4
2011
For Esses & Giggles: Go After Lincecum!
An article by 
One of our readers, Deebo, comes up with a worthy Friday afternoon debate that has nothing to do with Jose Reyes, bricks and blue walls. He writes:
I just read a FoxSports.com piece from JP Morosi that said an option for SF Giants to get more offensive support was to trade Lincecum for multiple players and then have money to sign a big name free agent (Reyes, Feilder, Pujols).
For Esses and giggles, what if the Mets traded Duda, Mejia (or Famillia), F-Mart, D-Murph and Flores for Lincecum? He’s going to make $17M next year and $20M in 2013. That, of course would mean NO REYES. Would that be a deal you would make? If not what would be your reason why?
Thanks to Deebo for the comment and for naming our brand new Friday Feature!
Here is the article that he refers to from Jon Morosi: Is Giants’ best hope trading Lincecum?
Matt Cain, Jonathan Sanchez and Ryan Vogelsongare on pace to become free agents after the 2012 season; Lincecum is up the year after that. Meanwhile, an offense that scored the fewest runs in the National League is in need of major upgrades. Hoping thatBuster Posey and Freddy Sanchez return at 100 percent doesn’t constitute an offseason plan.
So if the Giants wish to maximize their odds of returning to the World Series, they have two choices.
1. Spend big for Prince Fielder, Albert Pujols, Jose Reyes or at the very least Carlos Beltran.
2. Trade one of those prized starters for impact bats, because the day is fast approaching when the Giants won’t be able to afford them all.
The key for the Giants is that they want an impact bat. If I had to structure a package for Lincecum I would probably offer them:
David Wright, Zack Wheeler (who says you can’t go home again), Lucas Duda, Juan Lagares and Darin Gorski.
The Giants have been rumored to like Wright in the past and they would love the idea of getting Wheeler back. Lucas Duda’s power potential would have some nice appeal for them. The two minor leaguers are just window dressing and can be interchanged with just about anyone not named Matt Harvey or Jeurys Familia.
Use the David Wright money to re-sign Jose Reyes of course… Put Daniel Murphy at third base… Yada, yada, yada…
About the Author: Joe DeCaro
I'm a lifelong Mets fan who loves writing and talking about the Amazins' 24/7. From the Miracle in 1969 to the magic of 1986, and even the near misses in '73 and '00, I've experienced it all - the highs and the lows. I started Mets Merized Online in 2005 to feed my addiction. Follow me on Twitter @metsmerized.
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NL East Standings
| Team | W | L | Pct. | GB |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Braves | 24 | 18 | .571 | - |
| Nationals | 23 | 20 | .535 | 1.5 |
| Phillies | 20 | 23 | .465 | 4.5 |
| Mets | 16 | 24 | .400 | 7.0 |
| Marlins | 11 | 32 | .256 | 13.5 |
Last updated: 05/18/2013
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Disagre, trade wright for Cain.. duda along with ike davis can provide us 30+ hr’s per season for years to come, meanwhile, david’s full of excuses and chokes under pressure, in SF that will go unnotice, here in NY that won’t fly. trade him while he has value. some ppl still think he’s a “very good” player, well, let them deal with this stat padder who didn’t play well for us when the team has needed him the most, and at $15 million, he certainly isn’t worth the money..
Alex they’ll never do that deal because Cain is a consistant “innings eater”. The difference between SF’s “Innings eater” and ours (Pelf) is that SF’s can actually pitch! Timmy is more likely because of his high wire act and (dreaded word) potential.
The irony of your trade is not lost on me, though.
Deebo, of course, i am trading wright + prospects, hell, they want wheeler they can take him. at this point, duda CAN give us 30+ hr’s, wright can’t. duda can be a force, and wright can’t unless he’s surrounded by reyes, beltran and delgado again, which won’t happen. and enopugh with [pelfrey, we all know he sucks..
What year did Duda hit 30 homeruns at the Major league level? Are you making more guarantee’s you can’t back up?
I hope Duda does, better for the Mets of course, but your irrational hatred and lies you make up about Wright are becoming a real bore.
my ohh my… irrational lies and hatred for wright?!!? if they bore why you reply back to me then?? i told you yesterday to go back where you belong and not to reply to anything that says alex68.. i have no interest in talking or debating anything wih you..
Is that because you can’t answer the question? What year did Duda hit 30 homeruns or even close to that to say he CAN hit them going forward?
what was the question???? when did i say duda has hit 30 hr’s?? i said he can become a 30+ hr hitter as well as davis for years to come, at this point who’s not tire of wright inability to come trough in pressure situations??! but hey, he still be good looking in san francisco..
He said he CAN hit 30 HR’s…..he didn’t say that he did it before.
vinny, she just wanna create an argument for the sake of it because she don’t like when i talk bad about her precious golden boy david wright, this is an ungoing situation since i called him a choker for the first time in 2008, pay no mind..
Alex, you have a short memory. Yesterday you disparaged Kay, claiming with certainty . . . blah blah blah. It’s more than about Wright.
don’t tell me des, i’ve called wright a choker, his legion of fans still don’t accept the fact and call me a hater of wright.. i am just stating the fact..
O.K. Alex, I won’t tell you didn’t call Wright a choker. I know you did. But (and this is the point I was making) you said some other stuff too that if you said about me, I wouldn’t be happy. You’re convicted on multiple charges!!! lol.
Viiny B I just find it funny how some have confidence in on guy that he CAN hit 30 hrs when he hasn’t even completed one full year in the majors yet, meanwhile killing a guy that actually has done it.
Its also funny how Wright is the stat padder while Reyes was the one that removed himself to ensure he won the batting title. I have said I have no problem with what he did, but I do hate the double standards from some. Oh yeah and if a woman rreplies in favor of Wright the response always includes his looks? Why is that??
If the Mets got real piching in return I would trade Wright or anyone in a NY minute.
good you’d trade wright.. end of discussion then.. and btw, why is ok for a mets fan to showed confident in what freeman, kimbrel and jayson heyward can do for the braves, and me a real mets fan cannot show confident in duda or murphy~??? talk about double standard
There is nothing wrong with having confidence in Mets players, what I said has nothing to do with what you are saying. You have confidence is someone that hasn’t achieved something YET, and destroying at every chance a player that HAS achieved it. What you said has nothing to do with another discussion that happened with some Braves players.
In addition, you do know that Kimbrel, whether he’s on another team or not, won the players choice award as a rookie and broke the rookie saves record right?
and??? this is a METS BLOG, if you wanna drool about the braves and their prospect and the choke job, go to talking chop, that’s a blog about the braves.. go and have fun out there.. is ok to like a player, but why is it ok to sh** on mets players and drool about other players from the braves org?? you know what i remember about kimbrell? how he CHOKED the last game of the season when the braves needed him the most… f*** the braves and their prospects!!!
Can you please remind the people who praise the Yankees and Phillies around here that it is a Mets blog?
Start here
http://metsmerizedonline.com/2011/11/sabathia-avoids-free-agency-reyes-not-so-much.html
Did you really just say “but why is it ok to sh** on mets players”? Oh the irony………
i sh** on david wright for being unclutch and because his legion of fans think he’s some sort of godsend and can do no wrong. but, as i mention many times here, i used to love the guy, back in 2006 the man was money, in 2007 had the mets made the playoffs he was going to be IMO the first met to ever win the MVP, after that, well… ppl don’t mind trading him.. that says it all wouldn’t you agree1?!?
No I wouldn’t agree. People, like myself, that would be fine with trading him if it meant making the team better with the acquisition are fans of the NY METS, I don’t know about you, but I’m a Mets fan FIRST.
Who are these people that ever said he was a godsend, or where are these articles that said that? Are these more of your guarantees that it happened?
Yes make sure we post Links to the Oakland site for all the MONEYBALL Lovin folks too!
Kay — your logic is impeccable. It won’t be appreciated by some of the people who once upon a time liked both David and Jose. But you’re on the money in my book.
P.S.: For a number of years I’ve asked the ‘choker’ folks to define their terms quantitatively and then use it to prove their point. I don’t recall any responses.
des, you haven’t been around then.. but i’ll make it simple:
david freese in the 9th inning of game 6 = CLUTCH
david wright at any pressure situation = UNCLUTCH
Thanks for your view, Alex. But it doesn’t answer the mail.
P.S.: When Freese dropped the popup, was it because he was UNCLUTCH or he just made an error?
Clutch
adjective
16.
done or accomplished in a critical situation: a clutch shot that won the basketball game.
17.
dependable in crucial situations: a clutch player.
Something David Wright is not. He’s a good player, has nice stats, but he’s not someone to rely in in a critical situation.
And being clutch can be apply to anything in life, your job, when your friends need you when they’re in a bind, not just sports. But we’ve gone through this 8 hundred billion times already
So, a game winning home run with a broken back…not clutch?
again, as explained here 800 billion times. Sure a player can have some important hits in his career and after 8 years you SHOULD have a few no matter who you are.
I won’t explain it any further because anybody who reads my words who knows where I’m coming from will understand. That’s my target audience anyway.
a game winning home run with a broken back!?!?
Oh, I understand you perfectly. That’s why I can make fun of it so easily.
” Sure a player can have some important hits in his career and after 8 years you SHOULD have a few no matter who you are.”
So, is there a dividing line between clutch and unclutch? Is there a minimum bottom of the 9th home runs or something? What moves the needle on the Bayonne Mets Fan Clutch Scale ™?
Is it how a player actually performs, or is it just if Mike francesa tells you to like the guy or not?
So, one play defines his career?
maybe the whole postseason. you forget he was the WS MVP just on clutch hits in game 6 and game 7!!
Alex, there is no definition of CLUTCH or UNCLUTCH beyond ‘hits’ that you’ve provided. Why do we need to use what some folks would say is inflammatory language when the subject is just hits? Seems like overkill to me unless it can be tied to types of situations where a player’s performance varies.
No, he had a great October. He did make a pretty big error prior to those hits.
whether you say is 1 big hit, or 1 big postseason, he STILL HAS 1 MORE OF THOSE THAN DAVID WRIGHT, who under the brightest lights FOLDED..
So, Wright has no big, “game winning” hits?
i’ll give you 1 hour to come up with a BIG TIME CLUTCH HIT FROM DAVID WRIGHT… please start your google search
so, a game winning home run with a broken back isn’t clutch?
Thanks Des – but this whole choke/clutch conversation is just pointless at this time. You’d have better luck beating your head against a wall than to have a genuine objective discussion about that.
Do you remember a few months ago when the Cubs intentionally walked Duda to load the bases and pitch to Wright? Wright promptly ended the inning. Quick name the other MLB “star” you load the bases to get to with 2 outs? It’s not just the “Wright haters” who can see that he rarely comes through in clutch.
hey kay what year has duda played a whole season?
Ya, that is the point
The only point you have ever had is at the top of your head!
Gabba Gabba Hey!
He hasn’t, that’s the point.
To both you and dunderhead…
What has Wheeler done to deserve giving up Beltran then by that line of reasoning?
Huh?
Just because you doubting thomas’ don’t think much of Duda doesn’t mean you have any idea what he can or will do! Or any proof he won’t do it!
If last year’s numbers where he got sporadic playing time until August was any indication, he is good for at least 20 per year!
In August he hit 5 Hrs in 103 PA
That means he hit a HR once every 20.6 PA
If he maintained that rate he would hit 30 if he got 618 PA as a regular player!
Thats more indication he MIGHT hit 30 than you have to prove he never will!
Add to it they just moved the Fences in!
SO his rate is more likely to go up!
regular playing time will tell!
But he sucks right because he hasn’t done anything?
Does that mean Wheeler sucks who hasn’t done anything in the MLB as well?
Huh?
WOW, you are now making up lies. Where did ANYONE say he sucks? Show me where I said that? OMG this is the craziest thing ever.
How do you even deduct that I said he sucks? I am simply amazed now. Really go back and re read again what actually transpired, come back when you are a grown up and let’s discuss.
The San Francisco Giants have a proven record at drafting pitchers. Wheeler is a high ceiling pitcher from their draft. Beltran was leaving at the end of the year so you’d rather let him play out for 2 months on a losing team instead of getting, POSSIBLY, NO GUARANTEES OF COURSE a pitcher for the future of this team? Seems simple to me but…..
The San Francisco Giants have a proven record at drafting pitchers” lincecum and cain.. both HIGH DRAFT picks, yes, they got lucky.. please go ahead and tell me the last time a giant pitcher had won the CY YOUNG… ?? OHH wait.. i know.. how about 1967!!!!!!
please go back to where you’d do better ok..
by the eay, i know lincecum won, i am talking previous lincecum ok.. history of proven record drafting pitchers, give me a break go back … to ,,,
Cain was the 25th pick of the first round in 2002.
“please go ahead and tell me the last time a giant pitcher had won the CY YOUNG… ?? OHH wait.. i know.. how about 1967!!!!!!”
“by the eay, i know lincecum won, i am talking previous lincecum ok.. history of proven record drafting pitchers, give me a break go back … to ,,,”
That is hysterical right there.
A world series rotation of all homegrown pitchers would is probably just getting lucky huh?
Wait that means nothing, only one of them has a CY Young, lets forgets about the WS Title.
“What has Wheeler done to deserve giving up Beltran then by that line of reasoning?”
So, letting Beltran go for nothing is better than getting a top prospect.
More wisdom from Metsie: nothing is better than something.
Trading an MLB player for a guy who has done nothing in the MLB…You know like Lucas Duda!
I like Ike and Duda a lot. I’ve watched Duda in AAA for the past two years (and he mashed laser beam hits every time) But until I see either guy hit 30HRs, then their is no way I’m willing to bet that they are capable of providing us that kind of production.
so wait, we’re betting the BANK on nimmo and wheeler based on high ceiling, but is not ok to think duda is capable of hitting 30 hr’s based on the ceiling of the second half last year, where he hit 10 hr’s 14 doubles in less than 200 at bats!?!?
WOW!!!!! mets fans at its best…
The bank? What bank?
What are you talking about, who is breaking what bank. Mets fans at their best that twist everything written. You should go into politics, you are that good at it.
No on ever said anything about breaking the bank with Nimmo and Wheeler and NO one said Duda can’t hit 30 homeruns or won’t hit 30 homeruns. It was said we HOPE he can, but YOU said he CAN which to date is unproven in the same breath killing a player on the Mets that HAS done it.
Go ahead and twist some more!
I never thought y’all would actually make that a topic! Thanks. BTW your package is WAAAAAAAAAAAAY BETTER, LOL.
Murph @ 3rd actually isn’t a bad idea (can’t get run into over there, though there is Murphy’s law…) and he can hit.
Love your trade but I wish there was a way to hang onto Duda? That could come back to burn us.
If they want offense it’s either Wright and Duda, or Wright and Murphy. Murphy can replace Wright and Duda looked bad in the field.
Morosi has been sniffing glue. Lincecum will never be traded. He is the most popular Giant since Bonds.
If we can let our most popular player since Piazza (and most popular homegrown player since Strawberry) leave (over a few million dollars) then the Giants can trade Lincecum…right?
joe, if the reason they can’t sign Reyes is lack of money, your proposal doesn’t change that. Wright and Lincy make about the same amount, so with that deal payroll doesn’t change.
the initial one was all prospect types, so that would free up $$
I wouldn’t do that for Lincecum. This is not an “I heart Wright” thing, either. This team has holes. More than just one or 2. You’re proposing 5 players for 1 pitcher, 2 of which are slated as starters. Yes, Lincy is a true ace, but this team is not 1 Ace away from the playoffs, let alone the WS.
So, assuming Reyes does not re-sign, you’d have the following as your starting team:
Ike
Turner
Tejada
Murphy
Bay
Pagan?
Fmart?
Thole
And a rotation of:
Lincy
Santana
Dickey
Niese
Gee (assuming Pelf non-tender)
Better rotation, crappy offense. This team would basically become the SF Giants EAST, but with an overall crappier starting 5 than they have in SF.
Trade Wright, if needed, but not at the expense of Duda, Wheeler & Lagares.
Ya gotta love it….some FOX sportswriter suggests trading Lincecom for offense and next thing you know, everyone has all kinds of trade offers to get him.
This was nothing more than speculation on one sportswriter’s part. I’ll be real surprised to see the Giants trading Lincey this off season.
Haha you guys are funny… Alex, you are retarded!!! haha