for the Mets going all in and getting nothing to show for it.
All true and broke or not, the fact is they’ve got nothing to show for the ever increasing payroll that topped out at $142 MIL last year. Those that started uttering ‘Break up the Core’ at the end of ’07 got their wish. Just a damn shame we didn’t get anywhere with that core b/c if we had the complimentary pieces to go with them, I’m positive those years would have been different.
However, I believe the number one driving factor now is the money and nothing but the money. It sort of forces the issue of rebuilding though, especially the overhaul of the farm system. That’s an absolute necessity if once you become competitive, you need a strong farm system to stay competitive. Something this organization learned the hard way.
Most teams who have to rebuild it is primarily about the money. If they were still making enough money to support expenses there would be No need to rebuild to start with.
If Wilpon says to move him and recoup $7-8 million of the $15 owed he will get moved regardless of how low the return is and there’s nothing Alderson can say or do about it. A turnaround consultant I spoke with last week told me that it will take no more than 30 days to complete their full analysis and give Wilpon a full report complete with recommendations for immediate actionable steps. That puts the day around Feb. 3rd.
Wonder how many of those model plans they’ll be? One for high end losing that court case and one for low end?
That really does make the process exponentially more difficult. Without knowing how big (and when) that hit will be, how can you really make a difinitive plan?
This just goes to show that those who think Wright could be traded for “young starting pitching” is completely out of touch with baseball.
yeah just according to this post anybody (like me) who suggests Wright could maybe have been moved for young starting pitching is completely out of touch. Sure.
Too bad you forgot to mention that I would have also included a prospect or 2 maybe either Valdespin or Havens..or someone else or a combination of some other prospects. Maybe one of the other 28 teams could have matched up if this scenario was one that another GM would have vehemently pushed for. Sorry, you just DO NOT KNOW what could have happened
Yeah just because Paul Hoynse wouldn’t trade young pitching for Wright, dosen’t mean nobody else would. The Mets can defenitely get something valuable back for Wright – No doubt. But I think the Mets plan is to wait to the middle of the season hoping Wright will have a big 1st half, then trade him, so they can get more back for him.
You know how I know? Because baseball hasn’t changed. A declining player coming off injury making that kind of money does not return any significant pieces. It’s just not done. Wright can certainly be traded, but it’ll be more the salary dump the K-Rod trade was. Nothing of any real value will come back. This Hoynsie guy isn’t going out on a limb here.
If the Mets think Wright can return to form in 2012 (30 HRs, .300, 90-100 RBIs) with the walls moved in than so can another team, and if they want him they’re going to have to pay if they think they’re going to get that type of production.
I would have shopped him around WITH prospects with the eye on keeping Reyes. That’s what they should have done IMO.
You still think Reyes was coming back here. Tremendous. Are you paying attention at all?
I dont see why Wright wouldn’t have more or at least as much value as Beltran did. Especially because with Wright there’s the possibility of getting draft picks in return if he walks, which was not the case with Beltran.
Possible yes but teams will have to make a qualifying offer of a one-year guaranteed contract to their players eligible in order to receive compensation if the player signs elsewhere. This year it had to be at least 12.4mil, I think they said it will go up next year?
Good point about the draft picks.
Didn’t the new CBA do away with that? You can’t collect draft picks on a player you acquire during the season.
You are both right, which gives more incentive for Mets to trade Wright before the season rather than mid season.
Wright has more value with compensation than without. Plus a $12 million qualifying offer will not inhibit a team on Wright. It’s even less than his option if he decides not to drop it.
Around the first week in February we might get a big surprise. And while Alderson almost guaranteed Niese would be on 2012 roster, he made no such assurance on Wright.
I’d be absolutely floored/stunned if Wright is traded before Opening Day. I don’t see the reason to do it honestly…if you’re telling me to save $ than I think they would have been more active in practically giving guys away like Bay etc.
Can Wright be dealt by July 31? Yes. I still don’t think it happens, but I won’t be surprised if it does. I just think the fences moving in will increase his value, and if not then you’re still gonna get in July what you’d get for him in February so why bother?
Why would that floor you? If you lost your job today and couldn’t make the mortgage payments, wouldn’t you have to sell BMW so you could still try to keep the house?
The Mets haven’t floored you enough in the last 12 months?
This is about taking a team that bleeds $70 million annually and getting them into positive cash flow.
Cutting payroll from $145M = $60 million savings.
Cutting 10% of work force = $1.1 million savings
Cutting minor league affiliate = $1.5M savings.
Trading David Wright = $7.5M savings
Total savings = $70.1 – Positive Cash Flow.
This shouldn’t floor anybody if they’re paying attention.
Joe, a car generally doesn’t appreciate in value. Wright can.
It would floor me because they lost Reyes this off-season and I don’t see trading Wright before Opening Day as a wise baseball or financial move.
If they were going to such extremes before opening day than it’d be clear they were selling just like the A’s made it clear re: their guys and just like the Twins did when Johan became avail.
“shouldn’t floor anybody if they are paying attention”
nice jab there
Why not trade Johan for a song and dance? Jason Bay for Danny Herrera part 2?
Why would it start with Wright out of nowhere?
And they don’t bank cash if they are losing $ on daily operating costs of running the stadium. If somebody buys tickets from now to Opening Day, whether Wright haters like it or not, he’s probably the #1 reason. Reyes is gone, you can’t go back in time.
So if you’re telling me 2 months before Opening Day the Mets are going to give away their #1 ticket seller, it just doesn’t make sense.
Especially when his value is low right now.
If you concede they’d take half of his salary lets say. That means for roughly 81 games they are paying for Wright. So why trade him NOW when his value is low if you’re going to pay for him anyway? Why not hold him until his value increases?
So now the guy who mocked the ones that said Reyes sold tickets is now saying Wright sells tickets after three years of decline? Hmmm, everyone think about that for a minute..
Maniac: I’m not denying that from the day tickets go on sale to Opening Day that “names” sell tickets. All you have to go on for off-season ticket sales are expectations and a desire to see certain players.
When the season begins, “names” take a backseat to standings. This debate (which you were not a part of yet you say I stalk people, weird) was regarding trading Wright BEFORE Opening Day. If you trade him in July, I don’t think you’re worried about ticket sales as much.
Thanks for contributing though, it really makes your words from last week prove to be a waste.
They’d still have to eat almost this entire salary and would not get back anything impressive in terms of prospects. his value is too low.
Beltran worked for them because he was having an All Star year and they found a team in a playoff race in desperate need of offense with lots of pitching prospects.
There they go agan, the new met fan, i mean the new lord sandy fred wilponzi fan…. caring only about poor crooked fred’s budget, and caring nothing about a competitive baseball team. how utterly pathetic they be.
Huh? Eat most of his salary? You’re making it sound like Wright is worthless right now. He isn’t. If the Mets pay half his salary they still bankroll $7.5 million.
How could you think Aaron Hill, 29, who got 11.5M/2 this offseason is worth more than Wright? Heck Clint Barmes got $10.M/2 this offseason. Did either of them bat .250 this past season?
Just because Wright didnt have a year like 2007 or 2008 it doesn’t mean we have to pay almost all of his $15 million salary and that he has near-zero value.
Barmes and Hill are making less money combined this upcoming season than Wright. And they didn’t cost any prospects.
Wright suffered a huge injury, missed 60 games and had a down year. Trading him now would be selling low.
Trading him now would be selling low. But given the 3b market is pretty bare and there aren’t many teams with a good 3b, I think Wright would still have value. At least enough that the Mets wouldn’t have to pick up his whole salary. I think they could get something decent back for him.
But I’d rather they not just settle for something “decent”. Or to make him a salary dump. And I think the idea that his value could increase, plus wanting to avoid the PR hit, and maybe to a lesser extent still feeling out the money situation, will keep Wright a Met at least until mid year. I’d still be very surprised if he’s traded before the season.
I think that is actually debatable (the Mets incentives of when to trade him).
There is the debate for the productivity/time…would Wright have more value for a team having him the whole year or will he have more value if he’s able to show he’s healthy and performs better and teams might be more desperate down the stretch.
The draft pick compensation adds a new dimension to that debate. Conceivably if a team really wants a player, I don’t know if not getting draft picks would really stand in the way (see Beltran last yr). So the Mets might want to trade Wright at the deadline that way they’d still get to keep the picks plus get a solid prospect. Maybe other teams will be hesitant if they don’t get the picks. but I think if teams really need a bat and Wright performs well it shouldn’t be an issue.
Okay, lets look at it this way. What if David Wright is on the DL come trade deadline time with back issues? Do you think CRG will recommend to the Wilpons that they risk having that scenario play out? CRG are not baseball fans. They are not Mets fans. They are here to do one thing and that is sell whatever assets the team has and right the ship. Bay is not an asset. Neither is Johan. Wright is, even with his value at a career low he’s a valuable asset.
I don’t think CRG is going to be making all the baseball-related decisions. Nor do I think the Mets are obligated to follow all their suggestions.
I think Wright will be a Met come opening day.
CRG will not make ANY baseball decisions. Only financial ones. To them David Wright is not a player, he’s a $15 million dollar debt that the Mets should divest themselves of.
Well I don’t think CRG will be involved in telling what Mets to trade/dump. Maybe they’d set some estimate as to the total payroll that should be allocated to players, but I don’t see them saying specifically to get rid of X player b/c he makes 15 mil. And I think at somepoint if the Mets do cut payroll or plan to make even more drastic cuts in payroll MLB will finally step inn.
So……. Wright is a Met until July 2012 then… ? Murphy at 3rd base? And then in 2013 WIlmore Flores plays 3rd base and establishes himself as a very fine mediocore 3rd baseman. Management is happy. Met fans beg for mercy. Is this the plan?
Lifelong, that also depends who we get back, we might get a kid who’s really good and in 2014 might be a stud.. who knows right.. but i’ll tell you this, mets will lose close to 95 games this year, and 100 the next year…
Everyone says trade Wright, who do the Mets have to replace him, and please don’t say Murphy or Turner. Both would be very short term solutions at best. Murph does not hit for enough power and while I like Turner I don’t see his numbers translating into 25hrs and 106 rbi’s. So who do they get? Lutz?
Who do they replace Wright with? Did that even matter with Jose Reyes who was even more irreplaceable? That doesnt matter. All that matters is saving money. And for now they have Daniel Murphy who can slot in for Wright and had a better season.
If the Wilpons did not place themselves in the financial mess they are now in, there would be no talk about trading David. Getting rid of Wright for prospects is in no way a baseball move as it is one of financial desperation unless it is obvious to the front office that David is planning to leave after the 2012 season and will treat New York the same way Puljos did with St. Louis. Then we would have little choice but to do something now and get what we could get. And if they were attempting to sign a good free agent and send Wright packing for that same reason, no one could argue with such wisdom.
But because the Wilpons got us a Zach Wheeler, still imagine what 2011 might have been had we retained KRod and Beltran, Murphy and others had not succumbed to injury and perhaps we claimed one or two “rentals” off waivers. I for one cannot accept not knowing what could have been under these stated circumstances.
And these actions DO hurt the team in the long term for the Wilpons ARE sacrificing the future by slowly ridding themselves of quality players like Reyes and Wright who still have productive years ahead of them and some of the young players now on the roster once they become eligible for arbitration ala Billy Beane. These players are just as essential in the path to future success because few teams other than Tampa Bay ever won dominated mostly by prospects coming up within a year or two of each other without the aid of seasoned veterans. It’s always a mixture.
Only teams where the players all get old at once does a competitive franchise find itself in the situation of having to truly rebuild (and last season we WERE competitive before it was broken up). That was more the case beginning in 2007 when age starting catching up with our first baseman, second baseman, left fielder, right fielder, catcher, three starting pitchers and closer. Yes, I agree KRod or Beltran would have remained on the team this season but that is not like adding one’s left side of the infield along with it.
Which is more important – the team or the Wilpons?
Unfortunately, there is no way you can separate the 2. The Wilpons are the Mets, the Mets are the Wilpons. And unless the Mets are pulled from the dead frozen hands of the Wilpons, the Mets will not be associated any other way.
Perfectly stated.
This.
And I’m already tired of talking about these owners and being broke – and ST hasn’t even started. Yet this will be the most talked about issue for the next couple of years, at least.
So goes the Wilpons finances, so go the Mets….
Don’t worry srt. I think that once the boys head back to Port St. Lucie in a few weeks, a lot of this stuff will simply blend into the background and real Mets baseball will be front and center again. It wont be long until we hear the crack of a bat and the leather popping. I can’t wait to move on myself…
that mostly happened last year with the whole madoff/picard crap.
I wish I could be that optimistic but I’m willing to bet everything going on, on the field will be dissected by the media as having a direct correlation to everything off the field – mainly the state of the Mets finances.
Not unless we’re somehow the Cinderella team this season. I can dream…..
Either way I’m still looking forward to some NY Met baseball.
“the Wilsons ARE sacrificing the future by slowly ridding themselves of quality players like Reyes and Wright…” How can you even make that statement now? the draft hasn’t even occurred yet. We have no idea who they are getting for the sandwich pick or extra second rounder. David Wright was a sandwich pick. Also you have no idea what they’re going to get for Wright. He hasn’t even been traded yet.
NJ, you are 100 percent right and in that, the truth does hurt.
Which places all of us in an a very unhappy situation. The Wilpons are asking of everyone to do and give too much so they can retain ownership.
The only way we can support the team is by not supporting the Wilpons so let us do our part by not going through the turnstiles even if the team again surprises us all. Don’t forget that “dynamic pricing” scheme which virtually places us at each other’s throats outbidding each other for the privilege of admission. The more we go, the more we will be forced to pay. Just shows that even in their darkest hours, it’s not beyond Fred and Jeff to still try and skim the fans for even more.
It’s a shame to even have a conversation like this for both the fans and players.
well, MLB is still a for-profit business. They aren’t running a charity or some kind of public team!
With all due respect, don’t understand the point. Of course the Wilpons (or whoever would own the Mets) are in the business to make profit.
And we, as consumers, are looking for the best value for our dollar. Without ownership there would be no team for the fans and without the fans the owners make no profit. So in order to make that profit, the Wilpons have to produce a product that the fans both want and at a price they are willing to pay. And that includes both the team and the stadium experience.
Now, for those who aren’t concerned about the cost of the ticket, the things I mention are of little consequence. For those who are more prudent on how they spend their dollars, these points are indeed significant. That the Wilpons decided to accommodate both but rather cater to one and be indifferent to the other plays to that decision as well in the terms of anger and resentment.
I was just referring to the comment about “the wilpons asking people to do to retain ownership”
They are trying to stay afloat, just like every business. So they are putting what they can on the field. If you want to watch, up to you, as with every other potential customer.
It’s just business, not personal!
That comment was to point out that the Wilpons are counting on their fans to generate enough revenue to help them pay off some of their debts and retain ownership.
And yes, to care enough about the fans in the Champions Section as to have ushers bring them complimentary gifts (like they did opening day when we sat there) yet not care enough for fans in the upper promenade to build only one escalator and cut off a large segment of left field so they can build an expensive restaurant for those same high ticket buyers… yes that is making business quite personal.
I didnt like what was going on last year but I still went to as many games as I usually do. I didn’t buy their 7 pack but ended up going to 8 games anyway.You cant say Wilpon hates the team and then not support the team because then you’re hating the team too.
I’m an original New Breeder, having seen my first Met on April 19, 1962 when Al Jackson pitched the first shutout in team history, beating the Phillies 8-0 when, at the same time, Frank Thomas tied a major league record by getting hit by the pitch twice in the same inning.
I’ve been akin with both Bob Millers, Duke Carmel, Ed Bauta, Larry Burright, Al Moran and feel the exact same way with the likes of Ike Davis, Dillon Gee, Daniel Murphy, David Wright and all the rest just as I did that first day in the Polo Grounds.
One doesn’t have to support the Wilpons to support the team. If anything, the best thing for the team would be to get Fred, Jeff and Katz out of Flushing. No, new ownership wouldn’t guarantee success on the field, lower ticket prices, seeing all of left field or not having to run cross country to get to a rest room – but it would mean no longer having a front office indifferent to the fan base with little regard of what the Mets really mean to them. And looking at it purely from a business perspective, they made a lot of money despite a high payroll because the ticket prices were lower at Shea and there were more of them to sell. They just thought even more money could be made with less people paying a lot, lot more than before and it backfired on them as it should have for a good business stays the course and tries to expand it further and not go suddenly head off in a totally opposite direction.
But the most apprehensible injustice of them all was not supporting either the players, the fans or the City when the club was just five out in the loss column in late July and playing inspired baseball (especially after nobody gave a chance after starting off the season at 5-14). They turned a great summer into a long, hot one. And the reasons that caused them to salary dump and dump the season were again brought on by themselves. For those of us who paid to see Marvelous Marv would also pay to see Marvelous Murph (my own connotation) if only management didn’t try fleecing the fans for all the money they could.
That’s not good business.
That is also not “baseball like it ought a be”.
So that’s why my wife and I will be rooting for the team at home.
Joey, Maniac is right. If you start discouraging the team and speaking to everyone to practically boycott ownership then you’re basically against the Mets success. Everyone here doesn’t like the Wilpons but once opening day starts we all watch Mets baseball on SNY and support the Wilpons because take a wild hunch on who owns SNY. When the Mets made it to playoffs in 2006 during the time of which Fred became the Mets we didn’t argue, complain and whine about the Wilpons because he gave us a team everyone wanted at any cost and now were paying for our foolishness (without a WS from the “dream team”) and so are the Mets. I go to Citi when ever I can and I watch/listen to games courtesy of SNY and WFAN, why? Because I for one am a Mets fan. I support my team not the Wilpons but i frankly don’t care who’s running the team because someone on WFAN said something very true, “no matter who’s running the Mets, us fans always blame everyone but the players for the teams failure but for success we only encourage the players”. As long as I know the Mets at least have a season then thats all okay. Everyone just stop with the negativity and try to support the players and our Mets for success regardless who we have or don’t have because what brought us to the dance was the Mets, NOT ownership or front office. LETS GO METS!!!
Hi Pauly,
The bottom line is that a lot of the fun has been taken out of going to a Met game.
This has nothing to do with those guys in the field but rather being denied access to half the entrances to the ballpark, the lack of escalators, bathrooms and views of left field. These dilemmas are not faced by those buying more expensive seats nor where they faced by anyone when Shea Stadium was still around. At Shea, we could enter at the gate closest to our seat locations and there were escalators everywhere to get us to them comfortably, including the upper deck. We might have been high and far away from the action, but at least we were able to see it all.
This all changed with Citi Field and will stay the same whether the team remains in the cellar or has a ten game division lead. It will also be something new ownership cannot recitify much because it will be part of the new ball park they inherit.
And for many families with children, the price of tickets, parking, food and a souvenir has become so expensive that taking their kids to the ballpark more than once has become a financial consideration.
That is enough reason for many to get one fed up. Yes, a day at the park won’t break the bank for us so it’s not just a matter of higher ticket prices. It’s simply that I’m accustomed to better treatment for my hard earned dollar and not that of a second class citizen.
Amen JoeyD. So far since Citifield has opened I have only been to two games,both in 2009.I sat with my Wife and 2 sons between 1B and the RF corner about 10 rows back and each seat cost $91.00 a piece.Add that to the $19.00 to park a Yearbook A few beers and soda’s,pretzels and what not cost me upwards of $500.00. Season tickets were in my family from 1964-2008 starting with my father and handed down to me and my brother until Citifield opened up.I’m as big a Met fan as anyone but you won’t catch me at Citifield anytime soon as long as a Wilpon owns the team.I still watch every game and I go see them on road trips the last 2 years.I don’t blame anybody for boycotting the Wilpons.Their bullshit has gonne on long enough.
and the terrible job by the front office compounds it
Watching the games on TV is not boycotting the Wilpons. It is paying money for less product. They own the cable network that broadcasts most of the games, draw revenues from CBS radio (although that contract is up soon), and get a split of the national games.
Because of revenue sharing, you can’t even watch other teams’ feeds.
the bottom line is if you don’t want to give your money to the wilpons, then you can’t indulge in the Mets.
You have a point on the stadium prices and experience. Everyone would agree that Shea was and is still better than Citi due mainly to the memories and all experience. Citi Field ticket prices for me aren’t as deep as others because I’m 20 years old and single, I mainly pay for myself and thanks to stub hub a ticket for me on pepsi porch even the promenade is consistently on a $10-30 price range. I completely understand if you have a family and like Joe says that a family night out to the ball game is 500 is too overpriced because it completely is, hell thats near half rent on a 2 bedroom apartment. The only thing from my experience of when i went to Shea and Citi was the crowd. The Shea crowd was amazing and completely behind the Mets but the Citi crowd is mainly there as a simple “hey wanna go out and do something? sure, citi field?” not like a real Mets fan “man I cant wait to go to the ballpark and SEE the game”. The keyword is see the game at the ball park not hang out at the ball park. Wilpons I really don’t care about because their time is coming but what does tick me off is the complete reception the Mets fans give to the Mets themselves. In 1962 everyone remembers lovable losers but in 2012 everyone is predicting and expecting just flat out losers. I go to the ball park when I can and my wallet allows me too, watch/listen every game possible but I always support my team. I just feel that MMO has to put a post titled “Whats Wrong With The Mets” and once and for all just stop this spam thats occurring on every single post. Hell this post is what we think about David Wright and his potential future coming off a down year not front office, not wilpons, not who we dont have, not about ANYTHING besides david wright.
Amen to both you guys. Glad to know I’m not the only one who places integrity along with quality when it comes to these things.
And Joe, you mentioned the yearbooks. Notice how the past few years except for some new articles the yearbooks are virtually the same and more photo albums than anything else? Not much put into updating it each year. Remember the old ones that were just 48 pages but jammed with information and multiple pictures about each player, the manager and coaching staff?
Yes you”re right JoeyD.The older yearbooks especially the one’s in the 70′s were way better
.Donal I don’t have SNY anymore.I cancelled my sportspack on Directv.I moved out of NY a couple of years ago so I don’t get blacked out from the opposing teams broadcast.You can still watch the Mets without feeding the Wilpons pockets. Whatever they make in revenue sharing is miniscule. You can’t say it’s not hurting them because they have been losing money the last few years becuase there are a lot of others who feel the same way I do.
Hi Joe,
I feel the 1967 and 1968 yearbooks were probably the best of the early lot. All those from seventies were superb. Got an old, worn out original 1962 edition which my cousin gave me a few years later, not realizing what it would mean in memories alone. Actually, have them all from 1962 through 1974. I will say, however, that the magazine program that replaced the old scorecards is really filled with information and worth more than the yearbook and costs much less. Give credit for that one to Fred and Jeff at least.
As far as SNY, since the Wilpons are part owners, paying extra for the sports package means a few pennies going into their pockets nonetheless.
Ciao,
Joe
Pauley,
I’m so glad to see that you can understand our points about expenses and experiences – citing a family outing at Citi Field as the equivalent of a half-month’s rent was an excellent way of putting it all into perspective.
Agree with you about Citi Field being more of a hangout or place to be in – that is what happens when ownership encourages such behavior by appealing not to the baseball fan who won’t go to the park to watch a game because it is too expensive but rather to those who want to spend a lot on a night out instead and there happens to be a baseball game played there as well. Others told me there was a noticeable difference in atmospheres between Citi and Shea we saw it too our two times being there. It seemed like a hang out. Also, on opening day last season when it became too cold to sit outside, we stayed in the heated champions lounge like many others. The majority of those were hanging around the bar, talking to each other, or watching golf on many of the monitors. Only a few were gathered around the monitors that had the game on. And only a handful like my wife and I sat near the picture window where we could only see two thirds of the field – but at least were still concentrating on the game.
But you are also right – this was a post about David Wright and we should be concentrating on the subject at hand – but that also shows how the future of this team and David himself are so closely related to subjects that have nothing to do with the business of making money and baseball but of making of money period. Hence, the complaints about all that is wrong with Citi Field and the shabby treatment the average Met fan is getting. It’s all related, unfortunately, even when it comes down to the way the Yearbooks are put together.
Thank you Joey for understanding and having a conversation with me like two Mets fans and not like children of where one thinks he’s right and no other opinion matters. For me as a child I went to Shea about 2 or 3 times but 1 time i do remember was going in 06 or 05 and the Mets were facing the Cubs and I always enjoyed Dominican players because that is half of my nationality and I was going for Sosa a bit but when i tried screaming “Come on Sosa” I couldn’t even hear myself because everyone and I mean literally everyone just filled him with boos and forget about it when bonds came to Shea, I’m surprised bonds didn’t cry on the field like he normally would in interviews. Shea was a truly hostile, loud but none the less a real Mets crowd. I have been to Citi around 9 times or so since 2009 and I always lose my voice and get extremely light headed because I as a Mets fan want to be heard by the Mets and encourage them even if my putting my health on the line. I always have a true Mets fan around my section and me and him (mostly a male) cheer together and I have a really fun time because I know the Mets hear us but for everyone else there they just look at me like I’m on drugs or drunk but no it’s called being a METS FAN. I even see senior couple look at me with a smile and give me a thumbs up and I feel really warm inside because I brought this a couple a smile in a place where baseball is practically non existent. I was there when duda hit his walk off single against the padres and the crowd roared and you couldn’t even hear dude or kevin, why? because everyone gave up on the team at top of the 8th and just left and a few stayed and what do know? Mets did something amazing. In Shea the fans always stayed because it was a METS stadium not a reincarnated dodgers stadium filled with fake baseball fans. Back in the day people saw the Mets fans as annoying, committed and rough new york crowd but now were irrelevant that even the phillies come to Citi and basically sounds like veterans or citizens park. THE PHILLIES! in Shea you would be caught dead if you were a silly phillie fan, Mets fans would rip you apart but in Citi…nothing…
Sorry for the poor grammar. I’m just really angry talking about the Citi crowd. Please excuse my grammar, I just can’t help it when I talk about the Mets.