Comments on: Mets Should Take A Look At Conor Jackson

By: METS62FAN

METS62FAN — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 16:57:51 +0000

CAPSLOCK=DISABILITY ACCOMODATION
DANIEL, YOUR LIST OF JARAMILLO SUCCESS STORIES SHOCKED ME WITH THE REALIZATION GONZALES,I-ROD, A-ROD ALL HAD SOMETHING ELSE IN COMMON IN ADDITION TO RUDY,,,(JUICERS) WONDER WHAT HONEST RESULTS WOULD’VE BEEN. PERSONALLY I THINK HITTING COACH IS TOO OVERBLOWN, WHAT ANGERS ME RE. OUR GUYS IS MY BELIEF THEY’RE COUNTING ON VIDEO TOO MUCH, OBVIOUSLY CONCENTRATING ON THAT GAME’S SP WHICH WOULD EXPLAIN THE STUMBLING OFFENSE AGAINST RELIEVERS. TOO OFTEN OUR LINEIP STARTS BANGING EARLY AGAINT THE STARTER, THEN SUDDENLY FIZZLES AGAINST MEDIOCRE RELIEVERS. WHY? I THINK IT’S VIDEOS INSTEAD OF BUILDING SEE-REACT ABILITIES TOO MUCH GUESSING RELYING ON VIDEO TENDAANCIES! THAT’S MY 2 CENTS WORTH OF GUESS.

By: METS62FAN

METS62FAN — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 15:28:38 +0000

CAPSLOCK=DISABILITY ACCOMODATION
BOB, I AGREE WITH YOUR ‘NEEDS’ ASSESSMENT; BUT DISAGREE WITH YOUR TRADEABLE COMMODITY ASSESSMENT. WHAT HAS ALWAYS BEEN ONE OF THE MOST DESIRED BASEBALL COMMODITIES IS PITCHING, ESP ROTATION GRADE, WHHICH FOR SAKE OF THIS POINT I’LL BREAK INTO LEVELS 1,2,3,4,5 TO CORRESPOND WITH ROTATIONAL SLOT.
LAST SEASON THE NYM USED 12 SP THROUGHOUT THE ROTATION WITH VARYING DEGREES OF SUCCESS. NONE OF THOSE 12 WERE LIMA CLONES. SOME VIABLE, SOME UNTENABLE. WE HAVE 1 STUD GRADE 1 PITCHER, NO GRADE 2 & AND AN ABUNDANCE OF 3 THROUGH 5. WHILE MOST WOULD SCOFF AT THE VIABILITY OF PELFREY,MAINE,PEREZ,NIESE,NIEVE,MISCH,REDDING,FIGUEROA,ETC. THEY WOULD BE ACCURATE, IF AS WE ‘VE BEEN LED TO BELIEVE IN ST EVERY FRONTOFFICE SEES TYHEMSELVES AS HOPEFUL WS CONTENDERS. IN THE 21st CENTURY THAT IS NO LONGER THE CASE. RATHER THERE ARE AT LEAST 20 OF THE 30 FRANCHISES I BELIEVE WHO’S PRIMARY FRONTOFFICE GOAL IS A PLAYOFF BERTH. TYPICALLY IN THIS ECONOMY THOSE 10 BELIEVERS IN THE WS GRAIL ARE TYPICALLY THE TOP 10 IN PAYROLLS. FOR ’09 THEY ARE NYY, NYM, CHC, DET, PHL, BOS, LAA, LAD, HOUS, CHSX. WITH THIS ECXONOMY THE WORD IS MANY OF THOSE REMAINING TEAMS ARE REEVALUATING CERTAIN VET PLAYERS TO DETERMINE VIABILITY OF ROSTER SPOT BASED STRICTLY ON ROI. AS SALARY IS DECREASING THE VIABILITY OF CERTAIN HIGH PRICED PLAYERS, LOWER COST OPTIONS ARE EXPERIENCING AN INCREASE IN VIABILITY STANDING. THUS MANY OF OUR “LACKLUSTER” 2 THROUGH 6 SPing ASSETS, BY VIRTUE OF LOW COST WILL BE IN HIGHER DEMAND IF WE PKG THEM PROPERLY. JUST TAKE A LOOK AT THE 2 WS TEAMS THAT JUST COMPETED THE WINNER WITH 3 TOP TIER SP(CC,AJ,ANDY) THE LOSER WITH 2(HAMELS,LEE) GAZE THROUGH ALL OF THE REMAINING TEAMS AND MORE THAN WE REALIZE ARE CHOOSING “GET BY” TALENTS FOR BACXKEND ROTATORS. I DO NOT BELIEVE OUR TRADE SUCCESS WILL BE BEST SERVED IN SACRIFICING A CORE PLAYER RATHER 2 OF OUR SP (MAINE & PELFREY LIKELY MOST VALUABLE COMMODITIES). THAT’S WHERE I’D START NEGOTIATING DEALS FROM BOTH ARGUABLY ARE VIABLE ESTABLISHED MID ROTATION SP. ATLANTA IS ANOTHER TEAM LOOKING TO DEAL A SP, WHO ON PAPER IS DEFINITLY MORE CAPABLE TO CONTRIBUTE BUT ANY ONE OF WHICH WILL EARN MORE THAN BOTH MAINE & PERLFREY COMBINED. THIS IS THE DAWN OF A NEW AGE WHERE ROI SALARY vS. FIELD CONTRIBUTIONS ARE A GREAT FACTOR. FOR INSTANCE, DERRECK LOWE IS EARNING 15M PER WHILE MAINE & PELFREY COMBINED ARE UNDER 6M, IS LOWE’S PRODUCTIVITY PER $ GOING TO BE > OR < PELFREY+MAINE.
THIS HAS ALWAYS BEEN A SUBTLE FACTOR IN PLAY; BUT IS MUCH MORE OBVIOUS IN AN ECONOMIC ENVIRONMENT WHEREBY DISCRETUIONARY INC FROM ATTENDANCE,LOGO MKTING, LUXURY TAX DISPERSMENTS ARE SO VOLATILE. FORGETTING OTHER NEEDS LIKE #1C & LF, FOR NOW, I PROPOSE OMAR APPROACH BOTH MILW & SD ON THEIR 1B(FIELDER & GONZALES) MILWALKEE GM ALREADY HAS HELD PRESSER ANNOUNCING HIS OFFSEASON GOAL OF ADDING 2 'ESTABLISHED' SP WITH A WILLINGNESS TO SACRIFICE HIS HIGHLY TOUTED BEST PROSPECT TO DO SO. PADSRES ARE OBVIOUSLY LOOKING TO CONTAIN COSTS OVER LONG HAUL. THE METS HAVE MANY NEEDS AND FEW ESTABLISHED HIGHLY REGARDED PROSPECTS. IT IS IN THE NYM BEST INTERESTS TO COMBINE FA SIGNINGS & TRADES TO FILL HOLES. NOT ALL TRADE TARGETS CAN BE ACQUIRED FROM TEAMS REQUIRING PROSPECTS. ANY HOLES THAT CAN BE FILLED BY DEAKLING OFF MLB ROSTER EXCESS SUCH AS BACKEND LEVEL SPing. ALL BUT PEREZ IS VERY COST EFFECIENT FOR TEAMS SATISFIED WITH W/C. MY PREFERRED GOAL WOULD BE TO USE PELFREY & MAINE AS A NUCLEUS TO A PKG FOR FIELDER AND SIGNING AS F/A MOLINA or BARAJAS,LACKEY-#2, MARQUIS-#3. WITH BOSOX OBTAINING HERMEDA FROM FISH, PERHAPS THAT LESSENS DEMAND FOR BAY AS OPPOSED TO HOLLIDAY AS A VIABLE LF OPTION. JUST MY THOUGHTS, WITH RICK PETERSON AS MILW NEW PC I BELIEVE THE POTENTIAL FOR PELF & MAIN'S VALUE IS FURTHER ENHANCED. WE KBNOW HE LOVES THE 10 MIN FIXUPS!

By: Bob L

Bob L — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 00:17:11 +0000

The makeup of the Phillies, the ‘characters’ they are, combined with their ‘on paper’ talent combined to make them Pennant winners the past few years, and WS Champions last year, and giving the Yanks a hell of a Series, this year. It is ‘their talent’ sure, but they have something in addition to their talent that our vaunted core lacks. i call it grit, girst; some would label it ‘clutch’.
Look at the Yanks this year: A-Rod…..he jelled; maybe it’s Kate Hidson, maybe it’s Tex, maybe it’s the rest of the team and he accepting each other. i dunno. But i do recall the number of times the Yankees came back in games all thru the year and into the Post Season and through the WS.
It has mysterious causes; it can be called cohesion.
The Mets have lacked that in recent years.
i’m ‘picking on’ Beltran because i think we have to trade one of our core guys, and he is the only one that we could get ‘anything’ for at this point.
And looking at the possible additions to the team over this off season, discussed in this space, i believe we’d be a better team ‘with’ Lackey, Holliday, Halliday, C. Jackson at 1B (or someone), maybe a Mark DeRosa (if the Front Office agrees with me)…and trading Beltran to the BOSOX for Buccholz (i think it a possibility; you guys don’t) or a package of 1st tier prospects, like kalish, Nava, Rizzo, Williamson (SP), and/or Portice (SP). Thanks.

By: Mets faithful

Mets faithful — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 22:14:57 +0000

He is also one of the slowest men on earth.

By: Daniel

Daniel — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 18:59:39 +0000

Ok and yes I agree. So then from your opinion who do you think the Mets should go after ? What about Lackey he would demand less then Halladay.

By: Daniel

Daniel — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 18:56:10 +0000

I hear what your saying but Jaramillo is an improvement over Johnson now I love Johnson as a coach but not our hitting coach. Just look at what Jaramillo has done 4 players won MVP awards and Micheal Young was a 5 time all-star under his tenure. No Met player over our history has won a prestigious MVP award. Jaramillo had Juan Gonzalez, Pudge Rodriguez, Alex Rodriguez and Micheal Young. So I imagine what he could of done for Wright, Francoeur etc… Well I’m going to stop talking about this cause it can’t happen cause he is now the hitting coach for the Cubs.

By: METS62FAN

METS62FAN — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 16:32:31 +0000

DANIEL, NOT EVEN JARAMILLO CAN TURN WATER INTO WINE OR PIG EARS INTO SILK PURSES. I BELIEVE WE NEED TO SIMPLIFY IT. GETTING HALLADAY,LACKEY OR WHOMEVER IS A MUST FOR #2; BUT NOT EVEN BOB GIBSON OR TOM SEAVER EVER WON A 0-0 GAME! THIS TEA, IN MY OPINION AT MINIMUM HAS 3 POSITIONS 1B,LF,C TO ADD A MINIMUM OF 50 HR GUARANTEED ANY COMBO THAT EQUASLS LESS THAN THAT FAILS TO MEET MIN REQUIREMENTS. I’M ALSO BULLISH ON WRIGHT & FRENCHY PROVIDING AT LEAST 30 MORE THASN ’09 BETWEEN THEM. I’VE FLOATED A HYPOTHESIS OUT THERE NO ONE SEES AS CREDIBLE. YET WE’VE ALL SEEN HOW D.WRIGHT CAN ADJUST/DRESIL HIS APPROACH TO ACCOMODATE A PERSONAL GOAL AS HE DID PRIOR TO THE HOMERUN HITTING CONTEST HE LOST Vs HOWARD. I BELIEVE THAT UNDERLYING HIS BA OVER POWER APPROACH LAST YR MAY BE ATTRIBUTABLE TO HIS CHARITABLE GOALS Re. THAT UNFORTUNATE CONTEST HE ENTERED Vs JETER FOR CHARITY BASED ON HIGHER BA.

By: METS62FAN

METS62FAN — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 16:20:56 +0000

CAPSLOCK=DISABILITY ACCOMODATION
DANIEL, I HEAR U; BUT THE BIGGESTISSUE IN DEALING FOR ‘DOC’ ISN’T AS MUCH WHO WE SACRIFICE; BUT SIGNING HIM TO STAY ONCE ACQUIRED. YOUR PROPOSAL PUTS US IN THE SAME ‘DO OR DIE’ CONTRACT POSITION JOHAN HAD US IN. ONLY HIGHER PRICED. MY QUSTION IS DESPITE THE DOMINANT PITCHING ROTATION, CAN THE METS SURVIVE & CONTINUE TO COMPETE CARRYING THE BURDEN OF 3 CONTRACTS OF 18-20M PER FOR MULTIPLE YEARS WITH NO-TRADE CLAUSES? SANTANA+BELTRAN+HALLADAY ISN’T THAT THE SAME BINDING ISSUE THE YANKS FOUND THEMSELVES IN YEARS AGO? NYM DO NOT HAVE THE FREESPENDING, NO-BUDGET CONTRAINTS OF NYY. I FEAR THOUGH YOUR PROPOSAL IS LIKELY THE MORE OBVIOUS W & L SOLYUTION IT’S UNTENABLE REGARDING P & L.

By: MetsKnicksRutgers

MetsKnicksRutgers — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 13:03:49 +0000

You notice these things about Beltran, but they are extremely small samples of his overall game. With the exception of 2009 he is hailed by both stat-heads (UZR, Dewans +/- system) and scouts universally for his outstanding defense. And can you think of how many times last year he didn’t slide? Maybe twice I would say. Did those two slides really have anywhere near the impact that his franchise record 41 HRs in 2006 did? or his 909 OPS from 06-08 with 101 HRs and 66 SBs to just 8 CS? How about his 3 GGs during that period (even though I dont take GGs seriously).

If you are worried about Beltran getting old and regressing a whole bunch and thats your reason for trading him, I understand but don’t lump him in with our SP failing us in 07 and the BP falling off of a cliff in 08. The core was mostly injured this year and we went from a 89 win team to a 70 win team, and you blame it on Beltran when he was OPSing 915 playing on balky knees that our defunct training staff ignored.

And saying it was the Phillies grit that won them 3 straight Division CHampionships is unfair to their players (and we kinda owned them head to head in 08 so they werent really a thorn in our side). In 07 they got a career season from Rowand, a near 1000 OPS from Howard, Utley doing the same thing at a non-slugging position, and an MVP year (albeit undeserved) from Rollins along with decent seasons from Ruiz, Werth and Pat Burrel. Similar to everything breaking right for the yanks this season (8 freaking regulars OPSing over 800!) the phils entire pitching staff had career seasons in 08. Moyer was awesome, Hamels was an ace, Myers was hot at the end of the year as was Blanton and Lidge had a very good LOB%.

Give credit where it is due, they had damn good teams, it wasn’t their hustle and grit that got em where they are. Using that as an explanation is dishonest and takes the easy way out of doing any type of research and thought.

By: Bob L

Bob L — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 11:08:27 +0000

The ‘way’ to ‘prove’ it is to LOOK at the results: Beltran does not hustle; does not SLIDE; shows no energy or cohesion with his team, and is emblematic of ‘what’ ails the Mets: lethargy, undelivered potential, and ‘softness’ in tight spots. And Beltran is aboutthe only one of the ‘core’, we could get anything for at this point. Epstein won’t trade Buccholz. Fine, but find out if he would…because the reporter that touted that is an influential sports writer close to the Boston scene. Just find out.
The larger point is, that this team MUST be revamped. We should sign the guys i’ve elicited above or players available ‘like them’.
i’m not wedded to getting DeRosa, but Lackey, Holliday, Haliday, and a 1B (Jackson, or someone else)…and shaking up this team….trading one of the ‘core’ are essential components of making the Mets winners.
The Philies lost last night. But they never seemed out of it. They battled. The Ibanez and even Victorino at-bats late in the game against Mariano for the love o’ Mike, proved their grist, grit, evidenced the reasons they’ve been thorns in our side for 3 years.
My main point is to go get the guys that matter: make the starting rotation DEEP, get some pop, and yeah some grit, hustle, spirit…and go do it.
i ‘pick’ on Beltran, quite frankly, because he’s the only ‘one’ of the vaunted ‘core’ we could get ‘anything’ for at this point. And i believe the Mets being reborn, ‘begins’ with one of the core, in this case, Beltran, being traded.

By: Daniel

Daniel — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 08:25:25 +0000

I never started ripping Beltran that was Bob L so

By: MetsKnicksRutgers

MetsKnicksRutgers — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 05:43:16 +0000

Your ripping of Beltran is typical for a fan looking for a scapegoat for a teams failures. Beltran is awesome, and the reason he looks like he doesnt have energy is because he is so good, he makes things look easy.

And Derosa is terribly defensively, he plays a buncha positions none of them all that well. In fact most pretty crappy, and at a corner position he loses a ton of value due to his lack of offensive prowess.

Do some research and explain how Beltran isn’t energetic while Derosa is rather than one is gritty and the other isn’t. Because there is no way you can prove it.

By: Daniel

Daniel — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 05:42:33 +0000

Well I’m done for today. Tomorrow we can finish this Good Talking to you guys

By: Daniel

Daniel — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 05:30:07 +0000

I don’t know how to answer this but here it goes. This whole Beltran thing was brought up because some reporter posted it and since then we haven’t heard anything from Epstein so. If the Soxs did that they would be losing greatly both with Beltran and by losing Buchholz and what makes you think they would do that if they expect to compete with the now 27 time champion Yankees. I have nothing to say about Derosa and Castillo so….

By: Daniel

Daniel — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 05:25:09 +0000

Yeaa but with Castillo he had a bounce back year compared to the year before but can his knees hold up. If we do trade Murphy who do you see the Mets going after ?

By: Bob L

Bob L — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 05:24:41 +0000

Beltran has peaked; he’ll break down, he’s still a 5-tool player, but will fade soon. Yet, ironically, Epstein does want him. Let’s take advantage of that. They’re down on Ellsbury and they will trade Buchholz for Beltran.
Beltran has no energy; no emotion on the field; we have too many players like that. We have to reshape this team
DeRosa is, in fact, under-rated for the intangibles he brings to a team. He can play about 5 positions; is a better 2B than Castillo for pete’s sake, and would spark the offense and stabilize the defense.
Murphy should be used as one of the pieces to get Haliday.
Sign DeRosa, Holliday, C. Jackson, Lackey; trade Beltran; trade for Doc Haliday. This team is totally revamped and hungry.
Keep Beltran and get the same Jell-o in a tught spot.

By: MetsKnicksRutgers

MetsKnicksRutgers — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 05:22:44 +0000

Derosa beat out murph in wOBA by 9 points, while a decent amount is not a significant number especially considering contractual differences, and murphs age and potential for growth while Derosa can only regress

By: Daniel

Daniel — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 05:19:06 +0000

Not to mention those 2 sliding catches he made against the braves on Sept 22

By: Daniel

Daniel — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 05:17:23 +0000

Yeaa, but Murphy isn’t overrated he’s still young. Minaya would never trade Beltran the only reason why were talking about this is because some reported posted a blog saying that. Plus if the Red Soxs were to make that trade they would be losing a lot. They would be losing Buchholz which gives them the best rotation in baseball and if you say Beltran’s knees would be a problem then they would be losing cause what if he got injured and was out all year then what. I think with the whole idea of getting gritty players and what not I’m 50/50 on it I think we need to get players who know how to play and who want to play.

By: MetsKnicksRutgers

MetsKnicksRutgers — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 05:09:50 +0000

Ok… why would Epstein trade Buch for beltran? Please explain because it really makes no sense. If he wouldn’t include him in a deal for Agon or Halladay, why would he do it for Beltran who is coming of a knee injury and is an FA in 2011 while buch is controllable and awesome. This rumor was pure speculation. We cant trade beltran right now we WILL NOT GET FAIR VALUE, and because he doesn’t slide maybe 1-2 times a year we need to get rid of him? Did you forget that this guy is a top 2-3 CF?

And Derosa is terribly overrated. His OBP was 319 last year, and his perceived value hasn’t plummeted meaning we would have to overpay for him to play where exactly? LF is for Holliday, that move must be made. 1B is murph and hopefully evans/jackson for 2010 unless Ike is ready earlier. Castillo is our 2b unless somebody takes on his contract which would be great but is unlikely.