4
2011
Contract Details Point To Young and Capuano
An article by Hojo's Mojo
While reading this post by Adam Rubin of ESPN New York, I came across some information that may play a big role on this supposed seven pitcher battle for the final two pots in the rotation.
See what you think:
Young’s contract was specifically structured for him to be a starter. He receives a $1.1 million salary, and can max out at $4.5 million with 31 starts and 180 innings.
Similarly, Capuano’s contract was structured to account for him being a starting pitcher. He has a base salary of $1.5 million and can max out at $4.5 million with 32 starts and 200 innings. Capuano’s contract does provide for $500,000 in bonuses on top of the $1.5 million base salary if he makes 60 relief appearances. But the reason he signed with the Mets and broke off talks with the Milwaukee Brewers, his former team, is because his interest was in starting and not in working in relief and the Mets were interested in him for a rotation role.
It would appear to me that both Young and Capuano’s structured deals make it quite obvious what their roles were expected to be with the Mets.
Of course they both have to prove they can perform just like any of the other contenders this spring, but clearly the front office already envisioned them as part of the rotation when they worked out the details.
Basically, all they have to do is go out and prove they are healthy and that there velocity is where it should be.
Obviously, these performance clauses give both players a lot more motivation than the others. Young can quadruple his salary and Capuano can triple his, but the only way that happens is if they pile up starts and innings.
Officially, the Mets have said that in addition to Young and Capuano, Pat Misch, Oliver Perez, Dillon Gee, Boof Bonser and D.J. Carrasco are all in the mix for the last two spots in the rotation.
About the Author: Rob Johnson
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Everyone knew they were signed for starters’ jobs. The only other option was Gee. He’s now the fallback when the first one breaks down. Probably May 15.
Krods contract was structured for him to close. Is this a story?
Hojo,
Just letting you know I purchased the Tobi Stoner jersey from Citi Field. You were right, they were very nice and very professional about it.
The only thing was the game worn jersey was sold, so I purchased the last Tobi Stoner game issued jersey they had, 150.00 shipping included. I told them I was happy to buy it directly from the source instead of getting something from Ebay that may not even be an original. Can’t wait.
I’m in agreement with oldtimer that the hope or plan has always been that these guys would be the starters if healthy, the contract information you’ve uncovered merely underscores that eventuality.
I may be wrong but I think the old phrase is that you want to have at least 8 starting pitchers. Pelfrey, Niese, Dickey, Capuano and Young are the first 5. Gee is likely 6. Misch I believe will either be the long man or be gone to another organization so if he stays as long man could be 7. Bonser I guess is 8 with Mejia as a possibility depending on how his (and the Mets) season unfolds.
So the incentives total 9 million, and where would that money come from if they are successful? I would guess from the money coming off the books next year, right? Isn’t that what some of us were arguing for the Mets to do in the first place? Just borrow a little more off next year?
It’s like Sandy is playing his hand close to the vest. That’s not good. Be aggressive, even if it’s not much money.
And if that’s the case I would have preferred going the extra mile to try and lure a healthy pitcher with more money now. Young and a healthy starter, not another gamble. Now we’re relying on 2 gambles with a lineup that’s ready to fight for the WC now.
You can’t “borrow money off next year.” There is no budget for next year yet. That’ll come……next year. You’ve been saying that for a long time now, and I never understood why you’d think that. They can’t wait for next year to pay their players. If those guys do well, they get their money now, not next year.
Right, the 2.6 million total those 2 were signed for come off this years money. They signed RA Dickey with money from this year and for the second year, the money is coming from next year’s budget.
The 50/60 million that’s supposed to come off books next season, when does that exactly happen? After the last day of the season? Are Castillo, Perez, etc. done being paid by then?
Now for Cap & Young’s incentives, wouldn’t that kick in after the season? Now i don’t know the exact day or exact point when the monies start to be freed up from some of those contracts but it seems to me it should be around that time.
So instead of 9 million in incentives I would’ve preferred just the 4 million in incentives and get another healthy starter.
I can’t find anywhere when seasonal contracts expire, but my best guess would be the day after the World Series. Tweet your boy Rube…….I mean Rubin. He either knows or has enough contacts to find out.
Point is, just because Young and Cap (hopefully) could/would be paid $9 mil, doesn’t mean it’s this pay year. They have to finish the season with those numbers, so it stands to reason their incentives get paid out after the season. And I don’t even know if that’s all in lump sum, or not. Maybe it’s paid out in annuities. Maybe, if Young earns all his $3.4 mil in incentives, that gets paid out as an extra $200,000 over 17 bi-monthly checks? Or maybe there’s not set way to do it, it’s worked out in the contract.
Be that as it may, my best guess is that this year Young’s only making $1.1 mil, regardless. If more money is owed to him, it comes after the season when other money money is off the books.
Right,
That’s how they signed Dickey and that’s the way they should have signed another healthy starter to help support a good lineup that’s ready to contend NOW.
But instead Alderson decided to gamble on 2 reclamations projects. 1 would have been enough.
They signed Dickey to a two year deal, so he’s only getting $4 mil this year. The other four mil comes next year. Next year’s budget has nothing to do with this year’s. Also, they only paid Dickey an “extra” $650,000 dollars, a very inconsequential figure. Remember, their first figure for arb was $3.35 mil, am I right? So I say “extra” in quotes because they budgeted and expected to pay at least that much. And probably budgeted around four mil for him because the first offer is always low ball offer is always raised. So there was no “extra” money paid out to Dickey that could have been used to get another pitcher, and whatever he signed for in the second year of the contract has no bearing on this year.
I find it ironic how you talk about Alderson and his gambles, yet defend a guy that signed Ollie Perez, Livan Hernandez, Tim Redding, Scott Schowenweiss, Mota, broken down JJ Putz etc..
Then call out others saying they know nothing about baseball………
You can’t make this crap up.
It’s the context,
We were talking about something else. Omar also made a lot of good moves too and would have been here still if his team wasn’t decimated in 2009 and having starters not healthy in 2010. Let’s not get into the collapses of 07 & 08 which, i guess by your stantdards…Omar was on the field choking too.
But that’s been discussed ad infinitum here already.
Don’t go into areas that are beyond your comprehension, you don’t want to play with the big boys.
“A starter” Very vague. Intentionally?
yes because we already discussed all the other possible options in older posts that they could have used and I don’t feel like going over it again.
You already know it so don’t start.
Bayonne I don’t expect you to read this since you have stated your attention span to reading is slim to none but I have added this in hopes that others that might share your similar question in hopes it may help in trying to answer it. At least that is my hope. What I copied is found on Page 91 of the cba. It seems to suggest performance bonuses are paid on the contract year the bonus is reached.
http://mlbplayers.mlb.com/pa/pdf/cba_english.pdf
(4) Performance, Award and Other Bonuses
(a) Any amounts that are actually earned by a Player as Performance
Bonuses, Award Bonuses or any other bonuses properly
included in a Uniform Player’s Contract shall be included as part of
the Player’s Salary in the Contract Year in which the service or performance
giving rise to the Bonus was provided. Potential bonuses
shall not be included in the Average Annual Value calculation made
pursuant to Section E(2) above.
(b) A Special Covenant in a Uniform Player’s Contract that provides
that Player performance or achievement in one year of the
Contract will increase the Base Salary in other year(s) of the Contract
shall not be considered in the determination of Salary until the
triggering event occurs (other than, if applicable, as a “potential
bonus”), unless it is determined by the Arbitration Panel that the
Special Covenant was designed to defeat or circumvent the intention
of the Parties as reflected in this Article XXIII. As long as such
a finding is not made, the additional Base Salary triggered by the
Special Covenant shall count as part of the Player’s Salary in the
Contract Year(s) to which it is attributed by the Contract once the
triggering event has occurred. Multi-Year Contracts shall not be
recalculated on an Average Annual Value basis once the triggering
event has occurred; the additional Base Salary shall be added to the
Salary as originally calculated for the Contract Year in question.
Part B is two of the longest sentences ever, but I don’t think they apply, anyway. I guess part a) says that if either pitcher reaches their bonus, they get it this year in what I would imagine would be a lump sum upon reaching the goal. That’s my layman’s translation.
Instead of solely focusing on thing to complain about you should be glad we didn’t sign Tim Redding and Livan Hernandez. Redding alone cost Young and Capuano’s base salary.
You’re just taking an unnecessary shot at Omar here and quite frankly, it’s boring and pointless already. All those things have already been discussed.
It’s no different than you taking a shot at Alderson. Omar has a 6 year body of work with which to examine. Alderson’s been here for 3 months and you’ve been complaining about him since the day he got here.
Some things Alderson has done are brighter than what Omar did. Young AND Capuano for the same base is far better than Redding on his own. Forget about dragging Livan into the matter. You had nothing to say on the Redding signing because you liked the guy signing him. You complain about the Young and Capuano one because you don’t like Alderson and it’s gonna be that way all season long. Your gonna look for and hope you have something to hit Alderson on every day like you’ve been doing since Novenber.
If it isn’t Alderson it’s Wright. It’s a shame we ever drafted him we could have had Ty Wiggenton playing there all these years.
Your desired approach this off season is intentionally vague and your motives very transparent.
Young and Capuano’s structured deals make it quite obvious what their roles were expected to be with the Mets. The same thing — drat!!! — could be said for Ollie the Ouch!! Ask Omar.
Expectations and reality sometimes have a way of clashing.
“It would appear to me that both Young and Capuano’s structured deals make it quite obvious what their roles were expected to be with the Mets.”
I’m not all that sure that those provisions are there because the Mets insisted or only considered them as starters more than they themselves prefer to be starters and the Mets had to make some money promises to them if they were.
I don’t think the Mets (or Sandy in general) was banking on them being in nthe rotation (they sure wouldn’t mind it if they are pitching well) but the pitchers themselves wanted starter money and would not sign unless they got it. In a way those provisions are the compromise provisions. Sandy isn’t promising them a rotation spot and isn’t really obligated to give them one but if he does he promised to pay them accordingly.
So they still have to earn it, They won’t be kept or dismissed based on those provisions basically all they mean is if they prove to be starters then their salary will reflect that!
And if they don’t get hurt I think at least one of them will make the rotation.
That’s not necessarily true. I get the point, and your premise is correct. But If Young, for example, pitches 175 innings over 30 starts, he doesn’t max out his bonus. He could go 20-5 with a 2.00 ERA, but if it’s over 175 innings and 30 starts, he doesn’t get his full $4.5 mil. I’m sure his bonuses are structured to where it’s not all or nothing (maybe like an extra half-mil every five starts?), but simply becoming a starter, even an effective one, doesn’t kick in the full bonus.
X I wasn’t really trying to say anything other than the provisions say more about what the pitchers wanted as opposed to any expectations or plans for them by the Mets. It is on the whole a very fair deal for both sides!
I wasn’t really concerned or even claiming to be informed of the provisions of the incentives only that they wanted that kind of money if they did what they expect themselves to do and Sandy basically gave them the provision so that if they did manage to accomplish those goals they would be duly compensated for achieving those goals.
But the fact that the provisions are there does not mean the Mets have any expectations of what they should be capable of nor are their plans contingent (and ruined) if they don’t make it as a starter.
Of course you hope they do win the job as a starter because a starter is much more valuable and important than filling in a bullpen spot and the provisions simply give everyone the option to go to plan B without it costing the team or the player if he does manage to achieve those goals and earn the salary.
Its a very fair deal, I don’t know that Sandy is COUNTING on them being in the rotation but I’m sure he does HOPE that happens.
The deal is very much a “Lets not take things for granted” approach to trying to solve the problems without impacting the budget. If they perform and achieve the goals then they will get compensated according to their performance which does not lock Sandy into doing something he doesn’t WANT to do or that the pitcher has not earned via his performance.
The structure itself is based on the MOST he might contribute but the provisions are such that if he doesn’t it does not limit Sandy’s options and/or force him to start the guy simply because the contract has been built on the HOPES or assumption he will become a starter!
So it’s not like the cotract means no starter we are screwed. Or if the pitcher falls off those marks he pitched badly or was a waste. We will simply pay for whatever we get.
The incentives may be easily achievable by the pitcher but only if he pitches well enough and stays healthy enough to earn them.
Thats all I was trying to get accross there.
The structure reflects the possibilities but My opinion of what Sandy did was sure I’ll pay you that if you do this this and that, but that structure does not guarantee a spot in the rotation nor does it mean they are more likely to win a spot than someone who outpitches them in ST.
The structure is that of “ALL OPTIONS CONSIDERED!”