I’m talking ONLY about 2007 here. So yes, in 07 we were more talented. The years after that the Phillies improved, and were more talented than us, but I’m talking only about 07….And btw, Alou, Pedro, and Castillo were playing in Sept of 07, so them “breaking down”, had nothing to do with it, because they didn’t break down – they were playing, and they did good too.

Mejia has a chance to be the lights out ace of a pitching staff, the most elusive item on a Major League roster. Gee doesn’t have that ability.

Mejia was 20 years old. Gee is 25. Mejia was told to scrap all but one of his pitches. Gee will continue to use all four of his. Mejia’s talent had yet to be developed, Gee’s is about as good as it will get.

This “comparison” is about as similar as comparing our ace to the Phillies ace.

And anyone who thinks we are going to go overslot I would remind you that until we pay back those loans from the MLB the rest of the league will raise holy hell if we go spending more money before we have paid them back!

No one has ever been made an example of for not following the guidelines but then again no one has already been in debt to the MLB before they went and overpaid a player to steal him away from a small market team.

Four everday regulars anywhere from 34-40 years old being overrun by the in their prime everyday regular Phillies.

The Phillies also played more like a team, possibly because a lot of them either came up together or came through the same system and there was something that other players had to fit into not unlike the NYY core 5 that began in the mid 90′s.

We didn’t have that we didn’t really have a core. We had Delgado, a reserved Beltran, a bunch of older vets soon to be retired and 2 very talented young kids. That’s not really a core. We also had Bernazzard undermining our manager I can’t believe that didn’t cost a couple of games.

The point about the Marlins is we have gotten a lot of the best talent that we have ever had by relying on them and their finances to allow us to get these players. Counting on a division rival to keep you supplied with talent is not a safe bet. Someday your gonna have to start supplying it yourself.

Bury your head in the sand all you want I don’t care but the facts remain that this Phillie team has gone to the post season 4 straight years and they built off their farm to start the whole process and then used the farm to keep it going. Without their farm they wouldn’t have even sniffed first place even once.

By the time their current run is over they will have most likely, in seven years equaled the number of World Series winners we have had in fifty, equaled the number of times we have qualified for the post season in fifty years as well.

Yeah they beat the Mets on the field, but they beat everyone else too. Won a world series, got to another, and went to the post season four straight times. In our whole history of 50 years we’ve gone back to back once.

Your conclusion, it was just one game, fluke, luck, they hit, we didn’t, we were better on paper but if that were the case then how do you explain them going four straight times and beating everyone else on the field too?

The facts are that they were a team on the rise, we were a team already in decline and unnable to sustain ourselves because of the condition of the farm.

well anyway, my point was that we didn’t lose because of “talent”. we were just as talented as the Phillies that year, wait, you know what? I’d say we were even MORE talented than them….They won the games ON the field, they got big hits in big spots, late in the season, and we didn’t. – that’s why we lost.

Thole is an average catcher at best.

“In the minors we have some well thought of prospects from the Minaya era ”

Ya, so well thought of only one of them made it in Baseball America’s top 50 (Mejia at #44) and no one like BA or Baseball Prospectus ranks our overall farm system over #20

If you want to root for our farmhands to come up here and succeed, I shall join you. We all should.

But don’t fool yourself into thinking we’ve got Murderers’ Row waiting down there.

Some games? How about record breaking blown games?

It is NOT second guessing it’s you having selective memory.

I swear people are never happy. they want guys to perform and condemn them when they don’t, and now you want them to keep Carrasco and his 6 ERA, over Gee who is performing great? make up your minds.

worrying about putting Gee in the bullpen for a few games is making a mountain out of a mole hill, people.

That’s just as bad as what your arguing about.

The point is it’s too early to say either way.

He was the GM that saw what many feel is the biggest choke job in MLB history.

His biggest mistake may be not doing enough to be around to see if indeed some of his prospects turn out to make huge contributions to the Mets turning things around. It’s still too early to tell but I look forward to giving him all the praise he deserves if that day ever comes.

I suppose that having a farm system capable of obtaining Cliff Lee, Roy Halliday, Joe Blanton and Roy Oswalt doesn’t have anything to do with their sustaining their success either.

I guess the right way to build a championship team is to just wait around and see who’s available every year and then pay them twice as much to come here.

Yeah, either that or wait for the Marlins to have another fire sale.

In other words a team put together from multiple sources from 1996-2006 all 26-30 years old. A team that played like a team, not a collection of individuals all thrown together all at once with half of them on their last legs.

I wonder how many more games we would have given up 10 or more runs if our pitchers had to pitch in CBP 81 times a year? Probably twice as many.

Current MLB players signed by Minaya & Co. (either on the roster or who have played MLB):

C Josh Thole, 1B Ike Davis, RHP Mike Pelfrey, RHP Bobby Parnell, LHP Jon Niese, OF Lucas Duda, OF Fernando Martinez, 2B Reuben Tejeda, RHP Dillon Gee.

Prospects signed by Minaya:

OF Kirk Neiuwenhuis, RHP Matt Harvey, OF Corey Vaughn, OF Darrell Ceciliani. 2B Reese Havens, RHP Brad Holt.

Where Minaya really excelled was internationally where he found:

RHP Jenrry Mejia, RHP Jeurys Familia, OF Cesar Puello, IF Wilmer Flores, IF Aderlin Rodriguez, LHP Juan Urbina, 2B Reuben Tejeda, and OF Fernando Martinez.

While the Mets farm system isn’t a top 10 just yet, many of the international signings are very young and are still developing and several of them have very high upside if they develop as hoped, such as Mejia, A-Rod, Puello, Flores, Urbina, and Familia.

I’m not arguing that Minaya should have kept his job, on the contrary I agree with his dismissal because his administration seemed to be in disarray and wondering aimlessly at times with no clear direction. Hopefully, combining the raw talent Minaya managed to infuse with a clear and well defined direction by the new administration, the Mets will become what they should have already been: a NL powerhouse with a solid farm system adding to a well constructed ML roster.

Giving up 7 runs 41 times doesn’t mean your going to lose all those games but when a full 25% of all the games you play result in the other team scoring anywhere from 7 to 13 runs your not going to have a great record.

The question has to be asked. Why did we give up 7 or more runs 41 times? Because we had so much great, young, well developed talent flowing up here from the minors?

I don’t think so.

I’ll tell you why we collasped: we lost SEVEN games in a row against the Phillies late in the season….and a lot of them were very close games….

And It had NOTHING to do with not having any talent – in fact, in one game Reyes, Castillo, Wright and Beltran went hittless against ADAM EATON. And it’s not like they had talented starters either in those games. Moyer, J.D Durbin, Loshe, and eaton started for them. So if you can’t hit BAD pitchers with a lineup that was one of the BEST in the NL, it’s not because of “not enough talent.” Our hitters were WAY more talented than their pitchers…and we didn’t hit them in those 7 games.

You want to talk about Glavine, elduque, and Pedro and how bad they were, but you know who some of the Phillies starters that year? Moyer, Eaton, Loshe, Freddy Garcia, Kendrick, and backing them up were J.D Durbin, Zack Segovia, Fabio Castro, John Ennis, and Happ who was not ready – That’s better than our guys? yeah right. And I could cherry pick some names out of the Phillies bullpen. lets see: Yoel Hernandez, Matt Smith, Anderson Garcia, Joe Bisenius, Francisco Rosario, Kane Davis, the 41 yr old Jose Mesa, John Ennis, Fabio Castro and J.D Durbin pitched some relief as well – Now THAT seems like a severe talent shortage to me. In what planet is that a good team? lol.

But guess what? they still won…because they won it on the field, they got big hits in big spots in the game, and we didn’t – that’s why they won.

Good thinking.

On what planet would this be considered a good team?

So far i DO like Sandy’s quick decision making. It can cast doubt on guy who might have been a little more cavalier under Minaya’s regime but now they had BETTER perform. I also agree with Alderson’s stance on trying to avoid giving long contracts because how many of those contracts are fulfilled from beginning to end by players? I think he could’ve spent the little money the Mets had smarter this offseason by getting us better pitching. It could’ve been done. I hate the moneyball/saber aspect to him. The rest we will have to see. But not according to the writer – to him Sandy is Jesus Christ.