Mets Could Face Up To $1 Billion Lawsuit

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• Mr North Jersey February 4, 2011 at 3:07 am

  Let the legal tug-o-war begin. eventually once they get tired of the back n forth barring some smoking gun they come back sit down and work a deal out.
• Mr North Jersey February 4, 2011 at 3:18 am

  you know there is legislation at least 2 that i know of one last april and one last december that was introduced in the house that would limit what people that were victims of a ponzi scheme would be liable for in a clawback. you wonder if it may eventually have any bearing on picard seeking to settle?
  • METS62FAN February 4, 2011 at 9:31 am

    PICARD IS DESPERATELY ATTEMPTING TO VALIDATE HIS POSITION AS TRUSTEE AFTER A NUMBER OF VICTIMS WERE UNSUCCESSFUL IN GETTING HIM REPLACED THROUGH THIS SAME JUDGE

    As far as I’m concerned, Bravo!, Fred u r showing me more chutzpah than I ever thought u had.
    While Picard alleges Wilpons brought additional investors in & are thus complicit with Bernie I must wonder what any of us might do if we invested with a broker who promised a 10% return & delivered it. recommending it to others is considered by some as “generous” friendship. IF & only IF Picard can actually prove the Wilpoons actually knew something was amiss(not should have known as none are mkt wizards/pros & educational backgrounds don’t support such indepth knowledge to a level producing suspicions, one may conclude a predominance of people might discount suspicions with letting sleeping dogs lie, or trusting in oversight authorities to protect them) & that their promised returns were untowards I don’t see a judge ruling against Sterling, a jury would be another matter.
• Tommy2cat February 4, 2011 at 3:46 am

  Without concrete evidence to support his allegations, Picard is going nowhere with this lawsuit. The ad damnum clause that requests one billion dollars doesn’t necessarily contemplate recovering that much money or establish the Mets’ proportionate liability. It is simply a high-end number that limits the value of what the trustee can recover after trial.

  I would like to see the Mets hit Picard with a counterclaim for defamation, if any of the allegations are patentaly false. He’ll likely have some sort of immunity, but it would be nice to rock his world for a few days.
  • Mr North Jersey February 4, 2011 at 4:00 am

    don’t recall seeing you around. welcome to MMO
    • Tommy2cat February 4, 2011 at 5:34 am

      Thanks. Been around, but seldom contribute. I really like MMO forum. Competent, knowledgeable and respectful.

      I think our team is going to perform much better than people expect, notwithstanding the current mess. It does seem like one thing after another, doesn’t it?
      • super72 February 6, 2011 at 12:39 pm

        I agree with tommy2 I think we will do better then projected, this is the same line up mostly with a better 1st baseman then projected at the start of last year and a better 2nd (hopefully) that people where projecting to dominate the NL east and now they are basement dwellers? I highly doubt that the Phills will be a tough one to deal with but I see the Mets contending for the wild card IF ( and its a big if) the pitching can stay on track and the Mets stay relatively healthy I think Sandy has done a good job building up alittle depth in AAA incase there are injuries on the MLB level. NOt studs mind you but guys we know can play the game.. I think it could be a very fun year to watch. But they have to start out good or the thoughts of the last three years will creep back into everyones heads very very quickly.
  • Harry C February 4, 2011 at 8:22 am

    Truly amazing that some people think the Wilpons are good guys. Hey tommy, I’ve got some real nice land to sell you. maybe a bridge. Any real Met fan would hope this results in this horrid ownership being forced to sell 100%. Maybe you like the darma and the failures, and the contiuned soap operas. None of it is baseball. Give us ownership that doesn’t need ponzi schemes to compete.
    • will February 4, 2011 at 8:59 am

      Harry right on point!!
    • Tommy2cat February 4, 2011 at 9:39 am

      Harry – That was a very profound analysis. For your next exercise, I would like you to juxtapose the concepts of “darma” and “karma” and get back to me much, much later.

      Regardless, I had concern about the Mets’ business judgement when they decided to restructure Bonilla’s contract. I believed then as I do now that it was very unsound and subject to too many unforeseen market forces. Little did we know…

      However, I am NOT going to impute Madoff’s scheme to the Wilpons and I will never question, no matter how errant, their desire to improve the Mets product on the field. I believe their methods were often impatient and imprudent, as in the case of the Kazmir trade, or unsound in loading the roster with older, more vulnerable ballplayers.

      I have always thought they needed someone with genuine baseball sense, like Sandy Alderson, to correct the organization’s philosophy toward strengthening the farm system and building from within. 1969 and 1986 are good examples as both of those teams were comprised primarily of home-grown products. Carter and Hernandez were added to the 1986 roster via trade, not free agency. They were brought in on the organization’s sweat-equity and keen eye for baseball talent.

      Provided the Wilpons can step aside and let Mr. Alderson and his staff continue its restructure of the organizaiton, then I would like to see them remain as owners very much. I appreciate Citi Field, I appreciate their respect for baseball tradition and I do not question for one millisecond their passion for the organization or its fanbase. They remain in my prayers and I hope they can withstand this current challenge and emerge wiser in every sense.
      • t agee February 4, 2011 at 10:18 am

        This is pretty much how I feel Tommy. I am angry at their immaturity regarding building a team that can compete year after year for a World Championship but at the same time I also recognize that they have put forth the money necessary at the ML level in order to win.

        I was also surprised at the deal the Wilpon’s cut with Bonilla. It would have seemed better to just pay him off and be done with it. Many of the trades we have made were all about salary dumping instead of team building. That short sighted approach has cost them SRO for the last couple of years as well as many many years of poor attendance going all the way back to the worst team money can buy.

        Now that there is finally someone in the front office who properly values on field contributions and who deals in probability and realism as opposed to only looking at the most hopeful scenario I feel that we CAN finally compete every single year starting in 2013. I wouldn’t like to see that chance short circuited now.

        If the team is sold who knows what you get? An attention starved jerk who thinks the Mets are all about him? Even if you get the right guy what happens if he gets divorced or passes away? Will the new owners spouse offer thousand dollar take it or leave it bonuses to first round draft choices?

        In the Wilpon’s we know what we have. Their mistakes have all been in allocation of the teams resources and impatience, immaturity, gullibility and foresight. Those issues may be finally solved by going outside the Organization for competent leadership.

        With the Wilpon’s distracted by other things Alderson is in a great position to do for us what Gene Michael did for the Yankees when he was suspended. That led eventually to 5 world championships, 2 other World Series appearances and 15 post season appearances in 16 years.

        This just maybe our best chance ever to put this team on a firm footing with a strong prospect flow and loads of competition for every roster spot if only the fans will stop begging for more Bonilla’s, Coleman’s, Saberhagen’s, Alomar’s, Vaughn’s, Bernytz’s, Matsui’s Pedro’s, Alou’s, Castillo’s Bay’s and Wagners.
        • METS62FAN February 4, 2011 at 11:01 am

          t, MY FRIEND, REALITY DICTATES THAT MOST TURNSTYLE PUSHERS ALONG WITH WFAN CALLERS DON’T GO DEEPER THAN THE VERY BACKPASGE TO LEARN ABOUT THEIR SOCALLED TEAM, THIS BEING NYC,NY THE CALLS FOR THE; Bonilla’s, Coleman’s, Saberhagen’s, Alomar’s, Vaughn’s, Bernytz’s, Matsui’s Pedro’s, Alou’s, Castillo’s Bay’s and Wagners. ISN’T LIKELY TO END IN OUR LIFETIMES & IT GREATLY EXPLAINS WHY MOST EX[PERTS BELIEVE U CAN’T REBUILD IN NY.

          UBFORTUNATELY, UNLESS A VERY DEEP POCKED INVESTOR HAS PERSONAL MLB EXPRTISE/ANALYSIS AS WELL AS UNLIMITED PATIENCE & LOSS TOLERANCE, YOUR OFDDS OF SUCCESS IN OUR LIFETIME IS WORSE THAN TEJADA’S SETTING MLB HR RECORDS FOR 2B!
          • t agee February 4, 2011 at 11:20 am

            I know ’62. Your are most probably correct but I am still going to fight to see us stop borrowing from the future in order to unsatisfyingly fill needs that we neglected beforehand by tying up payroll and costing draft choices.

            Argueably we could have gotten the same on field production from all of those players mentioned above with the same kind of signings Alderson made this year. Those players listed above did not come anywhere close to providing what we thought we were going to get but they did cost a lot of money that could have been better used to draft sign and develop the McCann’s, Stanton’s, Pedroia’s, Lincecum’s and Cain’s and that would have made a HUGE difference.

            The big splashy back page signing in my opinion is just a way for Ownership/GM to cover their asses and be able to SAY they were doing everything possible to win a World Series and AVOID criticism in case they don’t.

            The avoidance of criticism should not even be a part of the decision making process. Talent evaluation, probabilities, costs, development issues, providing multiple options, those things belong in the process but avoiding criticism? Give me a break.
    • METS62FAN February 4, 2011 at 9:44 am

      Harry, Wghile I respect your right to disatisfaction with the Wilpon ownership, I’m often standing besides u there; however I’ve yet to see evidence of inpropriety in their actions if anything they’ve always acted too conservatively & this suit allkeges behaviors totally incongruent with conservative behaviors we’ve witnessed over 30 yrs 1980-2010. If it’s out of character it’s likely out of legitamacey,IMO.

      As Ive often opined here, if the Madoff scandal ultimately results in new aggressive ownership, then Bernie may end up in the NYM HOF by popular acclaim. he’d get my vote!
      Acyualy, if u recall, this would NOT be the first ownership change brought by outside legal action influences. Doubleday’s 99% was challenged as improper use of Corp money by the Doubleday Publishing House’s Board of Directors resulting in Nelson’s selling of 49& of his holdings to Fred Wilpon in mid-80s. How’d that work itself out? not my favorite Met moment in history.
• MetsMerizedAgain February 4, 2011 at 8:08 am

  The Wilpons and Saul Katz are finished as baseball owners. They deprived the Mets of a championship team for 25 years, complaining about money the whole time. Now they will face 25 years of prison time, maybe more, for being partners in Madoff’s scheme.
  • METS62FAN February 4, 2011 at 9:49 am

    BTW Civil Actions such as bankruptcy court procedures seldom lead to jail sentences & if Bernie’s wife & son were duped according to the DA, how were Fred & Saul in better position to understand?

    Be careful to not let your fan frustration force u into ASSumptions u can’t possibly be knowlewdgable in otherwise, your mental ineptitude is exposed to ALL!
    • Des February 4, 2011 at 10:38 am

      Touché!!!
    • baby al February 5, 2011 at 2:38 pm

      if bernies wife and son were free and clear why did his son kill himself?i ASSUME this means something!let the due process continue.if the feds don’t nail ya this year they will pop ya next year.(check the gotti family).the thing about freddye and saul(uncle fester)is they seem to be great at investing in ponzi schemes …these great business men!i ASSUME they look for these schemes or they are they just stupid?before u give freddye,fester ,madoffs wife, son or family a pass let picard due his thing.the wild card is the rockaway kid ole benie madoff …if he ever starts talking lotsa people u defend will be hanging with bernie in da big house.pardon my ASSUMPTION,pardner.
      • Des February 5, 2011 at 3:27 pm

        baby al, Mark Madoff was known to have a fragile personality. Of all the Madoff clan, Mark was widely viewed as the person most ‘at risk’ because of his introverted personality. It’s true he was in the batter’s box and was next up. He knew that his father’s misdeeds caused others. obviously including you, baby al, to view him suspiciously. Mark and his younger brother, Andrew, had each received $60 million from their parents. He felt trapped. Whether Mark acted with complicity may be determined when Andrew is grilled. Right now it’s too early to tell.
        • baby al February 5, 2011 at 4:48 pm

          des just explain T W O ponzi schemes.the wilpon mob paid roughly back 13 million to another ponzi scheme.lets forget about everything else how did they end up in T W O ponzi schemes.Greed PLAIN AND SIMPLE.one woman returned over 6 BILLION dollars to picard!the honorable wilpon mob fights to keep their monies by stating the s and e comission didn’t know so why should they!ignorance of the law is no defense in any court of law in this country.my end game,as i guess u know, is bye bye wilpon.sell the team and take your bs spining to another field.ny wants a big time owner with big time ideas.
• t agee February 4, 2011 at 9:51 am

  How, before the suit is unsealed and the case has gone to trial anyone can KNOW the Wilpon’s were partners in this whole scam is beyond me. Maybe they were but how can anyone KNOW right now?

  The SEC investigated Madoff 8 times in 16 years and found nothing wrong. To believe that individual investors knew or should have known is beyond ludicrous.

  The reason people go to brokerage houses is because they don’t know where to invest the money they’ve made. If they don’t know where to invest the money they’ve made how can they be expected to know what the SEC couldn’t even figure out?

  Before you make allegations about anyone you should at least see the evidence against them and their response to it. Then you can have an informed opinion. Until then your just piling on without knowing where the ball is.
  • Harry C February 4, 2011 at 10:17 am

    And if this were the Steinbrenner’s you and all of the others so ignorantly defending these rich rotten Wilpons, would be in glee and demanding they be jailed. Just like you all can’t wait for Clemens to go to jail, but you would cry and moan if it were a Met soon to be on trial for perjury. And you agee need to take a bit of your hypocritical advice to others. You defame Omar Minaya and his every move claiming every one was bad yet you give your false god credit for making only horrid moves. you endorse dmage goods that you blast Omar for, you celebrate aged signings that you claim were bad under Omar. HYPOCRITE they name is t agee.
    • t agee February 4, 2011 at 10:50 am

      I wouldn’t be “in glee and demanding Steinbrenner got to jail.” Not sure where you came up with that one Harry. If Clemens perjured himself and has to answer for it that’s his tough cheese but at least one can have a slightly informed opinion on that matter since we watched his testimoney and read about the allegations against him. This suit hasn’t even been unsealed. How can you or anyone else KNOW that someone is guilty when no charges were even brought against them.

      I’m not defaming anyone, you are. I bring up Minaya’s extraordinary poorly thought out decisions because they were. I’ve also brought up a few of the good things he’s done and acknowledged that he did have some bad luck (like Sanchez, Beltran) but with a top 5 payroll to round out the team with so many guys that shouldn’t even be in the Majors in years 5 and 6 of his “plan” is perfectly deserving of criticism.

      I also haven’t been defending every move made by a “false God.” The best I can say is Paulino’s strengths match Thole’s weaknesses. That is good thought process. Capuano, Hu, Carrasco, and the rest aren’t going to hinder our progress in future years like counting on Alou (again) and Pedro (again) and El Duque (again) and Perez (again) and Tatis (again) and Valentin (again) and Castillo (again) and Delgado (again) ect ect ect. None of those moves made this offseason take away from our ability to compete in subsequent years like Omar’s did with hamstringing the payroll with dead ass after dead ass and voluntarily handing over numerous draft choices that other teams used to get players who will be playing for them in their prime.

      Your just attacking me Harry because you want more Bonilla’s, Vaughn’s, Alomar’s Coleman’s, Alou’s, El Duque’s, and Castillo’s here. So do I, but I want them here in their prime not after their shelf life has expired.
    • Metsie February 4, 2011 at 11:07 am

      This is America Harry…

      INNOCENT TILL PROVEN GUILTY!
      • METS62FAN February 4, 2011 at 11:23 am

        Metsie, I almost used that same retort many times on this topic; until I realized that’s only relevant in a COURT OF LAW.

        As u acurately depict THIS IS AMERICA.
        Please realize the groundrules in America’s Legal Courts is certainly as u represent; however, it has been my experience that it proves 180 degress different in AMERICA’S COURTS OF PUBLIC OPINION! see freeadom of Speech guarantees.
        • Metsie February 4, 2011 at 1:12 pm

          The court of “Public Opinion” has no jurisdiction here!
          It also is powerless! It can’t force them to sell, step down nor can it convict them or help someone else to!

          This is not an Election or Popularity contest. It is a LEGAL proceeding and the only PUBLIC the Wilpons have to convince are the 12 members of the public that will be sitting in the jury box! My guess is Harry wouldn’t make it past the Voir Dire proccess!

          As for the rest of it it is as much our business as YOUR next IRS Tax Audit is! (and this is coming from a media person who has done a lot of courtroom TV in his day!)

          Most of the people who are trying to convict in this COURT of WORLD OPINION would not know what a ponzi scheme is even if you showed them a chart labeled “PONZI SCHEME” that showed them how it works! yet they make convictions for actions they do not even understand or comprehend. I wonder how many own stocks, not many if any!

          WHY is it important to them to do this?

          They just got 20 Pounds of flesh this offseason by getting rid of their last targets (Manuel and Omar) by daily complaints on the blogs, and it felt good so they are going for another 20 Pounds so they can feel empowered in their sad sack unempowered daily life!

          But enough psycho babble for one day!

          Back to public opinion!

          Will being considered a bad evil person hinder your ability to sign Free Agents to multi million dollar contracts? Never stopped Steinbrenner who was actually BANNED FROM BASEBALL, a far worse offense than the Wilpons are accused of in baseball terms.

          Does it matter to you that our Owner is honest and or loved by the community? Why? People hated Leon Hess too for taking the Jets out of Shea yet I didn’t see any Jet fans decide the team was not worth seeing anymore. Even during the time the Jets sucked balls they still sold out every game in 10 degree weather no less!

          Why feed the MEDIA’s need to fill up empty space because it’s that time of year? Over something that would hardly be a story if ST had actually started?

          Did you happen to notice the stories this past week about how Cashman is on the outs and about to be gone too?

          Funny how because there is no Baseball news for the next two weeks that all the stories revolving baseball in NY are about how people are not liked, evil or need to or about to be changed? Is that because Baseball and business is so newsworthy or is it because guys who are beat writers for the Mets have to come up with something to put into the public eye so they can justify their paycheck that week?

          Funny how when there is nothing to talk about the media go and find some juicy gossip and scandal story to run to pass the time? And the blogosphere runs and embraces it as if they just got told their house was being plowed under for a new highway!

          This is a non starter and has no affect on the baseball team. They are selling part of the team to get whatever cash they might need because thats what you do when you own things. You cash out on some investments so you can actually reap some profit while the profit taking is high! The team can generate that kind of money without loosing control and since their main investments were madoff (gone) and Real Estate they probably can’t sell a piece of a building the way they can the team and keep control of it.

          Happens everyday in the NYSE and as you have probably read happens all the time in EVERY investment avenue that exists. You put money in with the intention of someday taking out more than you put in!

          The Mets did that with Madoff not because they knew he was a scam but because they needed the money for the stadium! they are selling a part of the team to get quick cash as I stated before.

          And Madoff gave them a profit because if he hadn’t someone would have started asking questions a lot sooner than they did about his fund! If you are a scammer and say to someone hey you made X amount of money in my fund then if that person tries to take it out and you do not give them the number you told them the scam was OVER you would have been exposed right then and there!

          So taking money out of Madoff was about as criminal as selling shares of Microsoft. making a profit was not criminal on the part of the Wilpons it sure wouldn’t have been if it was a real fund and they cashed out!

          Madoff is the criminal. Wilpons are simply not one of his VICTIMS! They didn’t lose a penny. Either they were smart or they were lucky. Niether is a criminal offense!

          The worst that can happen from this court case is they will pay MORE money than what they supposedly made in the investment. And that would be fair to the point that they would be sharing in the pain of everyone else who got beat and covering interest on a loan.

          Lets face facts here the Wilpns will prob have to give back about 300 Mil.

          Thats a year and a half of Yankee Salary!

          It sure has NO AFFECT on the team or it’s spending. If it was then we would have a pirate payroll by now!

          And the entire team would be up for sale!

          And crying about how bad the Wilpons are is not going to change that proceeding or the controling interest in the team!
          • mets2012 February 4, 2011 at 2:00 pm

            “And crying about how bad the Wilpons are is not going to change that proceeding or the controlling interest in the team!”

            But it sure makes me feel good.
            Another thing, if Wilpons can’t find the investor before they get hit with $500 mil, which is very likely, then what?
            • Metsie February 4, 2011 at 2:56 pm

              Thank you for proving the point I made and admitting that your own life is so pathetic and awful that you need other people’s misery to FEEL GOOD!
              • mets2012 February 4, 2011 at 3:16 pm

                How about answering my question?
              • Tommy2cat February 4, 2011 at 9:37 pm

                The word is “schaudenfreude” – a German term that means to derive satisfaction from other’s misfortune.

                Inasmuch as I cannot impute any knowledge of Madoff’s scheme to the Wilpons, I am nonetheless consider their taking out bank loans to reinvest with his firm to be a very, very risky method to manage one’s money.
              • Metsie February 5, 2011 at 11:33 am

                Tommy – I totally agree that the Wilpons are probably not the smartest business guys to come down the pipe! LOL

                Anyone who ties most of their money up into a single fund can’t be TOO smart…

                But Dumb isn’t a criminal offense! If it was we would have a lot of guys posting from jail around here! LOL
            • Metsie February 4, 2011 at 3:02 pm

              And what happens to the team if they don’t find a buyer doe the Madoff victims get it?

              Not until they come up with the other 2B for controlling interest of the team!

              Wilpons will still own it…and you and your life will remain pathetic and in need of another’s tragedy to fell good!
          • mets2012 February 4, 2011 at 2:07 pm

            “The complaint alleges the partnership “received approximately $300 million in fictitious profits” from hundreds of accounts opened with Madoff’s firm. Of that, it says, $90 million of “other people’s money” were withdrawn to cover day-to-day operations of the Mets.”

            This will change how Wilpons operate the Mets.
            • Metsie February 4, 2011 at 2:59 pm

              Yeah how?

              Will they not buy free agents? Seems to me the signed some this year despite your accusations of them having no money.

              So what exactly is going to be done differently?

              And isn’t doing things differently precisely why we fired the entire front office in the first place?
              Because what they WERE doing wasn’t working?

              Get a clue kid and maybe try and make YOUR life a little less pathetic so you don’t have to have miserable people around you so you can feel good!
              • mets2012 February 4, 2011 at 3:13 pm

                Metsie,

                I lead a very successful and happy life in the Northwest.
                I feel good because Wipons, who I think is crooks, are getting what they deserve.
                Wilpons are built on the phony money of Madoff .
                They bought the Mets with them and operated the Mets with them.
                They forced their employees to invest on Madoff.
                Did they help the employees who lost all their savings?
                No.
                I love the Mets but hate wilpons.
                Does that allowed in your world?
              • Metsie February 4, 2011 at 3:19 pm

                Sure I allow pathetic people to be pathetic and needy in my world…I don’t really pay those folks much attention or respect them in any way but your free to be you just as the Wilpons are free to run a company they own in any manner they see fit until I buy the team and run it the way I decide it should be run!!
              • mets2012 February 4, 2011 at 6:48 pm

                Meties,
                Why so much anger all of sudden?
                I sense a whiff of a vile form of tribalism .
              • Metsie February 4, 2011 at 7:10 pm

                No 2012 you sense a great deal of Pity for you because I wonder how you would handle being falsely accused and if everyone took pride joy and felt good about your situation!

                By saying someone else’s problems make you feel good your really just about the lowest form of scum on this planet!

                I tell you what though, in your honor if anyone ever accuses you of something like rape or theft I will be sure to make sure the world knows you were accused and just how guilty before proven innocent you are in the court of world opinion!

                Not legally mind you your innocent legally but in the world of court opinion you are a scumbag and should never be associated with….DEAL?

                Here endith the conversation!
              • mets2012 February 4, 2011 at 7:21 pm

                Good,

                How about bailing out themselves without bailing out the emplyees’ fund they were responsible with?
                They forced the employees to Madoff.
                I don’t care about legality here.
                They should have bailed their employees before themselves.
                You called people names to protect Wilpons.
                That is what I called a vile form of tribalism.
              • mets2012 February 5, 2011 at 1:39 am

                from NYT

                “It looks like a very messy situation for Fred,” said Fay Vincent, a former baseball commissioner who is friendly with Wilpon and Picard. “I know Picard and he’s a serious and solid lawyer, and what he’s doing has to be taken seriously.”

                Vincent said he did not want it to appear as if he were advising Wilpon on what to do, but added, “It’s important for anyone in a situation this treacherous to consider whether he can run his main business and defend himself simultaneously.”

                Michael Ozanian, the executive editor of Forbes, which valued the Mets at $858 million last year, said, “I think the Mets have been a franchise that for many years relied on borrowed money.” He said Wilpon would have to sell the team and the SNY television network “to get out of this mess.”
                —–
                What are you saying now?
                scumbag.
  • METS62FAN February 4, 2011 at 10:36 am

    T, the fact tha amazes me beyond comprehension is if they could find no criminal grounds for complicity by either Berni’s bookkeeper(wife) or partner(son) that the Wilpons somehow were complicit because htey SHOULD HAVE known! Say what?
    • t agee February 4, 2011 at 11:01 am

      Tell me about it ’62. Every knew or should have known except the people closest to Bernie. Give me a break. Picard gets a percentage of whatever he brings back. Ask for the moon, get back a couple of stars, snatch a percentage and move on to the next one.

      If there were no charges against Bernie’s Wife or Son (or anyone else) how is it everyone “knew or should have known?”

      The one that “knew or should have known” is the SEC. They were even informed of the whole thing back in 1995 and investigated 8 times in 16 years. That’s the lawsuit that will be filed when each individual investor has been bled to death, then we can all pay because one way or another everyone “knew or should have known.”

      Great publicity for the book though.
      • METS62FAN February 6, 2011 at 9:10 am

        T, the one simple FASCT that 2 me totally disproves Picard’s logic is this;

        BY ALL REPORTS, DESPITE WITHRAWING BET 300-400M FROM THE LAST PUBLICIZED ACCOUNT STATEMENT, WHY WOULD A SKEPYICAL ACCOUNT HOLDER LEAVE MORE THAN A 500M ACCOUNT BALANCE.
        Primarily, Picatrd asserts the Wilpons were given professional warnings. Ny whom, financial account managers who were direct Madoff competitors. So, according to Picard’s logic, Fred & Saul should have trusted Madoff’s competitors suspicions more than the results of 18 sepearate SEC investigations
        in light of what has transpired, exactly where is it they should have transferred their accounts to? Merrill, Lynch? Paine Webber? Goldman Sachs? AIG? While they were being warned that Bernie couldn’t possibly make good on the returns he was promising. According to the only evidence in hand, account statements, trhat’s exactly what Bernie was supposedly doing, returning a consistant 10% ROI! Besidees, he’d always honored each & every withdrawal timely & without excuse. and “everyone we know” is happy with him as is the SEC who has investigated & passed him 18 times, who else has endured & passed such sctutiny.
        Let’s ALL be honest here & reveal who among us would have actually & tryuly bailed out on the best performing portfolio on the Street based upon rumor & inuendo heard from others wanting to manage my money for less returns. Espercially in light of those 18 passed audits from the OFFICIAL REGULATORY AGENCY?
        If hindsight is the measuring stuick for beasting the Wilpons, u can’t pick & choose only the obvious negative isues. Why, if they doubted Bernie’s veracity would they take 300M & leave 500M? In addition to their employees pensions they also risked their own & those of their children
        (1 Wilpon,3 Katz sons)? WHY?
      • METS62FAN February 7, 2011 at 7:53 am

        T, here’s my circumstance, my cousin, (4yrs older)grew up in the other half of a Bay Ridge 2-family & despite ALL basic similarities during development, same Grammer & HS, same Church, etc.he grew up a NYY fan & I a Dodger fan, like everyone else in the family/neighborhood.

        We’re much,much older now & in many ways, esp baseball much of our relationship has changed little, in as much as he lets no moment pass to ctrriticize NYM & proclaim the greatness of pinstripes. Baseball is not our only diversion, he;s still a flaming Liberal “Charity through Taxes” afficianado, Me, I’m a simple stand on your own, Traditionalist. Since retirement he’s dabbled in LI Real Estate as an agent, I attempted to use that in my analogy to thwart his latest barb aimed @ Wilpon veracity;
        If everyone will excuse the CAPSLOCK, I’d like to get other opinions on my thought process…
        IT’S ABSOLUTELY ASTOUNDING HOW EASILY U GLOSS OVER THE FACT THAT “BIG GOV’T CONTROL WAS COMPLICITE IN VIRTUALLY GIVING MADOFF 18 GOLD STARS FOR COMPLIANCE, IF THE SEC SAYS HE;S GOLD WHO IS FRED TO FLAUNT THAT RULING & SPIT INTO THE EYE OF RETURNS HIS FUTURE ABSOLUTEKL RELIED UPON! GOV’T GAVE MADOFF, A VERITABLE GOLD SEAL PROTECTION ORDER AGAINST ALL WARNINGS BEING GIVEN TO FRED BY THOSE WHO SEEMINGLY JUST QWANT TO REPLACE BERNIE AS HIS MAIN MONEY GUY WITHOUT DELIVERING = RETURNS. WHO DOES THAT? OK U WERE IN REAL ESTATE, ASSUME U’RE SHOWING 2 IDENTICAL HOMES IN THE SAME ESTABLISHED DEVELOPMENT, HOUSE A IS A COMPETITOR’S LISTING @ 500,000, HOUSE B IS YOUR LISTING @ 700,000, YOU SUSPECT HOUSE A MAY HAVE STRUCTURAL ISSUES NOT EVIDENT BY A CURSORY WALKTHROUGH, YOUR CLIENT OBVIOUSLY ASKS WHY THE DIFF IN PRICE & SHOWS CONSIDERABLY MORE INTEREST IN HOUSE A, U STRONGLY RECOMMEND HE FIRST GET THE HOUSE INSPECTED BY A LICENSED INSPECTOR, HE DOES & IT PASSES WITH NO APPARENT ISSUES NEEDING TO BE ADDRESSED. YOU’RE DUMBFOUNDED, U SUGGEST A RENOWNED INSPECTOR PERFORM A SECOND RUNTHROUGH @ YOUR EXPENSE, HE ACQUIESCES, IT PASSES YOUR GUY’S STRENUOUS EXAM.
        WHICH HOUSE DOES HE BUY?
        IF U WERE CLIENT, WHICH DO U BUY?
        BE HONEST!
        OK, NOW TAKE THIS TO THE 18th DEGREE, DON’T U BECOME SUSPICOUS THAT THERE’S UNDO INFLUENCE BEING BROUGHT BY YOUR COMPETITOR OPON ALL THESE INSPECTORS? OR AT THE VERY LEAST, THERE’S A SERIOUS FLAW TO THE INSPCTION PROCESS?

        KEY QUESTION, CLIENT HAS EXCELLENT EXPERIENCE DEALING WITH THE SELLER’S AGENT & RECOMMENDS HIM TO ALL OF HIS FRIENDS.

        HOUSE TURNS INTO MONEYPIT STRUCTURAL FAULTS CAUSE UBSTANTIAL WALL & CEILING DAMAGE, WHO’S TO BLAME?
        IN ADDITUION, AS IN THE MOVIE,”POLTERGEIST” ALL OF HIS FRIENDS DEVELOP STURUCYURAL HOME ISSUES, IS YOUR CLIENT COMPLICIT IN THEIR LOSSES PURELY BY HIS WILLINGNESS TO SHARE HIS GOOD FORTUNE WITH HIS FRIENDS..A MITVAH?

        PICARD SEEMS TO BELIEVE SO!
    • Metsie February 4, 2011 at 3:16 pm

      Its pretty simple why actually.

      Without a wiretap, or paper trail that proves they were conspirators you can’t prosecute them.

      Lets face it some people around here would hang the Wilpons for J Walking if they could! They hate them and they want to get rid of them.

      But just because they hate the wilpons doesn’t mean the Wilpons are guilty of anything.

      And when all is said and done the case will conclude, the verdict will be announced, the Wiplons will come up with the cash somehow and in the end they will still own, operate and be a thorn in the side of all of those people who are licking their chops because they think this will vanquish their supposed ENEMY!

      They are fooling themselves of course!

      If they really want to get rid of the Wilpons here is how. Head to Sterling with 1-2 Billion dollars in a suitcase and you too can have your wish of new ownership!
• Annie Savoy February 4, 2011 at 9:57 am

  As I said in yesterday’s post, I’m moving on to news of Spring Training and the beginning of the season of 2011.

  However, I’m sure you can’t leave the ‘Home Office’ here in New York with such a financial mess and you can’t put it all on ‘hold’ for the season like the Wilpons have apparently done for years.

  Finally, what the Mets Organization needs is fresh, new ownership circa Jerry Seinfeld, Marc Cuban etc. and somewhere there is a person like that. Now is the time to meet him/her.
• Pedro February 4, 2011 at 10:24 am

  I agree with T Agee. I remember the SEC had previously asked Madoff’s help in identifying potential Ponzi schemes, year earlier, when the story broke in 2008. We often trust friends that we believe know what their doing that are “in the business”.

  I lost tens of thousands in two investments with a good friend that thought they found legit opportunities. Both were IPO’s. Both had reasonable projections for returns. The websites looked real, the marketing material looked real. The people running the investments had no history I could find at the time. They even had credible names involved in these investment.

  Both turned out to be scams. Both shut down and seized by the SEC. My old friend lost their own money and the retirement money of a number of people including their own parents. Their credibility is gone and their own life is ruined. Jail time is possible for this person and they were as much a victim as the rest of us that invested. The difference is commissions were paid to this person so they are now culpable.

  None of us knew or suspected until it was too late.
  • t agee February 4, 2011 at 3:58 pm

    Sorry to hear about the IPO’s you got involved with Pedro. I’ll tell you one thing, no one knows where to put their money and with almost every working person involved in the stock market in some way it almost seems like it’s just a license to steal. One question I would have for you is did anyone attempt in anyway to retrieve any money back for you, your friend, his parents or anyone else that got taken? I’d be absolutely shocked if you told me yes.
• oktoday February 4, 2011 at 11:05 am

  Why not go the opposite way around, and the Wilpons then sue them back for a Million.

  After all if they are really so innocent, then the law suit against them did put their entire organization into a position of losing everything that they had.

  Is it legal to do it that way?
  • Donal February 4, 2011 at 12:06 pm

    If they can prove malicious intent or some sort of misconduct, absolutely they can counter sue. The problem is how to prove someone’s frame of mind.
• mets2012 February 4, 2011 at 4:22 pm

  So many of the Bloggers are forgetting that the Money Picard is asking for will go the people who lost their life savings on Madoff.
  This innocent until proven guilty only go for the law, not the morality.
  I like Henry James’ America where the morality and responsibility of the elites meant something.
  Wilpons needed to buy the Mets, build citifield and a TV station, so they couldn’t kill the goose that laid a golden egg everyday even though they knew it was too good to be true.
  They should’ve been responsible for the people he introduced to Madoff and the employees they forced to invest their $$$.
  When the Wilsons pulled all the $$$ out of Madoff, they let employees fund to stay there.
  I don’t want to compare the crooks to a hero of a novel.
  But how about Lord Jim? He would’ve been innocent in the court of the law.
  • METS62FAN February 6, 2011 at 12:01 pm

    ’12 spare us the Robin Hood logic, it doesn’t wash withn the actual facts. Maidoff’s Inverstors were a select group of deep pocketed individuals & charities among whom were Sandy Koufax, Kevin Bacon & his wife, I don’t think either will be appearing in a soup kitchen anytime soon. This is certainly a case of a bunch of heirs & heiresses getting kicked in their Conytry Club guts as many certainly had to quit the CC register & liquidate their EU vacation homes to manage, In fact many of these ‘victims’ petitioned the Court to fire Picard for not honoring the value of their last account sttements, if they had prevailed, Wilpons would have been untouchable as fellow losing victims. I personally agree with the logic of Picard’s dismissal of Account balance values as valueless yet I totally disagree with his self-serving motivations for assuming the verascity of his “Shouldas,Couldas,Wouldas”. There is ABSOLUTELY NO EVIDENCE that Sterling had greaster knowledge than any of those other Madoff clients sitting besides Picard’s table as complainants Were there rumors? certainly! did they lead to 18 separate SEC investigations? Certainly! Was Madoff fiound to be “in compliance” after each one? Certainly. Did Maidoff pay out on the 10% growth claims he proclaimed? Certainly! Prior to the panic calls for payouts caused by the National Financial Crisis how many instances proving fraud had been revealed to anyone? NONE,ZERO,NADA! Sterling is culpable, why? Did Sterling Enterprises, in their personal estimation lose money? Certainly, their accont balance showed they had $500M balance @ risk, supporting their lack of knowledge claims, as any warning would’ve triggered total account reassignment elsewhere as the natural reaction of any prudent investor sensing imminent destruction.

    ’12, simply, quietly & slowly extract your head from youe behind remembering to leave your ASSets alone unless you can justify each and every one of these contentions aka facts in evidence!
• francis February 4, 2011 at 7:59 pm

  the wilpons are so much poorer than they were in 2008. not only did they lose everything they had in madoff accounts when he went under, the also are facing this suit, and they now have to invest the money they still have at about 12% a year less than they were used to expecting.

  that’s why they need to sell, that’s why they hired the budget GM, and that’s why this team won’t ever see another star player that isn’t homegrown for the next 10 years.
• francis February 4, 2011 at 8:00 pm

  i don’t get this …

  didn’t the wilpons have money in madoff accounts when he went under ? if so, isn’t the trustee also looking to collect money for the wilpons ?

  are they suing for the difference ?
  • mets2012 February 4, 2011 at 8:32 pm

    LOL,

    Not much.
    Since Madoff didn’t make any money, if you’ve taken out more than you put in ,that is the money you should give to the investors who lost everything.
    That is $3oo mils.
    Plus you’ve been aiding Madoff to continue his Ponzi scheme, You need to pay to the investors who lost $$$ because of that.
    That’s $700 mils.
    If settled $500 mils. If not 1 Bil.
    I always liked Fred wilpon who seemed like a very descent guy.
    What I can’t forgive him is that when he bailed out , he let the employees’ pension fund to stay.
    He forced the employees on Madoff by saying Madoff was very smart..
    I wonder what would happen if Fred Wilpon introduced Tony Soprano to Madoff and bailed out without alerting Tony .
  • theonlymaskman February 5, 2011 at 9:45 am

    By all accepted accounts, the Wilpons withdrew more money from the Crook than what they deposited with him. So they are viewed as cash positive on their accounts with the Crook. When the Trustee distributes restitution funds to the victims, the Wilpons will not receive any of that as they are positive in funds, not negative, and are therefore not deemed to be victims. The only question that remains for the Wilpons is the amount of restitution that they have to pay back. That will be determined by the degree to which the Trustee can back up his claim of culpability. In the meantime, the Mets are dangling on a string blowing in the winds of litigation and public opinion.
    • METS62FAN February 5, 2011 at 10:51 am

      Mask, my friend, while we certainly agree that the Wilpons were not finacial victims per se; They moast certainly were psychologically destituted iinasmuch as the reported $500M portfolio they held as reserve/nestegg had empowered them to take on sudtantial risk/debt(ballpark,guaranteed payroll,SNY investments,etc) To suddenly & dramaticly erase that entire secure feeling must be as traumatic as any felt by actiual other ‘rich’ victims.
      One certainly should not be rash in entirely believing the self-serving trustee, Picard & to let personal fan disappointments & frustrations bias your views upon the respective positions in this case. While certainly the Wilpons withdrew amounts that exceeded their initial investments(not untoward for investments paying 10%) as a number of the Sterling Accounts were specifically targeted for certain usages in deferred payroll payments to departing players ie. Bonilla,Glavine,Franco(Lieter?Benitez?) as well asa taergeted building fund accounts for CitiField. despite claims of Sterlings getting warnings from other investment partners to be careful the security of being promised a 10% return & seemingly getting it, as promised, combined with the assurance that 18 separate SEC conducted investigations into suspicous earnings by paid professional Fin’l investigators had ALL supplied the selfconfidence 18 clean bills of health should provide.
      Picard has already withsood recall/replacement actions by those he wss appointed to represent providing substantuial returns is certainly his best option for justification besides having his earnings for this case determined based upon the size of his claimed & secured assets. The atmosphere is certainly ripe to question Picard’s motivations & illogical logic.
      In my opinion, the sinmple fact that Sterling Equities still maitained a socalled account balance in excess of $500M belies their posessing “insider” information as to the nature of the Madoff portfolio. To me that is patently more substantial evidence of ignorance than the fortunate timely withdrawal of accounts whose purposes had been fulfilled. Why should the non-Financial Market expert Wilpon/Katz be subjected to measurements 18 SEC investigations, the Madoff firm partner & firm bookkeeper could not fulfill & be held accountable for? Even, if they had received unsubstantuiated warnings from other investment partners in other accounts as alleged, the failures by the SEC combined with the apparent contuinued 10% return supplied by Madoff as well as the prompt payment of accounts as needed to Sterling by Madoff certainly would all signify SAFETY & discount said warnings from Madoff competitors as pure deliberate misgivings provided by a speculative jealous competitor aka unsubstantiated “bad-mouthing”.
      • theonlymaskman February 6, 2011 at 11:59 am

        62, My post neither said or implied anything about the Wilpons knowledge or complicity with the Crook. It simply replied to the post by Francis in which he asked whether the Wilpons are entitled to restitution as a victim. I replied that the Trustee’s postion is that they are not since they withdrew more funds than they invested, therefore, they are disqualified as victims. The only outstanding issue is the size of restitution they have to make. I didn’t make any comment relative to their actions to withdraw funds from under the Crook’s control. I stand by my statement that the Mets team is currently held hostage to this situation because of the onwer’s potential liabilities in this matter.
        • METS62FAN February 7, 2011 at 8:04 am

          Mask, I fully understand your conclusion of Picard issue holding the team hostage; I must point out IMO if Picard had not brought suit the current status would most likely remain the same s Alderson was interviewed with a mindset of fulfilling a financial contraction model prior to December’s lawsuit.
          Mask, I strongly believe that even if Sterling felt as financially secure as they did the day prior to Madoff revelations, the Minaya path of escalaring payroll was due to have the spigot reduced based upon the lack of “meaningful” results. Fred would never be comfortable residing @ the very top of the Leafue’s payroll list.
    • METS62FAN February 6, 2011 at 9:37 am

      Mask, as I understand it, the Wilpons & many in the social circle down in Palm Beech, were ALL heavily invested in Maidoff Investments, it was considered a perk to be ‘in’ with Bernie. As inconceivable as Bernie’s results seemed, he had been providing unusual ‘growth’ for years & 18 successive SEC audits revealed nothing but a clean ‘bill of health’ despite scurulous rumors spread by his ‘jealous’ competitors, so where & why should Sterling transfer their accounts?
      Not mentioned by anyone I’ve read is the simple fact that had not “the collapse” have occurred causing panic withdrawal request en masse. The scheme would still be undetected & facts cyurrently in evidence reveals that Sterling’s 500M? account balance would still be under Maidoff control.
      • theonlymaskman February 6, 2011 at 12:03 pm

        62, I agree with you that if the financial crisis of 2007/8 had not occurred, the Crooked Ponzi scheme would likely not have been detected and would most likely contiue in operation today. It was the fiancial downturn that triggered massive requests for withdrawal and the Crook saw that the jig was up. His hand was forced and he confessed. Had the economy continue unperturbed to the current day, he would likely not be in prison and still be leading his lifestyle of luxury at the expense of the victims.
  • METS62FAN February 6, 2011 at 10:33 am

    Francis, my understanding is that your perception is based upon the settlement definitions that applied in EVERY previous such instance, Picard has altered the landscapew by delibeately acknowledging that ALL account statements were fraudulent & as such have no bearing on calculations of losses & gains. For thjis reason the Judge had been petitioned by the victims to replace Picard relatively early in the process. Picard opposed their desires & was subsequently upheld, which. to me, provides him with another suibstantial reason for atempting to “claim” everything possible despite lack of evidence as a way to salve huis ego & prove his ‘clients’ wtrong foe ever doubtig him aka EGO TRIP! in addition to greedy attempt to increase his reimbursements based upon % of reclaimewd asset values.
    Picard has more reasons to accuse Sterling than for passing on them.The disregard for logic in his Sterling ‘Shouda known/suspected/acted is inconveniently rebutted by Sterling’s leaving the posted $500M balance in Bernie’s control until the very end. Talk about your INCONVENIENT TRUTHS?
    I wonder how Picard ca be entrusted in his capacity when he so blatantly reveals an inability to add 1+1 in arriving @ 2
• francis February 4, 2011 at 8:59 pm

  if you figure out that you might be caught up in a ponzi scheme, what’s the appropriate protocol ?

  call the feds and watch your investment turn to dust ?

  withdraw your funds and then rat the dude out ?

  if they aren’t complicit, i don’t see what they were supposed to do if they had suspicions, and why they can be blamed for doing anything.

  now if they knew, it’s one thing. and if they suspected, and still brought new investors in, that’s something too.
  • mets2012 February 5, 2011 at 1:14 am

    All the money Wilpons made from Madoff are the money somebody else got swindled.
    So he has to pay that. $300 mils
    Madoff ran the Ponzi scheme with the help from Wilpons, so they are asking for the damage.$700 mils.
    They lost everything, but Wilpons got their money back plus profits.
    They are not trying to send Wilpons to jail, they want $$$$.
    Wilpons are saying that all the outrageous earnings they received were theirs.
    Since they didn’t know.
    Madoff didn’t earn anything, the new investors were the earnings.
  • METS62FAN February 6, 2011 at 10:17 am

    Francis, exactly what would cause anyone to suspect their investments were in trouble? Failure of your accont manager to honor your withdrawal requests timely? Sterlings requests were ALL honored as were everyone else’s they knew in their social network, most Madoff ‘special’ investors.
    So Francis, Let’s assume Sterling did get so nervous with their apparent success that they decided to “spit directly into the wind” & call for a 19th SEC investigation. Is there any factual evidence supporting the results of theis investigation would differ from it’s predecessors(all supporting Maidoff procedures as “in compliance” Isn’t the successful completion of those SEC reviews proof that Maidoff Investments was as safe as any others(Bear Sterns, Goldman Sachs for example)

    Of ALL the potential “should have known better” culprits, the SEC is obviously the biggest failed authority here; but wait, blaming the SEC does not put any potential $$ ibn Picard’s pockets or reimburse any of the other ‘filthy rich’ victims that were numbered among Bernie’s elite investors.(see register of Palm Beech CC) along with numerous unfortunate Charities with large desposits. As evidence shows that Sterling Enterprisses is among the very few with actual proof of Madoff’s honoring his huge ROI claims, sans proof why is it that not one of these ‘victims’ had the responsibility to take apropriate action being assigned by Picard to Sterling. Certainly had Bernie balked at paying a Sterling demand & Sterling refused to report it, then & only then does the burden rest with Fred & Saul.
    When did sharing your apparent good fortune with others become an irresponsibility isn’t that the definition of a mitzvah?
• mets2012 February 5, 2011 at 1:36 am

  from NYT

  David Sheehan, the lead lawyer for Picard, said “the entire Katz-Wilpon enterprise” was being looked at as assets that could be used to resolve the lawsuit.

  “What the trustee is looking for here is a payment in cash,” Sheehan said. “So whether they utilize the Mets, SNY, Sterling properties or any other resource is of no moment to us. What we’re looking for is a billion dollars, and unless we settle for less than that, which we’re not inclined to do, where they get the money is of no moment to us.”
• mets2012 February 5, 2011 at 1:50 am

  “Good grief, the owners even offered Madoff a piece of the Mets in 2002 when they bought out Nelson Doubleday, according to Page 144 of the complaint. ”
  NYT
  I said Wilpons bought the Mets with Madoff money.
• theonlymaskman February 5, 2011 at 9:57 am

  The Wilpons are now involved in a high stakes game. They have opted to drop the alternative of a settlement and literally “go for broke”. For their sakes, I hope their claims are true and are vindicated. If the Trustee has valid evidence of complicity or even just awareness, they will lose the high stakes game and be liable for very high restitution. The best scenario for them is an eventual settlement with a large payback. The worst is a total wipeout. The stakes are huge and the Mets certainly hang in the balance. Whatever the outcome, I would like to see the Wilpons sell the Mets as soon as possible. I would like to enjoy rooting for the Mets without this cloud hanging over it. It is obvious that the Wilpons are going to need financial resources in hand to make the final payment and continue as a going concern. Selling the Mets is the right thing for them to do for themselves and for the team and its fans.
  • mets2012 February 5, 2011 at 1:17 pm

    I have a feeling that they don’t have cash to settle.
    • theonlymaskman February 6, 2011 at 12:08 pm

      2012, You could very well be right and that points us to sale of the team in entirety as their best exit strategy from this morass. Finding a minority buyer under these circumstances would be daunting in my opinion.
• mets2012 February 5, 2011 at 1:33 pm

  from NYP
  “Sources with direct knowledge of the 74-year-old Wilpon’s finances said that even if an angel investor took the embattled owner up on his offer to buy 25 percent of the team for $200 million, it wouldn’t put a dent in his potential Madoff liabilities.

  The actual Met team — including ticket sales, broadcast rights and branding rights — is worth $860 million. But the team owes a staggering $430 million in debt. Last year, the Mets lost another $30 million, mainly from interest payments on that massive debt.

  Citi Field, managed by Wilpon’s Sterling Equities, is another financial drain.

  Wilpon owes $700 million for construction. And under a deal structured with the city, the stadium — controlled by a Sterling entity called Queens Ballpark Corp — must pay $50 million in annual “payments in lieu of taxes.”

  The debt interest and stadium payments leave Sterling about $80 million in the red each year, sources with direct knowledge of the Mets’ financials said.

  Likewise, Sterling Equities’ 65 percent stake in SportsNet NY is choked with debt.

  The network gener- ates about $100 million a year in profit after paying $20 million in interest on $450 million in loans.

  Of that profit, Wilpon only keeps $65 million because he has other partners.

  So add all this debt — around $1.58 billion — to the near $1 billion he could owe Madoff investors, and there’s no way he can keep the team.

  “This will devolve into a full sale,” a source said.

  Besides, the source said, no one would want to go into business with Wilpon now and bear the risk that he’ll declare bankruptcy under the weight of the Madoff victims’ claim.

  Not to mention that the offer to buy was just for the team — not a share in his lucrative cable network.

  The Wilpons would love to be rid of the suit, but “Fred can’t settle,” a source close to the situation told The Post.

  He doesn’t have the money, the source added.”

  They are talking about the Ranger style bankruptsy.
  I wonder what my tribe won’t do wrong Metsie say about this.

  Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/queens/wilpon_losing_his_grip_on_the_team_839KYyGsQmnArfOY8Lsd9M#ixzz1D6tQbx2g
  • Mr North Jersey February 5, 2011 at 1:55 pm

    Seriously? it’s a source from the Post. Cmon.

    I hope that if and when the Wilpons sell the team that it’s for the better not worse of the franchise. It seems as if some are so eager to see the Wilpons sell you’d think they will have won something if indeed the Wilpons sell.

    Like those that wanted Minaya gone and are now complaining that Alderson is worse and those that wanted Willie gone only to then say Jerry was worse. Be careful that when and if the Wilpons are gone the ownership that comes in won’t be worse as well.
    • mets2012 February 5, 2011 at 3:56 pm

      NY Post is stating the facts.
      I just don’t like the attacks that have been directing at me because I’ve been saying that Wilpons were crooks and they deserved what they are getting now.
      Saying garbages like they may be scumbags but they are innocent, where is the smoking gun?
      Picard is asking for $$$$ not the yellow jump suits.
      • Mr North Jersey February 5, 2011 at 5:03 pm

        OK 1st a unnamed source is never a fact.
        2nd if your going to make comments attacking people by calling them crooks among other things. Then how can you be mad when others do to you exactly what your doing to someone else?

        This is a public blog you can’t expect to make comments and not be called out on them. Now if you feel that someone is overstepping their bounds and making personal attacks on you then I suggest contacting site about said incident. I speak from experience it has worked for me.
        • mets2012 February 5, 2011 at 5:29 pm

          thanks
        • Metsie February 5, 2011 at 6:14 pm

          What I find so funny is that 2012 says because the Wilpons invested in a Ponzi scheme they must be crooks.

          And if that were true then all the folks suing the Wilpons are crooks as well because they were just as much invested in a scheme!

          All he has is heresay and accusations but not one shred of PROOF that the wilpons were in on the scam!

          And I bet neither does the lawyer for the victims because if he had anything to prove it then the Wilpons wouldn’t be talking to him they would be in an orange jumpsuit sitting next to Madoff hoping they don’t get raped in the shower by a yankee fan!
          • mets2012 February 5, 2011 at 6:46 pm

            Metsie,
            I always liked Fred Wilpon until I found out about his employees’ pension fund.
            They bailed themselves out but let the employees’ pension fund to stay to lose everything.
            The employees didn’t have a choice because Wilpons forced Madoff on them and Wilpons were officers of the fund.
            I am not talking about legality here.
            I am talking about Ethics and morality.
            I asked this question the other day.
            Let’s say Wilpons introduced Tony Soprano to Madoff to invest and Tony paid back by breaking Ollie’s kneecap, Would Wilpons bailed out without alerting Tony about Madoff?
            Wilpon did that to his workers because his workers don’t use baseball bats and guns. They are powerless.
            I am glad Picard is working for them.
          • mets2012 February 5, 2011 at 7:03 pm

            Another thing,

            An Austrian banker who introduced many clients to Madoff like Wilpons’ve done is in hiding.
            Do you know why?
            Not because Picard is after her for $$$.
            Russian mobs are after her life with their fancy tools.
            Where I come from You take care of the people who work for you before anything.
  • theonlymaskman February 6, 2011 at 12:18 pm

    2012, Thanks for the quote from the Post. It is quite a detailed outline of the highly leveraged situation the Wilpons find themselves in regarding their holdings in the Mets, Citifield, and SNY. It is extremey meaningful to their ability to settle and also marketing the team for new owners. It says nothing about the state of their real estate holdings. So in that regard, it is not a full picture, but nevertheless, still quite enlightening.
• METS62FAN February 6, 2011 at 12:11 pm

  ’12 this didn’t have a reply option; but I became so concerned for your sefewty that I had to respomnd with this caution…
  ___________________________________________________________________________________________
  mets2012 says:
  February 4, 2011 at 3:13 pm
  Metsie,

  I lead a very successful and happy life in the Northwest.
  I feel good because Wipons, who I think is crooks, are getting what they deserve.
  Wilpons are built on the phony money of Madoff .
  They bought the Mets with them and operated the Mets with them.
  They forced their employees to invest on Madoff.
  Did they help the employees who lost all their savings?
  No.
  I love the Mets but hate wilpons.
  Does that allowed in your world?
  ___________________________________________________________________________________________’12, u live in the NORTHWEST? of the US? I would think someobne as dilusional as u would need to be very concerned over the Public perception of Euthanasia in the Northwest US

  Consider yourself warned just as Sterling was about Madoff.
  BE WARNED! BE CAREFUL!