Phillies Release Castillo

17 Comments + Add Comment

• Bayonne Mets Fan March 30, 2011 at 11:00 pm

  ..again, the statistical angle among fans is getting out of hand. I personally think OPS is a lousy stat for good hitters let alone light hitters or singles type hitters. OPS is not even relevant to players like Luis Castillo. Offensively it’s like giving the OPS for guys like Ozzie Smith, Omar Vizquel, Rey Ordonez. Ozzie Smith is in the Hall Of Fame. Luis Castillo hit .235 last year and it was his worst AVG since his 2nd year.

  I’m appreciating mainstream media more and more everyday because there’s still common sense used when discussing and analyzing players. Sure MLB Network may use OPS here and there but they use it in a sensible way and also when I’ve seen it they don’t just list the OPS. The usually list the relevant stats that go with the proper players. Who the hell wants to know the OPS for Ozzie Smith? Let me know his BA instead.
  • XtreemIcon March 30, 2011 at 11:10 pm

    I don’t like OPS, either. I prefer the relevant stats, like OBP and SLG%. Batting average is unnecessary, as it only tells you the frequency of getting hits ONLY in plate appearances that result a hit or a non-sacrifice out. It ignores the other plate appearances that can have a huge impact on the game. So why ignore it? Tell me how often the guy gets on base and how many bases he gets per hit. That’s a great place to start. If you choose to, or if warrants, you can break it down more, but don’t use a half-stat like batting average. You’re only cheating yourself.
    • Bayonne Mets Fan March 30, 2011 at 11:19 pm

      They don’t give an OPS or OBP award. They give awards for the highest batting average.

      If u can’t hit, u can’t play. Period. You’re just an anonymous blogger to me with a warped concept of what makes baseball works. IT’s flawed and hopefully this type of thinking will fade in time.

      THANK GOD for mainstream media. I enjoy listening to people who know what they’re talking about, not some anonymous fantasy league people who not only take the joy of baseball away from the casual fan but i think drive them away. Lots of new fans learning baseball the wrong way and it’s resulting in a newer generation of fans who have the wrong idea about what’s important in baseball.

      Your analysis is backwards working forwards and it’s not fun for the regular fans. Just saber/fantasy guys like you
      • XtreemIcon March 30, 2011 at 11:33 pm

        It’s not fun for you because someone poked a hole in your balloon. You were fed baseball out of the womb like it was years ago and go on that basis without ever thinking for yourself. You just blindly follow along what baseball was like in the 80′s and your fear of the unknown has held you back. It’s ok. You’re allowed to have your own opinion. Watch baseball. You don’t have to constantly live in your fantasy world where batting average and RBIs are important.

        I, too, like mainstream media. I love how Baseball Tonight has begun using the Next Level feature all the time, and when running down team’s lineups use OPS and OBP way more than they use batting average. I love how when Olney and Kurkjian talk or write about players, they begin with those stats, as well. I love how basically all the baseball bloggers on ESPN.com understand and use sabermetrics when necessary. I could deal without the OPS, but even in it’s flawed state is much better than batting average.

        Forget what you think you know about baseball and start fresh. Think for yourself. Read a prospectus. Understand that “Moneyball” is not a philosophy. It never was. Understand that plate discipline and focusing on OBP has very, very little to do with “walking more,” like you seem to think it does. That’s your problem. You don’t understand these things and you refuse to learn about them. That’s the definition of ignorance. Not just not knowing or understanding, but refusing to try to know and understand. You don’t have to like anything about sabermetrics, but you’re a fool for commenting on them with such little knowledge as you have.
        • Bayonne Mets Fan March 30, 2011 at 11:39 pm

          i know EXACTLY what they’re about and still feel the same way. And oh, I don’t watch ESPN. No Mets fan should. Oh, and ESPN is at the bottom of the pack for a reason. You can call me ignorant for refusing to learn new things that I already know will lead me right back to where I started from and that’s okay. You can use all the fancy numbers you want but u can never cover up a lack of knowledge about BASEBALL, you can’t fool the game and you can’t fool people who know the game. Not just me but most people who read this site who have a normal view of baseball. I’m sure they’re just as aware of those ridiculous numbers as me and they know better as well.
          • XtreemIcon March 30, 2011 at 11:45 pm

            You know what they’re about? Well, you could have fooled me (and everyone else) the way you talk about them in your posts. You have no idea and you’re not fooling anyone.
            • Bayonne Mets Fan March 30, 2011 at 11:53 pm

              “Understand that plate discipline and focusing on OBP has very, very little to do with “walking more,” like you seem to think it does. That’s your problem. You don’t understand these things and you refuse to learn about them. That’s the definition of ignorance. Not just not knowing or understanding, but refusing to try to know and understand” – Extreme Icon.

              As someone who was a leadoff hitter all the way to college level, who enjoyed walking a lot and had a great eye I know EXACTLY what you (anonymous person) mean. I don’t have to learn about that other crap because like i said..it only leads you back to where you started from. U can have the last work or else this will never end.
        • False Hustle March 31, 2011 at 7:35 am

          Again, why do you argue with this guy? He’s a closed-minded contrarian who spews the same nonsense every time. Let him live in his cave, whatever.
    • Metsie March 31, 2011 at 9:31 am

      Well you can’t say it is unnecessary. You do need it to weight the OBP since the OBP obscures the hitting aspect of a player.

      Like I have always maintained it is ok to use OBP in an evaluation provided you also look at the component stats used to make up that OBP to determine the QUALITY of that OBP.

      As I have pointed out many times. Similar OBPs do not mean similar players nor equal players. (I Know you know this X!)

      Two players with a .400 OBP can have that number for different reasons. And those reasons can lead to other qualities that are not reflected in SLG or OBP.

      A guy with a high BA and a High OBP is better than a player with the same OBP but lower average. Especially in the Runs scored department.

      Similar OBPs but disparate BA means the guy with the lower average walks more leading to less Runs driven in while the guy who hits better will drive in more runs while also scoring as much as the guy who walks.

      So to say BA is Unneccessary is patently wrong.
      OBP is fine to use but you have to reference the BA to understand why the OBP is what it is.

      a .300 BS with a .400 OBP is much much better than a .250 Hitter with .400 OBP!
      And OBP and SLG can not tell you that without looking at BA.
      Which makes BA quite a neccessary stat when evaluating a player even if you look at OBP first you still have to check back with BA to determine whose OBP is REAL and whose is merely a product of a pitcher walking him.

      If you ignore that BA what will happen is that OBP will not be sustained because all it takes to twart it is to throw strikes at that player to negate whatever it was you thought you were going to get.

      A guy with a Low BA but high OBP walked a lot!
      If his BA is bad (say Sub .250) then all a pitcher has to do is throw him strikes. Then that guy can’t get those extra walks and if his BA is only .250 the .400 OBP he had originally soon becomes a .250 OBP because you ignored the only reason a pitcher has to throw a ball out of the strikezone at the batter.

      Since the player has not showed he CAN hit the strikes there is no reason to not throw strikes at him. And you can’t get a base on balls unless the pitcher throws a ball!
  • 86mets March 30, 2011 at 11:14 pm

    Bayonne, I agree with you on this one. Okay, OPS for guys like Puljos and Wright can be relevant because their offensive games are based on power and run production. But for guys who bat 2nd, 8th, or even leadoff, OPS is not an accurate barometer of their contributions. For players such as Castillo, the old fashioned stats still work just fine: OBP (okay, that’s not so old fashioned I admit), runs scored, sac bunts, stolen bases, BB to SO ratios, etc., give a better picture of what these players contribute to a teams offense.
    • Metsie March 31, 2011 at 9:50 am

      OPS can not tell you anything about run production OR power.

      SLG by itself can tell you something about Power but OPS no as it combines two stats and doesn’t bother to weight one over the other it merely adds the two into a soup that you then have to go back and look at the components you added to determine the WHYS of that number.

      And neither SLG or OBP tell you about Run Production. You can ASSUME if they are high the run production was high but you would not be correct in every case. By assuming you are not judging on an absolute just a GUESS as an assumption IS nothing more than a guess! You can’t prove using OBP or SLG that any runs actually resulted! Unless the guy has a slg of 4.0 you can’t assume he actually scored or drove in any runs!

      No one except for a guy who had one at bat and hit a HR in his first PA of a season has ever had a 4.0 SLG.

      So in most cases SLG can NEVER really tell you that any run was produced except in the case of a very small sampling.

      Now as I pointed out in another thread.
      A guy can have a .400 OBP and a .400 SLG. OPS .800
      Another can have a OBP of .200 and a SLG of .600 OPS .800
      Another can have an OBP of .600 and a SLG of .200 OPS again .800

      OPS is only ever good after you have weighted all the other components of a player (including OBP and SLG if you want but also BA, RBI and RS) and only in the case of a list of players being tied should OPS be considered as a deciding factor!

      Since it is virtually useless as a primary WEEDING OUT stat (since it obscures a ton of data) it should never be used except as a last resort and after all the other desired qualities including Runs produced (RS + RBI-HRs) BA and SLG if you like.

      If you don’t you will not be making an EDUCATED and INFORMED decision you will merely be guessing at what it is you are about to aquire because you relied on LESS information due to using a RESULT instead of what CAUSES that result!
  • Clayton Collier March 30, 2011 at 11:13 pm

    Bayonne, no matter what stat you look at Castillo was just terrible this past season. There is not much to debate that.
    • Bayonne Mets Fan March 30, 2011 at 11:15 pm

      Right he was terrible but let the reader know what he did – not just give a ho hum general idea. NOBODY is gonna learn about players anymore this way..just rough ideas
• Berbalerbs March 31, 2011 at 10:22 am

  I really hope everyone bagging on the Mets for releasing Luis posts here about how stupid the Phillies are for doing the same. That Amaro, what a hack, am I right?
  • XtreemIcon March 31, 2011 at 10:36 am

    You sure are. He may go down as the worst GM in history considering what he waltzed into after the Phils end up where they’re heading.
• Alan March 31, 2011 at 12:52 pm

  Hey fellas….if you don’t like the opinions of any particular blogger….ignore them because the more you protest, the more attention these people get….if you wonder why the information that we are all looking for is always so diverse it is because the internet has given moronic “wanna be sportswriters” the forum to show their ignorance to the rest of us.

  Truthfully…most of these guys know less about the game then I did when I was 12 years old!
  • Berbalerbs March 31, 2011 at 1:38 pm

    Honestly, I’ll take a “wannabe sports writer” over “real deals” like Heyman, Francesca and Murray effing Chass 7 days a week, twice on Sunday.