When the Mets traded Ryan Church to the Atlanta Braves for Jeff Francoeur, there was an outcry among Mets fans such as I’ve never heard before over a trade that I thought was a great one for the Mets. All of a sudden Ryan Church was looked upon as this golden boy, when in fact he hadn’t put together a string of six solid games in a row since April of 2008.
At the time of the trade, I lobbied hard for Jeff Francoeur because I saw something in him that we haven’t seen since Darryl Strawberry last did it in 1990, almost 20 years ago. A 100 RBI season. It’s hard to believe that at a position that most teams have stocked with a slugger, the Mets have suffered through two decades of offensive futility. Not anymore.
In Francoeur, the Mets got themselves a player who already had two 100 RBI seasons before his 24th birthday. Many Mets fans have said that those 100 RBI seasons were now a distant memory and he was washed up. Washed up at 25? I didn’t buy it for one minute. What I saw was a young player who tasted success early on, and when pitchers adjusted to him, he failed to adjust to them. It was plain to see. In 2008, Frenchy unsuccessfully tried to fix things his way. In 2009, he was desperately seeking help wherever he could find it, including boarding a plane to meet with another team’s hitting instructor. That one move was the beginning of the end his tenure with the Braves, and led to a new opportunity with the Mets. It was a perfect match, although I may have been the only one thinking it at the time.
In last night’s win against the Astros, Jeff Francoeur drove in two more runs and now has 14 RBIs in 12 games as a Met. He is batting .327 with a .490 slugging percentage. And yet believe it or not, we have many complaining that he has no walks. Really?
There is a contingency in our fanbase that would prefer to see less hits and more walks. This is why I can never fully commit to all these new statistical measures. Why in the world would I ever care about how many walks my number five hitter has? I could understand if the argument was to distinguish the value of our number one and two hitters. Those hitters get paid to get on base by hook or by crook. But here we have a bona fide slugger whocan drive in runs, and yet so many would prefer to take the bat right out of his hands. <shaking my head in disbelief>
This is a Mets team that is struggling to score runs. They needed a hitter in the middle of the lineup who could drive some runs home, and in Francoeur they got just what they needed. Church had his 2.5 minutes of fame with the Mets, but he was not a leader or a clutch hitter or a power hitter. He was a square peg in a round hole. I knew it, Jerry Manuel knew it, Omar Minaya knew it.
The last thing this team needed was Ryan Church walking with a runner on second base instead of driving him home. Good riddance to him and his walks. By the way, he’s batting .200 with the Braves, but fear not, he has plenty of walks. You can keep the walks, I’ll take the RBI’s instead.
After the game last night, Mets manager Jerry Manuel said that Jeff Francoeur has energized a number of players on this team that were in need of some recharging, including David Wright.
He said that the clubhouse has had a new positive energy and a completely different dynamic since Francoeur’s arrival.
“That young man knows how to compete. He knows how to win and he hates to lose.”
Those are just a couple of those immeasurable intangibles that you’ll always see me blogging about.
Francoeur has helped revive a team that was pronounced dead at the All Star break. This weekend alone, he had seven RBIs in the three-game series against the Astros. Gary Cohen asked,
“When’s the last time any Met did that?”
When asked to comment about the series yesterday, Francoeur opted to talk about the Mets post season chances instead…
“The last two games, we’ve played great ball. It’s big momentum for us coming home. We got a shot. We’ve got 65 games left, and I guarantee you every person on this team will fight their butts off to the end.”
It sounds a lot like something Tug McGraw or Keith Hernandez would say when they once roamed the Mets clubhouse.
I am so glad that Francoeur’s 100 RBI bat is now an integral part of our lineup. And if we do manage to win a wild card this season, you can be sure that it never would have happened without Francoeur.
If we do in fact make the post season, the Jeff Francoeur trade will be known as the turning point in the Mets season. In fact, I believe it already is.
Lead the way Frenchy!
I see there are a lot of “moneyballers” out in full force or I should say so-called Mets fans who would actually love to see Jeff Francoeur fail miserably just so they can say “I told you so.”
It is absolutely killing them that Francoeur is having a little success here in the early goings of his Mets career.
You stat mongers should petition Major League Baseball to see if they can just stop playing the games on the field and just put two lineups in a computer program and get the results that way because as you all know there are no other variables then your oh so accurate metrics. Seriously, why even play the game on the field anymore considering your all experts and no exactly what is going to happen anyways?
Talk about taking the fun out of the great game just to say “I told you so, I told you so, I told you so.”
“considering *you’re all experts and *know”
no one claimed to be an expert.
Wow, this would be pretty funny if it wasn’t so pathetic. Thank you, Amazin Avenue for taking the time to making a big joke of a simple blog that showed a little enthusiasm for one of our own.
Joe, I’m glad you decided not to jump into the fray, and make this and worse. You can never go wrong by taking the high road.
The one thing all those Bill James disciples have in common is their propensity to be arrogant and rude whenever they try to make their points. They never pass up an opportunity to belittle any fan who shows an ounce of passion for the team. And God forbid you disagree with them.
I read their post and also their comments and I can’t believe how shameful they are. But you know what the worst part is? The final line to their post in reply to Joe’s final point:
Joe wrote:
I am so glad that Francoeur’s 100 RBI bat is now an integral part of our lineup. And if we do manage to win a wild card this season, you can be sure that it never would have happened without Francoeur.
If we do in fact make the post season, the Jeff Francoeur trade will be known as the turning point in the Mets season. In fact, I believe it already is.
Amazin Avenue wrote:
Wanna bet? Listen, the Mets aren’t going to make the playoffs, and if they do, it’s through an act of God, and in spite of the Francoeur trade, not because of it. I want him to succeed, but let’s give him the rest of the season before we proclaim him savior, or even good.
Wow! They are willing to bet the Mets are dead and only an act of God will get them to win a wild card. That’s outrageous. What kind of a Mets site would promote that in July?
Wow! They are willing to bet the Mets are dead and only an act of God will get them to win a wild card. That’s outrageous. What kind of a Mets site would promote that in July?
A shitty one!
one that doesn’t want to get peoples hopes up.
Or one that doesn’t subscribe to Mets motto’s like Ya Gotta Believe like this site plainly does.
Can we all agree at least that Church was a Grade A Pussy. He needs to go back to Washington where passion is as common as a mistress-free politician
Um… dude?
Francoeur not only gets on base less than virtually any other non-middle-infielder in the game, he HAS A LOWER SLUGGING PERCENTAGE than Church, lifetime. Even during his “peak” years, dude was slugging .440-.450; in other words, during his “100-RBI” prime, he was Armando Rios/David Segui, power-wise. (Except he got on base a lot less.)
I wish him well, and cheered like hell when he hit tonight’s home run.
I just hope a 12-game hot streak doesn’t prompt Mets management to make any rash decisions, extension-wise. (Hell, Castillo’s been hotter and for longer– that doesn’t make his contract any less of a mistake.)
Thank you for writing some sense. Great point about the slugging percentage.
If you want to watch the Mets via boxscores, calculators, and slide rules, why come to a site with a name like Metsmerized? This is a fan site, not a site for people who got their asses kicked in grade school and had their lunch money stolen. take your mood rings, Star Trek figures, graph paper, pocket protectors and everything else and wallow in your statistics elsewhere. This site is for die hard fans who believe in things like having heart, gritty players, hard-nosed baseball, clubhouse leaders and a host of other things you will never understand in your perfectly planned out life.
you know just because people actually read statistics and understand what they mean unlike you, does not mean that they are nerds and “got their asses kicked in grade school and had their lunch money stolen”. I for one never watched star trek, star wars, or anything else with star in it. Just because your an idiot when it comes to stats does not mean you can criticize people because they understand what on base percentage and slugging average is.
You never saw Star Wars? What do you live in a cave or something?
You have no idea how to take in a baseball game and enjoy all of it’s wonderful intricacies. Things like the smell of the grass, the crack of the bat, or a glove popping are lost on you.
You take a wonderful game and try to dissect it until you get to the seedy parts just so you can criticize players and tear them down.
You care nothing about the human element, only your cold hard numbers. Those percentages you cite are not what makes one a baseball purist. To me those are the tools used as weapons to take down players you dont like just as all of you are doing with Francoeur.
You use and manipulate those numbers to create a false vision of the player and recast them as you want others to see them.
It’s probably a heartless attempt at getting back at the athletes who called you geeks in grade school.
Don’t waste your numbers on me because I watch the game for the enjoyment and pleasure I derive from it.
Dude! You’re my Mets man crush of the week!
This controversy among Mets fans is ridiculous. Don’t get overly carried away with your own convictions about stats. It comes down to whether his presence is benefitting the team or not. For his first couple weeks, the objective person has to say that he has.
When the trade was anounced, I was sceptical for many of the reasons cited. However, I have seen now a player who has made key hits and provided some power to a lineup that has had almost none. Is he perfect – no. .Ccould we have gotten a better player – perhaps. Is he here and performing well – yes! That’s what counts. It is obvious the Mets are not making a key trade and picking up any powerhouse players. In that circumstance, let’s appreciate the playe.rd we did get and give him a chance. If you’re not willing to do that, then you are not a Mets fan, but a closed minded individual with a private agenda. LGM!
to Devin,
actually I do know how to take in a baseball game. I play it regularly and I enjoy it. Things like the crack of the bat are not lost on me. However, stats is the only tool we as fans have to measure players. It’s been this way since the game was invented. Baseball is a stat driven game. Thats what get people big contracts. Do you think A-Rod gets a $300 Million dollar game because of intagibles? Please, he gets hit because he hits 40 homers a year, and helps your team win.
I get not being happy with the way things have gone this season or the previous two seasons but this…
“Another Mets blog, created by another fan who is fed up with the Mets”
“About Me-Aidan G.-A Mets fan whose fed up with Jerry Manuel, Omar Minaya and the Mets”
“So, really, since joining the Mets, Jeff Francoeur has been no better than Mike Hampton. So why all the hype?”
…sounds like just a miserable so-called Mets fan. That last comment is beyond laughable but you have every right to your opinion. I know what comes next, you will say it is not opinion it is fact and it will still be laughable. Again, just another example of taking the fun out of the great game. Good luck with all that.
actually I don’t say its fact, its all my opinion. If you think this season hasn’t been frustrating to us fans, then you’ve had your head in a toilet all season. We had such high hopes about this season, getting K-Rod, Putz, etc, and its been frustrating. I’m also frustrated about the management we have. You don’t have to agree with me, and I don’t have to agree with you. But I am not another example of “taking the fun out of the great game”. Part of the fun of baseball for a lot of fans, is comparing players using stats. Thats why fantasy baseball is so popular. Thats not taking the fun out of the game. Thats making it more popular.
I guess you failed to comprehend the first 18 words of my reply since you said this…
“If you think this season hasn’t been frustrating to us fans, then you’ve had your head in a toilet all season.”
…and comparing Jeff Francoeur to Mike Hampton is just, well, moronic. Sorry, I have no other word to describe it. I know it is eating at all the stat heads that a player like Francoeur is having a little success. Keep wishing the worst so you can say “I told you so.” I am sure the first slump Francoeur goes through will be the end of the world and Omar Minaya will be crucified because he traded the great Ryan Church.
And concerning Francoeur, I posted this when the trade happened…
http://the1constant.mlblogs.com/archives/2009/07/mets_news_braves_and_mets_swap.html
…but I am willing to give the guy a chance and so far he has been a nice addition. I could not care less what he did during his Braves’ career. What I care about is what he has done from July 10 and moving forward.
I never said Ryan Church was great… I was looking for people to compare Francoeur too, and Mike Hampton popped up. Listen, I have a right to my own opinion, and I hope Francoeur does well, because I want to win. I just think it is too early to say that he has been exactly what we need. I think after 25 games, you can start to make a judgement. And I will change my mind, if he does well, but I think part of him doing well is changing his approach, and walking more. Imagine if you can maybe even 10%of those strikeouts into walks, we’ll score more runs.
yes, maybe I didn’t comprehend the first 18 words you said, but then why criticize me for saying on my blog (which I can say whatever the hell I want to) that I’m a frustrated Mets fan who is fed up with the Mets. As a fan, I’ve been through a lot as everyone else was. It’s disappointing, frustrating, and I’m tired of all the stuff that happens to this team. If you live in Philly, as sadly I do, you’re more easily frustrated then most Mets fan.
Church will fit in nicely with all the marshmellows down in Atlanta as long as someone holds his head while Chipper changes his diaper
hey francoeur keeps proving a lot of people wrong, and I hope he continues to do so, but also someone who has been criticized a lot is Castillo. Some of it is fair (dropped pop up, sucking last year), but he is one of our more consistent hitters.
I criticize because everything is negative, negative, and more negative. All I hear and I have said the same thing at times is that you cannot use the injuries as an excuse, well, it is not an excuse, if the Mets had their full roster healthy they would be right in the thick of the division race as well as the Wildcard.
Everyone is out for blood like it is the cool thing to do. No matter what someone must be blamed.
Yes the Mets have handled a lot of different issues this season in an odd manner but no team in baseball could overcome the amount of injuries to key players. No one.
Again on Francoeur, just like someone responded above, you say “when” Francoeur struggles like you are so sure he is going to fail almost to the point that you want him to fail just so you can say “I told you so.”
I don’t want him to fail, but the track record is that he’s going to go into a slump… all hitters go into slumps, and hot streaks, as we’ve seen with David Wright this year
Everybody has different opinions, and they are all welcomed on this site. Sometimes though, it’s easy to forget we all share one common goal for the Mets. I don’t mind a good debate, but it gets silly when it sinks down to mocking one opinion or resorting to name calling or labeling. There’s always been two schools of thought on determining what a good player is, and all the arguing in the world won’t get one side to see it the other way. When we win it all it doesn’t even matter. We’ll scream, and cheer, and drink beers together, and relish the moment. That’s all I gotta say.
Pelf has got a shutout going in the 6th, Mets up 3-0! It’s all good.
I’m good with that. Nice way to intervene.
I don’t have much to say other than anyone who thinks rbi are a stat worth measuring a player is an idiot. It’s not a matter of opinion either, it’s fact.
That braves fan is delusional. Failcy sucks. You were probably in love with him because he was the golden boy. He sucks, mets will realize this soon enough. And frank wren isn’t a good GM? Haha.
He turned jurrjens, campillo, Morton, reyes, and ? Into Derek Lowe, Javier Vazquez, Jair Jurrjens, Tommy Hanson, Tim Hudson/Kawakami/Medlen. He also replaced Schafer and Crotchman with McLouth and LaRoche. And BTW the platoon of Diaz and Church is much more prosuctive than Failcy.