Comments on: The Fifth Commandment

By: XtreemIcon

XtreemIcon — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 21:45:58 +0000

“Despite five straight winning seasons as manager, Cobb, followed a week later by Indians player-manager Speaker, suddenly retired after the 1926 season. The day after Christmas in 1926, the public found out why: Dutch Leonard, a disgruntled former player who had been released by both managers, accused Cobb and Speaker of fixing a game on September 24, 1919. Both stars, plus Cleveland outfielder Smokey Joe Wood, had allegedly agreed to let Detroit win the game to give the Tigers third place. Upon hearing the allegations, American League president Ban Johnson forced the two stars to quit. But Commissioner Kenesaw Landis cleared and reinstated both players when Leonard refused to leave California to testify. Cobb ended up in Philadelphia with Connie Mack, who defended the hated Cobb during the ordeal, and Cobb played two more years before retiring for good after a .328 season in 1928.”

http://www.baseballlibrary.com/ballplayers/player.php?name=ty_cobb_1886

By: Joe D

Joe D — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 20:47:16 +0000

I read that exact same thing in a baseball book once. I wish I could recall which book it was.

By: Donal

Donal — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 20:42:46 +0000

So what? It’s not their job to placate the public.

By: Donal

Donal — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 20:40:36 +0000

Actually, I heard that Ty Cobb retired when Landiss heard he had been fixing games and was let out in order to protect the game after the Black Sox scandal.

By: XtreemIcon

XtreemIcon — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 20:38:22 +0000

I can’t argue that one.

By: Donal

Donal — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 20:37:01 +0000

If someone caught Jeter using PEDs, it would snowball. Because there would be other guys who would provide the solid evidence and now have an outlet.

Again, look at how Chass went about it. No proof, no outside confirmation, just his own idea of what he might have seen.

By: Joe D

Joe D — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 20:33:06 +0000

Okay let me explain it this way. What i’m saying is that the court of public opinion has always preferred a beautiful lie than a terrible truth.

By: XtreemIcon

XtreemIcon — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 20:26:16 +0000

Canseco, a guy in the game who said he did it and listed the people he saw do it is a far different animal than Chass,who said he saw acne on someone’s back. Which we now know could a) have not even been acne, and b) even if it was, could have been cause by several different reasons, most of which have far more correlation than steroids do.

By: XtreemIcon

XtreemIcon — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 20:21:49 +0000

Of course not. He came out with far more recently than that. He said he had WANTED to write about it, but the Times editors nixed it. Convenient.

By: Donal

Donal — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 20:20:53 +0000

How about we begin with a consistent standard.

By: Joe D

Joe D — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 20:19:29 +0000

Chass is an ass, I’m just saying if one writer in a million said I saw jeter popping PEDs who would you believe? When Canseco first blew the whistle the fans first crucified him and called him a liar. So did all the players, coaches and GMs.

By: srt

srt — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 20:10:08 +0000

So, did Chase actually write about this back in the 90s when all were turning a blind eye? Or did he wait until Canseco blew the lid with his tell all book and forced the issue and the Mitchell list a decade later?

By: Joe D

Joe D — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 20:04:04 +0000

How can you ask someone to consider a players integrity, character and sportsmanship? Doesn’t that depend onone’s perception? How can you judge one’s perception right or wrong?

By: Joe D

Joe D — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 19:59:55 +0000

So you want to do what – let fans vote like in the all star game? What is your fix?

By: XtreemIcon

XtreemIcon — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 19:56:51 +0000

http://nybaseballdigest.com/2011/01/26/three-out-of-three-doctors-agree/

Howard Megdal, ladies and gents.

By: XtreemIcon

XtreemIcon — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 19:53:12 +0000

It got him there because he saw back acne, not steroids. It as a stupid claim to make.

By: Donal

Donal — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 19:51:59 +0000

If you are going to make such accusations against a man and threaten to destroy his character and legacy, then you show us the proof and you better have a damn good reason for not bringing it to light sooner.

By: Donal

Donal — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 19:50:14 +0000

Because he didn’t actually see it. Look at his accusation again. He heard from some other guy who thinks he saw Piazza showing bacne.

Was that other guy a doctor? Nope. Did Chass ask a doctor? Nope.

Other writers (including bloggers) did go ask some doctors and got a ton of explanations that didn’t involve steroids. One being that Piazza wasn’t exhibiting bance, but rather skin irritation because he’s a hairy Italian guy squatting in catcher’s gear for a few hours in 90+ degree heat.

But hey, what woulkd a doctor know compared to guy who pissed away his journalistic integrity with a second hand accusation, right?

Seriously, Murray Chass is your go to guy?

Murray friggin’ Chass?

By: Joe D

Joe D — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 19:43:52 +0000

This is their vote. This is how the system works.

BTW, If you think Martino and Puma are HOF writers you need to read better stuff lol. They’re not even in the same class of those that have been honored.

By: jessep

jessep — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 19:41:33 +0000

Yeah its not the voting that is my issue. It’s the hiding behing something and not having the fortitude to come out and say it.

If 1 person doesn’t vote for Bagwell because they think they saw something in his locker, then don’t hide behind the vote. Tell your story, that’s your job as a reporter. You’re a reporter and writer first, voter second. That’s what I am saying.

If you asked me to change the process, I’d want it to be similar to the Heisman but with a twist.

I’d want Writers + Living HOF members + some sort of elite Managers/Coaches/Executives Group to have a say.

I’d want not only the writers who don’t get to see a guy play as often as they claim to, plus HOF members who know what standards makes a Hall of Famer and Managers/Coaches/Executives who saw with their own eyes the player that is on the ballot.